Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 37
  1.    #1  
    EDIT: Precentral has spoken! Thanks for your input everyone - I think it's useful to have these discussions. People have virtually unanimously voted to keep the gesture area - Palm can definitely read this thread and come away with the knowledge that their design is successful and popular

    Whoa there, let me explain myself

    There are currently 4 main useful features that the gesture area provides. Let me explain how we get to keep all of our gestures and features, but without the need for a gesture area at the bottom of the screen.

    1) Universal back gesture
    Redundant: This is slick but a physical button would achieve the same thing with less confusion for newcomers.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    2) Swipe up to go into card view (and to bring up the launcher)
    Redundant: Have you tried swiping down from the top of your device to bring up the menu? There is no gesture area at the top of the phone, but the 'swipe down' gesture still works.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    3) Initiate the quick launch ribbbon/wave
    Redundant: I have always felt that the quick ribbon would work better if it was activated on a press-and-hold basis. You hold your finger down anywhere for 1-2 seconds and the quick launch ribbon pops up where your finger is.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    4) Application switching (advanced gesture)
    Redundant: Swiping accross the length of the screen itself could activate an application switch to the left or right depending on the direction of your swipe. Or perhaps a diagonal swipe? Maybe there could be a hardware button on either side of the phone (like BlackBerry) that you could assign a 'move one card to the right' (or left) function depending on which you clicked.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    But why bother? It works fine as it is. Well, this is how I see it:

    1) "How the hell do I use this phone?" I really believe that this is one of the main reasons why new Palm devices haven't become mainstream. New users' first reactions when they pick up the Pre or Pixi should not be "What do I do?". Even geeks and tech savvy people need to be taught - this is BAD and works against everything Palm has tried to do with their intuitive OS.
    Have you ever needed to be taught to use an Apple product? Their designs are intuitive so that you naturally begin to use it and experiment with it, without the need to ask "how do I go back?"

    2) Physical buttons respond better. My success rate using gestures is about 95% - so this is not an issue for me (or you, I'm sure). I don't make a lot of mistakes and the hardware is very good at registering my intentions. But when I show my phone to people and they try the 'back' swipe, they almost always have to try it two or three times before it works. That's because the lower half of the gesture area is "dead" - you need to be swiping above the line of the hardware button - but again this is not intuitive. Those of you with an original Pre - when your phone lags and is unresponsive, have you ever noticed that pushing the hardware button will bring you into card view, whereas swiping up does nothing? Yup. Physical buttons respond better.

    3) Gestures don't work with wet hands. If you don't use your phone in the rain or in the bath then I guess this doesn't apply - in England there is ostensibly (as I'm sure you know) a constant drizzle in the air, and I find my gestures failing because of the water. Buttons would solve this.

    4) It's not necessary. If there was some function that the gesture area served that was impossible to emulate without it, then it would be worth having. I don't see the advantage other than the 'cool' factor.

    5) It makes the phone look weird - take the Pre Plus as an example. The screen looks shunted up to the top of the device, but it doesn't appear (to the casual onlooker) that there is anything on the bottom half of the device - it looks unbalanced and top heavy aesthetically.

    6) It limits the size of the screen - without the gesture area, the Pre and Pixi could have a much bigger screen while keeping the same form factor and physical size.

    Conclusion:
    I actually love gestures, I use them on my PC, I love them on WebOS - I'm not saying get rid of gestures - just the gesture area itself Let's get people picking the phone up in stores and playing with it without becoming frustrated because they can't figure it out.

    What do you think?
    Last edited by SqyArc; 04/21/2010 at 08:41 AM.
  2. #2  
    My wife is (was) the lease tech savvy human on earth, yet she is able to use the Pre effectively. She is now Texting, replying to e-mails, taking and sharing pics, etc. ALL are things she and i would have said "NO WAY she gets that!" just a year ago.

    She took to the phone quickly and learned how to use it in amazingly short time.

    No matter what the process, all first-time users will have to take a moment to learn the nuances of any device.

    I like it as is. I would like it as you describe. I see neither as a problem.
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by SqyArc View Post
    2) Physical buttons respond better. My success rate using gestures is about 95% - so this is not an issue for me (or you, I'm sure). I don't make a lot of mistakes and the hardware is very good at registering my intentions.
    Not only that but if you compare a 5% error rate to a nearly 0% error rate of a physical button, even 5% is a fairly high error rate.
    Twitter: dullgeek
  4. vreihen's Avatar
    Posts
    495 Posts
    Global Posts
    506 Global Posts
    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by SqyArc View Post
    Have you ever needed to be taught to use an Apple product? Their designs are intuitive so that you naturally begin to use it and experiment with it, without the need to ask "how do I go back?"
    Yes, I have. My experiences are completely opposite of yours. My wife returned her iPod to the store after 4 hours of trying to figure out how to download music from a CD into the thing using the Windows version of iTunes. I have a Mac Mini collecting dust on my desk at work, because I couldn't deal with OSX's illogical way of finding minimized windows. I couldn't make it go back to another program!

    Everything that Apple makes is like an 8-foot tall Wookie on the planet Endor with 2-foot tall Ewoks...it just does not make sense.....
  5. vreihen's Avatar
    Posts
    495 Posts
    Global Posts
    506 Global Posts
    #5  
    Regarding the gesture area, I have a feeling that it is on our phones simply to avoid patent lawsuits. We're not infringing, because our phone uses a gesture area and theirs doesn't.....
  6.    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by vreihen View Post
    Yes, I have. My experiences are completely opposite of yours. My wife returned her iPod to the store after 4 hours of trying to figure out how to download music from a CD into the thing using the Windows version of iTunes. I have a Mac Mini collecting dust on my desk at work, because I couldn't deal with OSX's illogical way of finding minimized windows. I couldn't make it go back to another program!

    Everything that Apple makes is like an 8-foot tall Wookie on the planet Endor with 2-foot tall Ewoks...it just does not make sense.....
    Haha, I actually agree with you - I am not a fan of Mac OSX (have you ever tried installing a program? It took me 5 minutes of clicking on the pictures and shouting at the screen before realizing you had to drag the picture of the app into the picture of the hard drive - how is that intuitive?)

    So i see your point entirely - but I meant more that Apple's hardware is intutive for new users - using the scroll wheel on the old iPods, having a big fat "Home" button and nothing else on the iPhone etc.
  7. #7  
    gesture área is one of the reasons why a bought the pre. Its easy, fast, cutie
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by SqyArc View Post
    Whoa there, let me explain myself

    There are currently 4 main useful features that the gesture area provides. Let me explain how we get to keep all of our gestures and features, but without the need for a gesture area at the bottom of the screen.

    1) Universal back gesture
    Redundant: This is slick but a physical button would achieve the same thing with less confusion for newcomers.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    2) Swipe up to go into card view (and to bring up the launcher)
    Redundant: Have you tried swiping down from the top of your device to bring up the menu? There is no gesture area at the top of the phone, but the 'swipe down' gesture still works.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    3) Initiate the quick launch ribbbon/wave
    Redundant: I have always felt that the quick ribbon would work better if it was activated on a press-and-hold basis. You hold your finger down anywhere for 1-2 seconds and the quick launch ribbon pops up where your finger is.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    4) Application switching (advanced gesture)
    Redundant: Swiping accross the length of the screen itself could activate an application switch to the left or right depending on the direction of your swipe. Or perhaps a diagonal swipe? Maybe there could be a hardware button on either side of the phone (like BlackBerry) that you could assign a 'move one card to the right' (or left) function depending on which you clicked.
    We don't need a gesture area to keep this feature.

    But why bother? It works fine as it is. Well, this is how I see it:

    1) "How the hell do I use this phone?" I really believe that this is one of the main reasons why new Palm devices haven't become mainstream. New users' first reactions when they pick up the Pre or Pixi should not be "What do I do?". Even geeks and tech savvy people need to be taught - this is BAD and works against everything Palm has tried to do with their intuitive OS.
    Have you ever needed to be taught to use an Apple product? Their designs are intuitive so that you naturally begin to use it and experiment with it, without the need to ask "how do I go back?"

    2) Physical buttons respond better. My success rate using gestures is about 95% - so this is not an issue for me (or you, I'm sure). I don't make a lot of mistakes and the hardware is very good at registering my intentions. But when I show my phone to people and they try the 'back' swipe, they almost always have to try it two or three times before it works. That's because the lower half of the gesture area is "dead" - you need to be swiping above the line of the hardware button - but again this is not intuitive. Those of you with an original Pre - when your phone lags and is unresponsive, have you ever noticed that pushing the hardware button will bring you into card view, whereas swiping up does nothing? Yup. Physical buttons respond better.

    3) Gestures don't work with wet hands. If you don't use your phone in the rain or in the bath then I guess this doesn't apply - in England there is ostensibly (as I'm sure you know) a constant drizzle in the air, and I find my gestures failing because of the water. Buttons would solve this.

    4) It's not necessary. If there was some function that the gesture area served that was impossible to emulate without it, then it would be worth having. I don't see the advantage other than the 'cool' factor.

    5) It makes the phone look weird - take the Pre Plus as an example. The screen looks shunted up to the top of the device, but it doesn't appear (to the casual onlooker) that there is anything on the bottom half of the device - it looks unbalanced and top heavy aesthetically.

    6) It limits the size of the screen - without the gesture area, the Pre and Pixi could have a much bigger screen while keeping the same form factor and physical size.

    Conclusion:
    I actually love gestures, I use them on my PC, I love them on WebOS - I'm not saying get rid of gestures - just the gesture area itself Let's get people picking the phone up in stores and playing with it without becoming frustrated because they can't figure it out.

    What do you think?
    Agreed... I started this thread back in August.

    http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/204444-gesture-vs-back-button.html

    BTE... You don't even really need a hardware back button either. You could start a right to left swipe off the screen and on to the screen to achieve a back gesture.
  9. #9  
    No..I like a phone that takes me a while to get. It posses a challenge. I dont want an iPhony because i already know how to use it, so having it will be boring. Pre teaches me new things alot,so i dont usually get bored of my phone. Its only nice to be able to play with your phone without losing interest in it.
  10. #10  
    I love the gesture area amongst other things such as the elegant multitasking,it's also the beauty of my device...seeing the light lit up every time your finger slide over it.
  11. #11  
    Although I do agree with the gesture area being needed, it is still damn cool.
    Life moves fast, don't miss a thing
  12. #12  
    No. I like the gestures. I showed it to my friends, even they think it makes sense.

    My only annoyance for my Pre is the middle button, always accidentally pressing it and minimize a card when I actually want to swipe. They fixed that on the Plus.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  13. #13  
    IMO the gesture area was a great idea and I'd miss it if it were gone. But, what if Palm made the gesture area "virtual" so the display actually uses the whole face for stuff like games pictures & videos, but can be switched back to a blacked out area for all other tasks? Maybe make it a user preference when the gesture area is available?

    Physical buttons would permanently take up real estate on the phone's face.. not a good substitute although I do agree with much of your reasoning for this topic
  14. #14  
    no home button for me. What is wrong with you? Go get an android or iphone.
  15.    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by laingman View Post
    no home button for me. What is wrong with you? Go get an android or iphone.
    Who said anything about a home button?

    (Besides, if you have an original Palm Pre then you already have a "home" button.)
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by NordicMan View Post
    IMO the gesture area was a great idea and I'd miss it if it were gone. But, what if Palm made the gesture area "virtual" so the display actually uses the whole face for stuff like games pictures & videos, but can be switched back to a blacked out area for all other tasks? Maybe make it a user preference when the gesture area is available?

    Physical buttons would permanently take up real estate on the phone's face.. not a good substitute although I do agree with much of your reasoning for this topic
    I was going to post this same basic observation, but I read the whole thread for a change before I did.

    I cosign.
    Prē
  17. #17  
    1. Why replace one hardware feature with another? And the backswipe is just ingenious! Everytime I use my nokia e71 I constantly swipe over the screen to go back and it is not a touchscreen phone...

    2. If I swipe from the bottom down, I get the menu.

    3. Cool Idea, but what about the ability to have long press in apps. Since there is no secondary input button, aka right click, I wouldn't give up on that option!

    4. I don't use app switching, only when seeing multiple cards, again maybe an app requires you to swipe across the screen...

    Maybe buttons are more accurate, but you can only assign one function at a time, not so with the gesture area. But palm should consider integrating it more into the phone. Extend the screen so it covers the whole front, and place the gesture area on the bottom of the screen, maybe 10-20% of the screen is for gesture area input only, but watching movies would take full advantage of the devices' size.
  18. spare's Avatar
    Posts
    662 Posts
    Global Posts
    664 Global Posts
    #18  
    if gestures worked well without a gesture area, apple would have added them imo. Off the top of my head, how would advance gestures work on a zoomed in web page or photo?

    also, we gain no scren real estate by replacing the gesture area with buttons. Even the iphone screen isn't centered.
  19. #19  
    I love the gesture area. After several early adopters developed cracks radiating from the center button, I was happy to have a way to avoid using the button at all.
  20. bdog421's Avatar
    Posts
    513 Posts
    Global Posts
    575 Global Posts
    #20  
    No way, I love the gesture, one of the main reasons for it, is the ease of navigation. Less effort and movement to complete a "gesture" without touching the screen. If we had some kind of virtual pointer(kind of like a track ball but not) that would make it complete.

    I do agree that at first it's odd to get use to the gesture area and that may turn some people off, but once you get it, it's pretty cool to use. I really like the advanced setting, short quick little swipes to get through my open apps. I'd hate to swipe across the screen to activate the gesture, it just isn't easy enough when you want to move quickly through things.
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions