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  1. TheMacs's Avatar
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    #41  
    Good post cobrakon.

    To paraphrase Darwin, it's not the strongest nor the most inteligent that survive - it's the ones most responsive to change.

    Like premordial, I have similar issues with WebOS ("universal" search my azz). But it is PalmOS' replacement, so I'm dealing with the negatives, while loving the positives.

    Ulitmately I'm glad your data was recovered premordial. I've had similar (albeit not quite as bad) scenarios upgrading devices in the past, so I feel your pain. But others are right - moving away from Classic is the best move. Figuring out how to best do that for your situation is up to you. Good luck!
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by premordial View Post
    Oh. Yeah. Of course. Coming right up.

    Where were you when I needed your help, anyways?
    I got a few answers, you can pick:

    1. Speaking through others

    2. Swimming

    3. Same place you would of been if I'd asked a similar question

    4. Thinking how i'm going to spend the hundred.

    5. Typing up step, by step instructions with images, and a video tutorial in 19 different languages.


    or that was the first time I ran into the thread..


    Either way, I'm from North Korea, so Unless you want to further damage international relationships, you'll give me the hundred... (i'm actually born and raised in Canada, but wanted to try to be funny, come on, laugh, so I don't get depressed)
  3.    #43  
    Bwah!!
  4.    #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    I think you misunderstand the "cloud" aspect of the paradigm as "active" when it is in fact passive and a "backup". All data lives and is used directly on the device while the cloud provides your backup endpoint.
    Well, we can only judge the cloud by what we've experienced. If "ALL data lives and is used directly on the device," why is it impossible to use webOS like we use palmOS? I'm talking about a simple function like a calendar search to pull up important notes about a past customer interaction, say, 6 months ago. The achille's heel of the cloud is that it can't be done. Out of necessity, searches via the cloud (such as with google calendar) have to be limited either chronologically, by size, or both. Palm level 3 told me that palm currently uses one month back and two months forward for calendar note display. You still can't search 'em, but they won't even display them beyond a certain rolling date.

    In our business over the years, we have brokered hundreds of products, from dozens of manufacturers, to more than 10,000 customers who may randomly call and order at any time, day or night. They may not have ordered anything from us for years and then, suddenly, they want to order. We've recorded sales and customers so many different ways over the years that they may, or may not, have been entered as a contact into palmOS. With palmOS it doesn't matter. If the phone number is recognized; golden--we just happily greet them by their name, and oftentimes blow them away by picking up the conversation where the notes say it was left off several years ago. This is instantaneous, mind you, with or without cellular internet coverage, outages, or delays.

    Since many of our customers were never profiled as a contact, it still doesn't matter with PalmOS. We get a phone call, and, while the phone is ringing, we can pick up a treo, enter password to open, press the find shortcut, enter the incoming phone number, and usually answer the phone with the caller's name by the third ring. If the search has brought up too many matches, we'll ask the customer to please hold, we choose from the searches, and, seconds later, we answer and still blow them away with personalized service and recognition. They never forget. So, yeah, those nanoseconds matter.

    By the way, we have tried to use the Pre this way, and it is IMPOSSIBLE. Our first clue was when people would simply hang up during webOS calendar searches that were taking more than 2 minutes. As we now know, 14 months after the launch of webOS, it was wrong to have ever assumed the Pre would be a replacement for palmOS.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    Not sure what your business is, but rest assured that I have client contact information in the 1000's going back to the mid 90's one my phone and have "order history" data exported from the databases on my Centro into csv, then into .xls and living on "Docs" on my Pre. Customer names were replaced with "Cust_ID" and this number is "Nickname" in the contacts db. Works like a charm. While true it doesn't search all fields, it searches the ones that really matter; First\Last name (any combo), Company name, Phone#, Email, Nickname.
    That's nice, but it wouldn't work for us, as we must be able to instantaneously search all fields, and all characters within fields.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    You know who you're clients are so your not trying to search ambiguous data for them.
    No, we don't know who all our clients are, but THEY think we do because of palmOS. Do you know how many people 10,000 is? It's so huge that we can't even afford to have all of this data re-entered in a more standardized format. Nor will we need to, as long as there is an OS that operates like the old palmOS. Someone will come up with one...

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    And everyone works different, but why would you need data from old meetings?
    Old meetings? We used the DB+/palmOS calendar for years as a permanent repository of customer information--typically loading up all notes under the very first date of contact for a customer (unfortunately, this fact alone eliminates webOS/Google as an option for us, as stated in my previous posts, since OTA searches are incredibly slow and cannot provide the utility of drilled-down searching).

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    There should be minutes or updated documentation for client information not fragmented bits here and there in calendar entries regardless if it was retrieved in nanoseconds.
    Excuse me? You can tell me how our years of data should have evolved the next time I'm looking to hire someone for time travel.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    Not knowing your business again, but I can assume that there is a retail component to it and that being the case, CISP\PCI DSS regulations forbid the storage of ANY customer cc data beyond the time-frame required to authorize a given transaction (and said authentication must be securely encrypted). You could be at risk for heavy fines and loss of CC processing certification when audited.
    Yeah. We know. We're certified.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    Also note that the "cloud" aspect of the Palm Pre allows you to "nuke" your phone if it is ever stolen by you and without the need for a server policy to execute (ala BB)
    Pre's a little late to the nuke party. We've had that option for years with our treos. Our concern isn't whether it's stolen. It's what data can be hacked OTA-whether from a spoof tower, a wifi sync, or a bluetooth transmission. That's why we don't allow wireless synch, and also why we won't allow much interaction with the cloud until they pry our USB cables from our cold, dead fingers.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    Just offering some relevant counter points as you see to come from the old school "change is bad" class that I was in. It's 2010 and businesses must innovate to stay IN business lest they fall to the wayside.
    Well, fortunately for us, there is an endless supply of used treo 755p's if this Pre/Classic gig isn't still working out for us in another 5 or 10 years. Hell, we didn't think we'd have customers still responding to our business model after 14 years of doing this. Any continuing years are a bonus, as far as we're concerned.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    Point is I've (we've) moved away from PalmOS (*sniff*) to WebOS and haven't looked back. Is it perfect? Absolutely not. Can it be used effectively?
    I would have if I could have. WebOS is pretty much the polar opposite of perfect for us. Agreed. I hope you're right.

    If not, I'm looking into whether we can take our several thousand palmOS calendar entries/notes and migrate them into Pimlical. If so, that just might be the bridge we've been looking for. Only if we can then migrate from Pimlical to Android, iPhone, an improved Pre, or some future platform that would enable us to continue using pda's for the purposes, and with the speed, we currently rely on with palmOS.
  5. #45  
    This is why all my contacts are on my GMail account. I don't have to worry about a 3rd party app holding all my data. The cloud is great in my opinion. Others don't think so.
    Simple Tip Calc http://bit.ly/cdcJIu Review http://bit.ly/a9edpu & World Cup Flags http://bit.ly/daOoeJ
  6. #46  
    You should really look at getting a CRM system that does all what you have mentioned, I suggest Salesforce.com, there is a app in the Palm WEBos Catalog for it. Everything you mentioned, I do not know if it will work for off-line search. But this should be the direction with the amount of data you use. I have over 300K customers that I can pull information on just like you do for meeting their needs plus past purchases, we deal with the Private Sector as well as Public Sector along with Partners.
  7.    #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by sbrad425 View Post
    You should really look at getting a CRM system that does all what you have mentioned, I suggest Salesforce.com, there is a app in the Palm WEBos Catalog for it. Everything you mentioned, I do not know if it will work for off-line search. But this should be the direction with the amount of data you use. I have over 300K customers that I can pull information on just like you do for meeting their needs plus past purchases, we deal with the Private Sector as well as Public Sector along with Partners.
    Sounds interesting. So, you're mentioning this particular CRM in my case because you successfully migrated data to it from palmOS?
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