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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by rcyphermd View Post
    There are some of us that LOVED palm and are SO disappointed in the Pre. We are legacy users and truly feel abandoned. It was VERY hard to leave Palm after using their products for over a decade. So that is why we "hang around".....we are hoping Palm will get its act together!
    I think this quote sums up nicely why you will probably never really like the Pre. Palm isn't the same company anymore. They didn't accidentally abandon you. They left you on purpose because there weren't enough of you to keep them in business. They're not trying to do the same things that they did. Some of the things people complain about will be fixed. Others, Palm simply doesn't care about. Only they know what falls in which category.

    They've moved on. They're trying to shift the way we use our devices. They're also looking at the fat middle, rather than the outliers that were their most recent customers. I don't like Itunes, but I understand why they keep fixing the sync to it. A lot of people like Itunes and use it for their media. You don't. I don't. But a lot of people do- and it doesn't take Palm very long to fix what Apple breaks.

    I'm ok with the calendar. I have my work calendar on an Exchange account and my personal calendars with Google. It's not super fast, but it gets the job done. I like that I can integrate all of my calendar's easily. Would I like it to be faster? Certainly, but it works for me. If it didn't, I'd switch to something else.

    The Pre is a great tool if you're ok with doing things differently. It takes some getting used to, of course, because it's different and new. Some things could be better, some things could be updated or added, but overall, I enjoy using it. If things don't improve enough for me to remain happy with it, I'll happily switch to something else. I love the Pre, but I'm not married to it. I'll definitely abandon it before I feel like Palm abandoned me.
    Last edited by oddlou; 10/28/2009 at 12:30 PM.
  2. #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I guess the one difference is that most of us aren't hanging around the Droid forums talking about how much better we like our Pres...
    LMAO! So true! I'm glad you made a decision that helps you. Why are you still living in the past? Leave the Pre and Pre forums behind.

    "Move along...We're not the Droids you're looking for!"
  3. Kedar's Avatar
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    #83  
    I think these forums would easily scare away any future Pre buyer.
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by rcyphermd View Post
    There are some of us that LOVED palm and are SO disappointed in the Pre. We are legacy users and truly feel abandoned. It was VERY hard to leave Palm after using their products for over a decade. So that is why we "hang around".....we are hoping Palm will get its act together!
    I understand that (or at least part of that, not the why you hang around part). I've been using Palm devices (though some of it was Sony and Handera for a while) for about 12 years. Trust me, there are legacy users that LOVE Palm, and are NOT disappointed in the Pre. My first Palm device was a Palm III, and the Pre is far and away a better device, including the PIM, out of the box than the Palm III was. I spent many years, trying and installing many add-on apps (and abandoning many as well), before I finally got a device that suited my needs. By that time, the OS had been added to, munged, rewritten, salvaged, etc so much that I could not keep my Treo up and running without a reboot at least once every couple of days.

    These constant post about how Palm has "abandoned" its fantastic PIM are all through rose-colored glasses. The Palm PIM was barely functional until Datebk made it better, and it was a seperate device from corporate (or even advanced personal) email/address books/calendars until PocketMirror and Intellisync came out. I never used Agendus, but many swore by it as well.

    Some may think the Pilot was perfect out of the box, but someone decided that it needed a phone. That led to the Handspring, which led to the Treo. It was not a Palm invention.

    Some may think that the Pilot was perfect as a PIM, but there were those that needed it to sync with Outlook. That lead to PocketMirror, which eventually licensed part of it to Palm. But it was not a Palm invention.

    Others needed it to sync to GroupWise, or Lotus Notes. Intellisync released a product to take care of that. Again, not a Palm release.

    Some, no many needed additional functionality to the basic calendar. That led to Datebk (which Palm eventually partially licensed) and Agendus. These were not Palm inventions.


    The device, out of the box, cannot be the end-all be-all to everyone, so Palm had to create a device that enough basics to interest users, with a solid enough foundation that others can expend on for the specific needs of uses. In spite of how much diehard PalmOS users wanted something similar to what they had, the sad truth is that if that's where market success lived, Palm would not have been almost out of business.

    They had to make a change. They did. I understand those that don't think it was a good change. Fortunately, there are other choices. However, it foolish for those disappointed folks to come on to a Pre forum, and insinuate that somehow, those of us that do like the device are wrong, blind, fanfolk, or whatever. We like our device. When you come on here, even if it's for "old times" sake or to bask in a little hopeful nostalgia, you are making a mistake when you disparage those of us that happen to enjoy what we purchased.
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by oddlou View Post
    I think this quote sums up nicely why you will probably never really like the Pre. Palm isn't the same company anymore. They didn't accidentally abandon you. They left you on purpose because there weren't enough of you to keep them in business.
    ...
    'Zactly!!!!
  6. #86  
    hparsons, it's you who's disparaging other members. The person you replied to talked about Palm, he said nothing about you and others who might be happy with it.
  7. #87  
    I am a longtime PalmOS user who is heavily using the Pre for business and it is doing great. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I never really used my Palm phones as my primary device, leaving my desktop computers to handle meeting invites, mailbox cleanup, etc..

    I believe the Pre and webOS are better than the iPhone in a business environment, but not quite up to oar with RIM. Palm for sure has RIM in their crosshairs rather than the iPhone. They want the business market with a splash of personal use and life organization.

    They have a bit to go but they are on the right track. I guess some people can't see this.
    Palm Vx -> Treo 600 -> Treo 700p -> Centro -> Pre (Launch Phone 06/06/09) -> AT&T Pre Plus with Sprint EVDO swap -> Samsung Epic 4G w/ Froyo
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Keep bringing the issue up and don't mind the *******.
    Wasted reply....a rehash!!!....Just like this one!!
    GIVE DEBBIE THE CHIMP.....GIVE DEBBIE THE CHIMP!!!
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by IGoDwnTwn34 View Post
    Wasted reply....a rehash!!!....Just like this one!!
    Which was a response to being shouted down by the aforementioned *******.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    hparsons, it's you who's disparaging other members. The person you replied to talked about Palm, he said nothing about you and others who might be happy with it.
    I don't think I actually said anything disparaging about that particular user, my comments were directed at those that do come on here and either directly insult, or insult through implications, those of us that happen to like our devices. Here are a few examples of what I'm talking about. I'm sure you'll recognize at least one of the names (all added emphasis is mine):

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Keep bringing the issue up and don't mind the *******.
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan;1893043[B
    ]Anyone who thinks the calendar is fine doesn't use it in a business environment. [/B]
    You can't take your sweet time entering events when someone is talking to you, especially scheduling or modifying a series of events rapidly. It just doesn't cut it.

    Not to mention the idiotic 'physics' enabled scroll wheel to select the time which is just asking for errors. You just can't fumble around and make mistakes when others are addressing you on the spot.
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    ...
    Maybe if Palm wasn't pouring all its resources into the stupid app store and SDK someone could've taken the time to attend to the issues. What worries me is the possibility that someone at Palm decided it's good enough.
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Which was a response to being shouted down by the aforementioned *******.
    Quote Originally Posted by crogs571 View Post
    ...
    I got poo pooed along with a few others when we brought up PIM issues and all the old and tired excuses of "give it time", "early adopters" and "it's a brand new OS" were thrown about. I don't care what's flashy, what sells (and the one guy is wrong saying a good PIM doesn't sell), and all the stupid bells and whistles that give webOS it's Bling. Having all the new extra functionality in these phones at the expense of core functionality people have been used to for that past so many years is not a good thing.
    ...
    Some of these are direct insults (seems anyone that seems to disagree with the AniPres instantly becomes a "******"), others are insulting by implication. You may think the App Catalog (seriously, the app store is for iPhone users, we have the App Catalog) is "stupid", but that doesn't make it so. And it certainly doesn't mean those of us that not only like it, but look forward to it fleshing out even more, are by association stupid...
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by NickDG View Post
    I am a longtime PalmOS user who is heavily using the Pre for business and it is doing great. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I never really used my Palm phones as my primary device, leaving my desktop computers to handle meeting invites, mailbox cleanup, etc..

    I believe the Pre and webOS are better than the iPhone in a business environment, but not quite up to oar with RIM. Palm for sure has RIM in their crosshairs rather than the iPhone. They want the business market with a splash of personal use and life organization.

    They have a bit to go but they are on the right track. I guess some people can't see this.
    You may have something about the reason some of us longtime Palm users are happy with the Pre. My various Palm devices were always extensions of my system, not even really my desktop, but my corporate system. From day one, I was looking for a way to successfully integrate it.

    I was seriously just ready to make the jump to a BB. I wasn't looking forward to having to deal with BES again (I would have been the support person at my company at the time), when I heard about the Pre. I'm glad I did. I now have to carry both, and have no doubt that the Pre will be my favored device.

    However, it's not the center of what I do. It does bring it all together, but if I want to do some serious music listening, it's not on my phone. If I want to do some serious web surfing, it's not on my phone. If I want to do serious email, serious scheduling, etc etc (even serious game playing, though I don't do much), then I don't do it on my phone.

    The Pre, for me, is a bridge to all of those things. I can do a LOT of any of those on my phone. It works very well for me for that. I suspect it does the same for a lot of folks.
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I don't think I actually said anything disparaging about that particular user, my comments were directed at those that do come on here and either directly insult, or insult through implications, those of us that happen to like our devices. Here are a few examples of what I'm talking about. I'm sure you'll recognize at least one of the names (all added emphasis is mine):









    Some of these are direct insults (seems anyone that seems to disagree with the AniPres instantly becomes a "******"), others are insulting by implication. You may think the App Catalog (seriously, the app store is for iPhone users, we have the App Catalog) is "stupid", but that doesn't make it so. And it certainly doesn't mean those of us that not only like it, but look forward to it fleshing out even more, are by association stupid...
    Ah, but it's you who is making the association. Why are you confusing criticism of Palm with an attack on you?
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  13.    #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    hparsons, it's you who's disparaging other members. The person you replied to talked about Palm, he said nothing about you and others who might be happy with it.

    I agree. I respect those on this forum VERY much. It is Palm that I am so disappointed in.
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Ah, but it's you who is making the association. Why are you confusing criticism of Palm with an attack on you?
    Sivan, go back and reread your own posts. When someone is called a "******" because he/she happens to enjoy the device, that's a personal attack. When someone says that anyone that thinks the calendar application is fine doesn't use it an a corporate environment, the implication is clear (and the funny thing is, you were wrong, I am exactly such a user).

    The bottom line is, those that find that there are better devices out there should go use them. This forum really should be a place where those that use this device help each other, offer tips, etc.

    And, you have yet to show me where I've disparaged anyone here.
  15. #95  
    Those ******* are not just proclaiming their appreciation of Palm and the Pre, they are shouting down anyone who criticizes Palm, and you are among them.

    My reference to those who must not be using the device in a business setting followed proclamations that the Pre is usable in a such settings. But it turned out that the person making those claims does not use the Pre for data entry. So my point stands.

    And your particular usage is only enabled by reliance on a homebrew app and a patch, which are there to fix what should have been provided by Palm. You then give an example of you using it to invalidate criticism of Palm. That strikes me as dishonest.
  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    This forum really should be a place where those that use this device help each other, offer tips, etc.
    Yes but I would add that Palm users should also use this site to collectively register their problems and call out Palm where it falls short. No offense, hparsons, but brother it seems you feel personally responsible to poor water on every pre complaint. What about this one from PreCentral itself?
    http://www.precentral.net/dear-palm-...e-fix-calendar
    Does that article break your rule about only helping others and offering tips?

    eek
    PalmOS Treos: 90/300/600/650/700/755/launch day Pre minus/ Evo/Epic
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Those ******* are not just proclaiming their appreciation of Palm and the Pre, they are shouting down anyone who criticizes Palm, and you are among them.

    My reference to those who must not be using the device in a business setting followed proclamations that the Pre is usable in a such settings. But it turned out that the person making those claims does not use the Pre for data entry. So my point stands.

    And your particular usage is only enabled by reliance on a homebrew app and a patch, which are there to fix what should have been provided by Palm. You then give an example of you using it to invalidate criticism of Palm. That strikes me as dishonest.
    Ahhh, OK, now I understand. Disagreeing is "shouting down criticism"; while those who come to a Pre forum, and makes up the rules as they go, are just posting opinions (and yes, proclaiming that because I don't do data entry on a phone means I'm not "using it in a corporate environment' is "making up the rules").

    And I'm sorry, you're simply incorrect. I don't rely on a homebrew app nor a patch for my use. I have those to enhance my use, but I would be able to adequately use the Pre for my business purposes without those added abilities.
  18. #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by eekinsman View Post
    Yes but I would add that Palm users should also use this site to collectively register their problems and call out Palm where it falls short. No offense, hparsons, but brother it seems you feel personally responsible to poor water on every pre complaint. What about this one from PreCentral itself?
    http://www.precentral.net/dear-palm-...e-fix-calendar
    Does that article break your rule about only helping others and offering tips?

    eek
    Sorry, I don't think I was making it a rule. Nothing at all wrong with saying it's time to fix the calendar. However, there's also nothing wrong with saying, just as confidently, that the calendar is currently usable.

    As for my feeling "personally responsible", nah not so much. However, as others have stated, if someone totally new to the Pre, and especially to the forum, came on here to read the threads, they very well might believe some of the nonsense that's spread around.

    I'm not going to somehow feel guilty about expressing my support for the Pre on a the Pre forum... (but, I'm not enough of a fanfolk to go on the iPhone or Android forums, and tell them how much better I like the Pre...)

    Most of the Pre complainers that you see me ... debate ... don't use the device. When those folks come on here and fill up the forum with their "criticisms", yeah, that's an issue...
  19. #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Ahhh, OK, now I understand. Disagreeing is "shouting down criticism"; while those who come to a Pre forum, and makes up the rules as they go, are just posting opinions (and yes, proclaiming that because I don't do data entry on a phone means I'm not "using it in a corporate environment' is "making up the rules").

    And I'm sorry, you're simply incorrect. I don't rely on a homebrew app nor a patch for my use. I have those to enhance my use, but I would be able to adequately use the Pre for my business purposes without those added abilities.
    Splitting hairs with hparsons

    If I'm not able to enter events on the device while coordinating with others in real time, then I'm only partially using it.

    What's your definition?
  20. #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Splitting hairs with hparsons

    If I'm not able to enter events on the device while coordinating with others in real time, then I'm only partially using it.

    What's your definition?
    That's not my definition, but I'm able to do that. Sorry you're having problems, I have no issue with your need to use a different device. Why do you seem to have an issue with my lack of that need?
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