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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    It wasn't generated at you although it was plural. Fired off a comment quickly and I have no beef with you and respect your usually well informed posts.

    At times the connector for the 650 doesn't make as solid contacts as the 600 and its snap into place action. You find out when you power up again...
    The LED doesnt tell you that its charging when you plug it in (and before you set it down and walk away?)

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Additionally, it might not be a rampant problem with the connector but they surely made it cheaper and designed not to last.
    If it's not as big a problem as you suggest, then why do you claim that it was not meant to last?

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    It doesn't mean it doesn't happen eventually and I see a LOT of complaints about the cable when comparing the differences between the 600 and 650.
    If this were true, how come more threads haven't popped up claiming that the connector broke (I mean the 650 has been out for a year.)

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    My point was that there really isn't any practical path going from the 650 to the 700w if you've made the investment in Palm software, which most of us have done.
    While generally this is true, there is an inherent advantage to using the same connector (as was stated by ppcmd).

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Is it better than again having to buy all new connectors, sure but this means I'm also buying all new software which is hundreds more dollars outlay and hundreds of dollars sunk and gone.
    How many treo 650 users have spent hundreds of dollars? Because there is a TON of freeware and because most apps tend to be under $15, I don't see a majority of palm users having to buy that much in software. If you don't believe me, look at the threads containing the "Top (insert number) applications for your treo." I don't see too many entries where someone has listed $200 or more in purchased software. (and for the few that do, I don't think they are the type of pda/phone user that would switch to a PPC device).

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    My disgust with Palm is being another 600 owner who had to spend $$$$ that he'll never see back when his 600 was replaced with a 650. I'm so glad that the 700w, which isn't really the successor to the 650 (and potentially the 700p) has the same connector since it rubs salt into the wounds of having a relatively new 650.
    If it's really not the successor to the 650, then why do you feel compelled to bash it (and others who may consider purchasing it). If in fact the 700w is really not for a 650 user, then why not accept it as a device

    1)to lure those PPC users to a treo form factor or
    2) those 600 users who held out for something more than the 650?

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Now I won't consider going to a 700w because I've already had a firsthand experience with the RAM underpowered 650 and it would be insanity to ask for the same problem for the third time in a row and have a perpetual RAM problem... and not have WiFi.
    At least with the 700w you have a wifi option when you need it.

    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    If I dump the Palm OS it's going to be for a phone that will reasonably give me the features that are now becoming ubiquitous in smartphones and potentially switching to Sprint due to Verizon's data raping prices...
    Well I feel your pain on the verizon pricing...one reason why I haven't switched from sprint.
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    With units now in the hands of reviewers can the release be far of?

    Surur
    2 weeks at least; maybe 3.
    MMM | AntoineRJWright.com | BH | Jaiku

    Moved on to Symbian, but still will visit from time to time.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by laugher
    Can one of you who have a 700w PLEASE tell me whether the keyboard integration with the phone and SMS functions work just (or almost) as well as the 650? i.e. ONE HANDED OPERATION and therefore, PREFERABLY without the stylus being required for these functions only.
    No stylus needed, one handed operation is excellent, with the exception of the calendar (which has 5-way support, but I don't feel it is intuative).
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Antoine of MMM
    2 weeks at least; maybe 3.
    We should hear more during CES (Jan 4-8th), but I am not sure on availability.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by marcus
    We should hear more during CES (Jan 4-8th), but I am not sure on availability.
    I imagine that it would be out by CES. The release schedule for this one seems to be pushed up a bit. I think Palm originally wanted to release during the fun of the larger CES (that I wont be going too boo hoo). VZW is usually timely with their release pages. By CES I'd expect the business customers to get it, with all other consumers getting it by end of month.
    MMM | AntoineRJWright.com | BH | Jaiku

    Moved on to Symbian, but still will visit from time to time.
  6.    #26  
    I'm sure they are rushing to capitalize on the Blackberry "crisis". Expect the Palm to come out with the MSFP (push e-mail) already installed.

    Surur
  7. #27  
    The capability is there, but unless they did a quick update to the models already pushed out, it aint going to be there. Also, to do BB-style pushing, companies/govts need to be using Server 2005 with the second release piece. That's the sticky that will make or break this device. Lots o' places dont want to move to server 05 because it breaks things (usual MS style)
    MMM | AntoineRJWright.com | BH | Jaiku

    Moved on to Symbian, but still will visit from time to time.
  8. #28  
    I guess I'm a bit confused...

    My company currently runs Outlook 2003 and I would assume Exchange 2003. Would the ability for push email be there? And how is this different than "BB-style" push email that would require Server 2005? In short, what requirements for Outlook/Exchange/Server etc. does my company need to be running for the push email feature to work?
  9.    #29  
    Its Exchange 2003 Service Pack 2 that you need. Sp2 is a free download.

    Mobile E-Mail Improvements
    SP2 offers a huge leap forward in mobility capabilities. With SP2, Exchange Server 2003 can offer a significantly improved Microsoft Outlook experience on mobile devices as well as additional security and device control. As always, the Exchange ActiveSync protocol does not require expensive software or outsourcing fees to access data on your server running Exchange Server.

    The mobility enhancements in SP2 give you:

    • New seamless Direct Push Technology e-mail experience. No longer is there a reliance on short message service (SMS) to notify and ensure that your device automatically retrieves new e-mail from your Exchange server. SP2 uses an HTTP connection, maintained by the device, to push new e-mail messages, calendar, contact, and task notifications to the device.

    • Additional data compression translating to a faster experience when sending and receiving messages and reduced sync times.

    • Additional Outlook properties, including support for task synchronization and pictures in your list of contacts. In addition, you can now look up people by using the Global Address List (GAL) over the air.

    • Greater control over device security, including:

    • Policy setting. Unlock a device with a password.

    • Local wipe. Decide how many incorrect logon attempts are permitted before your data might be at risk.

    • Remote wipe. Lost, stolen, or misplaced devices are never out of reach. You decide when it’s prudent to reset devices remotely over the Web.


    Such policies help to ensure corporate data or applications are not compromised when devices are lost or get into the wrong hands.

    • New optional support for certificate-based authentication to eliminate the need to store corporate credentials on a device.

    • Added support for Secure/Multipurpose Internet Mail Extensions (S/MIME) to sign and encrypt messages coming to and from mobile devices.


    For details about the other mobility features in Exchange Server 2003, see the Mobility in Exchange Server 2003 page.

    Most mobile e-mail improvements, with the exception of support for tasks and for pictures in contacts lists, require that your device or the software on the devices be compatible with Exchange Server 2003 SP2. Windows Mobile–based devices require the Messaging and Security Feature Pack for Windows Mobile 5.0.

    Licensees of the Exchange ActiveSync protocol can take advantage of these improvements through updates to their messaging applications or devices. The roadmap for those devices is owned and managed by the licensee.

    If you have installed Microsoft Windows Media Player, you can see the Messaging and Security Feature Pack in action:

    • View video at 5 megabits per second (Mbps)

    • View video at 2 Mbps

    • View video at 300 kilobits per second


    To see how the "heartbeat" of Direct Push Technology keeps your mobile device up to date, view screenshots of the GAL Lookup and of other features, and more, register on the Microsoft Events site to watch the Secure and Scalable Messaging with Windows Mobile 5.0 webcast.
    http://www.microsoft.com/exchange/ev.../overview.mspx

    Surur
  10. #30  
    Whoops; and now to the IT guys I go with good news
    MMM | AntoineRJWright.com | BH | Jaiku

    Moved on to Symbian, but still will visit from time to time.
  11. #31  
    A couple of points: First, what's with the dinky connector? There seems to be a long-overdue move to mini-usb...but not on the Treo?!?!? And it is lousy on the 650. Most of us just resolved ourselves to be EXTREMELY careful in connecting/disconnecting, etc. ANY movement can dislodge it. It's only benefit is to the equipment suppliers--not the users.

    And that brings me to the second point. Why would I buy another Treo? My 650 in not quite a year old (2 weeks to go!); and it has NEVER been well supported, and now it is TOTALLY abandonware. Although I SHOULD already have a firmware update to enable DIRECT PUSH...instead, Palm has decided I should buy another device.

    Well, they got it half right, I will be buying another device (and Microsoft will be getting its license money for WM5), but it won't be a Treo.
  12. #32  
    Connector Issue:

    Here I go in rant mode again. For years, I've advocated a simple USB or mini-usb standardized connector for Palm devices (no more of those exposed wire connectors or snap off wings), and I was routinely shouted down that it couldn't be done.

    Then lo and behold, HTC (Palm's ODM by the way) uses a mini-D USB connector to charge and sync all their WM devices (like my Audiovox 5600); AND, surprise, surprise, like third party USB sync/charge cables in the Palm world, will CHARGE and SYNC the 5600 (and Wizard, Universal, etc) from my IBM X40 notebook.

    So it can be done, and very elegantly to boot.
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  13. Cartman's Avatar
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    #33  
    The 700w is not a replacement for the 650. It is an alternative product. The 650 will stay on the market for a long time. Expect the replacement for the 650 anywhere from 6mo-1year from now?
  14. #34  
    Does anyone know for sure if it uses the same battery?
  15. slinky's Avatar
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    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    While generally this is true, there is an inherent advantage to using the same connector (as was stated by ppcmd).

    How many treo 650 users have spent hundreds of dollars? Because there is a TON of freeware and because most apps tend to be under $15, I don't see a majority of palm users having to buy that much in software. If you don't believe me, look at the threads containing the "Top (insert number) applications for your treo." I don't see too many entries where someone has listed $200 or more in purchased software. (and for the few that do, I don't think they are the type of pda/phone user that would switch to a PPC device).
    To get the 650 running smoothly with a few extras, you'll need to spend at least $100 for software. I'll say that 9 out of 10 freeware apps you get what you pay for. Most software costs between $10-25. But 8 apps, which is not a lot especially since the "essentials" are necessary, and you're at the $100 mark. That's not insiginifcant.

    If it's really not the successor to the 650, then why do you feel compelled to bash it (and others who may consider purchasing it). If in fact the 700w is really not for a 650 user, then why not accept it as a device

    1)to lure those PPC users to a treo form factor or
    2) those 600 users who held out for something more than the 650?
    At least with the 700w you have a wifi option when you need it.
    Well I feel your pain on the verizon pricing...one reason why I haven't switched from sprint.
    I'm bashing Palm for making the same dumb offerings. My biggest knock on the phone is the lack of RAM -- that's pathethic. The WiFi "option" wouldn't be so bad if (1) there was enough RAM to make an SD card not necessary (2) a way to prevent yourself from having to carry around an extra, easily lost SD card for general usage. I use my Treo as an audio recorder/MP3 player. The SD card must be in there even for basic usage because the 600 and 650 does not have enough RAM, and we all can agree on this. Out of the gate, they are asking to be seen as the inferior device.

    What REALLY gets me furious -- and I'll sock it to Palm until they feel a need to share information with the consumers who spent all this money on the phone -- as to who is responsible for 650 owners being unable to get WiFi on a card the same way the 700 does and other Palm devices except the Treo. If contractual obligations prevent Palm from releasing the drivers, then that's what I want to know. And I'll jump to the first carrier that authorizes Palm to release those drivers if they are the impediment...
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    To get the 650 running smoothly with a few extras, you'll need to spend at least $100 for software. I'll say that 9 out of 10 freeware apps you get what you pay for. Most software costs between $10-25. But 8 apps, which is not a lot especially since the "essentials" are necessary, and you're at the $100 mark. That's not insiginifcant.
    This has not been my experience so far with my Treo 650. Can you list the software that you consider essential to a Treo 650?
  17. slinky's Avatar
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    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rome
    This has not been my experience so far with my Treo 650. Can you list the software that you consider essential to a Treo 650?
    Butler - $15
    Volume Care $15
    Agendus/datebk - $30/25
    Resco Explorer - $15
    Resco Backup/Backup Buddy $20
    Mail Program - Snappermail/Chatter/Agendus - $40 + up
    PowerRun -$15

    Butler is a must as is Volume Care. That's $30. Backup is completely necessary since HotSync only backs up so much. Now we are up to $50. Versamail is not completely stable and also STUPIDLY has no save data to the SD card so because the RAM situation is so scarce, you need to buy a mail program that can do this. Add another $40 -- now we are up to $90. Explorer is an invaluable tool (there are others) but Palm doesn't provide you with any file manager which becomes necessary frequently, especially to pick off stray files amongst other tasks. You've now hit $105. While the built in address book works, to even compare it to something that has a modicum of features you'd expect at this day and age already is ludicrous. It's barely changed since Palm created it before the birth of Christ. The built in calendar into PPC devices blows it away. Thus I bought Agendus or you can get datebk. Still will set you back $25. Now we are at $140. Some might want Treoguard... still you see where we are at right now.

    There is no built in voice recorder even though there is a microphone. I spent $30 on Audacity. Well worth it. All the freeware took up gobs of memory and the audio is not great. That's $170.

    Let's look at some "optional" but recommended. There's PowerRun or ZLauncher which people scream as an answer to run apps off the SD card. PowerRun was created because Palm underequipped the Treo with RAM -- there's another $10-20. Want docs on your Palm? Well Docs to Go will convert docs but there is Repligo and the like does a better job with being able to see the docs and navigate on screen. Every try to read a word doc on there? Scroll right... down... left..... right... etc. Splash Wallet for numbers etc. is important or else your sensitive data is insecure. If you want a doc reader to read loads of books and other items, there's another $20. See more below:

    PocketTunes
    Verichat
    Repligo -$30
    Splash ID (or wallet)
    Documents To Go - (I bought it with the 600, v8 has PDF capability worth upgrade)
    Uninstall Manager/NeatFreak Pack $20
    Any Document Reader/Editor - Teal/iSilo - $25

    It's really simple to go into the $200 software range. I'm probably in the $300, getting invaluable software like Bonsai, Verichat, Tube, Repligo, NeatFreak Pack, Call Filter, PocketTunes, and a few more. Still, as you can see above, getting to $150 isn't too difficult, especially since Palm has done jack with the basic OS and built in apps for years... years!!!
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Butler - $15
    Volume Care $15
    Agendus/datebk - $30/25
    Resco Explorer - $15
    Resco Backup/Backup Buddy $20
    Mail Program - Snappermail/Chatter/Agendus - $40 + up
    PowerRun -$15

    Butler is a must as is Volume Care. That's $30. Backup is completely necessary since HotSync only backs up so much. Now we are up to $50. Versamail is not completely stable and also STUPIDLY has no save data to the SD card so because the RAM situation is so scarce, you need to buy a mail program that can do this. !!!

    Yes, I agree. VC, butler, resco explorer, cardexport, snapper/chatter and maybe xiino are essential to make treo 650 usable (Plus some important freewares, like autohide, keygTime, fieldplus, treotexthack.)
    Treo 750 unbranded T-mobile, HTC WIZARD 8125 T-MOBILE (broken), Treo 650 T-mobile 1.43/1.14 OS 5.4.8 Garnet (sold).
    Dell X50v, X30 624Mhz and HP ipaq h2210 h1945.

    Treo 750 hacks thread.
  19. #39  
    I don't know if it's all Palm. I'm looking at loading about minimum $100 on my PPC. I think some of it might be a matter of personal preference and needs. I never loaded anything on my Treo. It worked fine with what was on there(for what I was doing). Although if I go back to using it full time, I may load some software on there, but I'm not sure $200 worth is really needed. Maybe wanted, but not necessarily needed.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  20. #40  
    Umm...that's a highly subjective list and will vary from one user to the next. The only one on your list that I have is Snappermail, and I know that others have been content with VersaMail.
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
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