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  1. s219's Avatar
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    #81  
    I think the iPhone started growing partially based on customer loyalty, but it has since expanded well beyond Apple's core following. I even see that in people I know around me; folks that had no interest in Macs or iPods bought iPhones. People that actively disliked Apple bought iPhones.

    It's a pretty remarkable change to see, but it's not hard to understand. Interfaces on typical pre-iPhone cellular devices were horrendous and unintuitive. Anybody could look at an iPhone and see it was easier to use. Apple started from scratch in the industry and came up with a better approach, and they were successful. It's any company's dream.

    Palm and Motorola are great examples of companies who were former heavyweights in the mobile industry, took a beating / lost their way, and are now both betting their future on devices more or less aimed squarely at the iPhone. To me, that's the biggest indicator of the iPhone's influence and impact on the industry. Like it or not, Apple changed the rule book with the iPhone. Apple's competitors know that. Palm probably would not be marketing the Pre, and Motorola the CLIQ, if the iPhone hadn't turned the industry on it's side.
  2. #82  
    It's time to take iPhone out of the picture and get back on topic with the thread...

    If you take iPhone out of the picture... Would the posts you see on this forum on various topics from Oreo Twist to losing their swoosh sound to lag to lack of apps to signal issues and other bugs and glitches and lack of features promised still be valid?

    YES they would.

    And Palm needs to address the owners/users issues as soon as possible and you really can't be using excuses saying Apple had years and this is first gen compared to 3rd gen, etc.

    The tunnel vision is caused by Palms own doing with Dan Hesse saying himself that it was Palms decision to take on iPhone and not his. Palm should be worrying about the combined sales of Android phones over Pres. Or the number of total BB sales over all product lines and their ineffectiveness over them. They have other phones to beat before iPhone. But it's their decision to target iPhone so you know what people will be expecting and you'll have to deliver big time. You can't advertise and talk up the Pre like it's up there with iPhone and joke about Dunkin Dounuts in space and not have to deliver or wonder why people are complaining.

    The Pre is out... people have complaints and bugs and issues and want apps and all that. And it has nothing to do with iPhone at all except that they put their phone up against the best and said, "We can play with them." The complaints are valid and they need to take care of their own house right now. Palms and the users issues with Pre has nothing to do with iPhone.
  3. #83  
    ^^The users will just have to have some patience that is all. They are actively updating the OS as you can tell but it's not all going to come at the same time. Those who can't wait know what to do.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Ease of development. There are almost 300 programs out for the Pre, in less than 4 months. That's on a new OS, on a new phone. Pretty remarkable, to me.

    In addition, I've been able to go in and modify many of the existing programs to suit me. A few of those have been without assistance from others. That's because of the platform.


    Sure I am. Besides the modifications that I've done myself, everytime I use a app written by a developer who was attracted to the Pre because of its platform, I'm benefitting from the platform.
    A good example of this is PDANet on the Treo compared to MyTether on the Pre. Look how fast MyTether came out, and how fast it's evolved. PDANet was a great product, but it's evolution was much slower.

    As for confusion, I think you're simply so blinded by your own dissatisfaction that you're failing to see that others may feel differently...



    From what I hear, they're not. That means that others will have to fill the gap. I suspect that will happen if they don't wake up. I have noticed a lot more chatter on their Yahoo group about the possibilities for the Pre. Basically, the feeling from some appears to be that since the announcement of the Pixie, the Centro is on its way out, and PalmOS is basically dead.



    Because I bought the device and OS, not the software that came on it. Windows comes with an OK text editor, I bought a better one. It also came with a document editor, millions of people buy MS Word. The Treo came with a PIM, hundreds of thousands of people bought Datebk.


    See litotes.
    I'm the kind of consumer who wants a high quality product out of the box. I keep my stuff stock and in good condition because I'd likely have something much better in a year and it's not worth it to me to keep pouring money and time into it. It's not that I mind paying, but I pay for stuff that saves me more time and money down the road. And the utility of what I buy is proportional to how much I pay. A product like the Pre, counting in the plan costs, should come with a well rounded and high quality set of applications to let me do most common tasks. I don't plan on paying for a substitute for something that should work out of the box.

    I've bought apps (ahem, shareware) for my Palm Vx, Treo 650 and Centro: I bought dictionaries, outliners and DocsToGo for my Vx, and later PocketQuicken, Life Balance, Kinoma Pro player, PocketTunes Deluxe, DocsToGo, and a few others.

    As apps mature and become widely used, it's expected that they will be folded into the product from the manufacturer. With the Pre I expect media playback to be complete out of the box and not to have to buy anything. But I'd likely pay for DocsToGo again (bought it for my G1), and finance software. I am not going to pay developers to fix Palm's software shortcomings, only for new functionality.

    Although all of us are entitled to buy whatever we want without justifying it to anyone, your perspective of buying a "platform" and then buying the parts to make it work is one of a hobbyist. Mine is the traditional one of the consumer or business user.

    Which of those should Palm focus on serving first?
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    ...
    Although all of us are entitled to buy whatever we want without justifying it to anyone, your perspective of buying a "platform" and then buying the parts to make it work is one of a hobbyist. Mine is the traditional one of the consumer or business user.

    Which of those should Palm focus on serving first?
    I disagree with your premise. The "platform" works as is. It does everything it's advertised to do. And it still has the ability to do more.

    The irony is, you're busy telling me how wrong I am, yet it would appear only one out of the two of us bought a device we're satisfied with...
  6. #86  
    I paid hundreds of dollars for what is supposed 2b a smart "smartphone".. It can never be that w/o the simplest, basic functions completely missing. We had to pay from day one, it should have been smart from day one. PERIOD.
    Last edited by dbdoinit; 09/12/2009 at 09:13 PM.
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by donm527 View Post
    It's time to take iPhone out of the picture and get back on topic with the thread...

    If you take iPhone out of the picture... Would the posts you see on this forum on various topics from Oreo Twist to losing their swoosh sound to lag to lack of apps to signal issues and other bugs and glitches and lack of features promised still be valid?

    YES they would.

    And Palm needs to address the owners/users issues as soon as possible and you really can't be using excuses saying Apple had years and this is first gen compared to 3rd gen, etc.

    The tunnel vision is caused by Palms own doing with Dan Hesse saying himself that it was Palms decision to take on iPhone and not his. Palm should be worrying about the combined sales of Android phones over Pres. Or the number of total BB sales over all product lines and their ineffectiveness over them. They have other phones to beat before iPhone. But it's their decision to target iPhone so you know what people will be expecting and you'll have to deliver big time. You can't advertise and talk up the Pre like it's up there with iPhone and joke about Dunkin Dounuts in space and not have to deliver or wonder why people are complaining.

    The Pre is out... people have complaints and bugs and issues and want apps and all that. And it has nothing to do with iPhone at all except that they put their phone up against the best and said, "We can play with them." The complaints are valid and they need to take care of their own house right now. Palms and the users issues with Pre has nothing to do with iPhone.
    ++++++++ 1111111111
    I paid hundreds of dollars for what is supposed 2b a smart "smartphone".. It can never be that w/o the simplest, basic functions completely missing. We had to pay from day one, it should have been smart from day one.
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I disagree with your premise. The "platform" works as is. It does everything it's advertised to do. And it still has the ability to do more.
    Don't go all vague on me now. What, again, are you referring to by platform? I'm talking about the Pre. What "platform" are you describing as "working"?

    The Pre, as of 1.1, is bug ridden and some of its most essential functions are not up to the task. Calendar, Music, search, etc.

    The irony is, you're busy telling me how wrong I am, yet it would appear only one out of the two of us bought a device we're satisfied with...
    No, you came to me telling me I'm wrong and I've responded to you. Your satisfaction comes from ignorance or some other permanent bliss that has nothing to do with the Pre.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Don't go all vague on me now. What, again, are you referring to by platform? I'm talking about the Pre. What "platform" are you describing as "working"?

    The Pre, as of 1.1, is bug ridden and some of its most essential functions are not up to the task. Calendar, Music, search, etc.
    The Pre is what I'm talking about. Which of those functions don't work as advertised?

    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    No, you came to me telling me I'm wrong and I've responded to you. Your satisfaction comes from ignorance or some other permanent bliss that has nothing to do with the Pre.
    That's almost laughable. The only thing I implied that you were "wrong" about was when you said the phone was in an unfinished state. I simply said the phone works pretty well.
    Again, it does.

    Exactly what is it that you feel I'm "ignorant" about?
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    The Pre is what I'm talking about. Which of those functions don't work as advertised?
    That's a very good question. What do you think should work "as advertised"?

    Well, Palm didn't advertise the phone as crash free, so it's open to interpretation.

    Also, that there is a Music player, doesn't mean it remembers where you left off on exiting, or that it lets you scroll quickly to find tracks, or that it plays tracks to the end without chopping them off. Also, Palm didn't advertise the Music app as stutter free, so it shouldn't be an issue. It also didn't say anything about missing a scrubbing bar, or that when in list mode the controls move from under your finger and making you press on a track instead. And it doesn't make any promises about showing the full track name.

    And just because we have a day view in the calendar, doesn't mean we can move easily between days, that would be an assumption. It doesn't mean that it's possible to enter an event quickly enough when someone mentions it in a conversation. And it doesn't mention that when you reschedule an event you can't look at available slots at the same time. Also, it doesn't mention that if you are in a meeting and edit the current recurring event the Pre will start giving you repeating audible notifications. The calendar advertised by Palm is just an abstract concept, and all of the above are unwarranted expectations.

    And although notifications are mentioned, it doesn't promise that an un-dismissed notification will let your alarm ring in the morning. It doesn't advertise that if you want to hear your alarm, you will also have to listen to every incoming message through the night. Or that you can take your Pre off the Touchstone, select a music track and put it back without the charging notification ruining the track beginning.

    In fact it doesn't make any guarantees about making it through the night without locking up so it can sound the alarm in the morning. And it doesn't say anything about an "undo" feature so you're on your own. And copy and paste, of course, nothing promised about it being on any kind of text.

    No, actually Palm benefits from us believing the features will be there and work, so it doesn't have to promise them explicitly.

    That's almost laughable. The only thing I implied that you were "wrong" about was when you said the phone was in an unfinished state. I simply said the phone works pretty well.
    Again, it does.

    Exactly what is it that you feel I'm "ignorant" about?
    I've been laughing at every post you made on the topic, I was just being polite about it
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  11. #91  
    That'a got to be the longest "no response" I've ever seen.
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    That'a got to be the longest "no response" I've ever seen.
    I'm trying everything with you. But I'm very patient.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  13. #93  
    I was just going to rant in my own thread, but vBulletin politely asked me to "Please have a look at those [this] threads before you start a new one"

    Grr, so I'm about to be on my FOURTH Pre.

    1. Touch Screen stopped working
    2. Notification stop working, plus the whole battery fitment issue
    3. Touch screen stopped working

    Hopefully the fourth times a charm. The worst part about it is I keep telling my friends how awesome this phone is!

    Oh, and as far as the warrantee...it starts with the first Pre's in-service date, which is June for me. So my "new" Pre basically will have four months of coverage. Oh, but Sprint was nice enough to offer the protection plan for $7 a month. Geez, something isn't right here.

    Why Palm, why can't you make a product that just works?
  14. stanis3k's Avatar
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    #94  
    ppl just like to b!tch
  15. #95  
    Yay, make it hopefully the 5th time is a charm!

    1. Touch Screen stopped working
    2. Notification stop working, plus the whole battery fitment issue
    3. Touch screen stopped working
    4. Slider very loose out of the box

    To make matters worse, I've been on the phone with sprint for 30 minutes. The lady has been saying "just a moment" for the past 15 minutes. At what point does poorly built phones + bad customer service + moderate coverage outweigh a potentially awesome device?
  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by PreGame View Post
    2.) WebOS has been released for 3 months! Give Palm time to iron out the bugs.
    OK, it know been 8 months since this reply. But NanPlayer still does not appear to be available and as far as I can tell there aren't any decent Media players for WebOS. the stock player is simply awful, especially after coming from PocketTunes Deluxe on PalmOS.

    If after 3 months it was too soon to be complaining, is it OK to complain now that we are approaching a year?

    Eric
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by edfehrman View Post
    OK, it know been 8 months since this reply. But NanPlayer still does not appear to be available and as far as I can tell there aren't any decent Media players for WebOS. the stock player is simply awful, especially after coming from PocketTunes Deluxe on PalmOS.

    If after 3 months it was too soon to be complaining, is it OK to complain now that we are approaching a year?

    Eric
    NaNPlayer is available if you ask the author. It's still beta. If you want more information on his progress, then read his thread.

    http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-...iew-video.html


    If I helped you or you have downloaded one of my files,
    then least you could do is click the "Thanks" button.
  18. #98  
    I apologize, I should have been more clear.

    The post I quoted was about people complaining that NanPlayer was rejected from the official App Catalog. And that people should be patient with Palm and stop complaining about NanPlayers rejection.

    Well, here it is another 8 months later and its still not in the App Catalog, and it seems that they still havent updated their API's so that developer's don't have to use undocumented API's in order to create a workable media app.

    Eric
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