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  1.    #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Gmail is obscure? Wanting to use the threading feature on Gmail is something an "ordinary user" wouldn't be heavily into? I'd...have to disagree.



    Actually, within the Android web browser (Well, at least on the Hero), you have "cards" that you swipe horizontally between in both bookmark and multiwindow (think Firefox) modes. But it is kinetic scrolling instead of individual swiping. So it only takes one swipe to get from web page number 1 to number 20 or any inbetween. Just tap the one you want to stop it, and tap again to launch it immediately. No reloading.

    Again, each platform has usability advantages the other does not have. I definitely miss some things from WebOS as an Android user, but if I went back, I would definitely miss some Android features.

    But yeah...it's been a fun discussion. Hopefully, it keeps rolling.
    I don't want to say the the use of Gmail is obscure. Sorry if it came off like that. What I meant was that, when compared to the other mulititasking that people do, it is more likely that the will be swithing between individual apps much more often than switching between Gmail conversations. However, if you are a hardcore Gmail user, then perhaps android is the way to go. I for one run into more situations like the example I gave in the OP, so my pre knocks it out of the park. And IMHO, most other user will run into those situations as well.
    gotta admit though, I do dig the kinetic scrolling navigation that android deploys. But it doesn't beat the overall multitasking experience of webOS. At least not for this user.
    where oh where are you iphone fans? Jailbreaking is nice, but good luck utilizing the gesture area, the physical keyboard, etc etc, that the pre and it's native multitasking OS can offer. Mimicking the real thing does not hold a candle to using the device designed to take advantage of everything the OS can offer.
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  2. Olidie's Avatar
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    #42  
    I agree with all you guys on the poor marketing of WebOS devices. Palm and Sprint commercials talks about multitasking but do not show how simple and seemless it is to do so on WebOS. Android comes out and say that it too multitask.

    To the average consumer, multitasking is the same on all phones. What WebOS need is a marketing campaign showing off the strengths of WebOS rather than just talking about it. It has work for the iPhone, and the Droid has proven that it will work for other devices.

    These marketing campaigns need show people using webOS similar to the opening story to this tread, without of course being in the driver's seat.

    As for me, I always leave my most frequently use apps (messaging, email, calender) open at all times. I open and close others as needed, but thoses 3 are always open.
  3. piaband's Avatar
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    #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by chako View Post
    I've been a Palm user for years and owned several Treos, etc. The iphone was a test phone that I fell in love with. However, once the Pre came out, I jumped the apple ship on day one. I LOVED the Pre, however...

    When you're using the Nav app or looking up a map or using data in any way, that all gets put on hold while on a call. My wife called me just before I had to make a couple of turns and my Pre told me the Nav app could not be used while on a call! That was it! No data and voice simultaneously was a deal breaker for me.

    I moved back to the iphone and found that after jailbreaking it, I was able to get the same multitasking functions of the Pre, but on my iphone. All the features that the Pre has are available on the iphone through brilliant developers who are happy to modify it.

    In short, I still have an iphone and the real deal breaker for the Pre was the data/voice combination issues of Sprint (and Verizon for that matter). Sorry to say it, but the iphone wins again. Don't hate me. I still love the Pre. It's Sprint that fell short.
    This guy never owned a pre. guarantee it. b/c if he did, theres no way he would equate 3gs backgrounder to multitasking on webOS. look at his post-count. he's just an apple fanb0y trolling over here.

    1. I've used an iphone with backgrounder. It is the most choppy experience ever. you can just tell that the iphone wasnt configured to run like that.

    2. There are numerous reports of a recent apple update breaking the jailbreak. something called bootrom that will remove jailbreak every time you reboot your phone. There are other reports of itunes not syncing with jailbroke iphones. its becoming quite a mess. people saying they have to switch back to the 3g to get a normal jailbreaking experience. OUCH. I'd hate it if Palm did that.


    PS: Precentral blocked the use of fanb0y? Isnt that a little rediculous?
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by morrison0880 View Post
    I don't want to say the the use of Gmail is obscure. Sorry if it came off like that. What I meant was that, when compared to the other mulititasking that people do, it is more likely that the will be swithing between individual apps much more often than switching between Gmail conversations. However, if you are a hardcore Gmail user, then perhaps android is the way to go. I for one run into more situations like the example I gave in the OP, so my pre knocks it out of the park. And IMHO, most other user will run into those situations as well.
    Even if you take Gmail out of the equation, Android's browser having "cards" inside of it for both tabbed pages and bookmarks compensates for this as well.

    Since FB and Twitter can be handled by widgets, that means the mail/web/FB/Twitter combo that comprises the VAST majority of what smartphone users use their phone for is covered by Android requiring very little to no swiping or holding down the home button to switch between them.

    Again, it's all in the implementation.
  5. piaband's Avatar
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    #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Even if you take Gmail out of the equation, Android's browser having "cards" inside of it for both tabbed pages and bookmarks compensates for this as well.

    Since FB and Twitter can be handled by widgets, that means the mail/web/FB/Twitter combo that comprises the VAST majority of what smartphone users use their phone for is covered by Android requiring very little to no swiping or holding down the home button to switch between them.

    Again, it's all in the implementation.
    If I was a heavy emailer I probably wouldnt buy a webOS device. Its just not as quick as I would need it to be. However, it fits my need very well. If I send 5-10 emails a day, it works just fine. If I send upwards of 30 emails a day, I wouldnt get a Pre.

    But I wouldnt get an android either. I'd get a blackberry.
  6.    #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by chako View Post
    I've been a Palm user for years and owned several Treos, etc. The iphone was a test phone that I fell in love with. However, once the Pre came out, I jumped the apple ship on day one. I LOVED the Pre, however...

    When you're using the Nav app or looking up a map or using data in any way, that all gets put on hold while on a call. My wife called me just before I had to make a couple of turns and my Pre told me the Nav app could not be used while on a call! That was it! No data and voice simultaneously was a deal breaker for me.

    I moved back to the iphone and found that after jailbreaking it, I was able to get the same multitasking functions of the Pre, but on my iphone. All the features that the Pre has are available on the iphone through brilliant developers who are happy to modify it.

    In short, I still have an iphone and the real deal breaker for the Pre was the data/voice combination issues of Sprint (and Verizon for that matter). Sorry to say it, but the iphone wins again. Don't hate me. I still love the Pre. It's Sprint that fell short.
    What you say about Nav isn't entirely true. When it is running and you answer a phone call, Nav is still running. It still shows your location as you move, and the directions do appear when you click for them. What will happen is that it will not get a new route when you don't follow the directions or go off track. That is data sent to the phone, so it will not come across while you are using the phone app. Also, if you are on a call and want to bring up Nav, it will not load because it does require a data connection to initially launch. But yes, it does still work as a gps stand alone once launched.
    As for saying that you get the same multitasking abilities as the pre with a jailbroken iphone, I can guarantee that it is NOT close to the multitasking that webOS can offer. No gesture area to switch between apps, no card view to utilize...
    That being said, I do agree that it is awesome to watch what developers can do. If you are addicted to the iphone (and there are plenty of people out there who understandably are), but you want to take advantage of functions that Apple doesn't implement, then jailbreaking your phone is a completely legitimate way to enhance your iphone experience. I liken it to our own homebrew community. However, just because it's jailbroken does not bring it on par with what the pre can do. IMO.
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  7.    #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by olidie View Post
    These marketing campaigns need show people using webOS similar to the opening story to this tread, without of course being in the driver's seat.
    It seems that I've touched a nerve with having me driving while using the phone in my example. So let's just assume that I meant that I was a PASSENGER in the vehicle. That should fix the example a bit, right?
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  8.    #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by piaband View Post
    2. There are numerous reports of a recent apple update breaking the jailbreak. something called bootrom that will remove jailbreak every time you reboot your phone. There are other reports of itunes not syncing with jailbroke iphones. its becoming quite a mess. people saying they have to switch back to the 3g to get a normal jailbreaking experience. OUCH. I'd hate it if Palm did that.


    PS: Precentral blocked the use of fanb0y? Isnt that a little rediculous?
    Yet another reason to choose the pre over the iphone. A freely open community of developers and homebrewers, not only accepted by Palm, but actually recognized the the CES event! I believe there was only one instance where Palm asked the community to hold back, and for the life of me I can't remember why that was. But I do know that it was a legitimate concern, and was done so in a very polite letter to the developers. If anyone remembers this, let me know. It's really hurting my brain trying to think of it.
    And yeah, I noticed the banning of fanb0y in another post. I thought that was pretty funny too!
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  9. C01E's Avatar
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    #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by morrison0880 View Post
    I posted this in another thread defending the speed of the pre against the iphone, but I thought I'd make it into its own thread to see the responses I could get.

    I agree with some of the posts that the iphone and the Droid are faster than the pre. I've seen my pre matched up with a droid and an iphone here in the office, and the speed in opening apps favors them both, as do the speed of their calendars. However, the browser speeds were very similar, and in some cases favored the pre, which, I think, can be attributed somewhat to my Sprint network (which I believe is the best out there, just my opinion so take it as it is).

    One thing that does get neglected in a lot of these comparisons is the pre's ability to multitask. If you look at any of the comparison videos or listen to people's experiences, they're always comparing the head to head opening of apps. The beautiful thing about the pre is that it can not only launch multiple apps at a time, but can also keep those apps active and you can switch back and forth between them quickly and seemlessly. The fact that I can keep 3 applications open and active means that once they are open, I don't have to restart them to access them again. With the iphone I have to open the app, and then close it in order to open another app. And so on. The advantage that it has over the pre for opening apps is completely lost if you have to wait for each app to load again after closing it. The droid is the same, except to a bit lesser extent because of the multitasking abilities there, which are still much less elegant and user friendly than the pre.

    Here's one test. Measure the amount of time it takes to open your phone app, a music app, the browser, the camera, and your calendar. The pre can do all of these at the same time. The iphone needs to open and close each app individually. Not really sure how the pre would handle this, but I'd still put my money on the pre.

    Here is another real world example. I am using the navigator to direct me to a local pub to hang with friends when the phone rings. I answer the phone and a friend asks me to confirm that I got the email he sent an hour ago and let me know if he included the information in it (whatever that might be =). I open up the email and find what he sent me and can confirm that it's all there. While I'm doing this I get a notification that my girlfriend just sent me a text. I decide to deal with that later because I'm busy at the moment. Then I hang up and decided to stream Pandora through my car speakers via bluetooth. Then I put my phone back on the car charger (for my pre, it's a touchstone charger attached to my dash, which is perfect for the navigation app), and away I go to my destination.

    Now, this is how quickly and easily this would go on my pre: When the phone rings I answer it, leaving the nav app running in the background. Then, without hanging up on my buddy, I open my email app. I get the text notification and swipe it away. After that I can swipe away my phone and email apps, all the while keeping nav running. Then, I open up Pandora and start it up. Then I swipe back to bring nav to the main screen, set the phone on the Touchstone, and I'm done. No need to close one app to open another.

    Please, tell me how the iphone or the droid would handle this situation, and THEN tell me that using the either of them is easier and faster than using the pre.

    Placing the iPhone in any multitasking based test is an automatic F for the iPhone for obvious reasons... This is also why I just ditched my iPhone and plan to buy a pre... Apple has had 3 years to figure it out, and they insult their users with push notifications? Really apple? ...
  10. #50  
    I know I'm a lil late to the party on this one, but I've had a Pre for about 4 months and I decided to buy a Hero. I got my Hero by UPS at 4 pm on Monday and by noon on Tuesday I called and had my line switched back to the Pre. I've continued to play with the phone since then and I've come the conclusion that everything I needed to do on the Hero was faster and more fluid on the pre. When connected to the same wi-fi the pre was 5-6 seconds faster loading pages and dont even get me started on the lag. People complain about the pre, well use a Hero for a day Sure the Android multitasks but not well, and not easily. Sure the Android Market has a ton of apps, but how many soundboards does one person need? Its flooded with crap like the iphone and like I'm sure our App catalog will be eventually.

    As I understand it the lag could very well be the phone itself and not the OS, so I'm certainly willing to concede that but for ease of use it's not even a question.
  11. #51  
    While it is true the Pre cannot do simultaneous voice and data transmission due to being on a CDMA network, one advantage CDMA has over GSM is better call clarity. It's really a trade off. GSM faster, CDMA higher quality sound.
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by morrison0880 View Post
    It seems that I've touched a nerve with having me driving while using the phone in my example. So let's just assume that I meant that I was a PASSENGER in the vehicle. That should fix the example a bit, right?
    then you have to fight with the driver over the cigarette lighter because your phone will die in 30 minutes.
  13. jaywaller's Avatar
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    #53  
    I think the most recent "Multi-tasking" commercial by Apple is hilarious. It talks about being on the phone and then looking up a show time or something at the same time.

    But to the large majority of consumers, they are going to think they get multi-tasking because that is what the guy on the commercial is saying. Hilarious. I think it should be called "Two-tasking - phone only." So you can be on the phone and open one app at a time.
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by chino0131 View Post
    Iphone users (at least the ones I've come in contact on this site) will defend the iphone to their death. While their loyalty is commendable,some obviously do feel the need for multitasking even if they wont admit it. On these types of sites, the most frequent iphone user response to multitasking is jailbreaking. The majority of my family (myself included before PRE), and the majority of my friends and in laws all own an iphone. NONE have ever heard of the Pre, except for my wife and my brother in law(who works for Sprint). NONE have also ever heard of Jailbreaking an iphone. ALL wish their iphone could multitask like the Pre.
    1. I'm sure they've never heard of homebrew either. They don't check internet boards. I bet more people know about jailbreaking than homebrew.
    2. If pre can defend the lack of vk with a patch why is not fair iphone to talk about multiflow?
    3. shows how popular the iphone is and how important marketing is to people. They don't know they need multitasking til they are shown how cool it is. Who here hasn't had a family member switch from a dumbphone then show everyone how cool multitouch is to other (older) friends?
    4. Your family thinks multitask is cool but they won't jump ship prolly cuz they don't value cell phone use as much as us.
    4. Sure they wish it could multitask but no one will switch because they
  15.    #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by surfhi View Post
    then you have to fight with the driver over the cigarette lighter because your phone will die in 30 minutes.
    Nah, I drive a CX7, so there are two outlets up front. I get the Touchstone, he can have the loose car charger. Assuming that he's driving my car because 1) That makes the story easier, and 2) We'll also assume that I've been drinking at work because it's a Friday, so I'm a little buzzed already.
    Oh yes, I do down a 323 or a Spotted Cow, or three, on Fridays.
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I already answered this in the original thread as a current Android user.

    Any Android phone could do everything in your scenario, except instead of swiping, you'd just hold the home button for 2 seconds and then tap the app that you want to go to.

    Is it "easier" or "faster"? Not at all. But it is roughly just as easy and fast, especially when dealing 4-6 programs.
    I gotta tell ya, at least half the reason I just bought an ERIS for my son is that the DROID commercials got me worked up about that OS and I wanted to spend some time with it. Now that I've played around with it, that interface isn't much different from the iPhone and nowhere close to the ease of WebOS. Why every other OS doesn't have some type of card/window metaphor, as you find on every computer OS, is beyond me. It's just the right way to do it. I disagree that it's just as easy or just as fast. I like that Android is more mature OS, but that whole home button thing needs to go.
  17. #57  
    As somebody that uses an iPhone as their primary device (but I also carry a Android device and a Pre) I can say, that there are times I wish the iPhone multitasked like the Pre. However, my needing or wanting multitasking just isn't great enough to give up what the iPhone (in my opinion) does far better than the Pre. In addition I would be lost without some of the apps I use that the Pre does not yet have.

    So there are trade offs to both devices, but the multitasking strength of the Pre does not overshadow its other problems (terrible hardware).
  18. #58  
    I'm glad there is such post.

    I was a long time palmOS user since Palm Pilot. I never thought multi-tasking was necessary. This belief was strengthened for my experience of using a WM 6 smartphone before. I could say switching programs in a single-task palmOS deivce would be faster, more comfortable than a multi-tasking WM6.

    Iphone makers must would have that belief, too.

    There is a Chinese old saying to describe an easy job. It is "As easy as flipping your palm".

    That is the Multi-tasking experience palm pre webOS has given to their users. A non-pre user will not understand. Iphone users think multi-tasking is not important is just like what we had thought before. It is because they have not that experience.

    I could said " If multi-tasking is not as easy as flipping your palm, then better nothing."
  19.    #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by surfhi View Post
    1. I'm sure they've never heard of homebrew either. They don't check internet boards. I bet more people know about jailbreaking than homebrew.
    2. If pre can defend the lack of vk with a patch why is not fair iphone to talk about multiflow?
    3. shows how popular the iphone is and how important marketing is to people. They don't know they need multitasking til they are shown how cool it is. Who here hasn't had a family member switch from a dumbphone then show everyone how cool multitouch is to other (older) friends?
    4. Your family thinks multitask is cool but they won't jump ship prolly cuz they don't value cell phone use as much as us.
    4. Sure they wish it could multitask but no one will switch because they
    1) More people may know about jailbreaking than homebrew, but that's because there a vastly more iphone users than pre users. =) The nice thing is that, once a pre user discovers or is directed to precentral, modifying his oe her phone through patches, themes, tweaks, etc, is extremely easy, and not frowned upon by the manufacturer.
    2) It is fair for the iphone to talk about how jailbreaking lets the iclone to use multiflow. It is not fair to say that it comes close to the multitasking abilities of webOS. Really, be honest. It isn't even in the same ballpark.
    3) You are right. The marketing dept of Apple is second to none. Period. That said, what is your point? Are you saying that they don't think they need multitasking, but once they experience it, they realize how lacking the Apple OS really is? That sounds more like your agreeing that multitasking it needed, and the iphone can't offer it. That is, unless you jailbreak it and use a mutant version of multitasking.
    4) Not sure what's being stated here.
    *I think you meant 5) Either you lost your train of thought, or you couldn't think of a reason NOT to switch to the pre.
    Thanks for the input though. As I said, an iphone user will not answer my original question and let me know how they would perform the tasks in my example. At least Android has a response. iclones lean on jailbreaking, but then don't finish up by telling me exactly how they would use it to do what the pre can.
    Last edited by morrison0880; 01/13/2010 at 05:16 PM.
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
  20.    #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by GMoney749 View Post
    I gotta tell ya, at least half the reason I just bought an ERIS for my son is that the DROID commercials got me worked up about that OS and I wanted to spend some time with it. Now that I've played around with it, that interface isn't much different from the iPhone and nowhere close to the ease of WebOS. Why every other OS doesn't have some type of card/window metaphor, as you find on every computer OS, is beyond me. It's just the right way to do it. I disagree that it's just as easy or just as fast. I like that Android is more mature OS, but that whole home button thing needs to go.
    Great comment, and it really shows that effective advertising can increase the mindshare of a product, which is exactly what Palm needs.
    I like your comment about the card metaphor as well. You know a product / OS is on to something when the bring a feature to the table that was never there before, but, once released, seems so obvious that it's a mystery why no one thought of it before. To be fair, Apple could claim having done this in the past. But Palm is there now, and the gesture area, wave launcher combo and the card metaphor features are doing exactly that.
    I don't understand the purpose of the line, I don't need to drink to have fun. Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and sticks when they've invented the lighter?

    Let's all give thanks to the app that started it all.
    http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...ebrew-app.html
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