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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    Not providing access to aGPS is a far cry from a "crippled" GPS. Let's stay tuned while the non-whiners investigate. WebOS is an open platform, and they will be able to figure out how things work. If they come back and declare that it's a big conspiracy, I will be first in line to hold VZ accountable. But, until we have actual (and repeatable) data, the conspiracy stuff just scares uninformed users and probably chases them away from a fantastic phone.

    a GPS is essential to my job. That's why I have a garmin. I travel with blackberry and iphone users all the time. They don't get anything better then I do out of google maps. The point is to keep digging, and stop whining.
    Again, I don't get it. How much more confirmation do you need? Are you saying that Dieter's story is incorrect and that Palm's statement isn't truthful? That what it sounds like b/c you keep saying that we need actual data and that we must let the 'others' figure it out.

    Hey, it's already been figured out. Do you not believe what Palm said? If you don't just say it b/c that sounds like what you're saying. I'm going to go with Dieter and Palm on this one. I gave you a link to show that V has a past history of this. Dieter's article reads as plain as daylight.

    Palm's statement is as clear as sunlight. Yet you want to continue to investigate. Fine, but to keep denying what has been established by the manufacturer of the phone is pretty strange. But you can do as you please.
    Are you trying to hurt me?
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    What seems to be emerging is that without aGPS it might take longer or be impacted by signal fragmentation, etc. That could affect accuracy in certain conditions. I have aGPS on my at&t blackberry, and it isn't really any better than my Pre. Investigation in another thread has some linux talented people are really digging to figure out the specifics. Stay tuned.

    What seems to be emerging is exactly what Dieter wrote in the article that has been linked for you before: Verizon doesn't allow aGPS access to non-VZNavigator subsrcribers.

    Here's the relevant quote: "We've confirmed with Palm that the root of the issue is that Verizon has a proprietary aGPS system - a system that only VZ Navigator can access on webOS devices."

    So continue the investigation, Sherlock.

    And yes, lack of aGPS does constitute "crippled GPS" when it's already been shown that they advertise both GPS and aGPS as a feature of the phone without any indication that you have to pay for it.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by idontwan2know View Post
    What seems to be emerging is exactly what Dieter wrote in the article that has been linked for you before: Verizon doesn't allow aGPS access to non-VZNavigator subsrcribers.

    Here's the relevant quote: "We've confirmed with Palm that the root of the issue is that Verizon has a proprietary aGPS system - a system that only VZ Navigator can access on webOS devices."

    So continue the investigation, Sherlock.

    And yes, lack of aGPS does constitute "crippled GPS" when it's already been shown that they advertise both GPS and aGPS as a feature of the phone without any indication that you have to pay for it.
    But what they don't tell you is that aGPS only works if you subscribe to their VZNav. Again, how much more proof those the poster need?
    Are you trying to hurt me?
  4. #64  
    fyi, I agree completely with dieter's story. I just think it's only part of the equation. I want data so we can hold vz or whomever accountale. That's all
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    fyi, I agree completely with dieter's story. I just think it's only part of the equation. I want data so we can hold vz or whomever accountale. That's all
    Part of the equation? Dude, it's the answer to the equation. No one can hold V accountable b/c it's their aGPS and they can restrict it all day if they choose to do so. And apparently they've chosen to do so.

    When you're not using aGPS, satellite triangulation takes longer and sometimes you may or may not time out. That's the fact of life with GPS. And tower assisted GPS will place near your location but not exactly at it most of the time. So what else is there to consider? Some people will have success with GPS on the V webOS devices and others will not. That's just the way the GPS cookie crumbles on V.
    Are you trying to hurt me?
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by cantaffordit View Post
    really? The? Shot each unit on the assembly line with a laser, and just missed a few? Tell me how that makes sense in the real world of manufacturing hi tech devices in a chinese factory.

    Or, it's more complex and relates to google location services, where agps is deployed (some towers have it, some don't), etc etc.

    All that article says is that agps from vz towers might be restricted. I have mine set to gps only so i am testing satellite locating services, and isolating that from any location-based interaction with cell towers. That means i am not using the service they are referring to.

    And it explain why google maps on my at&t blackberry curve doesn't work any differently/better than my pre+.
    really. How about exchange your phone for somebody else, not working one?
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by hk-usp45 View Post
    really. How about exchange your phone for somebody else, not working one?
    I made the offer. Send it to me.

    I've had mine replaced twice, and they all worked. That's why I think some of this is related to where I live and not that my phone(s) just managed to escape the cripple-laser that VZ phones pass under before going into boxes.

    I'm hoping to develop more Pre support around here so I will actually know someone else with a Pre. Rather than scaring them off with conspiracy theories.

    It's been a tempest in a tea pot. Of course it's important, but it has absolutely dominated this forum for the last few weeks. Exhausting.

    Ps, send me your phone... I'll even leave the ZAGG skin on mine when I send it to you.
  8. #68  
    @cantaffordit: the write by dieter pretty much says it all... VZW has indeed offered "gps and agps" in their pre+ docs without an asterick.

    I hope we can get some work around that's solid...i can't imagine how many people out there who don't tweak their phones.... I just don't see why they'd do it to palm?
  9. #69  
    I agree. it's Verizon... they wanted my money when I wanted to start a contract with them. since im young & i have no credit they wanted me 2 put down $400. that's crazy talk
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by LateNiteWithJme View Post
    I'm not a VZ customer, but from reading everyone's findings on the matter I do believe they ARE blocking GPS. They want your money and will nickel and dime you for anything they can. That's why I'm a loyal Sprint customer (for 10 years).
    I agree. it's Verizon... they wanted my money when I wanted to start a contract with them. since im young & i have no credit they wanted me 2 put down $400. that's crazy talk
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by jhodnettejr View Post
    s.... I just don't see why they'd do it to palm?
    It seems that VZ has done many things to harm Palm since launching the WebOS phones. Crappy ads, sales people that steer customers away from it, etc.

    I'm not saying they are TRYING to harm Palm, but they sure aren't trying to help.

    I would love to know if aGPS is also missing from other VZ phones (except Android, where it appears to be fully functional).

    If they are allowing aGPS for WinMo and Blackberry, then I would imagine that would be an issue that HP will want to address.

    If they do it to every mfr, then then VZ is just stupid.

    Fortunately, we have a platform and homebrew community that will likely figure this out. If it can be worked around, this is the one community most qualified and capable to make it happen...
  12. #72  
    Personally, based on their ads and literature, if they are blocking third party access to aGPS, then I think it now warrants class action lawsuit consideration. Obviously, I would prefer they just stop blocking access to it. Are they really stupid enough to think a bunch of Pre users are going to subscribe to their service? Some will, due to need, but most will find a way around as many of us have.

    Would be nice if there was an attorney amongst this group willing to notify Verizon that this is actionable (or tell us otherwise) as it may get them to do what they have done for their other phones, which is unblock aGPS. In the future they should be far more explicit in stating that only standalone GPS mode will work, and that you will need a clear sky and up to several minutes to get a lock in many situations.
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