Page 3 of 10 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 182
  1. Wiz1999's Avatar
    Posts
    38 Posts
    Global Posts
    39 Global Posts
    #41  
    Seems to me that the Pre does work as a true GPS device when the A-GPS is not available. I just tried turning off the Cell Radio and turning on wifi (you can do this by putting the device in Airplane Mode, then specifically turning on wifi), then I went to Google Maps. Initially it showed a very large circle for my location. After a minute or two, it had an exact fix on my location (sounds like the behavior of a normal GPS device unlike the near immediate fix of the A-GPS). Without the Cell Radio on, seems it must be using GPS to determine the location.
  2.    #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by raremage View Post
    I'm afraid this test doesn't really prove what you are trying to prove. Satellite acquisition is not instantaneous - if you reboot your standalone GPS units you'll see that it takes anywhere from one to eight minutes for them to get all the satellites they need to start doing positioning work - it's the same with any device (well, any non-military device, anyhow).
    Yeah, but the Pre doesn't even let it wait for long (in the ##GPS# menu at least), it times out after a minute or so.

    And the GPS devices I used in comparison both having been used for like a year and I pulled their batteries before testing.

    But, it seems that others are reporting that it does work properly, which I'm glad to hear.
  3. #43  
    Oh no, not the agps argument again. Agps doesn't, by definition, rule out the fact that it has a standalone capability.
  4.    #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by leez View Post
    And, for the record, airlines which allow GPS use onboard. Now, granted, you wouldn't be able to view your google maps without a data connection, BUT, with the number of airlines rolling out on-board WiFi, it could be useful.

    Airlines which APPROVE/DISPROVE GPS use in Flight
    Damn... I don't see Oceanic Air on that list...

    (Sorry, been on a bit of a Lost kick lately, been rewatching from the beginning since there's not much on for the summer. )
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScrapMaker View Post
    Oh no, not the agps argument again. Agps doesn't, by definition, rule out the fact that it has a standalone capability.
    I think I pretty much have laid out the definitive answer to the question in my previous post:


    gpsOne can operate in 4 modes:

    • Standalone - Your handset has no connection to the network, and uses only the GPS satellite signals it can currently receive to try and establish a location.
    • MS Based - Your handset is connected to the network, and uses the GPS signals + a location signal from the network.
    • MS Assisted - Your handset is connected to the network, uses GPS signals + a location signal then relays its 'fix' to the server, which then uses the signal strength from your phone to the network towers to further plot your position. You can still maintain voice communication in this scenario, but not 'Internet/Network service' ie Web Browser, IM, streaming TV etc..
    • MS Assisted/Hybrid - Same as above, but network functionality remains. Normally only in areas with exceptional coverage.
  6. #46  
    Yup A-GPS, in general, means full standalone and assisted mode as well.

    gpsOne definitely has the features you listed, same as the HTC Touch for Sprint.

    What's funny, is Sprint never set up the Touch to really use these settings, even though we had some registry changes that supposedly turned on certain modes, it never worked well. I could never get a lock in this server room, ever. My friend's Instinct could.

    My Pre gets a lock in here in about 2 seconds. Amazing.
  7. #47  
    well I was talking on my Pre and driving this past weekend to Florida on a trip i had planned. Thought i was losing my mind when i saw myself on my Pre's GPS (Sprint Navigation program) driving down interstate 85 and talking at the same time.

    that seemed pretty standalone to me. So deesugar's post is very on point. needless to say i bragged to my buddies the whole way there
    "I have to return some videotapes."
  8. #48  
    Tested GPS in airplane mode from my current location (work) and got a fix. There does appear to be some standalone component, and a fairly accurate one at that.
    Palm III -> Palm M100 -> Palm VII -> Tmobile MDA (The 3 year mistake) -> Palm Pre

    Hello, Palm. Good to have you back. Let's just pretend that the whole "me leaving you for WinMo" thing never happened, OK?
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by KnightZero77 View Post
    Tested GPS in airplane mode from my current location (work) and got a fix. There does appear to be some standalone component, and a fairly accurate one at that.
    The only accurate test like this would be to put it in airplane mode and then start walking around. If the location updates, we're good to go.

    Just finding you is not enough, since it could have been cached from before you turned it off. We already know that the Pre caches your location quite often.
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScrapMaker View Post
    The only accurate test like this would be to put it in airplane mode and then start walking around. If the location updates, we're good to go.

    Just finding you is not enough, since it could have been cached from before you turned it off. We already know that the Pre caches your location quite often.
    What exactly are you trying to "test"? The specs say it indeed has a stand alone GPS mode. Is it you don't believe the manufactures spec sheet or something???
  11. mfive's Avatar
    Posts
    186 Posts
    Global Posts
    193 Global Posts
    #51  
    The pre has a standalone gps. End of story.

    I confirmed this last weekend in a remote lake/cottage drive where I couldn't make calls or even send sms messages. I was shocked, however, (and relieved) to find that I was able to continue using my GPS all the way to the cottage in the middle of nowhere.
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    The pre has a standalone gps. End of story.

    I confirmed this last weekend in a remote lake/cottage drive where I couldn't make calls or even send sms messages. I was shocked, however, (and relieved) to find that I was able to continue using my GPS all the way to the cottage in the middle of nowhere.
    Yup, this confirms that sprint navigation downloads map basics beforehand...
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by deesugar View Post
    What exactly are you trying to "test"? The specs say it indeed has a stand alone GPS mode. Is it you don't believe the manufactures spec sheet or something???
    The reason why people wanted definitive tests, is that Palm has a different definition of standalone GPS than the industry standard. They don't agree with the definition given by other device makers, what you see on publications from technical papers to wikipedia.

    Palm's position is they can call a device standalone GPS even when the device has a carrier network dependence for GPS to work (IE in the case of Sprint only working on 5% of the globe as opposed to actual standalone which works on 99%-100% of the globe).

    AGPS does not mean standalone, and aGPS only, as Palm has made on other devices, has significant drawbacks over Standalone + aGPS.

    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    The pre has a standalone gps. End of story.
    I confirmed this last weekend in a remote lake/cottage drive where I couldn't make calls or even send sms messages. I was shocked, however, (and relieved) to find that I was able to continue using my GPS all the way to the cottage in the middle of nowhere.
    To be a valid test for Standalone GPS you would to have needed to reset your phone.
    Last edited by aero; 06/26/2009 at 04:37 PM.
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by rc46 View Post
    What good would it be if it were stand alone? You would not have any maps or applications that could access it without a data connection.
    Well lots of people like to tag their pictures with GPS coordinates. One will see such programs a freeware on the pre very shortly. There are many of free applications for uses that use location and GPS on mobile phones.

    Having a smartphone that won't do standalone GPS is definitely a lower value than one that will
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    AGPS does not mean standalone, and aGPS only, as Palm has made on other devices, has significant drawbacks over Standalone + aGPS.
    Depends on who you ask. Most people would say that aGPS MEANS it is a standalone GPS solution that is 'assisted' by outside sources.

    gpsOne does just that.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScrapMaker View Post
    Depends on who you ask. Most people would say that aGPS MEANS it is a standalone GPS solution that is 'assisted' by outside sources.

    gpsOne does just that.
    NO...NO ONE says that except for Palm. ONLY Palm claims they can cripple the GPS and force it to aGPS only (walled garden) and advertise "Standalone"

    Everyone else says standalone means absolutely no network dependence.

    There is no disagreement except for Palm. Only one single entity out of hundreds of papers, publications, product specs, definitions etc. Only Palm claims that aGPS alone is standalone GPS.

    We have been over this with the Palm 800w which turned out to have its standalone disabled.

    It doesn't "depend."

    "most people" do not think aGPS is not standalone -- you are confused and incorrect -- seriously.
  17. #57  
    I just found this thread, after creating two basically saying the same thing - but this thread has gotten more attention.

    I was in Europe from the 9th to the 23rd. Every single day I used my phone to take pics and upload to facebook on wifi hotspots.

    I can say with certainty that GPS does not work without a network connection. I tried it several times on two different Pre's (my wife's as well).

    There is no cell coverage for a Sprint Pre in europe (obviously), so it's interesting that the only time I could get my GPS apps to show new coordinates was when I was on WiFi. It would take the fix of the WiFi hotspot center/ISP.

    For example: On a ferry across the baltic Sea, I went outside on the boat deck to open sky several times and tried to acquire a GPS signal. It always gave errors or showed the last GPS fix. If I connected to the boats WiFi signal it would work, but it would tell me I was in the City the boat's home was in.

    Pressing ##GPS# WITHOUT a wifi connection always gave the last coordinates the phone had.

    As soon as I arrived in Atlanta airport on the 23rd, it immediately acquired a very accurate GPS lock.

    I find this very disappointing. I was planning to take lots of geotagged pics and make an album on Picassa showing where I was. I was twittering and trying to insert my location, which never worked.

    Hopefully this can be fixed through software.
    Last edited by Beanis; 06/26/2009 at 05:11 PM.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    NO...NO ONE says that except for Palm. ONLY Palm claims they can cripple the GPS and force it to aGPS only (walled garden) and advertise "Standalone"

    Everyone else says standalone means absolutely no network dependence.

    There is no disagreement except for Palm. Only one single entity out of hundreds of papers, publications, product specs, definitions etc. Only Palm claims that aGPS alone is standalone GPS.

    We have been over this with the Palm 800w which turned out to have its standalone disabled.

    It doesn't "depend."

    "most people" do not think aGPS is not standalone -- you are confused and incorrect -- seriously.
    wikipedia:

    "Assisted GPS, generally abbreviated as A-GPS, enhances the startup performance of a GPS satellite-based positioning system. It is used extensively with GPS-capable cellular phones as its development was accelerated by the U.S. FCC's 911 mandate making the location of a cell phone available to emergency call dispatchers.[1]"

    This argument is getting old.
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by Beanis View Post
    I just found this thread, after creating two basically saying the same thing - but this thread has gotten more attention.

    I was in Europe from the 9th to the 23rd. Every single day I used my phone to take pics and upload to facebook on wifi hotspots.

    I can say with certainty that GPS does not work without a network connection. I tried it several times on two different Pre's (my wife's as well).

    There is no cell coverage for a Sprint Pre in europe (obviously), so it's interesting that the only time I could get my GPS apps to do anything was when I was on WiFi. It would take the fix of the WiFi hotspot center/ISP.

    For example: On a ferry across the baltic Sea, I went outside on the boat deck to open sky several times and tried to acquire a GPS signal. It always gave errors or showed the last GPS fix. If I connected to the boats WiFi signal it would work, but it would tell me I was in the City the boat's home was in.

    Pressing ##GPS# WITHOUT a wifi connection always gave the last coordinates the phone had.

    As soon as I arrived in Atlanta airport on the 23rd, it immediately acquired a very accurate GPS lock.

    I find this very disappointing. I was planning to take lots of geotagged pics and make an album on Picassa showing where I was. I was twittering and trying to insert my location, which never worked.

    Hopefully this can be fixed through software.
    Well it tends to work without signal in the U.S. -- in telenav, at least.

    What is possible is that the "awareness" of the location in the Pre is updated via triangulation from the towers. This would save power, instead of ALWAYS having the GPS chip on. We would have to understand this aspect of it to really know why you could not get a GPS coordinate for your pictures.

    I'd like to see a test where there is no signal, (not airplane mode,) but you got WIFI, so you could use telenav.... and you could see if it activates the GPS chip... unless there is a 3rd-party navigation program I don't know about.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScrapMaker View Post
    Well it tends to work without signal in the U.S. -- in telenav, at least.

    What is possible is that the "awareness" of the location in the Pre is updated via triangulation from the towers. This would save power, instead of ALWAYS having the GPS chip on. We would have to understand this aspect of it to really know why you could not get a GPS coordinate for your pictures.

    I'd like to see a test where there is no signal, (not airplane mode,) but you got WIFI, so you could use telenav.... and you could see if it activates the GPS chip... unless there is a 3rd-party navigation program I don't know about.
    I did try that while in Europe. I turned Airplane mode off and ran google maps and sprint telenav. Telenav just outright said it wouldn't work. Google maps showed the last GPS location I had (if wifi was off) or showed the area I was in with a large circle around it (if wifi was on).

    I think the Pre's software only fires up the GPS chip second, only after getting a triangulation through towers. If it can't, it won't turn on the GPS chip at all. In fact, I would bet $100 that's what it does.

    In other words, when the Pre runs an app saying looking for location it goes something like this:

    Do I have a cell signal? If so, load my general location and activate GPS for more accuracy.

    If no cell signal, do I have a Wifi signal? If so, grab any location information from the ISP possible and leave GPS off.

    If no cell or Wifi signal, keep GPS off and display last known coordinates.
Page 3 of 10 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions