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  1.    #1  
    Yes, the Pre is slower at loading apps than, say, the iPhone 3G S. The difference, though, is that immediately after clicking on an app's icon on the Pre, you can just swipe up again from the gesture area as the launcher closes. This places the app immediately into card view as it opens.

    I just did this with 10 apps in succession, and no only did each app load without issue (when 7 cards were already open), but the time to click and open all 10 was no more than around 7 seconds total*. Each app continued loading in the background.

    So, by that measure, each app took only on average .7 seconds to "open." And note that while the slower apps (e.g., Pandora) were still opening completely, I could flip cards around and work with other applications.

    I'd say try that on an iPhone, but of course that would be impossible. Try it on any other smartphone, and I'll bet it's not easy to do on those, either.

    I'm going to arrange my most-used apps on a single launcher page so that I can load them quickly this way after the rare reboot. And of course since they're always open in the background, the load time thereafter because essentially nil.

    Golly, I love my Pre.

    * I did this a few more times and it did get a little choppy with some apps. But, it still worked, and I couldn't find any apps that didn't work just fine that way. And in fact, I can open apps that way on my Pre more quickly than I can open apps on my Mac or PC.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  2. pomokey's Avatar
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    #2  
    yes, the pre's processor is fast enough to handle opening that many applications simultaneously, but that still doesn't negate the fact there's a 2 second delay from when you touch the icon, to when the app starts to open. When you just want to open up one app, all the multitasking in the world doesn't help.

    the power is there, it's just not being utilized. I imagine we will see an update in the future which will speed up the opening of apps.
    neathings - neatˇthings and apps for webOS
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by pomokey View Post
    yes, the pre's processor is fast enough to handle opening that many applications simultaneously, but that still doesn't negate the fact there's a 2 second delay from when you touch the icon, to when the app starts to open. When you just want to open up one app, all the multitasking in the world doesn't help.

    the power is there, it's just not being utilized. I imagine we will see an update in the future which will speed up the opening of apps.
    Actually, multitasking is exactly the point. Other than the GPS programs, I normally just leave cards open for all of the applications I use regularly. You don't HAVE to close them unless you're resetting the phone. And if you leave them open, guess how long they take to load? Zip. Tell me what phone is faster than zip??

    If you come at the device from a positive angle and figure out how it's designed to be operated, rather than just comparing it spec-for-spec with some other platform or superfluous test, I think you'll find in practice that it's pretty damn good. If you instead choose to keep trying to operate it like your [insert what I used to have here], well then that's just your deal.
  4. jsabo's Avatar
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    #4  
    Agreed: if you tested how long it took to run a series of common tasks-- send an email, log into Facebook, send a mass-text, read and delete an email, reply to a text-- the ability to leave applications open is going to give you a definite advantage.
  5. #5  
    It's all good until you get the dreaded "No more cards" message.
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    It's all good until you get the dreaded "No more cards" message.
    Well yeah, that would be an issue, but I've yet to see that on my own phone and don't see it posted much on here anymore.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    It's all good until you get the dreaded "No more cards" message.
    In my example, I opened 17 cards in very quick succession without getting the error. I closed a bunch of them and then did it again, and then yet again. Never did get it.

    In fact, as another test, I just open 20 apps. And then used them (e.g., took a picture, checked email, etc.). Got the message when I tried to open the 21st app.

    I'm thinking they did a lot to fix that problem in 1.0.3. Today, the system's remarkably stable.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  8. #8  
    Doesn't it decrease the already poor battery life to leave many applications open though?
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    In my example, I opened 17 cards in very quick succession without getting the error. I closed a bunch of them and then did it again, and then yet again. Never did get it.

    In fact, as another test, I just open 20 apps. And then used them (e.g., took a picture, checked email, etc.). Got the message when I tried to open the 21st app.

    I'm thinking they did a lot to fix that problem in 1.0.3. Today, the system's remarkably stable.
    Definitely a good news message - amazing what a little Valgrind memory leak chasing will do for you!
  10.    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by leaverus View Post
    Doesn't it decrease the already poor battery life to leave many applications open though?
    That's like asking the question, "Have you stopped beating your wife?"
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    That's like asking the question, "Have you stopped beating your wife?"
    Not really - it's a valid question. If the Pre is required to keep commonly used programs loaded all the time in order for it to be responsive, there will be a definite degradation in battery life.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Not really - it's a valid question. If the Pre is required to keep commonly used programs loaded all the time in order for it to be responsive, there will be a definite degradation in battery life.
    Well, would you care to share with me a technical explanation for why that's the case, because I don't get it. And make sure you speak loud enough for my phone to hear, because it's so ignorant it doesn't even know that it's supposed to be suffering from "definite degredation".

    I intentionally excluded location service applications because I know they'll try to keep updated if they're left open and burn up battery, but how exactly is my email application using more battery because I left the card open? It's pulling down email whether it's open or closed. How is it using more battery when it's sitting there doing nothing in between that? The phone app, the web page, the SMS window, contacts - they're all just sitting there doing nothing. Maybe using memory, but not battery.

    But I understand why we're here - battery life was supposed to kill this phone even well before the launch and it's hard to let that one go.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    In my example, I opened 17 cards in very quick succession without getting the error. I closed a bunch of them and then did it again, and then yet again. Never did get it.

    In fact, as another test, I just open 20 apps. And then used them (e.g., took a picture, checked email, etc.). Got the message when I tried to open the 21st app.

    I'm thinking they did a lot to fix that problem in 1.0.3. Today, the system's remarkably stable.
    i'm finding this is the case too!! haven't gotten the "too many cards open" msg since 1.03 so very good news!!
    Sincerely,

    Dwight Shrute
  14. jsabo's Avatar
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    #14  
    In terms of open cards killing your battery, there are two things that we would need to know-- are those cards "active" when you don't have the screen on, and if not, does the CPU have to do more work, even with the screen off, if you have a bunch of cards open.

    I haven't actually tested this, but one example of a battery-draining open card would be connecting the the real facebook site. If the cards are actually active while the screen is off, that page is theoretically using the radio to check for new stories and chat messages, and CPU to update the page.

    Again, I'm not saying that's what is happening, just that it's a possible way that it could happen.

    Likewise, if everything doesn't "go to sleep," it's possible that the card manager process is having to use CPU to see if a card is trying to do something-- more cards open = more management overhead = more CPU = quicker battery drain.

    Can probably get a more definitive answer to this by watching the process information on rooted phone, and seeing what happens to the CPU levels when the screen is off.
  15.    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Not really - it's a valid question. If the Pre is required to keep commonly used programs loaded all the time in order for it to be responsive, there will be a definite degradation in battery life.
    My point was, yours was a logical fallacy, in this case a loaded question. You asked "Doesn't it decrease the already poor battery life to leave many applications open though?" You assume in your question that the battery life is "already poor," meaning that one can't really answer your question without accepting your erroneous assumption.

    You could have asked, "Doesn't it decrease battery life..." and that would have been a valid question on its own.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  16.    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Not really - it's a valid question. If the Pre is required to keep commonly used programs loaded all the time in order for it to be responsive, there will be a definite degradation in battery life.
    Also, incidentally, I'm guessing that it does degrade battery life to have multiple cards open. I'm assuming that the system has aggressive power savings capabilities, including the processor slowing down or shutting off whenever the load is reduced. So, it does make sense that if multiple cards are open and live in the background, processor and other system components (e.g., the radio as another poster mentioned) would be active more often/longer.

    But, I simply assume that doing more will use more power. And that's also irrelevant to my point, which was that in measuring how quickly the Pre can open applications vs. other smartphones, the Pre has a tremendous advantage when you move past pure loading speeds.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Not really - it's a valid question. If the Pre is required to keep commonly used programs loaded all the time in order for it to be responsive, there will be a definite degradation in battery life.
    This is not necessarily true. It is 100% dependent on what apps are being kept open. If one of the apps is GPS, then yes the battery will drain fast. If you leave email, SMS, and a couple websites up that will not make much difference at all in my experience. If you are streaming music over 3G that will decrease the battery life as well. But hey, you can't even try to do any of this on any other device so I'll live with a little battery drain to be on the cutting edge. For me the only thing that really kills the battery is GPS navigation. It goes pretty fast for longer trips a car charger is a must. imo
    Palm Pre
    (formerly TouchPro, iPhone 3G, Curve, 8800, Treo800p, E61, N9300, Treo 700p ,Treo 600, I500, I330, Treo 300, I300, 6035)
  18. #18  
    After seeing the blue screen of death too many times in my lifetime, I probably close apps too much and probably have remnants in memory. That said, if I leave calendar, all inboxes and contacts open, I can get through virtually the whole day with out much delay except Pandora. That's internet audio, so I expect the delay.

    I'm so much more efficient now with the Exchange sync that I know what Blackberry owners are happy about. I now have that with Yahoo, Gmail and my own domain as well. Not to mention contact pics from Facebook. LinkedIn can't be that far behind with this integration. I'm emailing photos to Picasaweb for my parents and multitasking makes it a breeze to go from the camera to photoroll to email to texting folks about the new pics. AWESOME!
  19. #19  
    You can justify it however you want but it is obvious the Pre is not up to par on using that nice processor to get things opened. It is also pretty obvious that most of the apps are not optimized as they tend to chug at time and frame rates can drop on scrolling and other activities.

    So if you think Palm doesn't have some serious tweaking to do you haven't been using the same device as me. Sure I love the phone but sticking your heads into a hole anytime something negative comes up doesn't help us in the long run.

    The more pressure on Palm to get this device on par with Apple's GS the better. We all benefit from competition.

    Say what you will about Apple but their implementation of video and copy / paste is excellent. As is their calendar and web browsing. So yes we get multi tasking and that is huge but it is no excuse for Palm to deliver everything else in a mediocre fashion.
  20. #20  
    You can justify it however you want but it is obvious the Pre is not up to par on using that nice processor to get things opened. It is also pretty obvious that most of the apps are not optimized as they tend to chug at time and frame rates can drop on scrolling and other activities.

    So if you think Palm doesn't have some serious tweaking to do you haven't been using the same device as me. Sure I love the phone but sticking your heads into a hole anytime something negative comes up doesn't help us in the long run.

    The more pressure on Palm to get this device on par with Apple's GS the better. We all benefit from competition.

    Say what you will about Apple but their implementation of video and copy / paste is excellent. As is their calendar and web browsing. So yes we get multi tasking and that is huge but it is no excuse for Palm to deliver everything else in a mediocre fashion.
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