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  1.    #1  
    I see that people are all hoping that an OS update will result in improved battery life. But, I can't see what could possibly be done to improve it.

    I mean, the electronics are going to take the energy that they need to function. Aside from turning stuff off, like bluetooth, there's just no way that there will be a magical improvement in battery life from a software update.

    If anything, I think they need to figure out how to get the poor signal issue figured out by boosting the power to the antenna, but I'm guessing there's no way of changing that either.
  2. #2  
    Software can be written differently so that it taxes the CPU less. The more work the processor must do, the more energy it consumes.
  3. #3  
    Because an update can clean up code, so the processor isn't used as extensively to complete the same task. Because Radio firmware updates can make things work more efficiently. At full power the components will use the same juice, but the software changes how often full power is used up by the components, hence why a software update can most definitely affect battery life.
  4. #4  
    oh wow...SW can be written more efficiently which would dramatically improve battery life, depending on where the improvements are made.

    There's a common saying in engineering that processors usually spend 90% of their time in 10% of the code.

    if you make a small improvement to that 10% of the code, the effects will be dramatic.
  5.    #5  
    Well, like everyone else I'd love to have more battery life, but I will not be holding my breath.

    I'm pretty sure they have spent a fair amount of time optimizing these sorts of things before they brought the phone to market. If they didn't, they are idiots... :-)

    I used a Touch Pro for a short time, and returned it for battery life that was the same or better than this. I guess this is the price we'll have to pay for power!
  6. bruba's Avatar
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    #6  
    Problem: any new Facebook/deleted Facebook contacts (EVDO)?

    Option 1: check every Facebook contact
    Option 2: check last Facebook contact update variable or amount contacts

    Option 1 takes a lot of time, data and power. Option 2 is faster, less battery, etc..
  7. #7  
    A good analogy is a rifle. I have a rifle that can hold 20 rounds. Now the hardware isn't going to change. My rifle will always be able to shoot at the same rate, and hold the same amount of rounds. So if my skill with the rifle is so so, I will need more rounds to accomplis the task and thus deplete my magazine faster. Once my skill goes up I will be using the rifle more efficiently so that it doesn't deplete the magazine as fast.
  8. #8  
    CPU-scaling can have a dramatic effect on battery life
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by clindner View Post
    I see that people are all hoping that an OS update will result in improved battery life. But, I can't see what could possibly be done to improve it.

    I mean, the electronics are going to take the energy that they need to function. Aside from turning stuff off, like bluetooth, there's just no way that there will be a magical improvement in battery life from a software update.

    If anything, I think they need to figure out how to get the poor signal issue figured out by boosting the power to the antenna, but I'm guessing there's no way of changing that either.
    You are dead wrong....do a search for CPU Scaling and SmartReflex that is built into the hardware. WebOS just needs to be updated to take advantage of these options. Those who have enabled them are noticing improvements in performance and battery life.
  10.    #10  
    If it's such a well known benefit, why hasn't it already been taken care of?
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by clindner View Post
    If it's such a well known benefit, why hasn't it already been taken care of?
    Same question we all ask ourselves. We are not employees of palm. We do not know. Why don't you do some research. You obviously do not know much about the device or any phone for that matter.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by clindner View Post
    If it's such a well known benefit, why hasn't it already been taken care of?
    Well if you see anyone who's rooted and activated the cpu scaling has run into some issues with it occasionally freezing up.
  13. #13  
    Embedded power management basically consists of figuring out how to put as many chips into the deepest sleep mode for the longest time possible without significantly impacting the user experience. This is entirely a software issue.

    Let's use the Pre's OMAP processor as an example. With all CPUs and peripherals on and working at maximum, this chip can draw over 2 Amps of current.

    1150 mAh battery / 2000 mA = about 30 minutes of battery life.

    Each peripheral can be independently disabled, and each CPU supports a wide variety of sleep modes. At deepest sleep, the OMAP draws only 40 nA (that's 0.000000004 Amps).

    1150 mAh battery / 40 nA = about 287,500,000 hours of battery life.

    Granted, this is just one chip and the values represent both extremes, but are you still so confident that software has nothing to do with power consumption?
  14. akarol's Avatar
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    #14  
    clindner, if software had nothing to do with battery life, how do you explain this:

    http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2008/07/the-iphone-3g-w/

    Windows 7 to Extend Laptop Battery Life by Minimum of 11% - Windows 7 battery - Gizmodo

    Windows 7: Extending Battery Life with Energy Efficient Applications | pdc2008 | Channel 9

    It's not a hard concept to grasp. Less resource hogging = less power drain.

    It isn't like Palm, Microsoft, or pretty much any other software company out there leaves things out on release. It's that there are insight in better programming, updates to languages, etc. that come up after the product has been introduced to the market.
  15.    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by SiniStereO View Post

    Granted, this is just one chip and the values represent both extremes, but are you still so confident that software has nothing to do with power consumption?

    Good to see that there's at least one person who knows how to read and intelligently respond!


    I can reduce the battery consumption to zero if I remove the battery completely, right?

    Point being that sure, you can shut down the functions of the phone, but then it won't be able to function. Even when turned off, the phone is sending and receiving data, that's the way it is designed. So it is unreasonable it would seem to be able to reduce the voltage to anywhere near the magnitude you cite, and still have it perform the functions it is designed for.

    As I said before, I'd love to have more battery life, but I don't see it happening.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by technoviking View Post
    So childish. Run a long kid. Go play in traffic.
    Ha ha, im getting good laughs out of your post man....but nonetheless, just another useless thread.

    If you (the OP) do not understand anything about software on smart phones, then why are you so sure the battery life cant be improved? No wonder you had to return a Touch Pro....you just dont know how to use these phones.
  17.    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by akarol View Post
    clindner, if software had nothing to do with battery life, how do you explain this:

    Review: iPhone 3G Trades Battery Life for Interface, Software Awesomeness | Gadget Lab | Wired.com

    Windows 7 to Extend Laptop Battery Life by Minimum of 11% - Windows 7 battery - Gizmodo

    Windows 7: Extending Battery Life with Energy Efficient Applications | pdc2008 | Channel 9

    It's not a hard concept to grasp. Less resource hogging = less power drain.

    It isn't like Palm, Microsoft, or pretty much any other software company out there leaves things out on release. It's that there are insight in better programming, updates to languages, etc. that come up after the product has been introduced to the market.

    So, we'll just need to wait several years for these improvements? And 10% improvement? That's what? A couple of hours on a Pre?
  18.    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by titansluvpre View Post
    Ha ha, im getting good laughs out of your post man....but nonetheless, just another useless thread.

    If you (the OP) do not understand anything about software on smart phones, then why are you so sure the battery life cant be improved? No wonder you had to return a Touch Pro....you just dont know how to use these phones.

    Yeah, I've been getting a laugh myself. I returned the Touch Pro because I hated WinMo, not because of the battery life. That was just an aside, but that's probably just a bit over your head.

    Maybe you guys need to take a look at when folks registered before you start with the personal attacks.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by donatom3 View Post
    A good analogy is a rifle. I have a rifle that can hold 20 rounds. Now the hardware isn't going to change. My rifle will always be able to shoot at the same rate, and hold the same amount of rounds. So if my skill with the rifle is so so, I will need more rounds to accomplis the task and thus deplete my magazine faster. Once my skill goes up I will be using the rifle more efficiently so that it doesn't deplete the magazine as fast.
    So you can improve the efficiency of your rifle by attending an Appleseed shoot.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by clindner View Post
    Yeah, I've been getting a laugh myself. I returned the Touch Pro because I hated WinMo, not because of the battery life. That was just an aside, but that's probably just a bit over your head.

    Maybe you guys need to take a look at when folks registered before you start with the personal attacks.
    4 years of posts and this is your crowning acheivement.

    To be fair, any software update that makes things run smoother with help the battery. So the more the bugs are fixed, the better the battery life.

    It might help to settle down a tad, and maybe we could have an intelligent discussion about the Pre, rather than this witty reparte we are engaged in so far.
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