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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    You seem determined to be Pro Palm at all costs. I'm surprised you don't have a cape on with a giant Palm logo on the back while you post on here
    Not really, it's more that I have owned my own business, and understand that there are things others don't see or realize about it. It's easy for the hamburger flippers to say "You should do this" when they don't realize what "this" takes. The fact is that the current leadership at Palm took a company that everyone had written off, that most "experts" were telling investors they would be making a mistake buying in at around $1.50 a share, to one that is selling product, hiring employees, is no longer being written off, and is currently trading at $16.83 a share.

    I think some of the folks on here need to stick to their hamburgers.

    (Oh, and I have a cape, they just don't let me bring it past the govt' security station where I work...)

    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Are you really trying to say that the Pixi didn't take much in resources? It's a new phone, a new form factor for palm, different guts, different size and resolution screen, etc. It takes marketing, testing, reaching out to carriers, promotions, blah blah blah. Any changes to webOS now have to be tested for the Pixi. Apps have to be designed for a low end Pixi different resolution and all. It slows down a young OS struggling to get out of beta.
    Nope, I'm saying that a staggered release, such as what they are doing with the Pixi (and hopefully, now with whatever the "Pre2" will be) best utilizes limited resources. Most of those job duties you mentioned have a beginning and end of a cycle. When the end of the cycle is reached, a company either lays people off, or starts to the new product.

    BTW, one of the design features of WebOS is that different resolution screens require very little modifications of the software. Sort of like I'm looking at this on a 1680x1050 screen at work, but when I go home to use on my 1900x1200 screen, no one has to rewrite anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Someone on here said palm had like 1000 employees. Those employees wrapped up with the pixi could be focusing on the Pre, the beta app catalog, optimizing webOS, and whatnot.
    That's just it, no they couldn't. The hardware team that worked on the Pre, their job is finished. Has been for weeks. They cannot move over to the beta app catalog, or optimize WebOS, or whatnot because they're hardware engineers.

    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    More customers? The Pre was already set up for it. Sell the 8gb for 79-99. Introduce a 32gb for 199. Launch more carriers..that's costly enough at first. Each has different requirements. Each foreign market requires marketing, promotions, etc.
    Again, we mere mortals don't know what Palm's agreements are, do you? Do you know whether or not they're allowed to put devices on Verizon or T-Mobile yet? Do you know whether or not they were allowed to put a lower end device out to other carriers?

    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Learned lesson? Palm sold the centros in bulk and for cheap (and on SERO). They still couldn't post a profit. You can't compete with the teen favored messenging phones in that range that don't require data plans that this Pixi will.
    The problem wasn't the price point. The problem was a dated OS that brought nothing new to an increasingly competitive market.
  2. gbp
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    #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by meyerweb View Post
    But you can access your Yahoo email via the web interface, just like you do on a desktop.
    thanks , I did use the browser version. But for that to happen I have to enable "Mobile" version in the browser settings.

    If I do the mobile thing , I will miss my yahoo stock portfolio desktop version.
    Besides the flash on the Hero is not working for this stocks portfolio.

    Overall the phone looks like iPhone ( screen and touch feel) with a nice track ball. But switching between the apps is a royal pain. I am spoiled by the Pre.
    Not only I can switch between browsers , but I know how many of them are "out there" open. With Hero I have no clue how many open apps exists. May be I don't need to know that.

    I know Google doesn't care for Yahoo and its email. But, leaving yahoo imap is not a good decision by SPRINT / HTC. I am sure it will make few mad.
    I was at androidcentral , couple of guys posted this issue.
    Last edited by gbp; 10/14/2009 at 03:23 PM.
  3. #163  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Not really, it's more that I have owned my own business, and understand that there are things others don't see or realize about it. It's easy for the hamburger flippers to say "You should do this" when they don't realize what "this" takes. The fact is that the current leadership at Palm took a company that everyone had written off, that most "experts" were telling investors they would be making a mistake buying in at around $1.50 a share, to one that is selling product, hiring employees, is no longer being written off, and is currently trading at $16.83 a share.

    I think some of the folks on here need to stick to their hamburgers.

    (Oh, and I have a cape, they just don't let me bring it past the govt' security station where I work...)


    Nope, I'm saying that a staggered release, such as what they are doing with the Pixi (and hopefully, now with whatever the "Pre2" will be) best utilizes limited resources. Most of those job duties you mentioned have a beginning and end of a cycle. When the end of the cycle is reached, a company either lays people off, or starts to the new product.

    BTW, one of the design features of WebOS is that different resolution screens require very little modifications of the software. Sort of like I'm looking at this on a 1680x1050 screen at work, but when I go home to use on my 1900x1200 screen, no one has to rewrite anything.


    That's just it, no they couldn't. The hardware team that worked on the Pre, their job is finished. Has been for weeks. They cannot move over to the beta app catalog, or optimize WebOS, or whatnot because they're hardware engineers.


    Again, we mere mortals don't know what Palm's agreements are, do you? Do you know whether or not they're allowed to put devices on Verizon or T-Mobile yet? Do you know whether or not they were allowed to put a lower end device out to other carriers?


    The problem wasn't the price point. The problem was a dated OS that brought nothing new to an increasingly competitive market.
    A hamburger flipper? I consult businesses on a daily basis as a CPA/MBA for over 15 years now. Or in other words, i tell business owners like you what to do. Although you said you were a "former" business owner which would imply your business failed. I'm not surprised.

    I'm not going to debate you any longer because there's no point. You wear Palm colored glasses. Let me know if you ever decide to take them off.

    I can only say it will be interesting to see what happens in the future. I've already sold my Palm stock for a gain a few months back. I don't consider it worth buying now.
  4. gbp
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    #164  
    Quote Originally Posted by meyerweb View Post
    Apple could afford to wait. They were the 800 lb gorilla in the space. With little real competition in sales, they didn't need cut and paste, or video recording. Palm doesn't have that luxury. They're the 100lb weaking on the beach, and the bullies are going to start kicking sand in their face(s) real soon now. It's hard to argue video isn't important when ALL of your competitors offer it.
    I agree to the video thing, but PALM is better of now compared to how it was in Dec 2008 ( stock dipped to 1.5).

    Don't you think it is no longer a weak company ?
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    You seem determined to be Pro Palm at all costs. I'm surprised you don't have a cape on with a giant Palm logo on the back while you post on here

    Are you really trying to say that the Pixi didn't take much in resources? It's a new phone, a new form factor for palm, different guts, different size and resolution screen, etc. It takes marketing, testing, reaching out to carriers, promotions, blah blah blah. Any changes to webOS now have to be tested for the Pixi. Apps have to be designed for a low end Pixi different resolution and all. It slows down a young OS struggling to get out of beta.

    Someone on here said palm had like 1000 employees. Those employees wrapped up with the pixi could be focusing on the Pre, the beta app catalog, optimizing webOS, and whatnot.

    More customers? The Pre was already set up for it. Sell the 8gb for 79-99. Introduce a 32gb for 199. Launch more carriers..that's costly enough at first. Each has different requirements. Each foreign market requires marketing, promotions, etc.

    Learned lesson? Palm sold the centros in bulk and for cheap (and on SERO). They still couldn't post a profit. You can't compete with the teen favored messenging phones in that range that don't require data plans that this Pixi will.
    I guess it depends on how they're staffed, but it wouldn't seem likely that you could just take those industrial design guys you hired to design the Pre and tell them to start programming the app catalog or the OS, right? You either fire them, tell them to sit on their hands, or start working on designing something else. No?

    But even without that, the Pixie isn't for me (and the name is really stupid) but I think it's great that they're coming out with another form factor. Truth be told, at the end of last year when I was frustrated with my BB, and the WinMo or Android phones weren't cutting it, if Apple had been offering an iPhone with a physical keyboard and replacable battery I'd probably be Borg right now...
  6. gbp
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    #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    A hamburger flipper? I consult businesses on a daily basis as a CPA/MBA for over 15 years now. Or in other words, i tell business owners like you what to do. Although you said you were a "former" business owner which would imply your business failed. I'm not surprised.

    I'm not going to debate you any longer because there's no point. You wear Palm colored glasses. Let me know if you ever decide to take them off.

    I can only say it will be interesting to see what happens in the future. I've already sold my Palm stock for a gain a few months back. I don't consider it worth buying now.
    Cardfan , in fairness, Pixie wouldn't take much of PALM's time now.
    I have a feeling that they have the device "ready" last month.

    The fact that Pixie showed up in engadget show and few other youtube videos makes me think its ready for the most part. They even addressed the screen resolution difference in SDK.

    If anything , they should be working on a bigger capacity ( 16 or 32 Gig) Pre or that Pixie Pro.
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    A hamburger flipper? I consult businesses on a daily basis as a CPA/MBA for over 15 years now. Or in other words, i tell business owners like you what to do. Although you said you were a "former" business owner which would imply your business failed. I'm not surprised.
    Funny, I didn't mention you, why did you infer so?

    And no, the business didn't fail, at least not while I was there. I went through a divorce, won custody and decided that after 3 years, and now as a single dad, I no longer had 60-80 to devote to the business, so I sold to my partner.

    Turned out it was good timing. That was about 17 years ago, and as I had predicted, computer purchases eventually became a commodity that no longer supported a dedicated computer retail outlet. Robert eventually closed shop (3 years later), but don't know if he sold to someone or just shut down. Six years wasn't a bad run, especially in light of the fact that about 80% of small business fail within the first two years (possibly listening too much to folks that know numbers instead of product, but that's just a guess).
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I'm not going to debate you any longer because there's no point. You wear Palm colored glasses. Let me know if you ever decide to take them off.
    Probably for the best, since it would seem when you run out of valid arguments, you turn to personal attacks. As for the "palm colored glasses", you must have missed the fact that I had decided to get a BB. A job change shifted things, but I'm glad they did. The BB wouldn't have been useful to me in business (my job requires a DOD approved BB, which is on the way), so I'll have both of what I wanted...
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I can only say it will be interesting to see what happens in the future. I've already sold my Palm stock for a gain a few months back. I don't consider it worth buying now.
    You didn't say how many months, but I'll assume around two. Had you waited, wouldn't that have made about you about 12% more? Numbers ain't my forte, but since you brung it up...

    Even if some of the pundits are correct, and Palm fails (though not many are talking about that these days, save "experts" on the forums here... ahem...) what they've done saved them thus far. Had they continued the way they were, they would undoubtedly be gone...
  8. #168  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    A hamburger flipper? I consult businesses on a daily basis as a CPA/MBA for over 15 years now. Or in other words, i tell business owners like you what to do. Although you said you were a "former" business owner which would imply your business failed. I'm not surprised.

    I'm not going to debate you any longer because there's no point. You wear Palm colored glasses. Let me know if you ever decide to take them off.

    I can only say it will be interesting to see what happens in the future. I've already sold my Palm stock for a gain a few months back. I don't consider it worth buying now.
    And yet, he's right you know. I shouldn't even have to say it. His entire post is spot on, and you'll ignore it because you think he's biased. If anyone is biased, it's yourself, and you show it in virtually every post.
  9. #169  
    Quote Originally Posted by GMoney749 View Post
    I guess it depends on how they're staffed, but it wouldn't seem likely that you could just take those industrial design guys you hired to design the Pre and tell them to start programming the app catalog or the OS, right? You either fire them, tell them to sit on their hands, or start working on designing something else. No?
    ...
    Shhhh, don't tell him that... he's a money guy, not a project manager... they're costing you money, so you put them to work, if an OS is important, you put them to work on the OS. It's all about the $$$ dude...[/Sarcasm]
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Shhhh, don't tell him that... he's a money guy, not a project manager... they're costing you money, so you put them to work, if an OS is important, you put them to work on the OS. It's all about the $$$ dude...[/Sarcasm]
    I guess the circle jerk is complete. I'll leave you and your sidekicks alone. Doesn't it seem weird how threads go down hill after you make your appearance? You made the personal attack, I simply responded.

    My mistake.. And on ignore you go
  11. #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I guess the circle jerk is complete. I'll leave you and your sidekicks alone. Doesn't it seem weird how threads go down hill after you make your appearance? You made the personal attack, I simply responded.

    My mistake.. And on ignore you go
    Where was the personal attack? He used a metaphor about hamburger flippers, I'm not seeing anything personal there. Threads go "down hill" when anyone posts the truth, there's not much more to discuss when it's out there right in the open.
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I guess the circle jerk is complete. I'll leave you and your sidekicks alone. Doesn't it seem weird how threads go down hill after you make your appearance? You made the personal attack, I simply responded.

    My mistake.. And on ignore you go
    Psssst, "hambuger flipper" is a common term used by IT support people. It typically refers to people that are acting as if they're experts in a field where they really aren't. While it is perjorative, I was not really directing it at you in particular, just the "experts" in general.

    If you'd like, I'd be more than happy to refer you back to many of the stupid little snide remarks you like to throw at me though.
  13. #173  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I guess the circle jerk is complete.
    I think I've just been insulted, and yet I'm sitting here laughing about it. Good work.
  14. #174  
    More useful feedback, hparsons.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  15. #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by Elysian893 View Post
    Where was the personal attack? He used a metaphor about hamburger flippers, I'm not seeing anything personal there. Threads go "down hill" when anyone posts the truth, there's not much more to discuss when it's out there right in the open.
    You hammered that one on the head. There's a small group of folks on every forum that determine it's their right, neigh their duty to post their thoughts and fully expect them to go unchallenged.

    Cardfan kinda glossed over the "cape and Palm logo" crack. Guess that's somehow more "highbrow" than hamburger flipper...

    The one thing I will say for him, he's smart enough to realize that if you want your fantasy world, where you hold the unshakable truth to all things, to remain unshaken, it's best to put anyone one who can debate against your beliefs on "ignore".

    I have this picture of someone with their fingers in their ears going "LaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLa"
    Last edited by hparsons; 10/14/2009 at 04:29 PM.
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    More useful feedback, hparsons.
    Every bit as useful as the one you mentioned prior...
  17. gbp
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    #177  
    guys we are here to discuss about Pre and PALM
    no personal attacks please
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