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  1. #21  
    I have the idea that the op is young and has not gone through what many of us old folks have. With that thought
    Sirenwails - I get the feeling like some here have touched on, that you have messed around with some desktop computers. Upgraded a card and some chips here and there. It does work. The main reason is that there are two MAIN (there are others) "consumer" operating systems. The components are made with those in mind and come with the drivers and parts to make them work. Most today are plug and play. Phones are a whole different tone. A chip or component is made and the owner of the operating system has to figure on a way to make it work. Many people may be involved to write code just to make a single chip "play nice" with the others. There is no real after market for the parts so almost ALL parts will be top dollar. That is even if you can get one. Most of the faster chips are in such demand that companies like Apple, HTC, LG, Samsung etc... can't get them sometimes. That means that there is NO WAY that any of us here may get some of the parts. I for one love the idea's you have but forget about getting the components, save the high dollars and the chance the it may never work while if it did work it would be past it's time. Just find a good ear at HPalm and let them know what you think.

    Take a look at the EVO. It is a wonderful phone. The demand it there BUT it is in such short supply because of one part. The 4.3" screen. With all the navs and mini monitors being made today the screen can't be made fast enough. Thus, VERY low supply of EVO's. Do you really think they would talk to any of us?
    Last edited by Finally Pre; 08/18/2010 at 08:39 PM.
    Sprint: 2-TouchPad 32g, Frank.-Pre-2, Pre-, MiFi & 1-LG Lotus with Xlink tied to home handsets. Backups: 650 & 700wx

    HP Please release the CDMA Pre3 phones!
    We want them!!!
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by sirenwails View Post
    is there no one on this portal that are hardware literate?
    anyone know where i might shoot my ideas elsewhere?
    There's a question that needs to be asked and answered first.

    Do you have tens of millions, maybe hundreds of millions to spend on R&D?

    If not, let it go.

    If you do, read on.



    Smartphones are not desktop computers. They don't operate on standards like ATX where parts are interchangeable. The reason you can swap out a com board from a Pre/Pixi to a Pro+/Pixi+ is because Palm designed it that way. They didn't do it so we could hack hardware, but to minimize manufacturing costs. Every Pre Plus can be built on the same assembly lines, and just put in different com boards depending on what carrier it's for rather than having separate lines for each carrier. It is a logical fallacy to assume that because this one particular part is interchangeable that you can simply build your own phone.

    The processors in smartphones are not for sale one at a time. There is no newegg.com of cell phone hardware. Companies like Palm put out requests for bids, and buy tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of processors at a time. The processors used for prototyping are only available because the manufacturers know that they'll get their cost back when prototyping is finished and Palm orders a quarter of a million units.



    As far as the mechanics of Frankensteining a phone, you're stuck again. The CPU's are not socketed. They're soldered and integrated. So, you can't simply remove one. It takes highly specialized (and highly expensive) equipment to do. Once you have the equipment (probably only a few million dollars) you will still be stuck with the fact that the CPU and chipset are all intended to be used together, not mixed and matched.

    On more time with feeling, cell phones are not ATX. There is no interchangeability standard.


    Now, let's just assume that you have the millions of dollars to spend on specialized equipment, clean rooms, training, hardware and all the other assorted costs, you then have to deal with the fact that what you're doing is illegal in most countries. In the US, it's called the FCC. You're also potentially looking at all sorts of copyright and patent issues if you go beyond personal use with any of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by VeeDubb65 View Post
    It is as if you said that the result a dog and a cat mating was a giraffe. It's so completely wrong, that it's difficult to argue with someone who believes it to be true.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by sirenwails View Post
    i planned on popping android on it for the meantime

    im not too sure how it could 10000$. doesnt the iphone cost like 89$ to make or something?
    Research and development costs hundreds of thousands of $'s.

    Nokie spent $65 billion making the first phone
    http://<font color="Navy">Poll: Requ...r webOS</font>

    Coming soon-Calm Alarm
    Quote Originally Posted by SirataXero View Post
    Palm Pimp.
    Comes with 2 free Pixis.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by imop45 View Post
    Research and development costs hundreds of thousands of $'s.

    Nokie spent $65 billion making the first phone
    Exactly.

    Think of it this way:

    The average cost of producing a cheeseburger at Burger King is $1.19 (Yeah, I know it's on the dollar menu. That's a whole separate discussion)

    They are able to get the costs that low by buying everything in HUGE quantities and operating very efficiently.

    However, let's look at what you'd have to do if you wanted to make a double cheeseburger at home.

    1. Buy some ground beef or a package of frozen burger patties.
    2. Buy a package of buns.
    3. Buy some cheese.
    4. Buy a bottle of ketchup
    5. A jar of pickles
    6. bottle of mustard.
    7. A BBQ to cook them on.
    8. A full set of BBQ tools.
    9. Fuel for your new grill.


    If you do all that to make a single cheese burger, depending on the quality of BBQ and BBQ tools you buy, you could easily be looking at a $1000.00 double-cheeseburger.

    Now, if you buy in bulk and make cheeseburgers every weekend, all summer long and your grill lasts you for several years, and you make enough burgers at one time that you're not wasting a lot of charcoal, than eventually you'll get down to $1.19 (or less) for the cost of each burger, and they'll be WAY better. However, that's of no use or importance when your goal is to make just one.

    The same applies to a DIY cell phone.
    Quote Originally Posted by VeeDubb65 View Post
    It is as if you said that the result a dog and a cat mating was a giraffe. It's so completely wrong, that it's difficult to argue with someone who believes it to be true.
  5. #25  
    The reason that companies can make an iPhone for $200 is because they did all the research and prototyping before hand.

    To build a prototype phone costs hundreds of millions of dollars (same with the XBox), it's the R&R that is expensive, but the reason for it is to determine what is needed, and what will work best for cheapest.

    Getting custom built parts is an expensive process as well. Once you have a final design down you can then easily build molds for quick mass production, but building each individual part requires a bit of dough. Though that cost may be quickly shrinking due to the advent of the 3D printer.
  6. MNotar91's Avatar
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    #26  
    It was fun reading some of the intelligent posts in this tread. After reading them, I think to myself... The basics of some of the previous posts are great explanations of general business. Most of the explanations made more sense than a few of the business textbooks I remember going through a few semesters ago in college.
  7. onebelow0's Avatar
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    28 Global Posts
    #27  
    [QUOTE=VeeDubb65;2614977]There's a question that needs to be asked and answered first.

    Do you have tens of millions, maybe hundreds of millions to spend on R&D?

    If not, let it go.

    If you do/[QUOTE], Can I have a gift? Large, non sequential bills please. (Those csi guys on tv tell me that is what I need)
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by VeeDubb65 View Post
    There's a question that needs to be asked and answered first.

    Do you have tens of millions, maybe hundreds of millions to spend on R&D?

    If not, let it go.

    If you do, read on.



    Smartphones are not desktop computers. They don't operate on standards like ATX where parts are interchangeable. The reason you can swap out a com board from a Pre/Pixi to a Pro+/Pixi+ is because Palm designed it that way. They didn't do it so we could hack hardware, but to minimize manufacturing costs. Every Pre Plus can be built on the same assembly lines, and just put in different com boards depending on what carrier it's for rather than having separate lines for each carrier. It is a logical fallacy to assume that because this one particular part is interchangeable that you can simply build your own phone.

    The processors in smartphones are not for sale one at a time. There is no newegg.com of cell phone hardware. Companies like Palm put out requests for bids, and buy tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of processors at a time. The processors used for prototyping are only available because the manufacturers know that they'll get their cost back when prototyping is finished and Palm orders a quarter of a million units.



    As far as the mechanics of Frankensteining a phone, you're stuck again. The CPU's are not socketed. They're soldered and integrated. So, you can't simply remove one. It takes highly specialized (and highly expensive) equipment to do. Once you have the equipment (probably only a few million dollars) you will still be stuck with the fact that the CPU and chipset are all intended to be used together, not mixed and matched.

    On more time with feeling, cell phones are not ATX. There is no interchangeability standard.


    Now, let's just assume that you have the millions of dollars to spend on specialized equipment, clean rooms, training, hardware and all the other assorted costs, you then have to deal with the fact that what you're doing is illegal in most countries. In the US, it's called the FCC. You're also potentially looking at all sorts of copyright and patent issues if you go beyond personal use with any of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by VeeDubb65 View Post
    Exactly.

    Think of it this way:

    The average cost of producing a cheeseburger at Burger King is $1.19 (Yeah, I know it's on the dollar menu. That's a whole separate discussion)

    They are able to get the costs that low by buying everything in HUGE quantities and operating very efficiently.

    However, let's look at what you'd have to do if you wanted to make a double cheeseburger at home.

    1. Buy some ground beef or a package of frozen burger patties.
    2. Buy a package of buns.
    3. Buy some cheese.
    4. Buy a bottle of ketchup
    5. A jar of pickles
    6. bottle of mustard.
    7. A BBQ to cook them on.
    8. A full set of BBQ tools.
    9. Fuel for your new grill.


    If you do all that to make a single cheese burger, depending on the quality of BBQ and BBQ tools you buy, you could easily be looking at a $1000.00 double-cheeseburger.

    Now, if you buy in bulk and make cheeseburgers every weekend, all summer long and your grill lasts you for several years, and you make enough burgers at one time that you're not wasting a lot of charcoal, than eventually you'll get down to $1.19 (or less) for the cost of each burger, and they'll be WAY better. However, that's of no use or importance when your goal is to make just one.

    The same applies to a DIY cell phone.
    Wow, VeeDub DOMINATES the Intelligence Award for this thread. Those were two very well written posts that anyone who thought this idea would work should consider. The cheeseburger one was a great analogy. Kudos.
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