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  1. #141  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    (psssst - it was his example)...
    This was your example:

    Were a judge to ask me such a thing, I'd have it with one click. Agenda (it's on my quickstart bar).
    To which I responded. Guy is trying to use a core function of the phone in a serious situation and you blame him for Palm's sorry excuse of a Calendar. Do you honestly think this sort of performance sits well with users under such circumstances, in corporate meetings, courts, doctor's office, even just between friends?

    Maybe Palm ought to ship WebOSQuickInstall, Preware, Agenda and QuickEvent on a special Business Productivity bundle CD.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  2. #142  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    ...
    To which I responded. Guy is trying to use a core function of the phone in a serious situation and you blame him for Palm's sorry excuse of a Calendar. Do you honestly think this sort of performance sits well with users under such circumstances, in corporate meetings, courts, doctor's office, even just between friends?

    Maybe Palm ought to ship WebOSQuickInstall, Preware, Agenda and QuickEvent on a special Business Productivity bundle CD.
    Again, it was his example, not mine. You jumped in with a lot of "what if's" that he never mentioned.

    Maybe Palm "out to" do as you said, it would certainly make my life easier; however, I haven't seen Microsoft ship a package that suits me either. I simply add the pieces I want.

    Truth be told, you or I neither one "know" if Palm failed in this instance or not, since there were very few details. I know for certain that I've seen instances on here where folks have talked about how "cumbersome" the device is, when the truth is they were just using it wrong. One prime example was a guy talking about dialing a contact. Something to the effect of "Press the button to turn it on, unlock the screen saver, open the launcher, find the Contact App, browse browse browse for the user" to which someone else responded "Or, you could have slid open the keyboard, and typed the person's name, and clicked on the phone number".

    All assumptions aside, this much I do know. If a device (whether it be a computer or a phone) didn't meet my needs, I would find one that did. If there were none available that met my needs better, I'd look at ways to improve the one I have.

    You, on the other hand, seem to find more solace in venthing hyperbole on a forum.

    Guess we're just different that way...

    In the example I gave above, which user was wrong? I guess neither. Both were describing how to use the same device to achieve the same result.

    However, I know whose advice I'd be following out of those two...

    BTW, I've never had a major problem using the Pre in a corproate environment, in a Dr's office, or with friends. I understand you do. Guess we're just different that way too.
  3. #143  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Again, it was his example, not mine. You jumped in with a lot of "what if's" that he never mentioned.
    You replied with an example of how you would have done it, which is to avoid using the Calendar in the first place. I replied to that. Clear?

    Maybe Palm "out to" do as you said, it would certainly make my life easier; however, I haven't seen Microsoft ship a package that suits me either. I simply add the pieces I want.
    I did not say "out to", I said "ought". Why are you mangling my words?

    Anyway, that comment was said in irony. Lets review Palm's advertising of the Pre as a business tool:

    Palm ® webOS ™ Phones for Business : Palm USA

    Business without boundaries.

    Palm® webOS™ phone let you tackle your entire workday like never before. Keep multiple applications open and move back and forth between business and life.1 View your work and personal calendars layered together or separately.
    Your notion about WebOSQuickInstall, Preware, Agenda and QuickEvent (and select patches I'm sure) being just another tool for those who need a reliable calendar is laughable. The reasons for all this homebrew toolchain is precisely because the Calendar APIs are not public for 3rd parties to implement an alternative. Palm is not shipping an OS and saying if you don't like the Calendar, look for 3rd party solutions. Palm does not endorse alternatives, they don't support them whatsoever. Homebrew and patches, however you like them, are not a feature of the phone.

    That said, lets entertain that notion for a bit, that somehow the poor guy in court was at fault for not enabling Dev Mode, and using WebOSQuickInstall to get Preware on his device and then install Agenda and QuickEvent. Lets say you were justified in mocking him for trying to use Palm's Calendar. The judge is asking for dates, will Agenda be sufficient? What if the dates, as is likely, are scattered throughout the year? What if on discussing availability, he will have to find and reschedule an existing event, would he then need to launch also the Calendar and now juggle 3 apps? What if his Pre is about to throw "too many cards"? Would he then need to quit all of those apps and launch them again, while the judge and all the attorneys are waiting on him?

    Agenda and QuickEvent are cool little apps that are appropriate when you are scheduling stuff at your leisure, nothing critical. As such they don't address the Calendar's shortcomings. Nor should it be expected of people who buy this phone, very likely out of expectation of a business device, to learn about WOQI, Preware, WebOSDoctor et al, however nifty all this stuff is.

    Isn't this supposed to be an easy, intuitive device that helps the user instead of demanding expertise and time consuming tinkering?

    All assumptions aside, this much I do know. If a device (whether it be a computer or a phone) didn't meet my needs, I would find one that did. If there were none available that met my needs better, I'd look at ways to improve the one I have.
    This thread is asking Palm to fix the Calendar. No one here asked what other device they should use. And really, what do you think is better, that people switch to other devices or that Palm fix the Calendar? Do you think it's unreasonable to ask them to?

    BTW, I've never had a major problem using the Pre in a corproate environment, in a Dr's office, or with friends. I understand you do. Guess we're just different that way too.
    We've already talked about this. You avoid using the Calendar on the Pre, be it by using your desktop Outlook or Agenda and QuickEvent. These are not sufficient for searching and working with dates beyond the next few weeks, hence your usage is too basic to tout as an example. This thread is about the Calendar, which we have agreed is too cumbersome to use. So, do you have anything to say about the actual topic of the thread?
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  4. mullern's Avatar
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    #144  
    This discussions exactly pick up what I was afraid of. Do this and that and tweak and homebrew until you come close to what the basic functionality should be. This is what I call a "toy environment".

    Please dont' take me wrong: I am a Palm user from it's very first day, ending up with a Treo650, eagerly waiting for the Pre, immediately buying one when it was available in Europe.

    What I am asking for is nothing else than what all Palms featured: An option to keep the appointment times when you change time zone. Whether this is supplied by Palm itself or any third party application, I don't care. I need the functionality, otherwise the Pre is not useable for me as a frequent traveller between time zones. And I am probably not the only one depending on this.

    And the whole discussion about ".... use another one if it does not fit your requirements....". Yes, no problem for me, but probably a serious problem for Palm. Palm was known to serve the business world, that's what their success was built on. I was expecting Palm to deliver a device taiored to the business world with the cleverness and ease-of-use today is standard. The Pre is a very good start, but it needs improvement and further development.

    Maybe my assumptions were wrong. My fault then, and maybe the decisive argument for thousands of Palm users to buy or not to buy a Pre or follow-on.
  5. #145  
    I too am a loyal Palm user for years, but this is calendar is beyond a joke. And although I am optimistically (or naively) hopeful that Palm will address the calendar, if Palm does not, that is what what will ultimately drive me away from the Pre.

    I am (at moment) sitting in my office for an appointment which was cancelled and deleted weeks ago, which my Pre restored on its own - I guess because the ability to permanently cancel one from a series of recurring appointments is significantly less important to Rubenstein etal than trying to one-up Apple.

    Yes, I am bitter and frustrated at the moment, it's a holiday weekend and I would have preferred not to be here with an open hour in between appts. If I had realized the hour was open, I could have offered it to another client, or tried to move my last client into this earlier spot, but Pre dutifully sent its idea of reality back to Google, which then synched to my Outlook and voila, here I am.

    The old days of Palm are G-O-N-E. And I think that reality is that loyal Palm users are assumed by current management and the target market is the (very unrealistic) iphone user. After all, the original Palm crowd is long gone from this corporate entity and the current folks are all former Apple, obviously with a tremendous chip on their shoulder.

    I don't want to tweak, homebrew, root, develop mode or do anything special to get a working calendar. I guess I have to give Palm until I can upgrade without a penalty at Sprint - June 6 (?) - to fix this, or I will switch to an android phone.

    It is really sad that technology of 2006 (my Treo 680) had more calendar functionality.
  6. #146  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    You replied with an example of how you would have done it, which is to avoid using the Calendar in the first place. I replied to that. Clear?
    Ahhh, so my example that might work in his example is not acceptable. Yeah, that's clear...

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    I did not say "out to", I said "ought". Why are you mangling my words?
    Chill, it was a typo.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Your notion about WebOSQuickInstall, Preware, Agenda and QuickEvent (and select patches I'm sure) being just another tool for those who need a reliable calendar is laughable. The reasons for all this homebrew toolchain is precisely because the Calendar APIs are not public for 3rd parties to implement an alternative. Palm is not shipping an OS and saying if you don't like the Calendar, look for 3rd party solutions. Palm does not endorse alternatives, they don't support them whatsoever. Homebrew and patches, however you like them, are not a feature of the phone.
    Sorry, but your notion that "they don't support them whatsoever" is simply wrong. I don't know if it's you displaying your ignorance on the topic, or you simply wishing to mislead people, but either way, it's wrong. Palm is very supportive of the HomeBrew community.

    But I wonder, since they're not features, does that mean those that use them must stop? (rhetorical question, no need to answer).

    Ironically, this "non-feature" is what many of the folks on here find so appealing about the Pre. That's the cool thing though, is that many folks can find many different things they like about the device.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    That said, lets entertain that notion for a bit, that somehow the poor guy in court was at fault for not enabling Dev Mode, and using WebOSQuickInstall to get Preware on his device and then install Agenda and QuickEvent. Lets say you were justified in mocking him for trying to use Palm's Calendar.
    Mocking him? How so? You've got a strange spin on things.

    Agenda was one possibility I offered. As I stated in a subsequent post, niether you nor I know the details (because he didn't offer them), so neither of us knows exactly what he did that caused the problem.

    You keep offering all of these silly "what ifs" based on someone else's complaint on which he/she hasn't offered any details. It's almost as if you want to insist that that device will fail no matter how it's used... Hey... maybe that's it!

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Agenda and QuickEvent are cool little apps that are appropriate when you are scheduling stuff at your leisure, nothing critical. As such they don't address the Calendar's shortcomings. Nor should it be expected of people who buy this phone, very likely out of expectation of a business device, to learn about WOQI, Preware, WebOSDoctor et al, however nifty all this stuff is.
    This is another example of your FUD. You're thowing terms out there to make it all sound more confusing than it really is. WebOSDoctor, for instance, has absolutely nothing to do with what we're talking about. More ignorance, or simple misdirection?

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    This thread is asking Palm to fix the Calendar. No one here asked what other device they should use. And really, what do you think is better, that people switch to other devices or that Palm fix the Calendar? Do you think it's unreasonable to ask them to?
    I beg your pardon, but maybe you should go review the original post in this thread. I'll point you to two particular parts:
    Quote Originally Posted by rcyphermd View Post
    My old centro calendar was INSTANT. We need this feature back. I am willing to pay for an app for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by rcyphermd View Post
    You can be sure many of us will be testing the android os to see if it works better. I do not want to switch because there are many things I like about the Pre....but the calendar is exasperating.
    So, in spite of your assertion to the contrary, another device was mentioned in the very first post. Not only that, the individual in question has moved on to another device. I'll touch on this at the end of this post, but first I'll disabuse you of another example of either your lack of comprehension, or deliberate misdirection (I really haven't figured out which is your problem, but either way, it's a bit exasperating).

    To answer your question, you've started with a premise that I don't agree with. I don't think the Calendar is broken, so the question is unanswerable for me. I think the Calendar is very usable for some. For others, this might not be the right device for them. I don't agree that Palm has done something wrong though, because they didn't meet someone's expectations.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    We've already talked about this. You avoid using the Calendar on the Pre, be it by using your desktop Outlook or Agenda and QuickEvent. These are not sufficient for searching and working with dates beyond the next few weeks, hence your usage is too basic to tout as an example. This thread is about the Calendar, which we have agreed is too cumbersome to use. So, do you have anything to say about the actual topic of the thread?
    There you go again, misrepresenting my views (and use). I don't know that I've ever entered a date in a calendar using Outlook, except on those occasions when I've done so by accepting an invitation in an email. If I have, it's been so many years ago that I don't remember it. I have an Exchange system on one of my home servers, and I read email from it in Outlook, but every scheduled event that I've entered into that system has been through my Pre (I never even used the calendar on it before getting my Pre), or from accepting an emailed invitation.
    At work, I use GroupWise. I sync that system up to a Google account for contacts and calendar. Work events are entered in GW not the Pre.

    With the exception of my FT job, and accepted invitations - Every other event that I enter: Church activities, social meetings, professional meetings (outside my FT job), client meetings (for my consulting) is done through my Pre.

    I've never said, nor even agreed, that the "Calendar ... is too cumbersome to use". I find it too cumbersome for me to enter dates, so I've used another app. However, that "cumbersome view" could very well be because of my 10+ years using a different system, and not anything to do with the device. Others have stated that they have no problem with it (they're likely not coming from a long history of using one system, not many systems had that staying power). However, I use the built in Calendar app, frequently to see events that are coming up, to edit those events (as I see necessary), and to move them from calendar to calendar. It's a very useful app for me, and for you to state that my opinion is any different is a misstatement.

    I'll end this by saying this:

    If my job depended on me having a 100% reliable PDA/Smartphone type device for appointments, it would not be a Palm Pre. For that matter, it wouldn't be an Android. It would not be any "cutting edge" technology, and most certainly not one that has been out for less than 6 months. It would be a tried and true device that I knew would work before I walked into an environment that demanded reliability. For me, it would likely be a BlackBerry.

    However, if I made the decision for the Pre, I certainly wouldn't be on a forum demanding that the company "fix" the device (that's really not broken - "not meeting my needs" does not equal "broken"). I'd be looking at ways to make my device work for me, or I'd move on to one that did.

    Fortunately for me, my job is not 100% dependent on my having my schedule in my pocket at all times. It's a convenience (one that works very well for me). Because it's a convenience, I can have a device that does what I need in a Calendar, and gives me all of the other things I like on the Pre. Instead of limiting myself to a device that does one particular thing exceptionally well, I can have a device that does many things very well.
  7. #147  
    Quote Originally Posted by dianagr View Post
    ...
    I am (at moment) sitting in my office for an appointment which was cancelled and deleted weeks ago, which my Pre restored on its own - I guess because the ability to permanently cancel one from a series of recurring appointments is significantly less important to Rubenstein etal than trying to one-up Apple.
    ...
    I'm not sure I follow you. When I delete one of a recurring event on the Pre, I'm prompted as to whether or not I want to delete that event, or the series. It's always worked for me. Maybe there's a bug in it, or maybe you selected something incorrectly, but the nonsense that it's "less important to Rubenstein etal than trying to one-up Apple" is just that, nonsense.
  8. #148  
    EVERY time I delete a single occurrence from a recurring series, the Pre puts it back. I have emailed Palm, searched the fora, even deleted my very complicated calendar and started again. It is simply a glitch....and a very troublesome one.

    While you may feel it "nonsense," a slew of updates to address broken itunes sync yet nothing to allow searching of a calendar or addressing this issue of random appointment re-generation tells me where the Palm priority lies. YMMV and I am a heavy calendar user, but I expected something at least on par with the Treo in terms of PIM, and I am disappointed.

    Other things about the Pre I really like, but when it starts to lose money for me, it ceases to be a business tool and becomes a fancy entertainment device. Not really what I had expected from Palm and not what I need.
  9. #149  
    you should change the title to include give me camcorder
  10. #150  
    Quote Originally Posted by dianagr View Post
    EVERY time I delete a single occurrence from a recurring series, the Pre puts it back. I have emailed Palm, searched the fora, even deleted my very complicated calendar and started again. It is simply a glitch....and a very troublesome one.

    While you may feel it "nonsense," a slew of updates to address broken itunes sync yet nothing to allow searching of a calendar or addressing this issue of random appointment re-generation tells me where the Palm priority lies. YMMV and I am a heavy calendar user, but I expected something at least on par with the Treo in terms of PIM, and I am disappointed.
    I truly do not mean to trivialize your situation, but you've given an indication to my point in your response - "searched the fora" (I'm assuming you meant forum).

    If you've searched the forum, and have been unable to find people with the same issue, then possibly it's a problem unique to your use, not with the software in general. In that case, it would be incorrect to state that the ability to delete one event in a series is "more important" to Palm than "one-upping Apple". It might be correct to state that one user having problems is less important to Palm than iTunes sync (and it'd probably be true), but to dismiss the iTunes issue as "one-upping Apple" is nonsense. There are litereally thousands of users that like the iTunes sync, though I am not one of them.

    I'd be interested in helping you troubleshoot your issue. If you'd like to send me some of the details in a PM, or even start a seperate thread, I suspect we can work through it. I have some suspicions on what I think the problem is, but would need more details.

    However, the notion that having a working solution (in general) is not important to Palm is simply incorrect. They have one. It works for me, and I suspect for most. My suggestion is that you use the forum, and ask for help determining the problem.

    ===

    Found your previously entered thread. I put some troubleshooting suggestions on there.
    Last edited by hparsons; 11/29/2009 at 02:57 PM.
  11. #151  
    Quote Originally Posted by jonathanlc2005 View Post
    you should change the title to include give me camcorder
    You don't have a camcorder on your Pre??
  12. #152  
    I did start a thread about this ages ago...in the synchronization thread, although that one has been dormant for awhile, perhaps I'll cruise over and see if anyone has posted recently.

    I was apparently not the only one with the issue and it happens no matter how many deletions/re-installs of my google calendar I have done (I even did a wipe and reset of the whole phone once - although I won't try that now with current data loss issues). I thought I had it under control as I hand write a sticky note when I have such a cancel and put it in my phone case, but I recently lost the case and had to get a new one, so today's cancel flew under the radar.

    I thank you for your offer of troubleshoot, please suggest something new and I am game to try it! I REALLY want my Pre to work. I am constantly poked fun at by Mr. Gr for buying us Pres, so there is an undeniable intangible benefit to fixing this issue as well.

    And, "fora" is the plural of "forum" -- since it comes from Latin (like data is plural of datum, etc). I was trying to impart that I have been to several different, independent Pre communities looking for a fix -- not just grumbling here, but I was inspired to grumble when I saw a grumble thread on a similar but related issue.
  13. #153  
    Quote Originally Posted by dianagr View Post
    I did start a thread about this ages ago...in the synchronization thread, although that one has been dormant for awhile, perhaps I'll cruise over and see if anyone has posted recently.
    ...
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    ...
    Found your previously entered thread. I put some troubleshooting suggestions on there.
    Interesting on the plural of Forum, I didn't know that, but then Latin and Catholic School was so long ago...
  14. Lee B's Avatar
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    #154  
    Quote Originally Posted by mullern View Post
    What I am asking for is nothing else than what all Palms featured: An option to keep the appointment times when you change time zone. Whether this is supplied by Palm itself or any third party application, I don't care. I need the functionality, otherwise the Pre is not useable for me as a frequent traveller between time zones. And I am probably not the only one depending on this.
    No, you're not. I chime in to agree whenever I find someone who raises this issue. The current functionality is nuts, and I'm surprised it hasn't been fixed already. I figure senior execs at Palm and Sprint must travel a lot with their Pres, and they'd run into the problem every time they hit a new time zone.
  15. equus's Avatar
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    #155  
    Quote Originally Posted by opensecret View Post
    No, you're not. I chime in to agree whenever I find someone who raises this issue. The current functionality is nuts, and I'm surprised it hasn't been fixed already. I figure senior execs at Palm and Sprint must travel a lot with their Pres, and they'd run into the problem every time they hit a new time zone.
    rofl.....they probably use the BB..
  16. #156  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Chill, it was a typo.
    It wasn't a typo. You deliberately misquoted me:

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Maybe Palm ought to ship WebOSQuickInstall, Preware, Agenda and QuickEvent on a special Business Productivity bundle CD.
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Maybe Palm "out to" do as you said, it would certainly make my life easier; however, I haven't seen Microsoft ship a package that suits me either. I simply add the pieces I want.
    What was the purpose of this?

    Sorry, but your notion that "they don't support them whatsoever" is simply wrong. I don't know if it's you displaying your ignorance on the topic, or you simply wishing to mislead people, but either way, it's wrong. Palm is very supportive of the HomeBrew community.

    But I wonder, since they're not features, does that mean those that use them must stop? (rhetorical question, no need to answer).

    Ironically, this "non-feature" is what many of the folks on here find so appealing about the Pre. That's the cool thing though, is that many folks can find many different things they like about the device.
    Supporting means exactly one thing: public API. No public API means -- unsupported. That's why homebrew apps aren't in the catalog.

    It's cool that Palm tolerates homebrew, maybe they're trying to create some open source buzz and draw hackers and be different from Apple. This is not a substitute for core functionality. The idea is absurd. You will not see any serious alternative to the calendar until Palm makes the API public.

    Mocking him? How so? You've got a strange spin on things.
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Maybe what they were seeing was your inability to use your device?
    You are implying that he is incompetent.

    Agenda was one possibility I offered. As I stated in a subsequent post, niether you nor I know the details (because he didn't offer them), so neither of us knows exactly what he did that caused the problem.

    You keep offering all of these silly "what ifs" based on someone else's complaint on which he/she hasn't offered any details. It's almost as if you want to insist that that device will fail no matter how it's used... Hey... maybe that's it!
    We know he was asked to provide dates of availability and was embarassed by the time it took the calendar to respond. Feel free to ask me to explain it again.

    This is another example of your FUD. You're thowing terms out there to make it all sound more confusing than it really is. WebOSDoctor, for instance, has absolutely nothing to do with what we're talking about. More ignorance, or simple misdirection?
    Once you go down the path of WOQI, Preware, homebrew and patches, WebOSDoctor is essential. From your own description of how you prepare yourself for an update:

    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I had major problems with all of the messaging. No messaging clients (the old AIM, now Yahoo and Gmail) would connect except for text messaing. I had installed several tweaks, including the messaging mod; but had uninstalled them all. After talking with JHoff80, I followed his advice, removed my backup, doctored back to 1.2.1, and started all over with no mods. Updated to 1.3.1, then all was well. Applied the other tweaks I wanted, and everything is still working fine.
    This is what you expect from people to become familiar with. This is horrible user experience that no sane company would subject their users to. Only in your twisted IT guy perspective this is normal living with the device.

    So, in spite of your assertion to the contrary, another device was mentioned in the very first post. Not only that, the individual in question has moved on to another device. I'll touch on this at the end of this post, but first I'll disabuse you of another example of either your lack of comprehension, or deliberate misdirection (I really haven't figured out which is your problem, but either way, it's a bit exasperating).

    To answer your question, you've started with a premise that I don't agree with. I don't think the Calendar is broken, so the question is unanswerable for me. I think the Calendar is very usable for some. For others, this might not be the right device for them. I don't agree that Palm has done something wrong though, because they didn't meet someone's expectations.
    With people quitting left and right because of the calendar, which you encourage as a course of action, you still assert that there's nothing broken with it. Amazing.

    If my job depended on me having a 100% reliable PDA/Smartphone type device for appointments, it would not be a Palm Pre. For that matter, it wouldn't be an Android. It would not be any "cutting edge" technology, and most certainly not one that has been out for less than 6 months. It would be a tried and true device that I knew would work before I walked into an environment that demanded reliability. For me, it would likely be a BlackBerry.
    Performance and usability problems are separate from reliability problems. Our latest exchange started by a post describing how painful it is to work with the calendar in response to other people who are asking you for answers on the spot. This wasn't a reliability problem, that kind of problem is described in dianagr's thread, to which you've responded. However, the performance issue is a situation I run into at least once a week, and here's just the last one.

    This was not strictly a business related matter. I was speaking to a person I meet with on a recurring event. They are on vacation next week so we wanted to confirm that the recurring event was cancelled for next week. I pulled out the Pre and launched the calendar...cue awkward silence for 15 seconds. Then it took another 10 seconds if not more just to jump to next week with every view painfully slow to load. What was the problem here? Clearly it's a performance problem, not reliability. And it is a usability problem too, because there is no convenient way to jump to "next Tuesday", necessitating going through multiple views.

    Why did it take so long? I suspect that it had very low memory left to launch apps. I've become acutely aware of this and launching Agenda, QuickEvent and potentially the Calendar is just something I'm apprehensive about due to "too many cards" errors. The worst thing would be having to quit everything and start over. So I take my chances with just a single app, which should let me handle all my scheduling needs.

    So this situation, luckily not in a strictly professional setting, just makes me look bad in front of people who have already got their notebooks, iPhones and BlackBerrys whipped out with all the information in front of them while I'm begging the Pre to respond. Now that person has seen this already, so by now we just both shake our heads and make fun of the situation. But I'm sick and tired of the same problem in the most inopportune moments and having people wait on me because of the Pre.

    However, if I made the decision for the Pre, I certainly wouldn't be on a forum demanding that the company "fix" the device (that's really not broken - "not meeting my needs" does not equal "broken"). I'd be looking at ways to make my device work for me, or I'd move on to one that did.

    Fortunately for me, my job is not 100% dependent on my having my schedule in my pocket at all times. It's a convenience (one that works very well for me). Because it's a convenience, I can have a device that does what I need in a Calendar, and gives me all of the other things I like on the Pre. Instead of limiting myself to a device that does one particular thing exceptionally well, I can have a device that does many things very well.
    Good for you. Just what are you defending exactly? Palm's right to cash in on its business friendly brand name while releasing a half baked consumer product instead? Hell, shouldn't even consumers enjoy decent performance and a simple device that doesn't need dev mode and tweaks?

    So you don't need a good calendar and you are dumbfounded that others do and expect Palm to fix it. You don't have to participate in this thread. Let those who need a calendar take it up with Palm, what's it to you? If you want to argue that Palm instead should fix or do other things, fine. Maybe you should start another thread, I'd be very curious to know what should Palm be working on instead. It's obviously not a gaming device, it's not a business device either, there are no significant apps for it. Synergy-equivalents are already offered by other manufacturers. Multitasking is barely usable due to memory management issues. So, other than a good browser, what's left of the Pre that is signifcant to anyone?
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  17. #157  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    If you've searched the forum, and have been unable to find people with the same issue, then possibly it's a problem unique to your use, not with the software in general. In that case, it would be incorrect to state that the ability to delete one event in a series is "more important" to Palm than "one-upping Apple". It might be correct to state that one user having problems is less important to Palm than iTunes sync (and it'd probably be true), but to dismiss the iTunes issue as "one-upping Apple" is nonsense.
    Nonsense? The same thing's happening to me and it doesn't take much of a search to find it is NOT uncommon to have deleted events keep showing up. It was happening to me so much that I've been forced to stop using the worthless google/pre calendar and use solely the classic with datebk6 so that I stop having false appointments in my calendar.

    Dude, a quick search of your posts looks an awful lot like you're a paid palm plant or something. What's with your bizarre defensiveness in the face of legit complaints?
  18. #158  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Maybe what they were seeing was your inability to use your device?
    Were a judge to ask me such a thing, I'd have it with one click. Agenda (it's on my quickstart bar).

    1.The issue for me that day was the scheduling of a jury trial with multiple dates and alternatives settings over a period of 6-10 mos out.

    2.I've used Agenda since it came out. It helps for sure, but for you to say you'd "have it with one click" and imply that I must lack ability to use my device is absurd.

    3.The calendar is slow, if you don't agree that's cool. But your response is to insult?

    "In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2]"
    Internet forum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    PalmOS Treos: 90/300/600/650/700/755/launch day Pre minus/ Evo/Epic
  19. #159  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    It wasn't a typo. You deliberately misquoted me:

    What was the purpose of this?
    Since you apparently know more about what my actions than I, I'll leave it up to you. I doubt you can find anything sinister in it, but you'll likely choose to ignore my information that it was a typo since you "know" so much more about me than I do.


    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Supporting means exactly one thing: public API. No public API means -- unsupported. That's why homebrew apps aren't in the catalog.
    Why is that the only way to "support"? Because you say so? Is giving information support? Is helping the homebrew community support? Is making dev mode easier support? Ironically, the folks at WebOS Internals say that Palm is supporting them, but then, you probably know more about it than they...

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    This is not a substitute for core functionality. The idea is absurd. You will not see any serious alternative to the calendar until Palm makes the API public.
    I never said it was "a substitute". You said Palm is not supporting them "whatsoever". You're wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    You are implying that he is incompetent.
    Nope, you chose to read it that way. I said that maybe it was in the way he was using the device. That's a long ways from "incompetence". But then, you know better what I meant than he.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    We know he was asked to provide dates of availability and was embarassed by the time it took the calendar to respond. Feel free to ask me to explain it again
    .
    So? That's not enough to tell us what may or may have gone wrong. As a matter of fact, you found the need to pump it up with nonsense about too many cards. Face it, you want it to be bad, so you make it to be bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Once you go down the path of WOQI, Preware, homebrew and patches, WebOSDoctor is essential. From your own description of how you prepare yourself for an update:
    Again, you misrepresent what I've said. I've never used WebOS Doctor to "prepare for an update". Do you make this stuff up, or are you just incapable of understanding. I did say I'm considering doing that in the future, maybe you don't understand the difference. I'll 'splain for you:
    "How you prepare for an update" implies that's how I do it already.
    "Considering it" implies I'm not yet, but may in the future.

    I've Doctored my phone only twice. Once, I thought there was a problem with the phone. There wasn't, it was how I was using it (I'm probably implying I was incompetent there - I don't think so, but I'm sure you know better). The second time was after the 1.3.1 update, so it could hardly have been part of my "preparation".

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    This is what you expect from people to become familiar with. This is horrible user experience that no sane company would subject their users to. Only in your twisted IT guy perspective this is normal living with the device.
    Where did I ever say "this is what I expect". I think you're a bit off with your nonsense about "twisted IT guy perspective". I challenge you to find anything where I said that this is something I expect people to become familiar with.

    Again, you make this stuff up as you go, right? And then your undies in a wad at a typo from me... Are you for real?

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    With people quitting left and right because of the calendar, which you encourage as a course of action, you still assert that there's nothing broken with it. Amazing.
    I'd also suggest that people that bought one hoping it would be yellow instead of black, and feel that's essential, should change. It has nothing to do with a system being broken; it has to do with people buying what works for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    This was not strictly a business related matter. I was speaking to a person I meet with on a recurring event. They are on vacation next week so we wanted to confirm that the recurring event was cancelled for next week. I pulled out the Pre and launched the calendar...cue awkward silence for 15 seconds.
    You should take it back. I've never had my Pre take 15 seconds to load anything. Maybe it just doesn't like you (understandable). Maybe you're exaggerating here like you do about me. Either way, you have the wrong device.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    So this situation, luckily not in a strictly professional setting, just makes me look bad in front of people who have already got their notebooks, iPhones and BlackBerrys whipped out with all the information in front of them while I'm begging the Pre to respond.
    Trust me, from my experience with you on here, the Pre "making you look bad" is the least of your worries.


    Good for you. Just what are you defending exactly? Palm's right to cash in on its business friendly brand name while releasing a half baked consumer product instead? Hell, shouldn't even consumers enjoy decent performance and a simple device that doesn't need dev mode and tweaks?[/QUOTE]
    Apparently, most do. You're assertion that they've released a "half backed consumer product" is idiotic. It's your opinion, but it's still idiotic. That's what I'm "defending" against.

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    So you don't need a good calendar and you are dumbfounded that others do and expect Palm to fix it.
    Nope, not at all. I have a good calendar. I'm dumbfounded that those that bought something that wasn't want they needed are insisting someone "fix" it for them when it isn't broke.
  20. #160  
    Quote Originally Posted by PREmeditated View Post
    Nonsense? The same thing's happening to me and it doesn't take much of a search to find it is NOT uncommon to have deleted events keep showing up. It was happening to me so much that I've been forced to stop using the worthless google/pre calendar and use solely the classic with datebk6 so that I stop having false appointments in my calendar.

    Dude, a quick search of your posts looks an awful lot like you're a paid palm plant or something. What's with your bizarre defensiveness in the face of legit complaints?
    I'm sorry my post wasn't clear enough for you. I thought this made it plain what was "nonsense":
    but to dismiss the iTunes issue as "one-upping Apple" is nonsense.
    That wasn't a "legit complaint", it was nonsense. I haven't seen the problem your describing, but did go back and offer to help the person posting it troubleshoot. I don't know if it's a genuine issue or not, as I've never seen it happen to me.

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