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  1.    #1  
    I looked at the "How good/bad is my battery" thread and reading some of the replies brought up a question I have regarding the battery.

    I often stream music through my phone when I'm in my office. I typically plug my phone into my computer while doing so, so that the battery doesn't die. Am I hurting my battery by having it 'charge' while streaming?

    Am I better off streaming music, and when battery gets low, i.e. 20% or less, then charge it? I would guess I would probably charge it off a touchstone then, since I think the Touchstone will charge faster than my the connection to the computer via usb. Perhaps I should stream music while on a Touchstone, instead of connected to my computer.

    I guess I could just bring in a radio and deal with commercials, but I like using Pandora & AccuRadio better than radio stations (and we can't stream over wokr computers, so that option is out).

    Anyone have any input? What I don't want to happen is stream music for awhile, get called into a meeting, have phone at 20% or less and then have it die. I also don't want to unnecessarily kill my battery by having it continously charge.

    My battery charge cap % is 91.40625 (on a 1183.125 cap stock battery). Battery is about 6 months old.

    Thanks!
  2. #2  
    Not much of a decision for me. I constant touchstone charge and stream Ampache in my car. As you stated, you can't predict an emergency when you might need your phone to have a decent charge. It might be shortening the life of the battery, but spare batteries are cheap compared to being stuck in a bad situation with a dead phone.
  3. #3  
    I would suggest opening the slider and positioning the Pre where there is good airflow across the device (a small desk fan works wonders).

    You would be amazed at the difference in battery temp levels just by creating a little airflow.

    My guess is you won't keep the Pre all the way to the end of the batteries life cycle anyway and even if you did kill one quickly as Mordbane points out, they aren't that expensive.

    I keep mine on a TS all day at my desk, all night while sleeping and in my car anytime I am driving. I even have one that is a floater for when I am doing battery intensive stuff while sitting in the living room or when I am traveling (ie. staying in hotels).

    The only one I keep a fan near is the one on my desk. The one in my car is mounted on a vent mount, so it gets nice cold A/C air.
    Last edited by pastorrich1; 07/30/2010 at 08:40 AM. Reason: no spell checker
  4. #4  
    It's better for Li-ion batteries to stay charged up. They have a limited charge/discharge cycle. No reason to run it down of you can stick it on a charge. But opening it up, like pastorrich said, will help keep the temps down, especially if you are overclocking.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by gapost View Post
    It's better for Li-ion batteries to stay charged up. They have a limited charge/discharge cycle. No reason to run it down of you can stick it on a charge.
    Yes they do have a limited charge/discharge cycle, but even keeping it on a charger all the time is still using up the cycles. Li-ion charger circuits have a cut-off point when they are fully charged to prevent overheating (which creates oxygen discharge) and could result in fire/explosion since the high oxygen concentration inside of a battery compartment feeds a fire. But they also have a threshold where they come back on and charge again. Let's assume that threshold is after a 2% discharge. This means your Pre charger will constantly cycle in the 2% range. So after 50 of these cycles you will have completed one full charge cycle.
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by pastorrich1 View Post
    Yes they do have a limited charge/discharge cycle, but even keeping it on a charger all the time is still using up the cycles. Li-ion charger circuits have a cut-off point when they are fully charged to prevent overheating (which creates oxygen discharge) and could result in fire/explosion since the high oxygen concentration inside of a battery compartment feeds a fire. But they also have a threshold where they come back on and charge again. Let's assume that threshold is after a 2% discharge. This means your Pre charger will constantly cycle in the 2% range. So after 50 of these cycles you will have completed one full charge cycle.
    You can watch this cycle in /var/log/messages (with terminal or ssh):
    tail -f /var/log/messages | grep BATTERY_IPC
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by somline View Post
    You can watch this cycle in /var/log/messages (with terminal or ssh):
    tail -f /var/log/messages | grep BATTERY_IPC
    But switching the cycle threshold will not reduce the number of full cycles your Pre experiences.

    50 @ 2% = 100% = one full cycle
    25 @ 4% = 100% = one full cycle
    10 @ 10% = 100% = one full cycle

    It doesn't matter how often it performs the charge/discharge cycle it will still accumulate full cycles at the same cumulative rate.
  8. #8  
    my battery experience last night on stock sprint pre: streamed radiotime on approx 40 min drive home with phone off charge. I was at less than 30% when I started. By time I got home I was at 0%. Funny part, phone ran another 95min before going dead, only lite use no stream/net use. Some quik calc and task use + kept turning on screen to see if it was dead. I had feeling batt monitor was off but not that much,wow. Have been seeing a fast drain in past month, do use quite heavily as pre is only connect to net. Gaveup landline and dsl long ago.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by garos09 View Post
    my battery experience last night on stock sprint pre: streamed radiotime on approx 40 min drive home with phone off charge. I was at less than 30% when I started. By time I got home I was at 0%. Funny part, phone ran another 95min before going dead, only lite use no stream/net use. Some quik calc and task use + kept turning on screen to see if it was dead. I had feeling batt monitor was off but not that much,wow. Have been seeing a fast drain in past month, do use quite heavily as pre is only connect to net. Gaveup landline and dsl long ago.
    Go check this thread out...

    http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pr...r-battery.html
  10. #10  
    I would say keep it on the charger becaused the battery drain is tremendous when streaming music. You are talking internet usage, speaker playing, display on, etc.
    The only draw back is heat. If your phone is overclocked then you will need to be careful because I believe it gets hotter charging. There are some measures for that too tho.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by pastorrich1 View Post
    But switching the cycle threshold will not reduce the number of full cycles your Pre experiences.

    50 @ 2% = 100% = one full cycle
    25 @ 4% = 100% = one full cycle
    10 @ 10% = 100% = one full cycle

    It doesn't matter how often it performs the charge/discharge cycle it will still accumulate full cycles at the same cumulative rate.
    Is it possible for the Pre to ever use power directly from the charger and not be cycling the battery? Or does it always take power from the battery and the charger just pushes charge back in? Or is it possible that the Touchstone is always charging the battery and the USB cable is applying power directly to the system?
    Palm III-->Handspring Visor-->Sony Clie PEG-NR70-->no PDA -->Palm Treo 755p-->Palm Pre-->HP Veer
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    Is it possible for the Pre to ever use power directly from the charger and not be cycling the battery? Or does it always take power from the battery and the charger just pushes charge back in? Or is it possible that the Touchstone is always charging the battery and the USB cable is applying power directly to the system?
    Technically, I don't know.

    Practically however the battery would have to be removed from the device and the Pre still function while plugged into the USB port. I haven't tried it.

    EDIT.. if there were some way to switch from battery power to AC and back using some sort of command script solution, that would be cool.
    Last edited by pastorrich1; 07/30/2010 at 08:56 AM. Reason: thinking out loud
  13. #13  
    Okay... just tried it, and it doesn't work. You get the white battery with a question mark image on the screen.

    It might be able to be spoofed somehow but someone would have to make a non-battery-battery place holder with the contacts and whatever other info to fool the phone.

    Probably the most realistic and practical solution would be the A/C / Battery power software switch within the OS.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by pastorrich1 View Post
    Okay... just tried it, and it doesn't work. You get the white battery with a question mark image on the screen.

    It might be able to be spoofed somehow but someone would have to make a non-battery-battery place holder with the contacts and whatever other info to fool the phone.

    Probably the most realistic and practical solution would be the A/C / Battery power software switch within the OS.
    You may try to set to variables in: /var/preferences/com.palm.power/powerd.conf

    In section [battery]

    fake_battery = true
    disable_charging = true

    and reboot.

    (Not tested but found in powerd)
    but I think this is kind of over the top.
    Last edited by somline; 07/30/2010 at 10:26 AM.
  15. #15  
    Keep the phone on the charger. I charge mine whenever I get the chance, especially when I am streaming music. Battery life on these things suck, so keep it charged. That simple. Save yourself the headache and likely negligible gains of doing anything else.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by somline View Post
    You may try to set to variables in: /var/preferences/com.palm.power/powerd.conf

    In section [battery]

    fake_battery = true
    disable_charging = true

    and reboot.

    (Not tested but found in powerd)
    but I think this is kind of over the top.
    If it didn't work, would it still boot and function with the battery in?

    Then if it did work, while it may seem over the top, it could prove to be a good way to help manage heat while using the device for MHS/Tethering and other radio intensive heat producing circumstances where you have AC or DC power available.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by stung View Post
    Keep the phone on the charger. I charge mine whenever I get the chance, especially when I am streaming music. Battery life on these things suck, so keep it charged. That simple. Save yourself the headache and likely negligible gains of doing anything else.
    I do the same. Open the slider to get some air on the battery.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by pastorrich1 View Post
    If it didn't work, would it still boot and function with the battery in?

    Then if it did work, while it may seem over the top, it could prove to be a good way to help manage heat while using the device for MHS/Tethering and other radio intensive heat producing circumstances where you have AC or DC power available.
    Actually I don't know. I just found this in powerd.
    I'm on holidays in Austria now, so I can try it end of next week ;-)
    It would be interesting, but I don't see the reason.
    Buy a spare battery for 10$ and leave it on the TS.

    EDIT: I don't overclock so maybe this is the reason?
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by somline View Post
    Actually I don't know. I just found this in powerd.
    I'm on holidays in Austria now, so I can try it end of next week ;-)
    It would be interesting, but I don't see the reason.
    Buy a spare battery for 10$ and leave it on the TS.

    EDIT: I don't overclock so maybe this is the reason?
    Thanks. I might try it later just out of curiosity. I don't have issues but it seems there are alot of folks that might find this option useful.

    Enjoy your time in Austria. I will be there for a month coming up in the middle of September. Currently looking for a gently used GSM Pre that I can put a prepaid Austrian SIM in and recover my Palm Profile while there. I'm with Sprint and my CDMA is only good on wifi when I am there.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by somline View Post
    You may try to set to variables in: /var/preferences/com.palm.power/powerd.conf

    In section [battery]

    fake_battery = true
    disable_charging = true

    and reboot.

    (Not tested but found in powerd)
    but I think this is kind of over the top.
    Ok... I tested it.

    1. The Pre will not boot without a battery installed, the system has to think there is one. Changing "fake_battery" to = true didn't appear to do anything. My first thought is this would prevent the device from drawing on the battery for power and look for an external source instead. But the fake battery most likely is the wired external source of power and the power just comes through the case contacts.

    2. Changing the "disable_charging" to = true, definitely disables charging. It doesn't appear however to switch the Pre to an external power mode of some sort. The battery still drains. Although you still get the charging notification and symbol.

    3. I got a bit nervous because I am at work and cannot connect my Pre to my work computer via USB, and it hung on the first boot within the first 5 Palm pulses. I pulled the battery and tried again, this time it booted up.

    So, unless you actually have a fake battery power source (and Palm must use one somewhere in development or diagnostics for it to be in the powerd.conf) this is a no go from this angle.
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