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  1.    #21  
    gapost,
    Correct-there are no hidden files. They're all there.
    So you're saying I prob cannot do anything with my palmOS files from the Sprint Pre? Do you think they'll only work in my new pre if they come directly from classic prgm > 3rd party software sync > new pre sync?
  2. #22  
    Have you synced your old phone to outlook or palm desktop? get the info into a format that can offer some flexibility...
  3.    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Workerb33 View Post
    Have you synced your old phone to outlook or palm desktop? get the info into a format that can offer some flexibility...
    No. Never could get sync to work, bt nor wifi.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by premordial View Post
    No. Never could get sync to work, bt nor wifi.
    do you have outlook or palm desktop? download CompanionLink (7 day free trial) and sync to outlook, desktop, etc. CL supports lots of programs. Then you can export or sync to another phone. CL works over USB so it is simple to use.

    ...and I'll take the $100 in unmarked and unsequenced singles...
    Run your ad here... reach thousands daily...



    ...Now accepting orders for my upcoming iHandle™.
    Reserve yours today!
  5.    #25  
    It was the Palm Desktop program that I tried to sync with last year. As mentioned earlier, it never did work. My data lies within the files I copied from the Sprint Pre just before activating the Verizon Pre Plus. Activating the VzPlus "deactivated" the Sprint Pre.

    As I understand it, Companion Link only syncs with a "live," or shall we say a normal-functioning, Pre.

    WorkerB33: If I buy CL and hook it up via USB, will it somehow be able to sync with my passive Sprint Pre and do anything? In other words, the Sprint Pre cannot be activated or awakened, without a reboot. A reboot would erase all of the palmOS files I need and put me right back in the position of trying to get the "raw" pdb files into an active Pre.

    I guess what I'm trying to do is turn my pdb files into active prc files, right? Is there a program out there that will convert my pdb files into prc files that I can then insert into the right places within the 'datamgr/PALM_DM' folder on the Pre?
  6.    #26  
    BY JOVE, I THINK I'VE GOT IT ! ! ! !

    It has been a week and this whole ordeal has been driving me a little batty. Can someone tell me if the solution that just popped into my sleep-deprived brain is crazy talk??

    Ok, I apparently can't make my "pdb" files work in a Pre, right?

    Apparently, it's because they're not recognized in that state, if I understand this correctly. (It would be nice to confirm this with someone at a company that deals with these types of questions all the time, say, oh, I don't know--like a company I've paid money to that won't even acknowledge my questions...oh, I know, I know; like the MOTION APPS COMPANY A-HOLES, for example).

    When I open one of these pdb files from my Pre using my PC's notepad app I can read my own words, phrases, and numbers, intermingled with all kinds of gobbledegorked symbols and code-lookin-thingies.

    This tells me all my info is still there and just waiting to come to daddy.

    However, it seems the palmOS<-->webOS products available only play nice with data coming from a live and/or active Pre device.

    Here's a possibly dumb question, but I'm desperate to get my data, and besides; necessity is the mother of invention. So, if webOS can't do anything with my "raw" pdb files, I'LL BET THE UNBELIEVABLY SOLID AND DEPENDABLE GARNETT/PALM OS TREO 755p CAN ! !

    WHY CAN'T I JUST SHOVE MY SAVED WEBOS PDB FILES INTO MY PALM TREO OPERATING SYSTEM AND GO FROM THERE?

    It seems to me that the Treo will probly recognize them, read them, open them, and the universe will be restored. So, should I go ahead and buy one of them there sync programs like Companion Link to sync with my Treo*.

    After that, I should be able to simply CL sync with a Pre? Right? Is this crazy enough to work? Someone tell me.

    Thank you in advance.

    *I will of course never buy another Motion Apps product, and I will tell as many thousands of people as I can about their complete disregard for this paying customer. I voiced my opinion in a review of their product in the app catalog and they somehow found the time to read it and delete it, yet they couldn't answer my sincere tech questions during the last 8 days.
  7.    #27  
    Oh, and Bluewanders, thank you for your well-thought out advice. I didn't try it because the geeks were able to get my files using developer mode.

    However, I'm wondering; if they had extracted my files from either of the sources you recommended: /var/luna/data/dbdata/ OR /media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/, do you think the classic program within webOS could/would have been able to make use of them?
  8. #28  
    Classic actually has a simple backup/restore method included within the webOS menu for the Classic app, which will take a full backup of your PalmOS apps and data. I realize if you weren't aware of that and cannot now start Classic on the Sprint Pre you may not be able to utilize that method.

    After installing Classic on the new phone, did you try simply restoring the entire \ClassicApps and \palmos folders you copied from the old phone? That would be my first instinct, although I haven't done this type of recovery before, it looks like that's where all of the user data is stored.

    By default, your Pre's photos are stored in \DCIM\100PALM.

    The advice on recovering your PalmDatabase.db3 was probably your best bet for recovering webOS system data that's not included in your Palm Profile, such as your call and messaging history.
  9.    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by zParticle View Post
    After installing Classic on the new phone, did you try simply restoring the entire \ClassicApps and \palmos folders you copied from the old phone?
    Yes. Just like you, I thought that would work. It didn't.

    I just had a horrible thought. What if the MotionApps designers didn't anticipate users doing this? In other words, what if moving from one Pre to another disables Classic and doesn't allow it to work on the new device?

    I just remembered that when I started up, the new Pre Classic didn't repopulate. I didn't give it a second thought when I went to the app store, downloaded Classic, and re-launched it with the free 7-day trial.

    But, what if the people at motion apps didn't design the software to consider it a re-launch?

    Now I'm wondering if perhaps Classic is treating my reload as an expired trial instead of a relaunch!?

    Maybe my files are just fine, and are sitting in the right place, but they're not working because the morons at MA didn't think about this?

    Since MA doesn't answer support questions, does anybody know how Classic software would react to the installation of a trial version? Or, since a trial is 7 days, does anybody know whether Classic provides a user with a similar 7 days to re-register Classic on one's device?

    If not, one would have to write an email to MA and request a change from one serial number to another. I can't even imagine what a nightmare that would be, waiting for someone at MA to MAYBE flip the switch for you, but not knowing if they will since there's no way to contact them. Well, I guess it would be the exact nightmare I've had for the past 8 days.

    That's just great. Wonderful. I'm thinking that's what is going on here. I hope this saga ends up helping someone someday. Or, at least prevents someone else from having this disaster.
    Last edited by premordial; 08/01/2010 at 06:53 AM.
  10. #30  
    You may be right. I would have thought MotionApps would have coordinated this with Palm so the license stays with your Palm Profile, but according to this you have to request reactivation for your new device.
  11.    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by zParticle View Post
    You may be right. I would have thought MotionApps would have coordinated this with Palm so the license stays with your Palm Profile, but according to this you have to request reactivation for your new device.
    Although writing out a reactivation request to a technology company in this day and age is archaic, it doesn't upset me nearly as much as the possibility that it would be impossible to use my device in the interim simply because of the designing company's lack of forethought.

    And, lest anyone think I'm being unduly harsh in my opinion of MA; I am not aware of any webOS apps priced higher than 'Classic,' yet there is no phone contact allowed, no online chat system, and no email contact for tech support.

    Yes, I'm ****ed-off. In short, I feel like I've put $30 and a note to Motion Apps in a bottle and thrown it into the ocean.
  12. #32  
    They have a username here. You could try a PM to Classic by MotionApps or on Twitter @_Classic
  13.    #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by johncc View Post
    They have a username here. You could try a PM to Classic by MotionApps or on Twitter @_Classic
    It would have been convenient to contact someone in this forum from MA, but seeing as how that username hasn't posted anything on this board since 07/16/2010 10:17 AM, it looks like that would have been as fruitless as trying to contact MA itself.

    My Classic data is now assimilated into this new Vz Plus and it is working! I cannot even begin to convey how costly this has been for me, in terms of dollars, lost time, and a major hit to my life force points.

    Once again, in an effort to perhaps prevent another poor soul from this odious experience, I share the following learnings with the collective:

    1. Copying and pasting the original Pre's contents onto a PC desktop or folder via USB cable, the way I did it, is perfectly fine and works, IF these other points are followed.

    2. Realize that your previous Classic data, EVEN WITH A CLASSIC TRIAL DOWNLOAD, will CEASE TO FUNCTION the moment your profile is switched to the new device.

    3. Write to motion apps (via email) the instant you have the serial number of the new device, because their re-assignment may take up to 48 hours (and I assume even longer on weekends).

    4. If using the direct copy/paste method I'm describing here, instead of 3rd party software, be aware that your palmOS files will automatically be overwritten and replaced with nothingness if MotionApp's reassignment isn't complete before rebooting/restarting your Pre.

    5. When pasting your palmOS files (from your old /palmos/datamgr/PALM_DM/ folder into the new one in the same location on the new Pre) take note of the approximate file sizes of the following: CalendarDB, MemosDB, ContactsDB, AddressDB, and TasksDB.

    6. Do NOT, under any circumstance, delete or erase the folder you have created and placed on your PC's desktop that contains the above files.

    7. After receiving a confirmation email from MA of your successful device re-assignment, restart your new Pre, copy/paste your files from the PC desktop folder you previously created into the correct location(s) in the new Pre (via USB).

    8. Restart your new Pre again and relaunch Classic. If you do not see all of your PIM data, go back into USB mode on your new Pre and compare the size of your *---DB files within the /palmos/datamgr/PALM_DM/ folder because Palm's server has probably erased and overwritten your precious files. If so, revisit items #5-9.

    9. Go, and sin no more.
  14. #34  
    so do I get the hundred? I think i deserve it!
  15.    #35  
    Oh, and it's lucky for MA I won't be able to pursue my anti-MA crusade now that my device is up and running. I simply won't have the time...
  16.    #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by nimer55 View Post
    so do I get the hundred? I think i deserve it!
    Oh. Yeah. Of course. Coming right up.

    Where were you when I needed your help, anyways?
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by premordial View Post
    It would have been convenient to contact someone in this forum from MA, but seeing as how that username hasn't posted anything on this board since 07/16/2010 10:17 AM, it looks like that would have been as fruitless as trying to contact MA itself.

    My Classic data is now assimilated into this new Vz Plus and it is working! I cannot even begin to convey how costly this has been for me, in terms of dollars, lost time, and a major hit to my life force points.

    Once again, in an effort to perhaps prevent another poor soul from this odious experience, I share the following learnings with the collective:

    1. Copying and pasting the original Pre's contents onto a PC desktop or folder via USB cable, the way I did it, is perfectly fine and works, IF these other points are followed.

    2. Realize that your previous Classic data, EVEN WITH A CLASSIC TRIAL DOWNLOAD, will CEASE TO FUNCTION the moment your profile is switched to the new device.

    3. Write to motion apps (via email) the instant you have the serial number of the new device, because their re-assignment may take up to 48 hours (and I assume even longer on weekends).

    4. If using the direct copy/paste method I'm describing here, instead of 3rd party software, be aware that your palmOS files will automatically be overwritten and replaced with nothingness if MotionApp's reassignment isn't complete before rebooting/restarting your Pre.

    5. When pasting your palmOS files (from your old /palmos/datamgr/PALM_DM/ folder into the new one in the same location on the new Pre) take note of the approximate file sizes of the following: CalendarDB, MemosDB, ContactsDB, AddressDB, and TasksDB.

    6. Do NOT, under any circumstance, delete or erase the folder you have created and placed on your PC's desktop that contains the above files.

    7. After receiving a confirmation email from MA of your successful device re-assignment, restart your new Pre, copy/paste your files from the PC desktop folder you previously created into the correct location(s) in the new Pre (via USB).

    8. Restart your new Pre again and relaunch Classic. If you do not see all of your PIM data, go back into USB mode on your new Pre and compare the size of your *---DB files within the /palmos/datamgr/PALM_DM/ folder because Palm's server has probably erased and overwritten your precious files. If so, revisit items #5-9.

    9. Go, and sin no more.
    Geez... that sounds like a lot of work... I'm sorry I wasn't around after my initial post I lost track of this thread entirely.... we could have gotten on the phone and pulled the databases out to convert them to another format... I'm glad you got it taken care of though... my suggestion to you is a very simple one... hand held computing is moving more and more toward cloud computing for lots of reasons... embrace it now... even if you don't stay with the pre... because sooner or later you are going to be pigeonholed into it anyway... start the process now. Oh... and get as far away from emulated apps as possible, by that I mean classic apps and the like, no one supports them anymore, anything running in an emulator is more likely to break and such... start finding tools on your phone now that will do as close as what you want it to now, then get used to those new programs but always keep your most important files (especially anything over 6 months old) in more standardized formats to be readily retrievable.

    Now that I think of it... im tired and I think I just mostly repeated something some other poster said. Ah well... it was good advice the first time, and its still good advice.
  18. #38  
    If you're not quite ready to follow bluewanders's excellent advice and take the plunge into converting your data to a cloud-based service, I recommend you at least give yourself one of the data recovery options you didn't have this time around: namely setting up a hotsync system that works for you or getting in the habit of using Classic's backup function after any major changes to your data.

    However, it sounds like the linchpin here was MotionApps's crazy activation scheme which was thwarting your original recovery efforts. Bad MotionApps. Hopefully your experience will help the next person attempting a similar recovery.
  19.    #39  
    Thanks for the input and words of advice. Unfortunately, as nice as the cloud sounds in theory, it just won't work for hundreds of thousands of people, including me. Here are just some of the reasons there will always be a market for local, or device-contained data computing and storage:

    -More than a third of my work month is spent with no wireless internet access. I couldn't run my business with cloud-stored info inaccessible a third of the time.

    -Our business relies heavily on the ability to reference several-year-old data points, individual customer profiles, individual order histories, and past calendar entries. And, oftentimes we need to be able to access all of this data while on the phone or in front of a busy client. WebOs searches are no longer allowed in our company because they take so long and the results are so incomplete.

    -The Palm/Google Calendar cloud setup is not searchable in all fields. Also, there's a severe backward search limitation due to Google/Palm's attempt to prevent slowing a search to a complete crawl (try to open your notes field on a 2 month old calendar entry from your Pre). Fortunately, palmOS performs these types of complete, local searches within 3-7 seconds each (and allows full/read/edit), compared to an average of 96 seconds for an identical search using webOs. The cloud is simply unacceptable.

    -Many of our records contain sensitive client information, including c/c info. Cloud storage doesn't pass the new, strict, government-mandated, security requirements regarding credit card transmittal and storage.

    -With wireless transmission data interception becoming a greater and more real security threat (see last week's Blackberry hacking article), our company does not allow wireless synchronization of pda's.

    -There are a lot more reasons, but I think I've made my point. Non-cloud computing will exist for a very long time.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by premordial View Post
    Thanks for the input and words of advice. Unfortunately, as nice as the cloud sounds in theory, it just won't work for hundreds of thousands of people, including me. Here are just some of the reasons there will always be a market for local, or device-contained data computing and storage:
    Glad you got it resolved. I just came upon this thread and could have provided some useful information but it all worked out. I've been in IT for 18+ years and my experience with Palm goes back to the Palm III. I've dealt with many unique and customized implementations of Palm devices (and many unique problems as a result!). Just a few comments...

    -More than a third of my work month is spent with no wireless internet access. I couldn't run my business with cloud-stored info inaccessible a third of the time.
    I think you misunderstand the "cloud" aspect of the paradigm as "active" when it is in fact passive and a "backup". All data lives and is used directly on the device while the cloud provides your backup endpoint. Think of expansion on your Palm Profile. If you are syncing with the office PC and your phone breaks while in AZ, what will you do? Ship it back for someone to sync it? With a cloud backup, all you need is ANY internet connection to have your device and all information restored.

    -Our business relies heavily on the ability to reference several-year-old data points, individual customer profiles, individual order histories, and past calendar entries. And, oftentimes we need to be able to access all of this data while on the phone or in front of a busy client. WebOs searches are no longer allowed in our company because they take so long and the results are so incomplete.
    Not sure what your business is, but rest assured that I have client contact information in the 1000's going back to the mid 90's one my phone and have "order history" data exported from the databases on my Centro into csv, then into .xls and living on "Docs" on my Pre. Customer names were replaced with "Cust_ID" and this number is "Nickname" in the contacts db. Works like a charm.

    -The Palm/Google Calendar cloud setup is not searchable in all fields. Also, there's a severe backward search limitation due to Google/Palm's attempt to prevent slowing a search to a complete crawl (try to open your notes field on a 2 month old calendar entry from your Pre). Fortunately, palmOS performs these types of complete, local searches within 3-7 seconds each (and allows full/read/edit), compared to an average of 96 seconds for an identical search using webOs. The cloud is simply unacceptable.
    While true it doesn't search all fields, it searches the ones that really matter; First\Last name (any combo), Company name, Phone#, Email, Nickname. You know who you're clients are so your not trying to search ambiguous data for them. And everyone works different, but why would you need data from old meetings? There should be minutes or updated documentation for client information not fragmented bits here and there in calendar entries regardless if it was retrieved in nanoseconds.

    -Many of our records contain sensitive client information, including c/c info. Cloud storage doesn't pass the new, strict, government-mandated, security requirements regarding credit card transmittal and storage.
    Not knowing your business again, but I can assume that there is a retail component to it and that being the case, CISP\PCI DSS regulations forbid the storage of ANY customer cc data beyond the time-frame required to authorize a given transaction (and said authentication must be securely encrypted). You could be at risk for heavy fines and loss of CC processing certification when audited.

    -With wireless transmission data interception becoming a greater and more real security threat (see last week's Blackberry hacking article), our company does not allow wireless synchronization of pda's.
    GSM has been proven to be weak in the past and aside from the iffy performance is another reason I stick with Sprint and CDMA. Also note that the "cloud" aspect of the Palm Pre allows you to "nuke" your phone if it is ever stolen by you and without the need for a server policy to execute (ala BB)

    -There are a lot more reasons, but I think I've made my point. Non-cloud computing will exist for a very long time.
    Just offering some relevant counter points as you see to come from the old school "change is bad" class that I was in. It's 2010 and businesses must innovate to stay IN business lest they fall to the wayside. I had to amend our service contracts to allow clients an "out" when they went belly up and still owed us for services not yet rendered. That "thoughtfulness" has yielded additional contracts when those out of work clients land at new companies and give us the nod. We provide innovation recommendations as part of our solution services and if they don't see the writing on the proverbial wall, there isn't much we can do.

    Point is I've (we've) moved away from PalmOS (*sniff*) to WebOS and haven't looked back. Is it perfect? Absolutely not. Can it be used effectively? Most definitely with some minor adjustments to your thinking. Has Palm (& HP) paved the way to future innovation? Yes. Q3 & 4 of this year will be very exciting.
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