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  1. #21  
    Every calculator that I've used would come out to 100.05.

    Not trying to be mean, and I can understand how the OP could get mixed up on this.
    -Goatin' Ain't Easy-
  2. #22  
    omfg...
    Sony n710 --> N760 --> NX70 ---> NZ90 ---> 4get sony ---> Treo 600 -- and two weeks later--> (Feb 05)Treo650 .... (March '08) Centro... Palm Pre (launch date)
  3. #23  
    Multiplication does not equal addition
    Sony n710 --> N760 --> NX70 ---> NZ90 ---> 4get sony ---> Treo 600 -- and two weeks later--> (Feb 05)Treo650 .... (March '08) Centro... Palm Pre (launch date)
  4. larnapp's Avatar
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       #24  
    Look. I have no problem understanding HOW to calculate 100 plus 5 percent of 100. I have no problem calculating 100 plus 5% of 1. I don't even need a calculator to pull it off.

    I have no problem understanding how to make any calculator without a % key give me the correct answer by first calculating 5% of 100 then adding 100 to the result. I have no problem parsing (most) parenthetical mathematic equations, though I'm no math genius and haven't needed to do much algebra or calculus since college.

    The PROBLEM I have is understanding why THIS calculator operates differently from all the other calculators I have ever used (including every single calculator program from our beloved Palm, Inc., the one on my iPod Touch, the calculator in my office that sits on my desk, etc.)

    If flaming me helps you feel better about yourself, then you have bigger problems than math.
  5. emuneee's Avatar
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    #25  
    Ironically every calculator I used (Windows Mobile and Windows XP) says 100 + 5% = 105.
  6. larnapp's Avatar
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       #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by emuneee View Post
    Ironically every calculator I used (Windows Mobile and Windows XP) says 100 + 5% = 105.
    Put on the flame suit. You're sure to get killed for actually using a calculator to see what it would do.
  7. larnapp's Avatar
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       #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by PedroTheGoat View Post
    Every calculator that I've used would come out to 100.05.

    Not trying to be mean, and I can understand how the OP could get mixed up on this.
    First let me say I'm honored "the Goat" joined my thread. Second, you said "would." Did you try some other calculator for real?

    For the record, as I said in my previous post, I am not confused by the math (and I appreciate you understanding how I might be confused) I am confused by the different results from identical key presses on different calculators. I am further confused as to why everyone is arguing the math or saying so strongly why the Pre calculator is right, rather than offering an explanation why so many other calculators' results are different with identical key presses.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by ajk511 View Post
    Besides all this smart people talk...as soon as you press the % key it changes ur 5 to .05

    Did you not look while you typed?
    Ok. This really made me laugh.
  9. nhavar's Avatar
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    #29  
    It sounds like MS Calc, MetaCalc and some others dumb down math and provide some convenience methods over accuracy.

    Using paper, MS Excel, or the Pre:
    100 + 5% is the same as 100 + 0.05 which equals 100.05.

    Using MS Calc/MetaCalc:
    100 + 5% is the same as 100 + (0.05 x 100) which equals 105.

    Doing the math in your head you make the connection that 5% is 5% of 100, you internally expand the calculation to 100 + (100 x .05). However these tools are not connected to your brain. These tools make assumptions based on what you've entered. I'd never want a calculator to make assumptions about a calculation. That leads to very bad math.

    Maybe this is what's wrong with government budgeting - they're using MS Calc and seeing that they have 2.6 trillion in tax revenue to spend when they really only have 2.47 trillion.
    Last edited by nhavar; 07/30/2009 at 01:12 PM.
  10. jrtesq's Avatar
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    #30  
    The Sharp adding machine on my desk, my TI calculator in my briefcase, and the WinXP calculator on my computer all give me 100 + 5% = 105.

    I have used calculators this way for well over 15 years. Every one I have ever used would give me the same: 100 + 5% = 105.

    oh, just tried it on my Treo 700wx. 100 + 5% = 105.
    It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm really quite busy.
  11. #31  
    It depends on how you want the calculator to work.

    100 + (.05 x 100) = 105
    100 + (5 percent of 100) = 105

    but

    100 + 5 percent = 100 + .05 = 100.05 (your result)

    I think this was learned in Pre-algebra.........
  12. hjmillre's Avatar
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    #32  
    I have to agree that the Pre calculator functions differently than other calculators I have used. Whether it is "right" or "wrong" I don't know. I tried multiple other calculators in my office building (and on XP), and they all function differently than the Pre calc.
  13. #33  
    Okay. I joined to answer your question ;P

    I must say that i have no pre right now but i think i can say something about the difference of calculators.


    The calculator you linked (and the Windows Calculator too) are so called immediate execution calculators.

    That means that every time you enter something it is immediatly calculated:

    Example:

    When you hit:

    3 + 2 it calculates 5 and displays 5.

    then you hit

    * 2 it displays 10.

    So it calculates (3 + 2) * 2 = 10.

    A socalled infix notation calculator is wayting until you typed the whole equation and hit =

    same example:

    you type

    3 + 2 * 2 and hit = it calculates

    3 + 2 * 2 = 7


    The example you gave:

    infix

    100 + 5%? = 100 + 5/100*? = 100,05 (autoassuming ? = 1)

    immediate:

    100 + 5 % = 105

    The immediate calculator is doing this because he assumes you want to do a + b % a (100 + 5 % 100).


    I hope that helped


    btw if you set your Windows Calculator to scientific it is a infix calculator and not longer an immediate execution calculator.


    regards
  14. #34  
    PBCK
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by jrtesq View Post
    The Sharp adding machine on my desk, my TI calculator in my briefcase, and the WinXP calculator on my computer all give me 100 + 5% = 105.

    I have used calculators this way for well over 15 years. Every one I have ever used would give me the same: 100 + 5% = 105.

    oh, just tried it on my Treo 700wx. 100 + 5% = 105.
    Your TI calculator must suck. TI-89 Titanium 100+5% = 100.05. It is basically performing the order of operations correctly. 100 plus 5 times the percent sign equals 100.05. The percent sign is another form of multiplication/division and should be treated as such.

    Your three calculators are performing the order of operations differently. You should go get new ones or realize that they are not different. They are just making guesses for what you wanted to input. I, for one, enjoy a calculator to just do the math and not assume I meant to input 100% for my first input.
  16. dave75's Avatar
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    #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by larnapp View Post
    Turns out the Pre's built-in calculator is dumber than a 3rd grader. Every third grader knows that 5% of 100 is 5. Every calculator I own (desktop calc, my old Treo, iPod Touch, etc.) performs the following function properly:

    100 + 5 % = 105

    The Pre thinks:

    100 + 5% = 100.05

    I got an idea... let's tell Palm's software team that their raises are gonna be calculated on the Pre's calculator. Think it might get fixed in an update?
    100 + 5%=100.05 OR 10005%

    Any calculator saying something different is making an assumption, which is bad. My TI-89 and Excel come up with 100.05 and 10005% respectively, which are both correct. 105 is definitely not correct, I don't care what your Fisher Price calculator says.
  17. squeff's Avatar
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    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by larnapp View Post
    Okay. You said "DUH so I must be stupid. But seriously, go find ANY calculator, enter 100 + 5% and see what you get.

    Here's one:
    Calculator - Metacalc

    100 + 5% = 105 every time.
    Yes, it does this. But try this on Metacalc: 5%. You get 0. On every calculator I've ever owned, "5%" will give you "0.05." It's always a shortcut key for "divide by 100."

    In other words, difference calculators define the "%" key differently. Personally, Metacalc is the first I've ever used that defines it the way it does, but it sounds like you've never had a calculator that does it any differently.

    Lesson: learn what your calculator does when pressing buttons.

    Other one to try in Metacalc: 100 x 5 %. Says it's 5. But shouldn't it be (based on 100 + 5% = 105) 500?
  18. dcdttu#WN's Avatar
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    #38  
    Some calculators, Excel included use a % differently than the Pre does. It's just a different way to use it. If you type 5 then %, you get .05. That right there shows how the % symbol is used in the Pre.

    No idiots here, just different ways of using the % symbol. :-)
  19. dave75's Avatar
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by dcdttu View Post
    Some calculators, Excel included use a % differently than the Pre does. It's just a different way to use it. If you type 5 then %, you get .05. That right there shows how the % symbol is used in the Pre.

    No idiots here, just different ways of using the % symbol. :-)
    How else can 5% be interpreted other than .05? It's math, there's no other way to interpret it.

    EDIT: I'm not saying people are idiots either, I'm just saying that any calculator that says 100 + 5% = 105 is not a good calculator.
  20. #40  
    I think this is the funniest thread of all the forums! It made me look at my HP 48G which I bought 15 years ago. I can't even find the % sign on my $300 calcuator (with a whopping 32K Ram!). LMAO!
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