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  1.    #1  
    I said in the Roundtable article that HP's acquisition of Palm is good for both companies. I hope that HP will be able to embrace the user community and not just ignore it as Palm has done.

    When I have taken my patches off for previous updates, I am always left just dumbfounded at how much I hate Palm's Pre and how much I love my Pre.

    Some of the user community patches add stupidly basic features missing from webOS.

    So far, Palm has only adopted 5 of the 300+ patches that users have created. Palm could take 20 of best patches at a time and have a gigantic release every month for a year.

    Why won't they?

    Is it nothing more than ego? If a patch was not thought of inside Palm, they won't add it even if it has been tested by thousands of users?

    Although HP is a more corporate culture, they don't have "not invented here" self-esteem issues.

    HP could:
    A. Try to shut down user development.
    B. Ignore user development as Palm does.
    C. Embrace user development.

    I hope HP takes option C and embraces the social networking that goes on in the user community.

    To HP: "Please come grab the low hanging fruit!"

    To the Patch Developers: "Thank you!"

    - Craig
    Last edited by milominderbinder; 04/30/2010 at 11:48 AM.
  2. #2  
    If we only held sway with them in some way...
  3. #3  
    Or, if you're not going to embrace user development, please don't try to shut it down. We really only need one apple in the world.
    Twitter: dullgeek
  4. ltlruss's Avatar
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    #4  
    I have to say, that even though I don't "hate" my pre without the patches, It definitely is not nearly the same phone. It would be great if HP recognizes all the great work these developers have done and work out a way to implement the really helpful ones into updates. For the majority of pre owners that don't patch their phones, it would give them the opportunity to see how great this phone really is...
  5. #5  
    which have the 5 they added?. i know they added led notifications, but what else?
  6. #6  
    All I can think of they added forward for text messages. Palm can't even add more pages to the launcher, that's kind of sad.
  7. #7  
    I don't see HP shutting down the Homebrew community. I don't see a reason for them to. It is not hurting business in anyway (with the exception of a few kernel's that may brick phones) If anything i think they'll be forced to embrace it. Because it literally takes man hours off of their hands.

    Think about it... One patch that comes to mind is led notifications. It was already there in the code, it just needed to be unquoted. Someone did that, and then EVERYONE started to use it. So palm said eff it, we'll release it.

    But on another note, it will save man(or woman) hours for the company. People will ask why we don't have this and why we don't have that, and then some developer will go and make the patch to suffice the need. No time wasted by a developer who could then be spending company time working on bigger picture items, such as increasing the speed/fluidity of WebOS, or even tweaking some in house apps to run better.

    Overall, i don't think HP would kill HomeBrew...

    Kill HomeBrew, Kill the Pre...
  8. jac-3's Avatar
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    #8  
    I am in the process of getting my 4th phone. The store told me that the warranty is void it third party apps are instaled.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by jac-3 View Post
    I am in the process of getting my 4th phone. The store told me that the warranty is void it third party apps are instaled.
    well yeah, they don't support it. But they don't disallow it...
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by jac-3 View Post
    I am in the process of getting my 4th phone. The store told me that the warranty is void it third party apps are instaled.
    Ask them to show you that in writing...I would love to know exactly where that clause is.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by jac-3 View Post
    I am in the process of getting my 4th phone. The store told me that the warranty is void it third party apps are instaled.
    Just doctor your phone - issue solved. Some stores are more stringent when it comes to these things than others. Any time you take a phone into a store for service, always uninstall stuff like the 800MHz kernal first. If you are sending the phone in, uninstall Homebrew stuff first, otherwise it shouldn't matter. But like I said... some stores are tougher about this stuff than others (some simply don't care).
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by jac-3 View Post
    I am in the process of getting my 4th phone. The store told me that the warranty is void it third party apps are instaled.
    If this were really true, they would have blocked the door for "side loading" applications way back in the beginning.

    Do they really expect us to believe that if they truly thought homebrews and patches were the cause of all the hardware failures they would not be screaming this from the rooftops (and blocking our ability to do it)?
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    When I have taken my patches off for previous updates, I am always left just dumbfounded at how much I hate Palm's Pre and how much I love my Pre.

    Some of the user community patches add stupidly basic features missing from webOS.

    So far, Palm has only adopted 5 of the 300+ patches that users have created. Palm could take 20 of best patches at a time and have a gigantic release every month for a year.

    HP could:
    A. Try to shut down user development.
    B. Ignore user development as Palm does.
    C. Embrace user development.

    I hope HP takes option C and embraces the social networking that goes on in the user community.
    All I can say and this is not in defense of Palm. But the one thing that would have to be built in as well is the ability to "turn off" certain patches. The one thing I do love about patches, is that I can choose exactly how I want my phone, and my wife can have hers exactly how she wants.

    So my only concern with widespread patch adoption, would be the ability to turn certain things on or off (not hard I know, but not something that is currently built into most patches). So I say as long as that is built in, I am with you 100% Craig.

    But I do feel, that could be part of the reason that has limited Palm's widespread adoption of patches up to this point. Now that they are not scraping the barrel to stay afloat, maybe they can and will dedicate resources to adopting patches.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    I said in the Roundtable article that HP's acquisition of Palm is good for both companies. I hope that HP will be able to embrace the user community and not just ignore it as Palm has done.

    When I have taken my patches off for previous updates, I am always left just dumbfounded at how much I hate Palm's Pre and how much I love my Pre.

    Some of the user community patches add stupidly basic features missing from webOS.

    So far, Palm has only adopted 5 of the 300+ patches that users have created. ...........
    It's interesting to see you admitting that the Pre basically stinks in its "out of the box" form; something I (and many others) have been saying since last summer.
    Unlike Palm (whom some people say don't read the complaints here), maybe HP will take your opinion to heart if they come all the way over here to read it.
    Last edited by dbdoinit; 04/30/2010 at 04:59 PM.
  15. #15  
    Sorry, but this is not an open source project. Patches as such are close to worthless, if it comes to controlled development and quality assurance. I don't think, the team at Palm does not know how to implement the multitude of change requests these patches do represent.

    The question is much more if Palm thinks the changes would improve the WebOS user experience for many and not just for a few. IMHO its sufficient if Palm tolerates the modding, but I don't think they "should" or "must" implement all the patches. Not, if we want a stable and user friendly WebOS.

    I do greatly apprechiate the work of the community and have some homebrew apps installed I really love.

    But I don't have patches. And if I would "hate" my Pre as is, I would get rid of it.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by bela42 View Post
    But I don't have patches. And if I would "hate" my Pre as is, I would get rid of it.
    I think you may be taking this the wrong way. Hating the Pre in stock form is to say you have had the Pre in another form. I loved my Pre before patches, but then when I started patching going back to stock does hurt. Also initially I only patched for things I really "needed", I have now found myself patching things that increase features of the phone (downloading youtube videos for example). If I were to get another phone, I would hate it as well because it still wouldn't be able to do everything my Pre does.

    Do I want more from Palm/HP/My Pre/The Next WebOS Device? HELL YEAH!

    Is there a phone out there right now that can replace my Sprint Pre? Only maybe a Sprint Pre Plus....

    With patches, homebrew, and the PDK there is not a phone that can even come close to competing with my Pre for what I want and need it to do.

    Just saying you have to take the statement as an overall thought, not just an I hate the Pre so something is better.... Patched Pre > Stock Pre
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    I think you may be taking this the wrong way. Hating the Pre in stock form is to say you have had the Pre in another form. I loved my Pre before patches, but then when I started patching going back to stock does hurt. Also initially I only patched for things I really "needed", I have now found myself patching things that increase features of the phone (downloading youtube videos for example). If I were to get another phone, I would hate it as well because it still wouldn't be able to do everything my Pre does.

    Do I want more from Palm/HP/My Pre/The Next WebOS Device? HELL YEAH!

    Is there a phone out there right now that can replace my Sprint Pre? Only maybe a Sprint Pre Plus....

    With patches, homebrew, and the PDK there is not a phone that can even come close to competing with my Pre for what I want and need it to do.

    Just saying you have to take the statement as an overall thought, not just an I hate the Pre so something is better.... Patched Pre > Stock Pre
    Couldn't have said it better myself
  18. #18  
    I currently have 62 patches installed. Just about all of them should be options on stock Pre's.
  19.    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by OldSkoolVWLover View Post
    ...So my only concern with widespread patch adoption, would be the ability to turn certain things on or off...
    About 40 basic patches do not need an ON/Off switch like:
    Add more snooze time options (Email, Messaging, Calendar)
    Email Add more sync time options
    Browser: Option to Send Link with Messaging.
    Browser: Change Number of Bookmarks to 100 bookmarks.
    Calendar: All-Day Events in Month View
    Calendar: Default to Month View
    Calendar: Default to Week View
    Calendar: More Reminder Alarm Times
    Calendar: Repeat Reminder Notification
    Calendar: Snooze Duration Selection
    Calendar: Wrap Location Field.
    Clock: Enable hidden clock
    Messaging: Character counter
    Messaging: SMS Tones
    Mojo: More autoreplace words
    Phone: Call Duration in Call Log
    Phone: Call History During Call
    Phone: Match State to Area Code - look up state if no Contact or Caller ID name
    and 30 other dumb things left off.

    Some need to be On/Off switches such as:
    Vibration/haptic feedback (phone, contacts, calculator, etc.)
    Phone Dialpad Tones Off
    Notification Repeat (Email, Messaging, Calendar)
    Topbar: Add Date - MM/DD
    Topbar: Add Brightness slider
    Topbar: Battery Percent
    Launcher 4x4, 5x4 icon options
    and 100 other options we have had for years on other phones

    Quote Originally Posted by bela42 View Post
    ...Patches as such are close to worthless...I don't have patches...
    Wow. That's like trying explain what it is like to have kids.

    - Craig
  20. #20  
    I happen to love my stock pre... Keep up the good work palm.... Nothing against the homebrew community, but if it dissappeared I wouldn't be affected at all, and neither would the majority of owners..
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