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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by rc46 View Post
    Let me try to explain it to you.

    WebOS is built on a Linux kernel and needs to run in a Linux memory partition in order to work properly. In order to install music and such using a PC with USB you need a FAT32 partition. Palm wanted to keep the media partition (FAT32) as large as possible and in hindsight ended up making the Linux partition too small.

    Trust me if Palm made the Linux partition 2 GB and only left 5GB for media there would have been complaining. Any way they slice it there will be those that will complain.

    Some of the apps could possible run in the FAT32 Partition but those requiring Linux services and such can not. So therefore the only proper solution will be to make the Linux partition larger and the media partition smaller. This would be an easy task if one did not mind have a full erase install of a new version of WebOS. Doing it without wiping is very difficult and might even be impossible.

    As others have said, palm is working on this and will have a solution in short order. You have 2 possible courses of action. One is to be patient and wait for a fix and the other is to whine and moan like a 3rd grade school girl. Your choice.
    very good explanation, either people complain about room for apps, or room for photos, (eventual) videos, music, etc.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmieGeddes View Post
    great.
  3. #43  
    I was told by Palm that they were only allowing 256MB of app space that would be backed up on their servers...256MB x the thousands of users is a lot of space...but a poor excuse for the limit. I would rather be given the option as to which apps i would like to backup and the rest i don't care about.

    On a related note: Since i have been getting the limit, i have installed about 10 more apps via Preware.
  4. #44  
    8 gigs is just not enough.this phone is going to brick itself!
  5. #45  
    Nice post, Palm are idiots for not updating the App memory during 1.2.1. They know they have an app memory limit, yet what are they doing, giving us more apps so we can get the annoying message. Fail palm, FAIL! Fix it, and fix it in the next update!
  6. #46  
    Man, some of you guys are so harsh. You've probably never tried to make a complicated system. I agree that the memory limit is aggravating. There should be a way to use the whole memory. And it seems that there probably is a way, perhaps multiple ways. Probably Palm should have never had such a limit in the first place. I understand there is also some other odd limit that no one really understands that doesn't have to do with how much space is available on the /var partition. Palm should fix this, and we should apply some pressure, and I'm sure they will. I'm all for going public--in fact I asked Dieter a long time ago to write an article on this, and they haven't, probably because they don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth.

    But every mistake Palm makes does not make them "stupid" or "idiots." I mean, seriously, have you never made a mistake? They happen. Really smart people make mistakes, but they also learn from them. Every product has them. We have the luxury of not having to live with them since Palm can update us. But I think we should look at the totality of what Palm has accomplished and evaluate them on that rather than myopically looking at one mistake and declaring sub-par intelligence.
    Palm III-->Handspring Visor-->Sony Clie PEG-NR70-->no PDA -->Palm Treo 755p-->Palm Pre-->HP Veer
  7. #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    What do you need all those apps for? The App Catalog already has more apps than your Pre can handle.
    Only because Palm won't fix the app limit. I like to load a lot of apps on my phone. My Palm Pre doesn't even have Documents to Go yet and it is already hitting an app limit. Should I delete Classic in order to install Docs to Go when it comes out? Should I delete My Tether? Should I delete Accuweather? Should I delete Fandango? Should I delete Twee? And why should I delete anything at all? Preware can work around the app limit and it's a third party app catalog. The official App Catalog should be able to do the same.

    Doesn't Palm want me to support their new platform by buying lots of software from the App Catalog? Well, I'm not going to do that if I have to delete an app every time I want to buy a new one. I'm not interested in spending a lot of money on a crippled platform.

    I hope the original poster's reading of his or her conversation with the Palm rep is wrong because it would kill a lot of my enthusiasm for the Pre.
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by chienandalusia View Post
    no kiddin, this is a terrible annoyance. they dont limit the app to a tiny folder/partition of the built-in storage on Android/Apple devices do they? ive got way less than 40s and im already hittin limit
    My T-Mobile G1 is limited to about 70MB of app storage space. As a result, it would slow to a crawl when I added a lot of apps. With their most recent update, Google finally appears to have fixed this bug after almost a year. During that year, I moved on to my Palm Pre. While I still own my G1 and use it on occasion, you can bet that I don't buy paid apps from the Android Marketplace -- I simply don't use my G1 enough to justify the expense. If Palm doesn't fix this bug, I can totally see myself jumping to another platform....Maybe even back to Android.
  9. #49  
    The people at Palm are definitely not idiots. They are not dumb people.

    But they have known about this for a while and have gone through updates without resolving this while resolving a ton of other issues...

    App store is still in beta so they could be doing this on purpose for whatever reason they feel to keep the phone stable.

    But as more time goes... I wonder if their not running into a road block with memory or multitasking or something that is a main part of WebOS design that they are having a problem resolving.

    Just have to wait and see.

    Quote Originally Posted by LupeValenz View Post
    Nice post, Palm are idiots for not updating the App memory during 1.2.1. They know they have an app memory limit, yet what are they doing, giving us more apps so we can get the annoying message. Fail palm, FAIL! Fix it, and fix it in the next update!
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    Man, some of you guys are so harsh. You've probably never tried to make a complicated system.
    Palm is competing with apple, google, microsoft, RIM and Nokia.

    if it can't handle the heat, then it should get out of the kitchen. Excuses, no matter how reasonable they might be, means little in reality. Its a brutal market, with every competitor laughing at 50 app limits, palm better be careful.

    and palm calls these upon themselves. They can only blame themselves for the pure stupidity.

    These being said, there is always 48 hr window to straight things out. I will wait and see what palm going to do by week ends.
  11. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by clevin View Post
    These being said, there is always 48 hr window to straight things out. I will wait and see what palm going to do by week ends.
    Your going to be very disappointed.
    Pilot 1000 -> Pilot 5000 ->Palm Pilot Professional -> HP 620LX -> TRG Pro -> Palm V -> Palm Vx -> Palm M505 -> Palm i705 -> Palm Tungsten|T -> Samsung i500 -> Treo 600->Treo 650 -> Treo 600-> Treo 700p ->Centro ->Treo 800w + Redfly C8n -> Palm Pre -> HP Touchpad
    R.I.P Palm 1996-2011
  12. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by clevin View Post
    i can think of no reason why webOS couldn't use FAT 32 disks. Its supported by any Linux distroes.
    Well, one major reason: FAT32 doesn't support any modern file permissions. FAT32 also has pretty weak error detection, and no fragmentation prevention. FAT32 is DIRT old, but was required to maintain comparability across operating systems (primarily Windows). FAT32 is also very hard to resize without destroying the data.

    iPhone and iPod Touch get around this by not offering USB Mass Storage. Everything has to be accessed by an external application (iTunes).

    This sucks, it does. But there is no simple fix. We're literally asking for a car (yes, a car analogy) that can seat three passengers OR use that space for to carry 100 gallons of gasoline. If you add tanks to the cars, less people can sit in it, even if the tanks are empty.
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain_ReCall
    I'm an Embedded Software Engineer. My idea of a Good User Interface is printf().
  13. St0rmD's Avatar
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    #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by michaelrj View Post
    Oh you must work for them Huh
    No, support doesn't know what development is doing. This is true in all companies.
    "Anyone who quotes me in their signature is an *****." -- StormD
  14. tarhead's Avatar
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    #55  
    i don't have much use for the free applications - movies, weather, news, food? really folks, i have a pre - i can find that without needing an application to assist me (isn't that what the cloud thing is all about?). there are a few applications that take specific advantage of the pre's capablities, so i think i have two applications in my phone that i would not like to uninstall.

    which doesn't mean that everyone with no music and photos should not have access to their memory space. i came off of a 755 with a card - when i saw the 8gig words in the specs, it didn't say i could not use the space for whatever i desired.

    i simply don't desire most of the applications - they are toys (to me).

    that being said.

    at some point the heavies are going to come out. the software packages that require serious elbow room to operate - what then?

    if i paid for every one of the applications that i added to my phone, what happens when i am required to dump one paid application to add some other paid application? in my 755 i could just swap cards...

    with the pre, the money is thrown away.

    i am NOT interested in homebrew. not now. not ever. i run a stock phone.

    and to the best of my knowledge there is no place within my stock phone that will tell me what my "mystery" user application memory usage is. if there is one, please let me know. until then - deciding to purchase an application from anywhere is a gamble.

    and paying to load anything right now, is a serious mistake for anybody that isn't getting allowance from their parents. your future paid software might have to be sacrificed in order to push in something else you may have to pay for.

    it should not be called a purchase fee.

    until palm can show me how much space i have (so i can make an informed decision before touching the go button), or allow me to use the space i have available for music and photos for whatever i wish - it should be a rental fee.
    Last edited by tarhead; 10/05/2009 at 10:28 PM. Reason: i'm old and cranky
  15. #56  
    I think they would have been okay axes the FAT32 support. Technically, they could have given us space with appropriate permissions and drivers for whichever filesystem they're using and we could still, kind-of, use it as a mass-storage device.

    Even better, maybe have like a 1-2MB FAT32 partition that includes all of the necessary drivers for the rest of the filesystem?

    Hacky but they could have simply axed the whole removable drive thing but I have a feeling they're working on software that just isn't done yet that can do all of the syncing we'll need.
  16. dwhall's Avatar
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    #57  
    Oh noes!!! I can't put 20 gallons of gas into my 18 gallon tank... What am I to do :|
  17.    #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by dwhall View Post
    Oh noes!!! I can't put 20 gallons of gas into my 18 gallon tank... What am I to do :|
    No it is I can't put 20 gallons of gas into my 800 gallon phone
  18. reminiz's Avatar
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    #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain_ReCall View Post
    Well, one major reason: FAT32 doesn't support any modern file permissions. FAT32 also has pretty weak error detection, and no fragmentation prevention. FAT32 is DIRT old, but was required to maintain comparability across operating systems (primarily Windows). FAT32 is also very hard to resize without destroying the data.

    iPhone and iPod Touch get around this by not offering USB Mass Storage. Everything has to be accessed by an external application (iTunes).

    This sucks, it does. But there is no simple fix. We're literally asking for a car (yes, a car analogy) that can seat three passengers OR use that space for to carry 100 gallons of gasoline. If you add tanks to the cars, less people can sit in it, even if the tanks are empty.
    Why can't Palm just code something like Preware?
  19. #60  
    On my Ipod Touch, I only used about a gig for apps and the rest for music and movies. My guess is that they didn't anticipate the level of participation in the Homebrew community.

    That being said, it is not an excuse to maintain the status quo. Making the partition larger is what is needed.

    Still love the Pre.
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