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  1.    #181  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmybob View Post
    I have never read so much BS in my life. Dsol and Insidr wanting to blame the incompetence of ATT and Palm on GoodMail. Goodguy, who admits he doesn't know anything, drinks the corporate kool-aid and represents a position that he can't back up and that has no logic. Lifes2short should just get a life or a hobby, cuz he/she is totally clueless.
    The update will come out when it does. If you want to use WM6 now, there's a bunch of choices. If GMM doesn't perform well, then go back to WM5 and use it there. If you don't use GMM, then you'll be happy with WM6, any flavor. But geez... same some energy for things you can do somthing about.
    Maybe so--then your opinion is this all rests on the shoulders of AT&T and AT&T alone?

    I admit I have been way to preoccupied by this but now it has become kind of funny.
    PDA Lineage: Palm Pilot, Palm V, Palm Tungsten, Treo 650 (Cingular), Treo 750 (AT&T), Treo Pro GSM (unlocked), Pre Plus (AT&T), Pre 2 GSM (unlocked), Pre 3 16GB (AT&T Branded) and Touchpad 32 GB
  2. #182  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmybob View Post
    I have never read so much BS in my life. Dsol and Insidr wanting to blame the incompetence of ATT and Palm on GoodMail. Goodguy, who admits he doesn't know anything, drinks the corporate kool-aid and represents a position that he can't back up and that has no logic. Lifes2short should just get a life or a hobby, cuz he/she is totally clueless.
    The update will come out when it does. If you want to use WM6 now, there's a bunch of choices. If GMM doesn't perform well, then go back to WM5 and use it there. If you don't use GMM, then you'll be happy with WM6, any flavor. But geez... same some energy for things you can do somthing about.
    Thanks for your input and well thought out posting. While I am not part of the 5.0 dev team, I do know about the relationship between Good and AT&T and our other carriers. I know exactly how many users we have on the various networks and, I dare say, I know more about the wireless space than the majority (not all) of the users on here. I have backed up my position well with the data that I do have and my opinions on the carriers as it relates to this. Should decide to provide some meaningful dialogue to the conversation, so be it, but to do a drive-by post critical of the entire discussion, with nothing meaningful to add, is weak and is a much bigger waste of energy. You should "same" some energy and ignore the posts to which you have nothing to add.
  3. #183  
    Goodguy,
    What have you added to this dialog? Your illogical, "I'm not in a need to know"/ "I know everything" role? Or are you just defending the role of GM in the delay? It doesn't make any difference. I can at least appreciate Dsol's statement above that it's become kind of funny. Maybe he gets a kick out of stirring you Goodguy's up. Maybe he recognizes crazy, convoluted logic when he sees it and he's got nothing better to do. I've read your defense carefully before joining this debate. It's all inconsequential. The update will come out when ATT is ready. I don't know why it's later than every other carrier. Never will. It might be Moto's fault. It might not be. What's it matter. You're defending a position that can't be proved. Give it up.
  4. WDW
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    #184  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    The Q9m is WM6 and has the GetGood icon. Vzw and Good have the same agreement in place as AT&T as it relates to GMM data plans.
    I just can't believe that this is totally true.

    The only phone currently available from Verizon Wireless with WM6 is indeed the Motorola Q9m. However it does not indicate anywhere that Good Mobile Messaging is an option with their service. In fact when you view their PDA offerings and click the "Email" link next to the Q9 picture, it says that there are "two ways to use VZEmail - either with Blackberry or Wireless Sync". If you click on the device for more details and look on either the "Overview" tab or the "Phone Deatils" tab, again no mention. And if you click on the "Capabilities" tab it says this phone's email can "View Email and Attachments" but no GMM mention. Also, on their home page, click on the "Business" and then on "Wireless Email". Again no mentions. Does Verizon use GMM but market it under a different name like "Wireless Sync"? And after a Google search I also cannot find any info on the Q9 with GMM (except for GMM meaning "Google Maps Mobile") . I do know, however, that GMM is available for that device. maybe Verizon is holding up on advertising this until the compatible GMM 5.0 comes out.

    I do know that if you go to Cingular/ATT's site right now and look under the 750, Blackjack or 8525 you will see a specific mention of Good Mobile Messaging in each ones "Features" overview. Also if you click their "Business Center" link and look under "Email" you will see "Good Mobile Messaging" prominently displayed. If you click on that link, there is an entire page devoted to GMM inluding a long legal paragraph at the bottom.

    Either Verizon does not have the same vendor relationship with GMM that ATT does or they do not consider it a wothwhile marketing feature. Which is it?
    Treo 750 - ATT branded
    Version: TREO750-2.25-ATT
    WM6 Prof.
  5. #185  
    Quote Originally Posted by CrunchDude View Post
    I agree. And that speaks to your user name, which I also very much agree with.

    At first, I thought, alright, let me participate since I also would like to see WM6 released, but if someone's problem is that they don't have it, it really isn't a problem in the grand scheme of things. I also would like a high resolution 320x320 Treo 750. But it's not really a problem. If this is your "problem", count yourself lucky, because if something was seriously wrong in your life, such as if you're in poor health, a loved ones dies, the current administration...lol, posting in this thread would be the last thing on your mind.

    So let me gracefully bow out of this thread that has become nothing but people getting angry at each other, arguing, getting so emotionally involved to the point where they're so upset over something so trivial, if you take a step back and look at the bigger picture. I have a Treo 750 running Windows Mobile 5.2.2 with the audio fix. I'm satisfied. Let there be peace.
    Same here. This thread has now become a magnet for less than respectful dialogue.

    /unsubscribed
  6. #186  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmybob View Post
    Goodguy,
    What have you added to this dialog? Your illogical, "I'm not in a need to know"/ "I know everything" role? Or are you just defending the role of GM in the delay? It doesn't make any difference. I can at least appreciate Dsol's statement above that it's become kind of funny. Maybe he gets a kick out of stirring you Goodguy's up. Maybe he recognizes crazy, convoluted logic when he sees it and he's got nothing better to do. I've read your defense carefully before joining this debate. It's all inconsequential. The update will come out when ATT is ready. I don't know why it's later than every other carrier. Never will. It might be Moto's fault. It might not be. What's it matter. You're defending a position that can't be proved. Give it up.
    Let's see. The bottom line revenue to AT&T from GMM is maybe $2 million/qtr, on the high end. Other carriers seem to be fine in releasing devices and updates, i.e. the Q9 from VZW (a Moto device, no less, with the GetGood icon), 750V WM6 update from Vodaphone. There is a high number of GMM users on Vodophone. Though not as many as with AT&T, the number is not inconsiquential. There are 100's of thousands of 750's out there, yet only a small fraction are running GMM. ATT has consistently been late with updates. Those are facts, not theory. As far as I can tell, through this entire discussion, I am the ONLY one who has presented facts. Those facts lead me to my theory that that GMM is not the cause of the delay. That is my theory based upon what I know. Nothing convoluted and a theory, again, based upon facts. Nobody's position here will be able to be proved and, has been stated, there will be no winner here whenever the update is released.
  7. #187  
    Quote Originally Posted by WDW View Post
    I just can't believe that this is totally true.



    Either Verizon does not have the same vendor relationship with GMM that ATT does or they do not consider it a wothwhile marketing feature. Which is it?
    The only difference is that ATT sells CAL's and VZW does not. Outside of that, the relationship is exactly the same. VZW has a Good Data Plan just as Sprint and ATT. You are correct that it comes down to marketing. On VZW's business pricing plans page, the statement "All plan or feature prices for Good Mobile Messaging service customers will be increased by $5 monthly access over the corresponding prices shown in these tables." is there. You are correct, it is a marketing decision that VZW has made. Believe me, VZW is not the easiest to work with.

    As for the Q9, maybe VZW understands that GetGood is simply a web shortcut that will not apply to the majority of the buyers of the Q9.
  8. WDW
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    #188  
    I think this particular issue comes down to support for Palm/ATT and the corporate help desks. ATT has hundreds of thousands 750/8525/Blackjacks deployed. Having the possible Good Mobile Messaging 5.0/WM6 conflict out there is a big deal for that many devices. The Q9 is the only WM6 device in Verizon's offerings and it just launched in August. So they cannot possibly have many Q9 handsets in the fleets of corporate users by now. So Verizon made the choice that this is not a high impact to them. ATT however has much more skin in the game. It is true that ATT could launch WM6 without GMM 5.0. But they are smart enough to know that it wouldn't be wise to leave this gap open.

    A little research on Good's own site as well as a Google search will show that Cingular/ATT is the main U.S. wireless partner for GMM. Cingular was the first to hammer out a partnership deal with Good in 2005. If you check out the Press Release section on Good's web site you will find at least 8 releases regarding Cingular Wireless. you will only find one on Verizon. No one can tell me that Good is not significantly more embedded in ATT's business plans than any other wireless carrier.
    Last edited by WDW; 09/25/2007 at 10:19 AM.
    Treo 750 - ATT branded
    Version: TREO750-2.25-ATT
    WM6 Prof.
  9. WDW
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    #189  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    As far as I can tell, through this entire discussion, I am the ONLY one who has presented facts.
    Wow. That is very humble of you. True colors. I think if you read back through this and the other related threads you will see that a lot of people indeed presented many undisputable facts. Others added some theory and speculation that is a logical extrapolation of the facts. And then others added some far fetched theories that we all know to disregard. I can give you 2 absolute facts as of today. 1. Good Mobile Messaging 5.0 has not been released nor have its customers been given a solid release date. 2. The WM6 upgrade is not available for ATT customers.
    Last edited by WDW; 09/25/2007 at 10:19 AM.
    Treo 750 - ATT branded
    Version: TREO750-2.25-ATT
    WM6 Prof.
  10. WDW
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    #190  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    The fact that AT&T has announced WM6 upgrades for all those devices and hasn't released them tells me it is AT&T's issue when other carriers have released the upgrades, i,e., the 750.
    Since no one has been shy about putting in their 2 cents, I would like to hear some theories on why ATT has not released WM6 when all other carriers have it, they have it on some of the exact same devices as ATT, and the leaked ATT upgrade seems to work flawlessly on the ATT handsets. If it is not Good Mobile Messaging 5.0 (GMM 5.0) then what would you attribute it to? Anyone?
    Treo 750 - ATT branded
    Version: TREO750-2.25-ATT
    WM6 Prof.
  11. #191  
    Quote Originally Posted by WDW View Post
    Wow. That is very humble of you. True colors. I think if you read back through this and the other related threads you will see that a lot of people indeed presented many undisputable facts. Others added some theory and speculation that is a logical extrapolation of the facts. And then others added some far fetched theories that we all know to disregard. I can give you 2 absolute facts as of today. 1. Good Mobile Messaging 5.0 has not been released nor have its customers been given a solid release date. 2. The WM6 upgrade is not available for ATT customers.



    While those are facts, you cannot present any data or information that correlates the two. Nobody can.

    I re-read the thread and have not seen any other "undisputable" facts presented by anyone relating to a correlation between GMM holding up ATT.

    The facts that I presented back up my theory. Right, wrong or indifferent, I have presented what I think regarding this correleation based upon what I know to be facts: No significant revenue affect on ATT, GMM users are a fraction of the total device population of the affected devices, other carriers have released the upgrade for the 750 as well as WM6 deviced and, based on what I do know regarding the population of GMM users on those carriers, would affect approximately the same number as with ATT.

    This conversation continues going in circles and will never end. Nobody that in involved will admit the other side is right and even when both are released. GMM hits it's release date, WM6 comes a week later, it was GMM's fault that WM6 was delayed. What is the time frame between GMM 5.0 release and WM6 release to where it had nothing to do with GMM? Week? Two weeks? A month? Whereas if WM6 update came out tomorrow for the 750, and we release GMM 5 this week, then ATT knew we were going to release, so they went ahead and released the update.

    Here are three facts I know:

    1. Good Mobile Messaging 5.0 has not been released nor have its customers been given a solid release date. 2. The WM6 upgrade is not available for ATT customers nor have its customers been given a solid release date. 3. There are absolutely 0 irrefutable facts correlating #1 and #2.
    Last edited by GoodGuy; 09/25/2007 at 01:01 PM.
  12. #192  
    Quote Originally Posted by WDW View Post
    I think this particular issue comes down to support for Palm/ATT and the corporate help desks. ATT has hundreds of thousands 750/8525/Blackjacks deployed. Having the possible Good Mobile Messaging 5.0/WM6 conflict out there is a big deal for that many devices. The Q9 is the only WM6 device in Verizon's offerings and it just launched in August. So they cannot possibly have many Q9 handsets in the fleets of corporate users by now. So Verizon made the choice that this is not a high impact to them. ATT however has much more skin in the game. It is true that ATT could launch WM6 without GMM 5.0. But they are smart enough to know that it wouldn't be wise to leave this gap open.
    There have been several devices released on multiple carriers, that on their release, were not supported by GMM. The Q was the fastest selling PDA/Smartphone ever released (prior to the iPhone) and was targetted directly at the enterprise space. However, when it was released, it was not supported by Good. When the first WM5 devices shipped, GMM did not support WM5 and we caught alot of flack. We did, not the carriers. There are WM6 devices shipping all over the world right now and GMM does not support them.

    No one can tell me that Good is not significantly more embedded in ATT's business plans than any other wireless carrier.
    I can tell you exactly that. We are no more embedded with ATT than with any other carrier we have relationships with. The fact that ATT has more device releases than any other carrier can give that impression, however, as it relates to a business relationship, we are no more beholden to ATT than Sprint, VZW or any other carrier. And the number of users, while slightly higher on ATT (mainly because they are GMS, therefore, more condusive for international business), the difference between the number of users across carriers is not high enough to back up that argument.
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    #193  
    Quote Originally Posted by WDW View Post
    If it is not Good Mobile Messaging 5.0 (GMM 5.0) then what would you attribute it to? Anyone?
    It obviously must be Bush's fault.

    Thanks Goodguy for your tiime and efforts on the Goodlink forurm.

    - Jeff
    A liberal is someone who feels a great debt to his fellow man, which debt he proposes to pay off with your money
  14. #194  
    Upgrading my Treo 750 to WM6 has tranfered the garbage Tro750 into a great phone. I cannot overemphasized what a difference in speed and phone functionality. It no longer locks up, and I am able to answer all the calls, where previously I would miss it, waiting for the interface to process the request.

    Having said that, I also like to mention that the active sync works perfectly syncing my work email and that I hope I will never have to use GoodLink again. I still remember all the frustration I went through with their application taking over my Treo750 contacts, etc..

    Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade, if you can.
  15. #195  
    For those who are unwise. What are the benefits of Good? I have heard it discussed in mystery and in corners.

    Maybe just a quick run down for some of the curious, including myself.

    Thanks
    graylion
  16. #196  
    Quote Originally Posted by graylion View Post
    For those who are unwise. What are the benefits of Good? I have heard it discussed in mystery and in corners.

    Maybe just a quick run down for some of the curious, including myself.

    Thanks
    Not to turn this thread into a GMM advert, Good Mobile Messaging is an enterprise software solution that syncs Exchange or Lotus with various smartphones. You can see more at www.good.com. If this follows form, you will now hear from people telling you how bad it is
  17. #197  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    I can tell you exactly that. We are no more embedded with ATT than with any other carrier we have relationships with.
    That is just intellectually dishonest. As you can see the average Joe was able to go out on Good and ATT's websites and see the cross-pollenation all over the place. I wish I could tell you how I know, but it is a fact that ATT has much deeper roots with Good than either Sprint or Verizon. Yes Sprint and Verizon sell GMM services, but no one in the U.S. has more influence over the GMM product than ATT. I would stake my life on that. Regardless of who is right about the whole WM6 hold up, I just wish Good would shoot straight with its customers. From sweeping bugs under the carpet to not proactively communicating with its customers it has been a case study in poor service. Period.
    Treo 750 - Cingular/ATT
  18. #198  
    Quote Originally Posted by graylion View Post
    For those who are unwise. What are the benefits of Good? I have heard it discussed in mystery and in corners.
    Thanks
    Gray,
    GMM is a potentially excellent mail/calendar/contacts synching application with several other features. However it has many kinks to work out before it is stable across all devices and OS's. Don't make any moves right now. Version 5.0 will be out soon. About a month after its release come back here and read the reviews. You will get a huge sampling from many different users on how 5.0 is performing. Use that information along with other reviews and forums you find on the web to form your decision. As far as its features, do go to the demo on the Good site. Good luck.
    Treo 750 - Cingular/ATT
  19.    #199  
    Quote Originally Posted by graylion View Post
    For those who are unwise. What are the benefits of Good? I have heard it discussed in mystery and in corners.

    Maybe just a quick run down for some of the curious, including myself.

    Thanks
    First off let me state I am an end user of GMM--not an admin nor a knowledgeable "techie". That being said I think by and large it is a great email client for me. It allows me to consistently receive and send emails real time as well as see my outlook contacts, calendar, etc., look up peoples contacts in my company outlook database as if I was in the office and get updates the minute my assistant makes changes to Outlook. For me it has had some minor issues but by and large I am very happy with the application. I can not speak to the admin of the server however.

    On a side note I would be lying if I didn't mention that it frustrates me to read about a number of upcoming enhancements/upgrades to their software so far in advance of a release that they openly discuss on their website. I think they could do a better job of communicating that their website touts features of an upcoming release that is currently in the works. To me the site implies those features are available today. I guess if you spend a lot of time on the site and look for an asterisk you will see it is a "future relase" but I think it is misleading. However, those enhancements will only improve upon a good software package for me and I certainly don't need them to use it effectively.

    Lastly, I am not sure what is involved for an individual without corporate support to even use it in the first place but that could probably be better answered in the Good Link forum on this site.
    PDA Lineage: Palm Pilot, Palm V, Palm Tungsten, Treo 650 (Cingular), Treo 750 (AT&T), Treo Pro GSM (unlocked), Pre Plus (AT&T), Pre 2 GSM (unlocked), Pre 3 16GB (AT&T Branded) and Touchpad 32 GB
  20. #200  
    Quote Originally Posted by conekkted View Post
    That is just intellectually dishonest. As you can see the average Joe was able to go out on Good and ATT's websites and see the cross-pollenation all over the place. I wish I could tell you how I know, but it is a fact that ATT has much deeper roots with Good than either Sprint or Verizon. Yes Sprint and Verizon sell GMM services, but no one in the U.S. has more influence over the GMM product than ATT. I would stake my life on that. Regardless of who is right about the whole WM6 hold up, I just wish Good would shoot straight with its customers. From sweeping bugs under the carpet to not proactively communicating with its customers it has been a case study in poor service. Period.
    Conekkted, since you like to come across as the guru of all things Good, let me give you a history lesson as well as some more information that may help.

    Back in the G100 (an email device that competed with the BB 900 and 957)days, when Cingular was the one carrier we sold through, they may have had influence. That relationship went south several year back. We then rebuilt the relationship, which because of those past issues was something well short of easy. If those are the roots you are referring to, then, yes, ATT has deeper roots. After several years, Cingular was the first carrier to sign a resell agreement with Good when we switched to the carrier model. Then, about 2 months later, we signed with Sprint and then roughly a year later with VZW. The one thing ATT has over the other carriers is they offer a wider selection of devices that are supported by GMM. They also offer a wider variety of devices that don't. Cingular has been very aggressive in introducing new devices to the market which gives them, IMO, a distinct advantage over the other carriers.

    Now, with that being said, ATT has no more influence over GMM than anyone else. That is especially more true now that we are part of Motorola. How many MOT devices doese ATT offer? Now, compare that to Sprint/Nextel and VZW. But, of course, since you (whichever of the three people that post under your ID this actually is) staked your life on it, who am I to question?

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