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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by heberman View Post
    ...
    I'm not a Palm General leading a charge to destroy all competing phones. Iphones are cool. The Pre is awesome! So are Android phones. So are WinMo - uh, nevermind.
    ...
    Whew.... almost lost me for a minute there...
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    Whats with the attitude? The people you're arguing with are Pre owners who believe enough in the platform that they are willing to invest $300, new plans and a 2yr contract, so why all the hostility? People aren't rooting for failure, they're discussing (on a discussion board) what they think is necessary for success.
    The op can't find a place to buy the phone and may choose the Iphone if Sprint or palm don't get him one soon...fyi

    I just don't understand why this is the appropriate forum to be discussing why the Pre is not the "homerun" we hoped it would be. Wouldn't that be the forum for the device you decided to go to after the pre? Some bought the phone and hated it, some bought it and loved it. Some Have yet to buy it and are making posts on a enthusiast website with no enthusiasm for the phone. So OP whats your favorite part of the Pre? Looking back at your post history, there are lots of post's about hardware quality, and questions about if a new batch will include a new processor, and why palm is having trouble getting apps...I know I just missed it, but where is your enthusiasm?
    Last edited by mrloserpunk; 06/25/2009 at 12:54 AM.
  3.    #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by mrloserpunk View Post
    The op can't find a place to buy the phone and may choose the Iphone if Sprint or palm don't get him one soon...fyi

    I just don't understand why this is the appropriate forum to be discussing why the Pre is not the "homerun" we hoped it would be. Wouldn't that be the forum for the device you decided to go to after the pre? Some bought the phone and hated it, some bought it and loved it. Some Have yet to buy it and are making posts on a enthusiast website with no enthusiasm for the phone. So OP whats your favorite part of the Pre? Looking back at your post history, there are lots of post's about hardware quality, and questions about if a new batch will include a new processor, and why palm is having trouble getting apps...I know I just missed it, but where is your enthusiasm?
    get off the internet, hide under a blanket, and to go to sleep. When you wake up everyone will think the sun shines out of the pre's *** and go back to a geocentric view of the universe except this time the universe revolves around the pre.

    http://forums.precentral.net/cross-p...-than-3gs.html
    and you're opinion is as baseless as your post fyi. yea my posts are all anti pre./sarcasm seems any post that doesnt praise the pre irks you. and actually i'm waiting on my upgrade to come in july to get the pre. and after getting burnt with the instinct im making sure the phone is what i want and that its heading in the right direction. sorry not everyone can run out and buy a phone with their head up their *** and ask no questions. you view this as a pre enthusiast site. a lot would say your wrong. A lot, like me, would view this as a Pre info site. A site for owners and would be owners trying to make a decision.

    and if i wanted a iPhone. I would have an iPhone.
  4. #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    Whats with the attitude? The people you're arguing with are Pre owners who believe enough in the platform that they are willing to invest $300, new plans and a 2yr contract, so why all the hostility?
    It's interesting how you ignore Jmaine's condescension and personal insults, including the fact that he was the one that began hurling them in this thread, but somehow picture me as the irrational and hostile one? Am I the one generalizing about "fanboys" having "wet dreams" about the Pre?

    Also, Jmaine doesn't "believe" in anything - by his posts in this thread - aside from his own cynicism and certainty of Palm's doom. I'm more than happy to discuss or debate the Pre platform. But it is plain stupid to rake it over the coals because it hasn't magically erased and reversed all of Palm's financial and tactical mistakes of the past several years....in the course of less than three weeks.

    Go back and re-read his every post in this thread. There's nothing to indicate he cares about the Pre, but he sure shows a lot of interest in Palm's finances leading up to it. There's your attitude. There's your hostility. I was never anything but amused by his inane ramblings.

    People aren't rooting for failure, they're discussing (on a discussion board) what they think is necessary for success.
    Actually, jmaine did no such "discussing what he thinks is necessary for success" in this thread. That's why I didn't engage "people", just him.
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by mrloserpunk View Post
    ...
    I just don't understand why this is the appropriate forum to be discussing why the Pre is not the "homerun" we hoped it would be. Wouldn't that be the forum for the device you decided to go to after the pre? Some bought the phone and hated it, some bought it and loved it. Some Have yet to buy it and are making posts on a enthusiast website with no enthusiasm for the phone. So OP whats your favorite part of the Pre? Looking back at your post history, there are lots of post's about hardware quality, and questions about if a new batch will include a new processor, and why palm is having trouble getting apps...I know I just missed it, but where is your enthusiasm?
    This is a discussion site and I think people are discussing the phone. I don't think that PreCentral is intended as a propaganda or praise only forum. It's healthy to discuss all sides of an issue and that's what people are doing. The are many "this is good about the Pre and Palm" threads and many "this is bad about the Pre and Palm" threads. In my opinion, that's the way it should be and I would find PreCentral a lot less useful if it were any other way.
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by clipcarl View Post
    This is a discussion site and I think people are discussing the phone. I don't think that PreCentral is intended as a propaganda or praise only forum. It's healthy to discuss all sides of an issue and that's what people are doing. The are many "this is good about the Pre and Palm" threads and many "this is bad about the Pre and Palm" threads. In my opinion, that's the way it should be and I would find PreCentral a lot less useful if it were any other way.
    Well said.
  7.    #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by clipcarl View Post
    This is a discussion site and I think people are discussing the phone. I don't think that PreCentral is intended as a propaganda or praise only forum. It's healthy to discuss all sides of an issue and that's what people are doing. The are many "this is good about the Pre and Palm" threads and many "this is bad about the Pre and Palm" threads. In my opinion, that's the way it should be and I would find PreCentral a lot less useful if it were any other way.
    x2
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by photojake View Post
    Its funny to read this and act like we can actually make decision for Palm. Most of us here never even had a Palm product until the Pre.
    I don't know if that is the case. Most people here have seemed to be like me. They started with palm back in the Palm Personal days. I've got a Treo 755p in my holster right now.
  9. urkel's Avatar
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    #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by sacherjj View Post
    I don't know if that is the case. Most people here have seemed to be like me. They started with palm back in the Palm Personal days. I've got a Treo 755p in my holster right now.
    I think that is why the opinions are so polarized. Some people view them as a "New" startup company because they have new backing, a new product and a new attitude. And some people view them as an "Old" company that had the industry in their hands and totally screwed it up so their failures are all self-inflicted.

    As a Palm Pilot owner then I'm in the camp that views them a VERY old company that SHOULD get a higher level of scrutiny because PIM has been their PRIMARY business for over a decade. Apple and Google may be bigger companies but they are newer to the game so their mistakes are part of the learning experience. But Palm and (to a lesser extent) Microsoft have been in this market for so long that the omission of even the slightest feature deserves a kick in the swimsuit area because if you had it right 10 years ago then why don't you have it right today?

    Some may feel it's not be a fair assessment but we're consumers and our way of being "nice" to companies is to spend hard earned money on their products.
    Last edited by Urkel; 06/25/2009 at 11:18 AM.
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    I think that is why the opinions are so polarized. Some people view them as a "New" startup company because they have new backing, a new product and a new attitude. And some people view them as an "Old" company that had the industry in their hands and totally screwed it up so their failures are all self-inflicted.

    As a Palm Pilot owner then I'm in the camp that views them a VERY old company that SHOULD get a higher level of scrutiny because PIM has been their PRIMARY business for over a decade. Apple and Google may be bigger companies but they are newer to the game so their mistakes are part of the learning experience. But Palm and (to a lesser extent) Microsoft have been in this market for so long that the omission of even the slightest feature deserves a kick in the swimsuit area because if you had it right 10 years ago then why don't you have it right today?

    Some may feel it's not be a fair assessment but we're consumers and our way of being "nice" to companies is to spend hard earned money on their products.
    I would agree if this was a PalmOS device, but it's not. It's a whole new OS and as that is the case, it's going to take some time to flesh things out. That's just the way it is. Although I've been away for years, I go way back with Palm and understand that they let the world pass them by, but now they're back in the game with a terrific product.

    I also find it a little ironic that a lot of the folks who have been complaining since January that Palm was taking too long to release the Pre are now saying they released it too early. Nothing is perfect, and while there are some things I'd like to see revised in future versions, the phone performs great as it is. Even with a few warts, it's much more effective than my last device and it's brand new.

    And beyond all that, Palm doesn't "owe" you anything; if you don't like it, don't buy it.
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by GMoney749 View Post
    And beyond all that, Palm doesn't "owe" you anything; if you don't like it, don't buy it.
    I think that was the plan. I believed Palm does owe PalmOS users something, the continued support of that platform which they are still selling. OTOH PalmOS users owe Palm nothing. If they liek the Pre they will presumably buy it. Otherwise they won't
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    I think that was the plan. I believed Palm does owe PalmOS users something, the continued support of that platform which they are still selling. OTOH PalmOS users owe Palm nothing. If they liek the Pre they will presumably buy it. Otherwise they won't
    I thought that at first, but then changed my mind. It would be great if the Palm Pre had the PIM quality of my current 755p (Even without DateBk6 or Agendus). However, the incremental updates were often driven by better 3rd party apps that "forced" the base OS to get better. The same cycle happens with any system.

    If the classic get a good sync system and working well, the good of the Palm OS will be available while the Web OS incarnation matures. That is great, because I still haven't found a phone that does PIM better than good ole' Garnet OS.
  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by photojake View Post
    Its funny to read this and act like we can actually make decision for Palm. Most of us here never even had a Palm product until the Pre. I remember just a few months ago when Palm was not even mentioned in the same galaxy as the iPhone, Android, BB, or even other WM phones.

    Now it is up to the 2nd or 3rd place of any phone out. That is a huge jump for Palm. They have sold over 100,000 phones in the first few weeks. That is also huge for Palm. Compared to Apple, it is a drop in the bucket, but it is just the beggining. Be patient my friends... good things come to thoughs who wait.
    I would guess that quite a few of the people on this Board are long-time Palm lovers. I had a Palm PDA early this decade and have had a 700, 755, and a centro before the Pre. As hard as it may be to believe for some of the people on here, the term Iphone-killer has been used for a much shorter period than the term Treo-killer was. Palm isn't some new upstart, but rather an old dog reinventing itself.

    With this in mind, it's really interesting to see the reactions on the board to all sorts of things. First, a lot of people seem to think that the Iphone was the first "smartphone" to ever exist or that it was a phone revolution.

    As lovely a device as it is, I would argue
    that it was more evolutionary in that it really doesn't do an incredible amount more (and in many cases does less) than the Treos, blackberries, Winmo devices, etc. of old, but did make the smartphone accessible and popular for the masses by improving ease of use and adding a "cool factor" to the smartphone. I think the biggest thing it did was let the masses know that you could have one device do a lot of things at once. Many gadget freaks already knew this and probably had Treos and winmo devices doing a lot of the stuff that Apple people appear to think started with the Iphone. Again, the Iphone may have done it prettier or in a "cooler" way, but almost everything it does had already been done.

    It's crazy how fast people forget, but Palm was the King. Honestly, with the popularity of the Iphone, and the ability of Apple to cult-ivate its customers, I doubt that will happen again anytime soon, but I really feel that they are going back in the right direction after all these years of being stagnant.

    Some people think everything about the Pre is perfect, and others seem to think that it's a disaster. I think both sides are wrong, frankly. The Pre is not perfect, and I'm pretty sure Palm knows that. They've put out 2 updates in less than a month. They're working their tails off. Maybe they're not moving as quickly as some of you would like, but after seeing what Rubenstein and co. have done since he's been running the show, I have faith that the Pre is just the beginning.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by oddlou View Post
    As lovely a device as it is, I would argue
    that it was more evolutionary in that it really doesn't do an incredible amount more (and in many cases does less) than the Treos, blackberries, Winmo devices, etc. of old, but did make the smartphone accessible and popular for the masses by improving ease of use and adding a "cool factor" to the smartphone. I think the biggest thing it did was let the masses know that you could have one device do a lot of things at once.
    I disagree. The biggest thing the iPhone did was bring a decent web browsing experiance to a smartphone. Treos, blackberries and Winmo devices all had and continue to have crappy web browsers. The second biggest thing it did was combine a really great video ipod with a phone. Finally, though the email client is generally fairly crappy, it was the first to properly display email with built in HTML.
  15. #75  
    Needs a larger user base? The phone has only been out for what two and half or three weeks? There were already a million app downloads reported. Give it some time Palm has to get more out the door. I believe the user base will continue to grow by leaps and bounds and Palm will put out more WebOS devices to further that growth.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    I disagree. The biggest thing the iPhone did was bring a decent web browsing experiance to a smartphone. Treos, blackberries and Winmo devices all had and continue to have crappy web browsers. The second biggest thing it did was combine a really great video ipod with a phone. Finally, though the email client is generally fairly crappy, it was the first to properly display email with built in HTML.
    Actually, winmo has some pretty impressive web browsers out now. Opera is great. Skyfire is pretty good. There are others. You have to do a little extra to get those browsers on the phones, but they're available. Agreed on the Ipod/phone convergence. It was and is probably still the best combination of those two things. But again, Apple just improved something that was already available, they didn't invent the combination.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    As a Palm Pilot owner then I'm in the camp that views them a VERY old company that SHOULD get a higher level of scrutiny because PIM has been their PRIMARY business for over a decade. Apple and Google may be bigger companies but they are newer to the game so their mistakes are part of the learning experience. But Palm and (to a lesser extent) Microsoft have been in this market for so long that the omission of even the slightest feature deserves a kick in the swimsuit area because if you had it right 10 years ago then why don't you have it right today?
    Palm started out with PIM and soon branched to OS where they left the same bloated PIM in a slow OS built around 3rd party apps (sounds like a certain "smartphone" today) So they really havent been relying on their PIM techonology as their business once the PDA craze died. I dont know what feature 10 years ago is so important today; Most if not all have either been revolutionized or become outdated. To say Apple and Google should be excused from being scrutiny is ridiculous. Apple still doesnt have MMS on their phones in the US, a basic feature any dumbphone can do since 2002. Both Apple and Google have had the time from learning for others mistakes. I dont see how its ok to dismiss a mistake from a new company entering a new market. If you didnt do your R&D and make critical mistakes, much like Apple has then you probably shouldnt be entering said market.

    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    I disagree. The biggest thing the iPhone did was bring a decent web browsing experiance to a smartphone.
    I disagree. It brought Feature phones to the forefront of cellphones. Before their were either a dumbphone or a smartphone. Never a middle ground where you got a mixture of both. Look at any cellphone provider and see how many dumbphones (i.e. flip or candy bar with phone/texting/camera capabilities) compared to those with some smartphone/pda capabilities, i.e. the feature phones.

    I have nothing against Apple or the iphone. Great company made a good device. But a smartphone the iphone is not. It lacks many basic features which many smartphones today are expected.
  18. #78  
    This is a discussion site and I think people are discussing the phone. I don't think that PreCentral is intended as a propaganda or praise only forum. It's healthy to discuss all sides of an issue and that's what people are doing. The are many "this is good about the Pre and Palm" threads and many "this is bad about the Pre and Palm" threads. In my opinion, that's the way it should be and I would find PreCentral a lot less useful if it were any other way.
    Actually, my experience with Forums, prior to this one is that it's where you go to share information on how to use your product and ask questions.

    In otherwords the person who figured out that you can listen to audible.com in classic, the person who tells you how to view movies, tips or even personal bad experience to help others making the same mistake. An example would be installing an app that crashed your phone are others running into the same issue.

    There is also the people who rave or share their apps or experience with their phone, but it's not a place for Pre bashers to jump on and annoy people constantly with their opinion of a decision they didn't make or their isolated experience.

    There are so many posts by people who aren't actually discussing the specifics of the phone and how to use it or great apps that have been discovered that it's hard to find the ones that do provide the valid insight and ideas.

    Anyway there's a great thread from a guy who's figure out the settings for Orb and another one for audible.com.
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by sacherjj View Post
    I thought that at first, but then changed my mind. It would be great if the Palm Pre had the PIM quality of my current 755p (Even without DateBk6 or Agendus). However, the incremental updates were often driven by better 3rd party apps that "forced" the base OS to get better. The same cycle happens with any system.
    ...
    What a perfect example. In spite of all the talk about the PIM that PalmOS had for years, the fact is that one of the perennially best selling apps was DateBook, which improved the PIM. So much so that an eventually Palm included a "DateBook light" on one of the releases.

    DateBook didn't just magically show up when the PalmOS was released. It showed up because someone recognized the base functionality of the PIM and saw ways to improve it. Further, it didn't magically appear in its final format. The last version I bought was DateBook6, so even that was regularly changed, and added to.

    Had Palm stuck with the old format, we would have just seen more building on the old. Instead, they went with something totally new. That will be built on. However, to build it as new, they needed a new foundation.

    I am so looking forward to see what's built on that foundation.
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Had Palm stuck with the old format, we would have just seen more building on the old. Instead, they went with something totally new. That will be built on. However, to build it as new, they needed a new foundation.
    Unfortunately, part of that foundation appears to be missing.
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