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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe
    Still, there are times when you just can't beat wi-fi. My biggest reason is traveling abroad: Not much CDMA / EVDO in Europe, but there's plenty of wi-fi (although admittedly, very little of it is free - even in your hotel). Still, the consistently reliable, wider (and wider) reaching EVDO is making wi-fi use a very low priority for a lot of us here in the USA now.
    I know this is a Verizon oriented thread, but how come only Verizon users forget that others have need for DIFFERENT data connection? Wi-fi is an alternative and WORLDWIDE connection choice, so WHAT if it's a low priority to those want to use USA EVDO only??? Get it through your head please, EVERYONE ON THE PLANET DOESN'T USE OR WANT EVDO!! Wi-fi is the ONLY WORLDWIDE data connection choice as of now! I'm REALLY REALLY sick of those saying that EVDO should be my only data connection because everyone else is using it!!! Which they AREN'T, by the way!!

    And you also forget that there are GSM users who use EDGE and will probably use that new UMTS that's supposed to be coming, NOT EVDO!! Thank goodness for CHOICE!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe
    Hobbes,

    Good stories - and very much individually important. I think as the EVDO coverage continues to expand, your wi-fi stories will become less compelling, for example:

    I suspect this will continue to be the norm for Wyoming for quite some time - even in Cheyenne! I was pleased to hear they have electricity!

    I regularly travel to about 12 cities around the CONUS and just don't run into that scenario except in cases where wi-fi is also not available (like in the Pentagon, although I can pickup EVDO at Ground Zero Cafe, the center courtyard).

    I just use EVDO at my house. Although my home network might be 54MBPS (802.11g), my internet connection is still only 700Kbps - just like my EVDO. I can even access my network through my firewall if I need files.

    I would agree in situations where you have no phone signal, laptop, or local computer you can borrow, you could always use the wi-fi of the company your visiting assuming their network is unprotected / unencrypted. Otherwise there's no getting the information "FAST."

    Personally I would use EVDO at the Portland airport. It's a lot faster to connect to Verizon than it is to plug in the wi-fi card, and wait for it to establish a network connection.

    Still, there are times when you just can't beat wi-fi. My biggest reason is traveling abroad: Not much CDMA / EVDO in Europe, but there's plenty of wi-fi (although admittedly, very little of it is free - even in your hotel). Still, the consistently reliable, wider (and wider) reaching EVDO is making wi-fi use a very low priority for a lot of us here in the USA now.
    I agree with you as EVDO becomes more widely available, then WIFI becomes more useless.....but that is the key...UNTIL EVDO becomes widely available. At the moment VZ has the widest EVDO network, which does not help those on Cing, Sprint, Tmobile, etc..... And even with those on VZ and Sprint it is only in major Metro areas. So those in ID, WY, MT, Eastern OR & WA, etc (which is my District)....could have realistically have years to wait for EVDO to come to them.

    I was told by a National Sales manager for Sprint that they are rolling out their EVDO network based on the ranking of the highest Data communication Airports in the Country.

    IMHO, EVDO is great as long as:
    • widely available as cell phone coverage is now
    • it is offered by your carrier
    • available in your area (or the area you are traveling to)
    • willing to pay an extra $50 a month
    • you are not roaming
    • and you can actually get a signal due to service areas or the building you are in


    If you comply with all of the above points...great, you are set. But, if only one of the points above do not apply to you, then yes WIFI can easily become vital to getting that vital connectivity.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 01/02/2006 at 07:42 PM.
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    I know this is a Verizon oriented thread, but how come only Verizon users forget that others have need for DIFFERENT data connection? Wi-fi is an alternative and WORLDWIDE connection choice, so WHAT if it's a low priority to those want to use USA EVDO only??? Get it through your head please, EVERYONE ON THE PLANET DOESN'T USE OR WANT EVDO!! Wi-fi is the ONLY WORLDWIDE data connection choice as of now! I'm REALLY REALLY sick of those saying that EVDO should be my only data connection because everyone else is using it!!! Which they AREN'T, by the way!!
    Since you quoted me in this post, I can only assume you're directing this at me. Sorry you feel the way you do. Even after I make it clear in my post the limitations of EVDO, you still appear to react to the simple posting of some EVDO anecdotes. Since you appear to be worried about "EVERYONE ON THE PLANET," it looks like you forgot GPRS (the most widely used wireless data standard on the planet - way more so than wi-fi) - are you purposefully trying to exclude the GPRS community? I suspect not - in the same way the EVDO community is not trying to exclude anyone. I might suggest you take a step back, re-read some of these posts, and celebrate the excitement folks feel about all these new technologies coming out.

    Notice how Hobbes and I differ in our respective use of these data technologies, yet we can recognize the advantages and disadvantages of each other's viewpoint? It might be a good lesson.
  4. #44  
    But I see no advantage in constantly saying just use EVDO because it's available. What about those who don't even use CDMA and/or don't want a proprietary data plan? Yet that's all I ever see on here, people saying EVDO is available so why use anything else. THAT is what I'm saying. I never said EVDO was bad, all I'm saying is please stop saying EVDO is all we need when it isn't. EVDO only works for USA CDMA users on data plans. Everyone isn't in that group!

    But you're right, I did forget about GPRS. Thanks for reminding me!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  5. #45  
    But on this thread (700w), for the users of that phone (Verizon, only, for now), EvDo is very possibly more relevant than Wi-Fi.

    I still maintain that EvDo, on the 700w, provides more overall national connectivity, in more total geographcial coverage, than does WiFi. Yes, there are hot spots here and there, and it might be in your house/hotel/whatever, but overall - I'd bet that more miles are covered with EvDO than with Wi-Fi. And since the 700w, being the subject of this thread, and being ONLY available on Verizon's EvDO network, is what we're all talking about here, EvDO has more relevance than Wi-Fi. For now. For the users of this device.

    We'll see how it all shakes out, in the end.
  6. #46  
    But even though VZ may be launching the device, I doubt it will be the only carrier to offer it. I was just curious about their "Broadband Access" coverage and here is the map for the Northwest:

    Purple = Wireless Broadband Speed Access Coverage
    Yellow = National Cell phone access coverage
    White = No coverage

    Again, I do fully agree that EVDO is the answer....I personally cannot wait to get it and plan on using it A LOT......but it just isn't there yet as a all around solution. I think another 2 years we will see a huge difference....or maybe not....but until then all the VZ people in yellow on the map does not have access to EVDO and then is stuck with dialup speed data plans and everyone in white are roaming and have no data plans.

    EDIT: It looks like Sprint has a bigger EVDO footprint on the West than VZ does:

    http://www.sprint.com/business/produ...Portland,%20Or
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 01/03/2006 at 12:03 AM.
  7. #47  
    I pay only 15 extra per month for evdo on my BB with tethering. Nothing like streaming Slingbox while on the road. Those fighting for wifi should fight for EVDO or equivalent. Nothing like it.
  8. #48  
    That looks like really meager EVDO coverage out West. Is the East better?
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by camartin
    Those fighting for wifi should fight for EVDO or equivalent. Nothing like it.
    Its not like someone is arguing for wifi OR evdo. I think the argument is:

    1. everyone likes the evdo speeds and wants it.

    2. we want wifi as a backup for data connectivity.
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

  10. #50  
    Exactly!
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    That looks like really meager EVDO coverage out West. Is the East better?
    Here's a look at the East.
    Attached Images Attached Images
  12. slinky's Avatar
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    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by nrosser
    But on this thread (700w), for the users of that phone (Verizon, only, for now), EvDo is very possibly more relevant than Wi-Fi.

    I still maintain that EvDo, on the 700w, provides more overall national connectivity, in more total geographcial coverage, than does WiFi. Yes, there are hot spots here and there, and it might be in your house/hotel/whatever, but overall - I'd bet that more miles are covered with EvDO than with Wi-Fi. And since the 700w, being the subject of this thread, and being ONLY available on Verizon's EvDO network, is what we're all talking about here, EvDO has more relevance than Wi-Fi. For now. For the users of this device.

    We'll see how it all shakes out, in the end.
    And I still maintain that as others have said, EVDO and WiFi are NOT COMPETING technologies. I mean how many times does this have to be repeated? In addition to some of the responses above about "backup plan" there are numerous reasons why EVDO will not work for functions and areas where WiFi is clearly the only solution.

    To get this straight for those of you who are still whining about EVDO superiority because you think you're making a point that escapes the rest of us, what will your EVDO do when traveling to the many areas where EVDO doesn't exist and you need to use the hotel's/friend's/your own WiFi off the wireless router? How about looking at future/current uses of IP phones? (Personally, I don't care to replace my phone every 6 months like some of you do.) How about secure network connections to your corporate network?

    Point is don't compare the two technologies, especially since there is no excuse that Palm didn't include BOTH in the 700w.
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    And I still maintain that as others have said, EVDO and WiFi are NOT COMPETING technologies.
    Actually, they are competing technologies in areas with both wi-fi and EVDO coverage.
    what will your EVDO do when traveling to the many areas where EVDO doesn't exist and you need to use the hotel's/friend's/your own WiFi off the wireless router?
    Sadly it will do nothing - in the same way wi-fi does nothing when it's not available. Something new users need to be aware of when making their purchase decision.
    How about looking at future/current uses of IP phones?
    IP Phones work with EVDO or wi-fi, so again, having both is certainly advantageous.
    How about secure network connections to your corporate network?
    Red herring - I connect to my corporate network via my phone using VPN and EVDO - and I'm not restricted to the company's limited wi-fi range.
    Point is don't compare the two technologies, especially since there is no excuse that Palm didn't include BOTH in the 700w.
    But the 700w will likely be capable of running both (SDIO wi-fi, like I used to on the XV6600). Comparing the two technologies gives readers of this forum the opportunity to understand how both technologies might be used so they can better understand how their needs might be met. I don't understand why Palm didn't include both technologies - I would be interested in understanding what led them to that decision.
  14. Stihl's Avatar
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    #54  
    Just because there is an option for both wifi and evdo in an area does not make them competing--it means there is an option.

    I don't understand the need to argue for one or the other: the argument for both (ie wifi and evdo or its equivalent) is the only one that makes any semblance of rational sense from a consumer perspective.

    That's not even opinion. That's fact.
  15. #55  
    wow hobbs you have a lot of passion in this!!! The truth is i dont find myself without the data option most of the time where i happen to be. I understand your point and i am trying to explain mine. for me wi-fi is not a deal breaker. The deal breaker for me is WM. (That is for another thread.) I have the option and never NEEDED to use it once. You my friend may need this for your particular job/lifestyle. I do respect your argument i am just saying i could take it or leave it. thanks for the compliment on the avatar. Thats my toy!
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by td67mustang
    wow hobbs you have a lot of passion in this!!! I have the option and never NEEDED to use it once. You my friend may need this for your particular job/lifestyle.
    I think it is more of where I live vs job / lifestyle. I do have to travel a lot visiting retail locations of major chains. As you can see by the maps above there are HUGE chunks of land that have NO cell....or at the very least roaming ....let alone EVDO or at any data plans available (when roaming not data plans).

    Back east there is a pretty good blanket of coverage for at least data plans. Once you start hitting the western states of WA, OR, N CA, ID, WY, MT, NV, etc....once you stray too far from the main freeway, you are out of luck with data....no matter what carrier you are using.

    I just hate putting my responsibilities of my job on hold because a cell carrier does not provide non-roaming coverage in area while at the same time denying me WIFI access.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I think it is more of where I live vs job / lifestyle. I do have to travel a lot visiting retail locations of major chains. As you can see by the maps above there are HUGE chunks of land that have NO cell....or at the very least roaming ....let alone EVDO or at any data plans available (when roaming not data plans).

    Back east there is a pretty good blanket of coverage for at least data plans. Once you start hitting the western states of WA, OR, N CA, ID, WY, MT, NV, etc....once you stray too far from the main freeway, you are out of luck with data....no matter what carrier you are using.

    I just hate putting my responsibilities of my job on hold because a cell carrier does not provide non-roaming coverage in area while at the same time denying me WIFI access.
    Good point. I live in New England, Coveragre is great here. I do most of my work here or other major cities which also have ev-do so for me it is a non-issue and thats why i have my stance on this particular subject. yours is different and thats why you have your stance. At least you will have the option for wi-fi in the latest devices I.E. 6700, i730, 700w ect... (if your a verizon subscriber)
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by Stihl
    Just because there is an option for both wifi and evdo in an area does not make them competing--it means there is an option.

    I don't understand the need to argue for one or the other: the argument for both (ie wifi and evdo or its equivalent) is the only one that makes any semblance of rational sense from a consumer perspective.

    That's not even opinion. That's fact.
    Now this, I have to agree with!!!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  19. blee4's Avatar
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    #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by ronbo2000
    I will throw a guess, the 650 OS does not have the necessary drivers to support it?
    Yes or a better guess being the Treo 650 OS, Palm OS is a steaming pile of poo with a nice red bow tied around it.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe
    But the 700w will likely be capable of running both (SDIO wi-fi, like I used to on the XV6600).
    Just remember though...you lose your sd storage when you put the wifi card in. I agree that having the wifi option is better than nothing but its still a downer ;-)

    (and I think the 6600 has more memory than the treo w)
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

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