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  1. Goyena's Avatar
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       #1  
    This thread has info and means to get legally unlocked phones from countries where the possibility might exist. Just the basics now (from Wikipedia and a PalmCentral's post) feel free to add.

    Checklist for importing an "sim-unlocked" Pre:
    1. DATA CONNECTION CONFIGURATION (APN): Is your carrier's data pre-configured? (check current tested list here, thanks to Dakis)
    2. PALM PROFILE ACTIVATION: Is the Palm Profile activated (by importer) or can you do it (with data connection or bypassed with WebOS Internals Meta Doctor)?
    3. 3G BAND COMPATBILITY: Does your carrier use same 3G bands as device?
    Check page 3 of this thread for discussion on last two points...
    4. WEIRD FOREIGN KEYBOARD LAYOUT: Can you live with different keyboard layout (although it is possible to change key assignments. e.g. pushing a Z on a QWERTZ keyboard will give you a Y, as if it were QWERTY)


    SIMLOCKING/EXCLUSIVITY laws and practices (or network selling unlocked) from (wikipedia)

    Germany - O2 is exclusive dealer, but sells unlocked Pres without a contract.

    Spain - In 1998, the Spanish telecom regulator Comision del Mercado de las Telecommunicaciones, saw that Spanish mobile carriers already provided unlocking codes voluntarily for fee within the first 12 months and for free after 12 months, so CMT decided not to put any legal framework in Spain.CMT has not revisited this decision since then, therefore there are no simlocking laws in Spain.
    Movistar sells locked QWERTY Pres. Apparently it is possible to unlock with IMEI (legality unknown); see post in this thread here[/URL].

    UK - In the United Kingdom, mobile phone network providers don't have to provide unlocking codes at all even after the end of the contract. Most operators offer some form of voluntary unlocking service, depending on the state of the contract and the model of phone, but usually for a charge. The full Oftel 2002 SIM lock position paper specifies that there is no SIM locking law in the UK; the regulator only wants "consumer awareness". The examples within the position paper are just "examples" of current carrier practices for illustration purposes, but do not reflect any official Oftel regulation. The main networks may unlock handsets at their discretion at a cost either at the end of a contract or if it is a prepay handset after several months. O2's iPhone and Vodafone's new Blackberry offerings (i.e., Storm)[ are two examples of UK carriers not offering unlocking codes.

    PRICES AND SPECS
    Germany - QWERTZ Pre, EUR 481 (this is the unsubsidized/no contract price, it's simlock free )
    Spain - QWERTY Pre (simlocked, contract only, exclusive Movistar)
    UK - QWERTY Pre (unofficially: simlocked, contract only, exclusive O2)

    Note on language: The OS in GSM Pre's have German, English, Spanish, French and Italian localization.


    Edit (10/12/09): It appears there's something else that might prevent you from using a simlock-free Pre's data connection on any network. According this article (in German), the network connection is NOT MANUALLY CONFIGURABLE as "known" providers' settings have been pre-programmed - tests have nevertheless shown problems connecting. (Thanks for the link, Spud101)



    Edit 2 (22/12/09): In addition to the issue above, two other questions remain unresolved: (1) whether the sole unlocked (German O2) uses the necessary bands to enable full 3G data use (EDGE is possible). Around page 3 of this thread, I'm not sure if it's a hardware or software thing. (2) Activation of the Palm Profile must be done (or bypassed).
    Last edited by Goyena; 11/02/2009 at 03:14 AM. Reason: Dakis' list of compatible carriers added
    Pixi Plus - Pre Plus - Pre 2 - Pre 3 - Touchpad 1 ;-)
  2. #2  
    I belive that French telecommunications law states that all mobile phones must be offered to customers unlocked so that my also be another avenue for a unlocked GSM Pre.
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by ryleyinstl View Post
    I belive that French telecommunications law states that all mobile phones must be offered to customers unlocked so that my also be another avenue for a unlocked GSM Pre.
    That's also what I have read. France, Belgium and a few others required unlocked phones to be available to prevent the monopolization by one company.
    My Phone & My Wife's Phone Two Unlocked GSM Treo Pro's

  4. Goyena's Avatar
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       #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by ryleyinstl View Post
    I belive that French telecommunications law states that all mobile phones must be offered to customers unlocked so that my also be another avenue for a unlocked GSM Pre.
    I live in France and am playing the waiting game, so I am wondering if that was the reason Palm was taking their sweet time in releasing it here. In the three countries listed above, none of the providers are legally obliged to provide unlock codes. In France (according to Wikipedia) you have the right to them, either against a fee, or for free in the last six months. Exclusivity is also against the law.

    For at least up to early 2010, Palm has got it so all Pre's sold (CDMA and GSM) are locked to a single vendor. Thanks so much.

    Would somebody please remind me how the heck this is going to help WebOS dominate the world??? I secretly suspect that they are incapable of producing the necessary volumes anyway, so they might as help out their bottom line by a few juicy exclusivity agreements.

    I didn't add the wikipedia simlock entry for France since there's no plans for release there yet, but here's a paste: In France, SIM locks are not prohibited. However, the mobile operator must inform the consumer of the existence of a SIM lock. The subscriber has the right to request that the SIM lock be removed at any time. No later than 6 months prior to the conclusion of the contract, the mobile operator must "systematically and free of charge" provide the subscriber with a procedure to deactivate the SIM lock.Operators may charge a fee for removing the SIM lock prior to the 6-month deadline.

    Apparently Singapore is the only country which expressly forbids simlocks. In Europe, the European regulators left it up to national law to decide.
    Pixi Plus - Pre Plus - Pre 2 - Pre 3 - Touchpad 1 ;-)
  5. Goyena's Avatar
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       #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    That's also what I have read. France, Belgium and a few others required unlocked phones to be available to prevent the monopolization by one company.
    Be careful to separate the issues of "simlocking" and "exclusivity". For "our" purposes (to get a Pre and use it on another country and/or network), all we really care about is if it's simlock-free.

    iPhones in France are sold by all major carriers (nonexclusive distribution), but still simlocked into their network for a few months (unless you pay the equivalent of the subsidy).
    Pixi Plus - Pre Plus - Pre 2 - Pre 3 - Touchpad 1 ;-)
  6. #6  
    I'm not liking this, from the hardware review on theunwired.net:

    the European Palm Pre, as released by Telefónica and O2, supports quadband GSM/GPRS/EDGE as well as dualband UMTS/HSDPA (but not HSUPA) at 900/2100 MHz.
    So my prediction was incorrect, but I hope it's them who's wrong.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  7. Goyena's Avatar
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       #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    So my prediction was incorrect, but I hope it's them who's wrong.
    I don't copy you. What was your prediction?
    Pixi Plus - Pre Plus - Pre 2 - Pre 3 - Touchpad 1 ;-)
  8. #8  
    Wow...that was random.

    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    I'm not liking this, from the hardware review on theunwired.net:



    So my prediction was incorrect, but I hope it's them who's wrong.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Goyena View Post
    I don't copy you. What was your prediction?
    This: http://www.precentral.net/good-news-...-and-unlocking

    So by means, if it only has 900/2100 HSDPA, it will not work with AT&T and Rogers/Bell/Telus for 3G, 2G EDGE only.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Goyena View Post
    Be careful to separate the issues of "simlocking" and "exclusivity". For "our" purposes (to get a Pre and use it on another country and/or network), all we really care about is if it's simlock-free.

    iPhones in France are sold by all major carriers (nonexclusive distribution), but still simlocked into their network for a few months (unless you pay the equivalent of the subsidy).
    Good point!
    My Phone & My Wife's Phone Two Unlocked GSM Treo Pro's

  11. pjim's Avatar
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    #11  
    Hello everyone.

    I've been lurking here since some time after CES and now decided to register and share a few thoughts I have about buying a Pre abroad.

    First there's the issue with the warranty. I would imagine that the Pre comes with a one year warranty within the EU issued by Palm though I haven't found any confirmation. Given the fact that the build-quality of the Pre varies shall we say, I would have to send the device abroad for repairs either through O2 or Palm most likely at my own cost both ways. That takes time, money and a spare phone but personally I might be able to live with that. If the warranty is only issued in countries where O2 offers the device, then I for one will be buying something else.

    My second concern is the language and the character set used on the Pre. I for one will be needing additional alphabets to the English ones. Luckily the German character set has two of the three I need but unfortunately I can't speak -and use a Pre in- German. Hopefully the character set on the device isn't tied to the language used in the UI. The lack of options in the menus all over the Pre suggest otherwise. If this is the case then that's a deal breaker for me.

    And the final thing I'm pondering is the use of Palm profile service and webOS updates. I can't see any reason why Palm would make impossible to use the service outside of the countries where the Pre will be offered but that's something I would like confirmation on directly from Palm before I buy anything.

    Bit of a long post but... Any thoughts?
  12. TrevMoore's Avatar
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    #12  
    As soon as I see a UK import, I will be purchasing it. I don't care about the US 3G (I use T-Mobile). I will use it on wifi all the time and EDGE Isn't THAT bad.

    At least that will hold me off until something official comes into the use. Granted, T-Mobile will probably never get a 3G WebOS device, so Wifi and EDGE it is!
    Last edited by TrevMoore; 10/07/2009 at 08:19 PM.
  13. vladi's Avatar
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    #13  
    There is one thing I always wanted to know about 3G. Can we partially use 3G?
    2100MHz frequency is used for download and its compatible with T-Mobile 3G but upload frequency of 1900MHz is not (T-Mobile uses 1700MHz) so instead can we use EDGE for upload?
  14. TrevMoore's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by vladi View Post
    There is one thing I always wanted to know about 3G. Can we partially use 3G?
    2100MHz frequency is used for download and its compatible with T-Mobile 3G but upload frequency of 1900MHz is not (T-Mobile uses 1700MHz) so instead can we use EDGE for upload?
    Nope. You either get it, or your don't.
  15. #15  
    You can see the network in the network list, but that's about it.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by TrevMoore View Post
    As soon as I see a UK import, I will be purchasing it. I don't care about the US 3G (I use T-Mobile). I will use it on wifi all the time and EDGE Isn't THAT bad.

    At least that will hold me off until something official comes into the use. Granted, T-Mobile will probably never get a 3G WebOS device, so Wifi and EDGE it is!
    That's the same way I feel. I have T-Mobile and Edge is fast enough for my mobile phone. I can use GPS and TeleNav and the Edge data connection updates maps fine. I can use Orb and connect to my home computer and watch TV off my computers TV card. If I need anything faster I use my home computer and my cable connection.
    My Phone & My Wife's Phone Two Unlocked GSM Treo Pro's

  17. Goyena's Avatar
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       #17  
    I've seen that most people "confirm" that the O2 Germany Pre will be available unlocked, but I can't find anything official (from Palm or O2) or semi-official (from someone who works in a O2 store?). Can anybody direct me to a link? (and not a link in the comments to some article...I got those already)

    I'll update my first post with the availability of languages in each country's version as soon as I find something on that. This is probably a non-issue for chaps over at webos-internals, but I wanted the thread to hold info for the majority of consumers. (i.e. no "illegal" sim-unlocking, no reflashing OS, etc.)
    Pixi Plus - Pre Plus - Pre 2 - Pre 3 - Touchpad 1 ;-)
  18. c_man's Avatar
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    #18  
    Called O2 UK earlier. The customer services advisor informed me they know nothing about the Pre, its features, its selling points, or its availability. They told me to call my local branch as the staff will have undergone training for the phone... who will be able to answer any questions I have.

    ...just got off the phone to my local O2 store in London.

    They have already got the store set up to house the phones when they arrive (stands, posters, etc). This is the only marketing (if you can call it that) I've seen/heard of, of the Pre at all

    She was hopeful they will arrive on the 16th but didn't sound convincing . From what I gather, the actual in store employees know VERY LITTLE about the phone itself. Though she did confirm, no pre-orders. Have to wait until 16th.

    She confirmed they will not be selling the Pre in unlocked or sim free form, due to its exclusivity to O2.
  19. #19  
    No surprises there then.
    From those mythical lands beyond the great USA...

    It is a convergence device not mankind's disc/filmography.
  20. TrevMoore's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    That's the same way I feel. I have T-Mobile and Edge is fast enough for my mobile phone. I can use GPS and TeleNav and the Edge data connection updates maps fine. I can use Orb and connect to my home computer and watch TV off my computers TV card. If I need anything faster I use my home computer and my cable connection.
    Exactly. The only issue right now is what is going to be available for import or release soonest: HTC HD2, Palm Pre GSM, or Nokia n900..

    I would really love a palm pre, but I feel like I have been waiting for an eternity
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