Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 56
  1. Speebs's Avatar
    Posts
    297 Posts
    Global Posts
    403 Global Posts
    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey47 View Post
    No, just tired of people whining thinking companies need to bend over backwards to meet their demands, you are not going to make a company do something that it does not want to do, nor has any legal obligation to do. It is the whole "victims society" we now live in, we no longer have to worry about our own actions we can always blame someone else.

    If you purchase a product and it does not perform as it should, then return it and get a different one. If you wait beyond the warranty period to see if it is going to get fixed, then the company has no obligation to you. Sure, shame on the company, but this is business.

    Jonathan I Ezor went on the offensive and took this issue to very high levels (see article he wrote here: http://www.precentral.net/verizon-wi...at-gps-issue-0). In the end what happened? VZW extended his 30-day Worry Free Guarantee return period. I applaud Jonathan's efforts, and I do feel that you all are getting stuck by VZW, but do something that will get their attention! Vote with your dollars!

    If you really want to make a statement, return your phone, cancel your service with them and move to a different carrier. That will be heard much more loudly at VZW than will these complaints. Everyone is going to have to make their own decision.
    I was being facetious. You must not be aware that this happened with the Blackberries and VZW ended up uncrippling them after people raised enough hell.

    It has to do with monopolizing things and deceptive advertising. It's reasonable to expect GPS to function fully for all applications on a smartphone, even though it is not explicitly stated, when the phone is advertised as a smartphone with GPS capabilities.
  2.    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by Speebs View Post
    I was being facetious. You must not be aware that this happened with the Blackberries and VZW ended up uncrippling them after people raised enough hell.

    It has to do with monopolizing things and deceptive advertising. It's reasonable to expect GPS to function fully for all applications on a smartphone, even though it is not explicitly stated, when the phone is advertised as a smartphone with GPS capabilities.
    EXCELLENT points.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Speebs View Post
    I was being facetious. You must not be aware that this happened with the Blackberries and VZW ended up uncrippling them after people raised enough hell.

    It has to do with monopolizing things and deceptive advertising. It's reasonable to expect GPS to function fully for all applications on a smartphone, even though it is not explicitly stated, when the phone is advertised as a smartphone with GPS capabilities.

    May be very true, but what was the size of the Blackberry user base that demanded this in comparison to the size of the Pre Plus user base?

    Given this, plus all the other information coming out of VZW, it appears that they are happy to just write-off the whole Palm/webOS relationship. This has been a thorn in their side.
  4. #24  
    I did this a few weeks ago when someone suggested it. I am still bugging them on Twitter, every once in a while I'll get a "what seem to be the problem with ur gps?" I'll tell them "we are looking into it". Whatever.

    We currently dont have any information on this will infrom u once we get information about gps *AB
    Last edited by squeezy; 09/24/2010 at 10:48 AM.
  5. #25  
    thorn on their side?
    well that means no matter how small a userbase we are, we can be a force to reckon with.
  6. #26  
    Doing this takes all of two minutes, about the amount of time it takes to complain in this forum that it won't work. I doubt anyone can legally force Verizon to do ANYTHING on this. However, they're expending their own resources to disable aGPS for every new WebOS build that comes along for very little benefit to them. Add some complaints to them they also need to deal with, and who knows, maybe they'll actually stop going out of their way to disable aGPS!

    There's no harm in filling out the form; why not do it?
    - Dan Butterfield (dan@butterfields.net)
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Speebs View Post
    I was being facetious. You must not be aware that this happened with the Blackberries and VZW ended up uncrippling them after people raised enough hell.

    It has to do with monopolizing things and deceptive advertising. It's reasonable to expect GPS to function fully for all applications on a smartphone, even though it is not explicitly stated, when the phone is advertised as a smartphone with GPS capabilities.

    See this is where you guys are missing the point. VZW WANTS you to be unhappy and to upgrade with them (so you resign a contract). It is their business model. BTW, an econ lesson for you folks since you seam to need it, complaining doesn't get things done, leaving the carrier does. This is why VZW does BOGO on EVERY new phone..... 2 contracts are better than 1, they will pay for the phone to lock you into a 2 year contract on a 2nd line.


    Quote Originally Posted by YankBoy View Post
    Look, as I stated in my original post, we all understand there's a chance this may not work. We don't need to be lectured like we're a bunch of ignorant cornpones on why this may not work. Why anyone even felt the need to reply to this thread explaining anything is beyond me. If you don't want to participate and file a complaint, then don't. Nobody would fault you for sitting on the sidelines. But don't bother us with your history lessons on how Verizon conducts business, why they may be legally allowed to hamper aGPS, etc. We already know all of that. I simply put this thread out there to let people know that this is an option. The absolute last thing we needed was a bunch of finger-waggers replying and shooting the idea down. I didn't ask if people thought the idea would work or not, because I don't care if anyone thinks it will work or not. It's something people can do that takes less than 10 minutes of time. The worst thing that could happen is that nothing could happen, but maybe something would happen. Who knows?
    Read what I said above, and my original post. Once again, I do not understand why you don't use the power you ACTUALLY HAVE, and take your money to another carrier. The biggest carrier isn't going to move for the smallest percentage of users (especially when they know those users will continue to re-up contracts which is where the company makes it's money). The company (whatever it is) will only notice when it starts losing its subscribers to a company that actually provides a better service to it's customers. Clearly VZW is sticking to it's business model, and will not be changing that unless it's customers actually do something (let their contracts run out and switch carriers).

    Once again, simple econ, you folks keep feeding the beast that is VZW. Not hating on VZW users, but to think they will change is simplistic and shows a lack of understanding of how the market works.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by danjb View Post
    Doing this takes all of two minutes, about the amount of time it takes to complain in this forum that it won't work. I doubt anyone can legally force Verizon to do ANYTHING on this. However, they're expending their own resources to disable aGPS for every new WebOS build that comes along for very little benefit to them. Add some complaints to them they also need to deal with, and who knows, maybe they'll actually stop going out of their way to disable aGPS!

    There's no harm in filling out the form; why not do it?

    There's no harm in taking your money to a carrier that better fits your needs since clearly VZW is not fitting yours if GPS is your issue. This would be like Sprint users filling a claim because VZW offers Mobile Hot Spot but Sprint doesn't. You speak with where you choose to spend your money, if you choose mobile hot spot over GPS for example, that is your choice and that is how you send your message. Complaining that a certain feature doesn't work as you suspected isn't going to do anything.
  9.    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    See this is where you guys are missing the point. VZW WANTS you to be unhappy and to upgrade with them (so you resign a contract). It is their business model. BTW, an econ lesson for you folks since you seam to need it, complaining doesn't get things done, leaving the carrier does. This is why VZW does BOGO on EVERY new phone..... 2 contracts are better than 1, they will pay for the phone to lock you into a 2 year contract on a 2nd line.




    Read what I said above, and my original post. Once again, I do not understand why you don't use the power you ACTUALLY HAVE, and take your money to another carrier. The biggest carrier isn't going to move for the smallest percentage of users (especially when they know those users will continue to re-up contracts which is where the company makes it's money). The company (whatever it is) will only notice when it starts losing its subscribers to a company that actually provides a better service to it's customers. Clearly VZW is sticking to it's business model, and will not be changing that unless it's customers actually do something (let their contracts run out and switch carriers).

    Once again, simple econ, you folks keep feeding the beast that is VZW. Not hating on VZW users, but to think they will change is simplistic and shows a lack of understanding of how the market works.
    There's a little thing called a "2 year contract" that I agreed to based on Verizon'sd deceitful advertising.
  10. #30  
    Exactly my point.... ohhh and you might be better off trying to get out of your contract based on your phone not living up to VZWs "deceitful advertising." Thank you for making my point.
  11. Speebs's Avatar
    Posts
    297 Posts
    Global Posts
    403 Global Posts
    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey47 View Post
    May be very true, but what was the size of the Blackberry user base that demanded this in comparison to the size of the Pre Plus user base?

    Given this, plus all the other information coming out of VZW, it appears that they are happy to just write-off the whole Palm/webOS relationship. This has been a thorn in their side.
    Are you seriously suggesting that simply because we are in the minority, we should just keep quiet?? Verizon is dicking over customers. Why is it relevant whether it's 1, 100, or 10000?
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    See this is where you guys are missing the point. VZW WANTS you to be unhappy and to upgrade with them (so you resign a contract). It is their business model....
    This may be right from a corporate macro-economics perspective, but if you think every action taken in a big corporation is driven by a careful analysis of corporate macro-economics, you may be missing the point. Just as many or more small decisions get made based on misunderstandings, inertia ("we've always done this"), and sub-optimal decision making ("this makes my job easier, even though it's not the best for the company').

    This aGPS thing with Palm has the feeling of something like this... after all, they don't do it for any Android phone, a far larger segment of their population. They also don't do it for some of their niche special purpose phones. This is some historical decision from a year ago when Palm's outlook was brighter by someone who misunderstood what aGPS gets used for. It is now being mindlessly repeated for every new WebOS release because no one is re-examining it, exactly because WebOS is not considered an important platform to Verizon.

    Enough complaints, though, and maybe the irritation factor triggers someone in support to suggest removal of the restriction just to stop the headache of having to deal with them. It's worth a try.
    - Dan Butterfield (dan@butterfields.net)
  13.    #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    Exactly my point.... ohhh and you might be better off trying to get out of your contract based on your phone not living up to VZWs "deceitful advertising." Thank you for making my point.
    I don't want to upgrade and sign a new contract. I want THEM to live up their own terms on the contract I have right now. Also, I don't have good Sprint or AT&T coverage at my current house, so paying an early termination fee and storming off to another carrier would only hurt me.
  14.    #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by danjb View Post
    This may be right from a corporate macro-economics perspective, but if you think every action taken in a big corporation is driven by a careful analysis of corporate macro-economics, you may be missing the point. Just as many or more small decisions get made based on misunderstandings, inertia ("we've always done this"), and sub-optimal decision making ("this makes my job easier, even though it's not the best for the company').

    This aGPS thing with Palm has the feeling of something like this... after all, they don't do it for any Android phone, a far larger segment of their population. They also don't do it for some of their niche special purpose phones. This is some historical decision from a year ago when Palm's outlook was brighter by someone who misunderstood what aGPS gets used for. It is now being mindlessly repeated for every new WebOS release because no one is re-examining it, exactly because WebOS is not considered an important platform to Verizon.

    Enough complaints, though, and maybe the irritation factor triggers someone in support to suggest removal of the restriction just to stop the headache of having to deal with them. It's worth a try.
    Exactly.
  15. Speebs's Avatar
    Posts
    297 Posts
    Global Posts
    403 Global Posts
    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    See this is where you guys are missing the point. VZW WANTS you to be unhappy and to upgrade with them (so you resign a contract). It is their business model. BTW, an econ lesson for you folks since you seam to need it, complaining doesn't get things done, leaving the carrier does. This is why VZW does BOGO on EVERY new phone..... 2 contracts are better than 1, they will pay for the phone to lock you into a 2 year contract on a 2nd line.




    Read what I said above, and my original post. Once again, I do not understand why you don't use the power you ACTUALLY HAVE, and take your money to another carrier. The biggest carrier isn't going to move for the smallest percentage of users (especially when they know those users will continue to re-up contracts which is where the company makes it's money). The company (whatever it is) will only notice when it starts losing its subscribers to a company that actually provides a better service to it's customers. Clearly VZW is sticking to it's business model, and will not be changing that unless it's customers actually do something (let their contracts run out and switch carriers).

    Once again, simple econ, you folks keep feeding the beast that is VZW. Not hating on VZW users, but to think they will change is simplistic and shows a lack of understanding of how the market works.
    Why would I go to another carrier if VZW was the one that had the Pre Plus that I wanted? Also, if I just switched to another carrier, then I wouldn't really care what happened at VZW anymore. Bad publicity is a bigger enemy than a handful of people defecting, anyway.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    There's no harm in taking your money to a carrier that better fits your needs since clearly VZW is not fitting yours if GPS is your issue.
    This statement assumes GPS is the only factor I consider in choosing a carrier. It's one of maybe 20 factors, and it's not even near the top. Don't be annoyed, though, if I wish there weren't an artificial restriction on it by the carrier that wins out on all those more important factors.

    Incidentally, when I signed up for my 2 year plan with Verizon, I had not heard there was an artificial GPS restriction, and don't remember if I figured it out within the 30 day window to get out of my plan. Even when I did figure it out, I assumed it was a simple bug that would be fixed with the next WebOS release since of course Verizon never told me they had deliberately removed the feature, even when I asked them about it. I'm stuck now, unless I want to pay the ETF. Switching carriers is not an option, even if I wanted to.
    - Dan Butterfield (dan@butterfields.net)
  17. #37  
    All of this and VZW has publicly stated they see a security issue with the way WebOS handles location services (I agree with all of you this is bull), but this IS the way they run their business. Especially considering this is a device they are reportedly going to EOL, you really think they will change their stance on this?

    Once again, showing them how you feel with your cash is the ONLY way to make a point. They aren't going to get annoyed by a handful of complaints on an EOL device that they have publicly stated they have "security concerns" with and change the way they operate their business.

    As I said above, your time would be better spent taking this issue to top tier customer service and attempting to get out of your contract based on the false promises you feel VZW gave you.

    @Speebs, bad publicity????? Really you think (in your words) a "handful of people" complaining is bad publicity??? Seriously, once again, you don't understand a small number of complaints that won't ever even reach VZW while you are still over paying for VZW service under contract (and continuing to sign contracts) is bigger than the "bad publicity" you are dreaming of. Once again an EOL device VZW never attempted to push.... nobody is going to care even if this gets "big" because at this moment the majority of people going to VZW aren't looking at Palm phones and VZW hasn't been looking to push WebOS devices. It's a no lose for VZW in the "publicity" department.
  18. Speebs's Avatar
    Posts
    297 Posts
    Global Posts
    403 Global Posts
    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    @Speebs, bad publicity????? Really you think (in your words) a "handful of people" complaining is bad publicity??? Seriously, once again, you don't understand a small number of complaints that won't ever even reach VZW while you are still over paying for VZW service under contract (and continuing to sign contracts) is bigger than the "bad publicity" you are dreaming of. Once again an EOL device VZW never attempted to push.... nobody is going to care even if this gets "big" because at this moment the majority of people going to VZW aren't looking at Palm phones and VZW hasn't been looking to push WebOS devices. It's a no lose for VZW in the "publicity" department.
    The whole point of these threads is to grow from a handful of people into more than a handful. And yes, I do think that bad publicity is worse to VZW than losing a few thousand dollars that they never needed in the first place. The goal is to actually turn this into bad publicity. I don't see what the harm is in trying. Dan makes some excellent points above as to why it's not so simple to jump ship in the middle of a contract on an otherwise decent carrier.

    Even if this is completely ineffective and based solely on the principle of a company doing right by its customers, it is worth doing.
  19. #39  
    FYI there are many apps that are paid for or free out there for Pre that rely on the GPS service that should be there in my opinion. Granted I'm not a Verizon customer but my husband is thus he added to the 'complaint' about it. The phone is fully capable as evidenced by Sprint and AT&T.

    Another issue is that Verizon doesn't allow TV to be broadcast on the Pre+ either. We know that it is capable. Sprint has it (not sure about AT&T). He'd even pay for the service but Verizon doesn't permit it (last I knew the original Droid couldn't and not sure if subsequent versions of the Droid can).
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    Read what I said above, and my original post. Once again, I do not understand why you don't use the power you ACTUALLY HAVE, and take your money to another carrier.
    Most of people are locked in with a $300 disconnect fee on the smart/data plan.
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions