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  1.    #21  
    Lady Treo, calm down.

    Anyway, is doesn't EVDO exist or will exist with other CDMA phone providers?

    To me, with family only, the ration is 3 out of 5 with Verizon. The rest are Cingular and I am the only one with TMo. I guess it depends which phone companies your friends and family or people you get in touch with often uses, more on personal experience. Hence for some, the world revolves around Verizon.
  2. #22  
    I'm sorry, but I'm sick of hearing how we all need to be satisfied with EVDO alone. That's all I ever see from the wi-fi haters!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  3. #23  
    Not having a pressing need for WiFi doesn't make one a "wi-fi hater". In a perfect world, I'd have a Treo-form Smartphone with full Blackberry capabilities, CDMA/GSM capable, unlocked, a high res screen, WiFi, 6 hr talk time, and built-in GPS.

    There are phones (many outside of the US) which have one or more of these features but the Treo 700w misses several. As I mentioned earlier, it is about making trade-offs to get most of what you want in a device.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Beryl
    Not having a pressing need for WiFi doesn't make one a "wi-fi hater".
    You're right...it doesn't. But what does make a wifi-hater is someone who constantly makes the argument that evdo is all you need to stay connected. We know this approach doesnt work for everyone especially those that travel and end up having to roam or not have any network coverage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beryl
    There are phones (many outside of the US) which have one or more of these features but the Treo 700w misses several. As I mentioned earlier, it is about making trade-offs to get most of what you want in a device.
    This is quite true...Im just not convinced that leaving out wifi in a device being introduced after 2005 is a 'smart' tradeoff.
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    Everyone does not use Verizon!!!! What is wrong with you EVDO people???? You think the world revolves around Verizon and EVDO???
    No, but my world sure does! You're welcome to join it any time.

    I understand your point LT - I use my i730 wi-fi when I travel to Europe to feed my surfing, email, and Skype habits. I'm looking very seriously at the i830 for this reason ... then I won't need wi-fi because I'll have EVDO in the US and GSM digital in the rest of the world!!! Muahaha!
  6. #26  
    How much is it for data overseas? It's supposed to be quite expensive. Your calls can be covered with a pre-paid SIM, but what about getting email?
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    How much is it for data overseas? It's supposed to be quite expensive. Your calls can be covered with a pre-paid SIM, but what about getting email?
    $1.29/minute in Europe (voice or data). Even more in some Asian and African nations. Text messages $0.50 per to send, $0.05 to receive. You won't want to spend a lot of time conversing with friends at those rates - but it will be immensely convenient for work.
  8. #28  
    Kupe, you weren't able to purchase pre-paid SIMs with text messaging built-in? I got a card in Hong Kong and used there and in Beijing which included messaging at around .10 each. It also included a little WAP access within the same rates as voice (around .50/minute). I used a dumb phone but was hoping to read that a similar SIM would allow full data on a Smartphone.
  9. #29  
    I didn't use pre-paids the one time I've traveled just to simplify the expense report. Will likely do that in the future though.
  10. #30  
    I love it!... ...For a year now there has been this big "What are you talking about????? I don't need WIFI, so you REALLY don't need it too" debate. Just look at the Its Official: 4 New Smartphones in 2006 thread.

    Now that Palm is joing the market that has already offered WIFI for 2 years now, it is becoming a cool idea.

    As for me, there is a 90% chance my next phone will have WIFI built in.....which yet again will probably exclude me from buying the next gen of Treo.

    For those who say WIFI isn't important in the market today look at the long list of work related and personal experiences of why this has proven to be so vital for me (one who has had WIFI access for over 14 months now) with browsing the last couple pages of the thread link above.
  11. #31  
    Hobbes,

    I read the posts and didn't realize that there are people who actually are opposed to having WiFi as a feature on their phones. Geez-Louise! The level of passion about the issue on both sides amazes me.

    You stated a good case for a need for WiFi. I particularly understand your situation given SPCS lousy coverage (been there). I hope you and others who really need WiFi continue to have it available in the devices you want to purchase.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Beryl
    You stated a good case for a need for WiFi. I particularly understand your situation given SPCS lousy coverage (been there). I hope you and others who really need WiFi continue to have it available in the devices you want to purchase.
    We do have have SEVERAL choices today and in the near future of phones with built in WIFI.....unfortunately, it appears that Treo.....yet again....will not be among them.

    Which is the number reason why me ( a former Treo 600 owner and lover) and many of my co-workers (who are current 650 owners and lovers) have either upgraded to other non Treo devices or are seriously ready to make the jump from the Treo to another device.
  13. rkdiddy's Avatar
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    #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    Everyone does not use Verizon!!!! What is wrong with you EVDO people???? You think the world revolves around Verizon and EVDO???
    When it comes to the Treo 700w it DOES currently revolve around Verizon!

    In another 6-months it might revolve around another carrier.

    Cheers!
  14. #34  
    Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't wi fi use up alot of battery real fast? I just bought a new laptop and when I go wireless on battery power it lasts about 1 hour. On a small device like a Treo wouldnt the battery drain in 30 minutes or so? If thats the case why would anyone want wi fi?
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by newtonjack
    Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't wi fi use up alot of battery real fast? I just bought a new laptop and when I go wireless on battery power it lasts about 1 hour. On a small device like a Treo wouldnt the battery drain in 30 minutes or so? If thats the case why would anyone want wi fi?
    Wifi does take a lot of battery but if that is the only way to get your data than I would accept that...otherwise the phone would be a useless brick. :-)
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by rkdiddy
    When it comes to the Treo 700w it DOES currently revolve around Verizon!

    In another 6-months it might revolve around another carrier.

    Cheers!

    I was speaking of the reasons people use to say wi-fi isn't needed. Many on here always mention EVDO, which usually means they're using Verizon.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Again, just because you don't use it doesn't mean numersou others don't. That is the point. WiFi is not pay per use anytime you are near your own corporate network or any other free WiFi enabled area. Many cities have subsidized WiFi hotspots in major city intersections.

    But once again, you are assuming that EVDO does everything that a secure WiFi connection does, which it does NOT.

    How about this one -- WiFi/broadband phones have spread like wildfire.

    How about this one -- EVDO is $50+ per month. WiFi, which will get you access for ANY WiFi enabled device, not just your phone, is less than half of that.
    But i already pay $44.99/mo anyways. Evdo is broadband and it is fast so i dont know wi-fi is any better in that regard. I am just saying i think wi-fi is overrated. You say many city's have hotspots at major intersections. While i am driving down the highway or trying look up a phone number i dont want to try to connect to a wi-fi network when i am already connected to evdo adn can just start my browser. I already have access to a phone that has the wi-fi and i never used the feature other than to play with it. Whenever i needed the interent ev-do was there and off i went. thats my opinion.
  18. #38  
    Mustang....the reason is not to use it all the time or in place of another option, but to have it when there are no other options, which is not hard to find yourself in a situation like that.

    If you are with VZ or Sprint and have EVDO, then what happens when you travel to an area without EVDO and you are roaming with no data?

    This same question came up in the other thread I mentioned above. Here was my answer:

    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    Tim....didn't I just give 5 examples above? Having WIFI is often times not a matter of choosing it over other options, but having all options available for whatever situation you might be in. I will try to make reasons for wifi as clear and simple as possible:

    • REAL STORY: When roaming......no data plan available. Hence WIFI would be your ONLY option for data and internet connection. I was travelling in WY, roaming. My boss calls and says there is a VITAL email for me I needed for my meeting in less than 20 minutes. Luckily there was a Hilton Hotel next door (Free WIFI). I walk over into their parking lot and throw in my WIFI card (no data plan because I was roaming) and download my email with the vital info.
    • REALITY: EVDO has limited coverage. So when not in EVDO area, and in a one of thousands of free WIFI areas it is a logical fastest online option.
    • SEVERAL REAL STORIES: I am in a building (office, airport, warehouse, etc...) where I am unable to get a cell signal, but there is Free WIFI avialable. I can give dozens of real experiences with this situation.
    • REAL STORY: I am comfortable on my lounge chair on the back deck and want to check the stats of the Big Game. I don't want to hike upstairs, boot up my desktop to check. I have a personal WIFI network at home, so I want to use that instead of using 80% slower data plan.
    • REAL STORY: I am in a meeting. No EVDO. I need info from the net FAST. I don't even have a laptop with me. WIFI in office, hence time is of enhance, I choose the fastest option available.
    • REAL STORY: I am in 6th line at airport. I hear only 3 seats left. I throw in my WIFI card into my PPC-6600 (free WIFI at Portland Airport you see) jump online and book my seat. When I am 2nd in line I hear her say all sold out. I get up there and get my ticket. If left with slow data plan I would probably have missed that important flight for work.


    Here are some additional real life examples of how I have actually used my WIFI option over the last 13 months on my phone on my home WIFI network, mostly for non work related situations:
    • I don't have an iPod. No EVDO. I want to stream music from the web while I work around the house / yard.
    • I have ORB. I want to stream a movie from my Desktop for my child to entertain him while I am on the phone with my boss on my home phone.
    • My boss says he just emailed me with a large 3 mb spreadsheet. Would I want to use slow data plan or my home WIFI network to download it?
    • My wife is watching TV....my kids are working on homework on each computer I want to see the video highlights of the Tour De France that day. I use my home WIFI network to stream the video. Everyone is happy.


    See.....this is what gets me....it is not an either / or debate. It is not an all or nothing debate. It is not even about putting WIFI into the device. It IS ABOUT at the very least offering the option for a WIFI card if they choose not to include wifi in the phone. It IS NOT ABOUT using WIFI all the time. It IS ABOUT having all available options available to you in whatever situation you are in.
    Here is an additional post that might help as well:CLICK HERE

    I believe that there are two issues:

    1) providing all commonly available sources of connectivity to the customer.
    2) A business decision by Palm of possibly losing potential Treo customers (both old and new) to other branders from HTC (the same manufactuer of the Treo) that offer WIFI built into the phone.

    Here are my thoughts about Palm offering built in WIFI or not:

    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    As you stated not every customer needs WIFI, but there are also those either want it or need it. You are right in saying exactly what I said over a year ago.....Palm does need to evaluate the needs vs loss of business. I am just not sure if Palm can afford to make the wrong decision whatever it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I think the bottom line is to give the customer EVERY opportunity to get connectivity in ANY given situation he/she is in. If research shows that Wifi would NOT be supported by a majority of the customers, then at least make it an available addon to those who do want it or, more importantly, to those who NEED it.

    It is supply and demand....depending on the demand, then supply Wifi in the phone or as an addon....but the fact is, as several other threads have proved, there is a demand and there should be a supply to meet the demands of those customers.
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    If WIFI is such an issue with extremes on both ends....those who don't need it, never want to see it in their phone....and those who absolutely need it so they dump the Treo for a phone with WIFI....why don't they do the same thing as when they offer a camera model and a cameraless model? Why couldn't Palm offer a Treo and a TreoWIFI for $30-50 more? Everyone is happy, extra cost for Palm all or mostly covered, and then Palm would be able to get real hard feedback with the desire/need for WIFI once and for all. AND all customers are happy. Then these endless I need WIFI....no you don't need WIFI debates would finally end.

    EDIT: BTW...nice car in your Avatar!!!!
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 01/02/2006 at 02:38 PM.
  19. rkdiddy's Avatar
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    I was speaking of the reasons people use to say wi-fi isn't needed. Many on here always mention EVDO, which usually means they're using Verizon.
    Thanks for the clarification...I misunderstood you.

    I personally don't think I need wifi on my device. However, I do feel it SHOULD have it. There is really no reason that a business device that costs $600 and change shouldn't have all the bells the whistles...it is not like both the 6700 and 700 are manufactored by the same company or anything!!
  20. #40  
    Hobbes,

    Good stories - and very much individually important. I think as the EVDO coverage continues to expand, your wi-fi stories will become less compelling, for example:
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes
    * REAL STORY: When roaming......no data plan available. Hence WIFI would be your ONLY option for data and internet connection. I was travelling in WY, roaming. My boss calls and says there is a VITAL email for me I needed for my meeting in less than 20 minutes. Luckily there was a Hilton Hotel next door (Free WIFI). I walk over into their parking lot and throw in my WIFI card (no data plan because I was roaming) and download my email with the vital info.
    I suspect this will continue to be the norm for Wyoming for quite some time - even in Cheyenne! I was pleased to hear they have electricity!
    * SEVERAL REAL STORIES: I am in a building (office, airport, warehouse, etc...) where I am unable to get a cell signal, but there is Free WIFI avialable. I can give dozens of real experiences with this situation.
    I regularly travel to about 12 cities around the CONUS and just don't run into that scenario except in cases where wi-fi is also not available (like in the Pentagon, although I can pickup EVDO at Ground Zero Cafe, the center courtyard).
    * REAL STORY: I am comfortable on my lounge chair on the back deck and want to check the stats of the Big Game. I don't want to hike upstairs, boot up my desktop to check. I have a personal WIFI network at home, so I want to use that instead of using 80% slower data plan.
    I just use EVDO at my house. Although my home network might be 54MBPS (802.11g), my internet connection is still only 700Kbps - just like my EVDO. I can even access my network through my firewall if I need files.
    * REAL STORY: I am in a meeting. No EVDO. I need info from the net FAST. I don't even have a laptop with me. WIFI in office, hence time is of enhance, I choose the fastest option available.
    I would agree in situations where you have no phone signal, laptop, or local computer you can borrow, you could always use the wi-fi of the company your visiting assuming their network is unprotected / unencrypted. Otherwise there's no getting the information "FAST."
    * REAL STORY: I am in 6th line at airport. I hear only 3 seats left. I throw in my WIFI card into my PPC-6600 (free WIFI at Portland Airport you see) jump online and book my seat. When I am 2nd in line I hear her say all sold out. I get up there and get my ticket. If left with slow data plan I would probably have missed that important flight for work.
    Personally I would use EVDO at the Portland airport. It's a lot faster to connect to Verizon than it is to plug in the wi-fi card, and wait for it to establish a network connection.

    Still, there are times when you just can't beat wi-fi. My biggest reason is traveling abroad: Not much CDMA / EVDO in Europe, but there's plenty of wi-fi (although admittedly, very little of it is free - even in your hotel). Still, the consistently reliable, wider (and wider) reaching EVDO is making wi-fi use a very low priority for a lot of us here in the USA now.
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