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  1.    #1  
    Apple has already released several updates for the iPhone. Palm has released NONE for the Treo 750v even though there are well documented problems. If the iPhone was available to Canadians, I would buy it right now and end my Palm relationship that I had since 1999.
    PDA Lineage: Sharp Wizard, PalmVx, Tungsten, Treo 650, Treo 750v
  2. edmc's Avatar
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    #2  
    Hardly a good comparison:

    Palm: Doesn't own the OS/Apps & the OS/Apps are relatively much more "mature"
    Apple: Owns the OS/Apps & the Apps (at least) are very "immature"

    Be thankful Apple is so responsive. Palm (& MSFT for that matter) have an easier time being much more methodical.

    That said, I'd love (officially released) WM6 on my Treo 750 too :-)
  3. TazUk's Avatar
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    #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by naftalim View Post
    Palm has released NONE for the Treo 750v...
    The main issue people seem to have with the 750 is the loss of sound, Palm have released a patch for that. There is a major update in the works in the shape of the WM6 upgrade. It makes more sense to get that out quickly rather than waste time patching WM5. And yes I know the release of WM6 hasn't exactly been rapid
  4. #4  
    Yeah, i agree. they have been busy with WM6.
  5.    #5  
    The patch was only for AT&T 750, not for the Vodaphone 750v

    Quote Originally Posted by TazUk View Post
    The main issue people seem to have with the 750 is the loss of sound, Palm have released a patch for that. There is a major update in the works in the shape of the WM6 upgrade. It makes more sense to get that out quickly rather than waste time patching WM5. And yes I know the release of WM6 hasn't exactly been rapid
    PDA Lineage: Sharp Wizard, PalmVx, Tungsten, Treo 650, Treo 750v
  6. TazUk's Avatar
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    #6  
    Well I've got a Vodafone 750v and I've had that problem, that's not to say that it doesn't exist though.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by edmc View Post
    Hardly a good comparison:

    Palm: Doesn't own the OS/Apps & the OS/Apps are relatively much more "mature"
    Apple: Owns the OS/Apps & the Apps (at least) are very "immature"
    "Mature" is a strange word to use, but agree if you are talking years in exsistance. But if you are talking about how refined it is... Apple have Windows Mobile beat HANDS DOWN.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Interstink View Post
    "Mature" is a strange word to use, but agree if you are talking years in exsistance. But if you are talking about how refined it is... Apple have Windows Mobile beat HANDS DOWN.
    I would agree with this assessment.

    Quote Originally Posted by lyndon_h
    Yeah, i agree. they have been busy with WM6.
    This, I wouldn't be so sure of. Palm's not very forthcoming with what they're doing, and it's really ended up hurting them in the eyes of their customers because there are glaring problems with some of their products (i.e. 700p) and yet they never gave hint that they're working to fix them. While I would typically give a company the benefit of the doubt, I've learned not to do this with Palm.

    Now while you might argue that Apple isn't forthcoming either, you'll find a LOT more Apple users have faith that Apple will fess up to and fix a problem nowadays (like the recent speaker popping problem that happened with the 10.4.10 OS update) then Palm users have faith that Palm will do the same.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Interstink View Post
    "Mature" is a strange word to use, but agree if you are talking years in exsistance. But if you are talking about how refined it is... Apple have Windows Mobile beat HANDS DOWN.
    Give and take here IMO.

    I love my iPhone and love its UI. Much moer than Windows Mobile. But how is that UI going to be when it evolves? WM is much more complex, its difficult to compare them.

    One side can say that Apple "simplified everything," which a case can be made for.

    But the other side is that Apple's features on the phone are VERY limited, as I can name 100 things my Treo can do that my iPhone cannot.
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Pattycerts View Post
    Give and take here IMO.

    I love my iPhone and love its UI. Much moer than Windows Mobile. But how is that UI going to be when it evolves? WM is much more complex, its difficult to compare them.

    One side can say that Apple "simplified everything," which a case can be made for.

    But the other side is that Apple's features on the phone are VERY limited, as I can name 100 things my Treo can do that my iPhone cannot.
    Yes but you're forgetting that the iPhone runs OS X. If Apple truly did port the bulk of OS X to the ARM architecture for the iPhone, once we get an SDK, it will be a far better platform than Windows Mobile. The only reason it's so simple now is because there is no SDK available, and Apple's kept access to the inner OS under lock and key. Once that opens up you're going to see more potential in the iPhone's software than you'll see in Windows Mobile because you will gain the flexibility you desire (that windows mobile has), along with the speed and UI of OS X on the iPhone.

    Don't get me wrong, I love my treo 750's functionality (3G, unlockability, etc), especially with the WM6 ROM, but the iPhone has it beat on UI, browser, screen, sync ability with OS X. When they release a 3G iPhone that's unlockable with an SDK to develop programs for it (and let's through in bluetooth PAN as well), I really don't see any reason to stick with another phone.

    It's like all phone manufacturers are in a race to create the ideal mobile device that can work for power users and simple users alike while remaining easy to use. Apple's joined the race but taken a huge leap as their first step. They can appease most simple users, but all of us power users are waiting for the iPhone to really open up to 3rd parties, polish some of the rough edges, and make it the rest of the way.

    Right now, the phone I believe is closest to that ideal phone happens to be the treo 750 with the WM6 rom on it, just because of the improved stability/speed as well as the immense featureset (including tri-band 3G). My only complaint is that for as long as windows mobile has been on the market, I feel it should have developed a far better UI than this start menu based UI, but that's gotten better over the years, and Palm has made it quite usable enough to get a former PalmOS user like myself to be satisfied with it.
  11. #11  
    I agree totally, my point is that I'm not sure that the UI will be so simple (or stable) with a bunch of 3rd party apps on it. We'll see
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by naftalim View Post
    Apple has already released several updates for the iPhone. Palm has released NONE for the Treo 750v even though there are well documented problems. If the iPhone was available to Canadians, I would buy it right now and end my Palm relationship that I had since 1999.
    I suggest two responses:

    (1) Apple is just bigger than Palm and they have way more coders working on the iPhone than Palm does; plus seeing as it's basically a port of OSX, it's easier for them to work with

    (2) Apple doesn't need carrier approval to roll out updates: they just do them via iTunes

    #1 is just somewhat obvious I think. #2 though...that is a very envious position to be in as I'm sure every OEM would love to be able to do that. However, it seems that any update that touches the phone's radio firmware and network has to be approved by the carriers, which from what I understand, is usually about a 3-month process. In turn, this costs everyone money, hence less updates (they try to nail as many bugs in one-update as possible, since most devices get 1 MR in their life-cycle to keep costs down).

    I wish Palm could do #2 but it won't happen. Even Verizon, who supposedly thoroughly test these updates, missed the big one with those '3000' errors on the 700p and 700w/wx updates.

    The whole system/model is just wrong, imo.

    In theory, WM6 has that 'auto update' feature built in but I have no idea how often it is used and what exactly it updates. It's at least a start.

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  13. samsul's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    I suggest two responses:

    (1) Apple is just bigger than Palm and they have way more coders working on the iPhone than Palm does; plus seeing as it's basically a port of OSX, it's easier for them to work with
    Palm does not have to write Windows Mobile 6, they simply get it from Microsoft and make few changes which should not take them long - unless they only have 1 part-time coder working for them.
  14. TazUk's Avatar
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    #14  
    It's not like Windows for your PC where one CD can be installed on lots of different makes and models of PC, each firmware is developed around that particular model/hardware, so it's not quite as simple as that. Sure it requires a lot less work than writing a new OS from the ground up, which Palm are also doing.
  15. TazUk's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    #2 though...that is a very envious position to be in as I'm sure every OEM would love to be able to do that. However, it seems that any update that touches the phone's radio firmware and network has to be approved by the carriers, which from what I understand, is usually about a 3-month process. In turn, this costs everyone money, hence less updates (they try to nail as many bugs in one-update as possible, since most devices get 1 MR in their life-cycle to keep costs down).
    It also mean making a firmware specifically for each carrier as well, so the more carriers you're with the more work that needs to be done. This also results in different version numbers and different bugs between carriers, which must make things more difficult.
  16. mmereos's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by Pattycerts View Post
    Give and take here IMO.

    I love my iPhone and love its UI. Much moer than Windows Mobile. But how is that UI going to be when it evolves? WM is much more complex, its difficult to compare them.

    But the other side is that Apple's features on the phone are VERY limited, as I can name 100 things my Treo can do that my iPhone cannot.
    I totally agree, I bought an iPhone and loved it for the first few hours, but when I tried to do the same things I do with my Treo 750 the iPhone couldn't even come close to the functionality of the 750. Maybe in the future it will surpass it but I would say it's a couple of years away. The iPhone is no replacement for the Treo 750 not even close. In my opinion the iPhone is a great replacement for phones like the Razr, or the music phones but as a PDA it falls short.
  17. #17  
    I think the posts here offer a fairly healthy assesment of the whole Apple iPhone v. Palm WM Treo debate.

    The iPhone's ultimate weakness is that it is not a true business device, and was never intended to be. It's a Smartphone for the crowd that doesn't have a corporate e-mail/PIM solution.

    The Treo's ultimate weakness is that in order for it to take advantage of the features that make it a sale for people like most of us (business users) they had to go to Windows Mobile, which (a) they have little control over the development of and (b) is simply not as innovative as Apple OS X and Palm OS (was).

    My wife just bought me an iPhone for my birthday. I've been using it for a week today. I have to say - I love it and I hate it. I want my plastic keyboard back. Yeah, I know Steve Jobs thinks it's horrible, but I do. I love having my iPod in my phone at work (and having folks unsure as to whether I'm working or playing)... But I hate the lack of real Exchange compatibility. Finally, it (unlike my Treo 750) requires two hands to operate. Yep, I know I should be more European and simply Slow. Down. But I can't. My boss expects me to keep moving.

    So, there you have it. My fun side wants to keep the iPhone, but my business side wants to give it up. Therein lies the problem for a lot of people.
    HP iPAQ 6515 -> Cingular 8125 -> Samsung BlackJack -> Treo 750
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by CorpITGuy View Post
    I think the posts here offer a fairly healthy assesment of the whole Apple iPhone v. Palm WM Treo debate.

    The iPhone's ultimate weakness is that it is not a true business device, and was never intended to be. It's a Smartphone for the crowd that doesn't have a corporate e-mail/PIM solution.

    The Treo's ultimate weakness is that in order for it to take advantage of the features that make it a sale for people like most of us (business users) they had to go to Windows Mobile, which (a) they have little control over the development of and (b) is simply not as innovative as Apple OS X and Palm OS (was).

    My wife just bought me an iPhone for my birthday. I've been using it for a week today. I have to say - I love it and I hate it. I want my plastic keyboard back. Yeah, I know Steve Jobs thinks it's horrible, but I do. I love having my iPod in my phone at work (and having folks unsure as to whether I'm working or playing)... But I hate the lack of real Exchange compatibility. Finally, it (unlike my Treo 750) requires two hands to operate. Yep, I know I should be more European and simply Slow. Down. But I can't. My boss expects me to keep moving.

    So, there you have it. My fun side wants to keep the iPhone, but my business side wants to give it up. Therein lies the problem for a lot of people.
    I went through the same decision, same struggle. Hehe....you left out how beautiful/awesome the interface and web browser are. No other phone can really compare in this regard.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by CorpITGuy View Post
    I think the posts here offer a fairly healthy assesment of the whole Apple iPhone v. Palm WM Treo debate.

    The iPhone's ultimate weakness is that it is not a true business device, and was never intended to be. It's a Smartphone for the crowd that doesn't have a corporate e-mail/PIM solution.

    The Treo's ultimate weakness is that in order for it to take advantage of the features that make it a sale for people like most of us (business users) they had to go to Windows Mobile, which (a) they have little control over the development of and (b) is simply not as innovative as Apple OS X and Palm OS (was).

    My wife just bought me an iPhone for my birthday. I've been using it for a week today. I have to say - I love it and I hate it. I want my plastic keyboard back. Yeah, I know Steve Jobs thinks it's horrible, but I do. I love having my iPod in my phone at work (and having folks unsure as to whether I'm working or playing)... But I hate the lack of real Exchange compatibility. Finally, it (unlike my Treo 750) requires two hands to operate. Yep, I know I should be more European and simply Slow. Down. But I can't. My boss expects me to keep moving.

    So, there you have it. My fun side wants to keep the iPhone, but my business side wants to give it up. Therein lies the problem for a lot of people.
    If you can deal with 2 lines, I think you can keep both the iPhone and the 750. They are both good for their purposes, which are indeed different. Or move the SIM between them, although the iPhone SIM door is hard to deal with IMO.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  20. #20  
    I do the SIM swap myself, but honestly I haven't swapped in weeks (and the SIM is in the iPhone I must say). I tried wm6 for a few days then went back to the iPhone. I just love the interface, what can I say. And I have had almost every wm device on the market.
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