View Poll Results: Good Idea Battery Cover with Breather/Vent Holes

Voters
42. You may not vote on this poll
  • Great Idea

    14 33.33%
  • Horrible Stupid Idea... how dare you cut holes in my Pre!

    21 50.00%
  • Neither good nor bad

    7 16.67%
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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by gtkansan View Post
    battery cooling in high draw research equipment
    The problem is that a phone is far from "high draw". The situation is completely different.
  2.    #22  
    A heatsink wouldnt likely do much... The purpose of a heat sink in say a computer chip is to provide an easy pathway and enhanced surface area for the heat transfer.

    Think of it this way... No heat sink on a computer chip: heat transfer rate = (heat tranfer coefficient)*(temperature differential between air and chip)*(surface area).

    The purpose of the heat sink is to increase the surface area as much as possible. Since we have a phone in hand and wouldnt want a multipronged metal aparatus sticking out the phone, ill work with what I have .

    As for the holes, im not saying that they would be a magical cure all, im talking about mitigation. Even a 25% percent drop in the temperature change of the phone surface would make it bearable to hold while on a call.
  3. #23  
    What kind of amazing phone are you using that isn't "bearable to hold while on a call"?

    And I know what a heatsink does. Please don't berate me.
  4.    #24  
    The 'high draw' comment meant a highly localized source of heat that needs to be dissipated. In our case, that would be the battery. The outside temperature of the phone on the back while in a cell phone call (measured just now by thermocouple) is 102 degrees F. That is MUCH too high to be comfortable.

    Also, I am in a 70 degree F room, so the total T difference is 32 degrees F (and that is the phone surface, the battery will be much hotter than that), so the natural convection current that can be driven is significant.
  5. #25  
    I'm done arguing with you. It's obvious you're right and I'm wrong (in your mind). Go forth, wise one, and fix this mysterious non-existant problem that you seem to be having. Then make billions by selling it to mobile phone manufacturers. Or waste your time. Either way.
  6.    #26  
    Wow why such attitude? I am having a discussion, nothing more. You asked questions, I answered.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by jasonaward View Post
    What kind of amazing phone are you using that isn't "bearable to hold while on a call"?

    And I know what a heatsink does. Please don't berate me.

    Aww come on. No need to get defensive. I found his point very informative, yet debatable. Nobody is berating you but yourself.
  8.    #28  
    informative yet debatable?
  9. Loolaw's Avatar
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    #29  
    I'm not convinced that it would help because there is no way for air to pass through. My bigger concern, however, is more holes means more ways for dust and other debris to get in and gunk up the works
  10. #30  
    Debatable?.... Ummm... Not yet. I only have an 8th grade edamacation. Lemme git 10 years at college (or 90 days @ DeVry) then ill debate ya! :-)

    Seriously.. Yes debatable. Even though what you say is correct on the heat reduction and battery strenghs in corelation to the temperature, lets go outside the box.

    Consumers, 90% of time place their phone down where? On its back. On what? Palm can't risk the headline.. "design flaw" from some cooling vents that nobody else has. We tech savvy like to baby our Pre's but that's not what Palm is directly aiming for. It just so happens it wwnt more that way then they anticipated. So. Jane 'tinybop' Doe puts her phone down on water or anything for that matter.. Lets say 100 people do this. All of a sudden, its a design flaw.

    Hot batteries is nothing new. We need to update our battery tech within mobile devices. There is already new tech just not cost friendly.

    There. My weak debate.
    Last edited by JohnnyPre; 06/18/2009 at 03:04 PM.
  11. vkewalra's Avatar
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    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by gtkansan View Post
    The outside temperature of the phone on the back while in a cell phone call (measured just now by thermocouple) is 102 degrees F. That is MUCH too high to be comfortable.
    Huh, I have my shower set to that temp and I can stand in it for longer than I'm willing to hold a phone to my ear. I'm fairly sure the heated seats in my car turn up higher than 102 degrees, granted clothing insulates my **** from the heat somewhat.

    I don't want to get into the argument, I just don't think 102 degrees F is all that hot.
  12.    #32  
    The air doesnt need to pass through to provide extra cooling... The density gradient created by the temperature differential would in general create a recirculating air current. The air near the battery heats, and therefor expands, it moves towards the surface of the hole and in its wake draws fresh air down the channel. Look up a thermal jet and you will see the type of behavior I am refering to.
  13.    #33  
    Ok then it doesnt bother everyone else as much as it does me . We can leave it at that if you want, Ill post the results of the tests when i finish up boring out the surface.
  14. #34  
    Won't the holes make it hotter in your hands with the heat pouring out? It would cool the battery but generate more pertruding head?

    I'm just going to move into my freezer and forget all of you and your bickering! ( glance @ jason )
  15. nullity's Avatar
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    #35  
    How about an aluminum/copper battery cover with no additional holes? Sure, I wouldn't advise slathering your battery in Arctic Silver to conduct heat to the cover as if it was a true heatsink, but I'd wager just having a less insulative material than plastic as a cover would help a lot with heat dissipation.
    Last edited by nullity; 06/18/2009 at 03:14 PM. Reason: *no holes = no additional holes
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by gtkansan View Post
    Since seido is making an extended back for their bigger battery, perhaps we can all get them to make a battery door with some breather/vent holes over the battery to allow it to cool off better. This would keep the actual temperature of the battery down and make it so you could get through a phone call without burning your hand... Anyone agree?

    Anyone have a spare back cover (those who bought a touchstone Im looking at you) to allow me to experiment with? I have a good CNC mill and it wouldnt be hard to test out.
    In my experience the greatest heat doesnt come from the battery but from the daughterboard below it (processor?). If you could make something like this that meaningfully decreased the temperature of the Pre while maintaining touchstone compatibility I think you would be able to sell more then a few.

    Why not buy a couple touchstone backs test out your idea and call it an investment in a possible business opportunity?
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by nullity View Post
    How about an aluminum/copper battery cover with no additional holes? Sure, I wouldn't advise slathering your battery in Arctic Silver to conduct heat to the cover as if it was a true heatsink, but I'd wager just having a less insulative material than plastic as a cover would help a lot with heat dissipation.
    Might get a little heavy? Might increase the perceived heat since more of it will be radiated out to your hand and it might impact reception pretty badly.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by bryanharig View Post
    Might get a little heavy? Might increase the perceived heat since more of it will be radiated out to your hand and it might impact reception pretty badly.
    Not THAT heavy. A thin layer of copper foil right under the backplate with a mesh between it and the plastic might be enough to help a little. I'd experiment with that as it would be real simple to MacGuyver up, but a certain cell provider has me on a waiting list to even get a Pre.
  19. Mosbb's Avatar
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    #39  
    Next time you are going to make a LONG phone call, remove the battery cover.
    Make your long phone call and you will see that the phone still gets HOT!

    So holes or no holes it won't help. There are no moving parts in there that "blow" hot air for us to have to drill holes to let the hot air out.

    My nokia E71 also got very hot, and other phones do the same.
    And as far as drilling holes and than being worried that dust/debri getting in there to "mess" up the phone, it WONT. I guess most of you have not taken phones apart, there are no moving parts. You can put sand it there and the phone will still work. People over think this stuff.
  20. #40  
    Holes may help get rid of some heat a little bit, but there is already some room where the hinges are for heat to escape.

    If anything, putting holes in the battery cover will just help more humidity/salt watery air/rain etc. to get into the exposed circuity behind the cover.

    Open air + Bare electronic connections = always bad juju.
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