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  1. msb
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    #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobra977 View Post
    I will agree with you to a point. However, my company's EAS configuration is certainly not "unique" (which implies one of a kind). I don't know the numbers, but go read some of the comments posted on the EAS support story on precentral's homepage and elsewhere, and I think you will retract your characterization of this configuration as "unique." Also, you refer to the lack of this capability like it was something trivial... like "no playlist in landscape mode." This is supposedly a revolutionary, high-end smartphone. Yet it can't sync email and calendars for a large segment of corporate exchange users. This is not some revolutionary new capability that we shouldn't expect to work out of the box. It's pretty basic stuff. And its absence is certainly no trivial matter to these users. For most, it's a show-stopper. Upon reflection, I think you will relate a little better to my conclusion when viewed from that perspective. From other perspectives, yes, I can see how my conclusion sounded harsh.
    Well, feel free to parse the meaning of unique - perhaps I should have used "non-standard" or "uncommon" or "specific" - but it doesn't change what I said. I feel your frustration, but your conclusion that the phone is not ready for prime time based on this lack of support is simply not founded.

    Do you think the iPhone or Blackberry are ready for prime time? I'm sure I could find missing support for some basic feature that some segment of the users feel is a dealbreaker on each of these phones. Do you think they would be correct in saying that these phone are "not ready for prime time"?

    You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but that doesn't make it correct.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobra977 View Post
    I will agree with you to a point. However, my company's EAS configuration is certainly not "unique" (which implies one of a kind). I don't know the numbers, but go read some of the comments posted on the EAS support story on precentral's homepage and elsewhere, and I think you will retract your characterization of this configuration as "unique." Also, you refer to the lack of this capability like it was something trivial... like "no playlist in landscape mode." This is supposedly a revolutionary, high-end smartphone. Yet it can't sync email and calendars for a large segment of corporate exchange users. This is not some revolutionary new capability that we shouldn't expect to work out of the box. It's pretty basic stuff. And its absence is certainly no trivial matter to these users. For most, it's a show-stopper. Upon reflection, I think you will relate a little better to my conclusion when viewed from that perspective. From other perspectives, yes, I can see how my conclusion sounded harsh.
    Actually, if I recall correctly from the leaked internal Sprint manual, it spoke of making sure not to sell the phone to the wrong people. For business users, who had IT security, EAS, etc. they recommended that sales people refer them to the Pro, instead of the Pre. This information came out prior to the launch of the Pre. In any event, I'm happy you discovered it didn't meet your needs prior to walking out the door, as I'm sure the restocking fee would've really made your blood boil.
    All for One and One for All!
  3. cobra977's Avatar
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       #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSB View Post
    Well, feel free to parse the meaning of unique - perhaps I should have used "non-standard" or "uncommon" or "specific" - but it doesn't change what I said. I feel your frustration, but your conclusion that the phone is not ready for prime time based on this lack of support is simply not founded.

    Do you think the iPhone or Blackberry are ready for prime time? I'm sure I could find missing support for some basic feature that some segment of the users feel is a dealbreaker on each of these phones. Do you think they would be correct in saying that these phone are "not ready for prime time"?

    You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but that doesn't make it correct.
    Again, my company's EAS configuration is not "non-standard", and it's not "uncommon." You continue to portray this as a trivial, fringe issue. It is not, and I think Palm's public statement on the issue is testament to that.

    Second, I don't think, "not ready for prime time" is really all that harsh. Had I said the device is worthless and always will be... I could understand your reaction. I left open that it may be ready for prime time at some point in the future, and that it is currently ready for NON-prime time... meaning non-mission-critical applications.

    Third, yes, from my perspective, any BB or WM device is ready for prime time, i.e. ready for mission-critical business communications applications. If "primetime" for you means a finger-happy, iPhone-like UI, with no scroll wheel or stylus, and the promise of apps galore, then fine. That's certainly a valid viewpoint also. I was hoping the Pre would be the device that finally bridges that gap. But, at least for now, it is not.

    Last, opinions are neither correct nor incorrect. They are just opinions, and this forum, by design, is full of them. So, feel free to state your alternative viewpoint (which you have already made abundantly clear). But don't label my opinion as "incorrect." It is quite valid from my perspective and that of other exchange users who were so massively disappointed by the lack of complete EAS support at launch.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobra977 View Post
    ...
    For most, it's a show-stopper. Upon reflection, I think you will relate a little better to my conclusion when viewed from that perspective. From other perspectives, yes, I can see how my conclusion sounded harsh.
    (My emphasis added). I'm sorry, but just as MSB misused the word "unique", you are misusing the word "most".

    While this missing ability may be a problem, "most" of the Pre owners (and potential market) do not need it. Most Exchange servers are 2003 servers which don't even have that capability. Most potential buyers don't care one way or the other about the security measures on EAS.

    That's most likely the reason we didn't see them in initially.

    That said, I hope Palm can add the functionality, as long as it doesn't remove the ability to attach to multiple Exchange servers.
  5. #45  
    you should have seen the BB Storm at launch!! while email was functional... the phone itself was not! Verry laggy OS, barley usable, crashes, memory leaks, unresponsive touch screen, 5 minute boot time, battery drain issues... that phone wasnt ready for prime time at all... but it was mostly hardware. Took RIM and their HUGE pockets 6 months to come out with first update.. yea there were leaked Beta OS's but only a small number of users downloaded thm.. remember the "masses" aren't that bright.

    But i can say this phone at launch is MUCH stronger then the BB Storm was.. Maybee you'll give the Pre another shot in 3 months?
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by antonio3 View Post
    But i can say this phone at launch is MUCH stronger then the BB Storm was.. Maybee you'll give the Pre another shot in 3 months?
    I hope everyone will, considering they've had the most feature-packed initial (first gen) launch of a new OS and hardware, ever.

    Remember that iPhone 1 lacked exchange entirely... We've come a long way, and it's taken them a heck of a long time to get everything straight. Palm will fix this within 60 days. Stop whining, seriously.
    Palm III -> Visor Prism -> Dell Axim X30 Hi -> HTC Apache -> HTC Mogul -> HTC Touch Pro

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  7. msb
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    #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by osidak View Post
    Why I am happy - as they said I was all set to go and then the day before I double checked and they said they would not honor what we had already agreed to. And no I would not make an exception for myself either. I have a company issued phone for that.
    Yes, but why "happy"? Makes no sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by osidak View Post
    Oh and for you information IT does everything for a reason - sorry if it prevents you from goofing off when you should be working but things are not just done arbitrarily
    Right. Anybody that's worked in an corporate environment for longer than 5 minutes knows this is a completely silly statement.
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by zyxwv88 View Post
    I disagree on the EAS part. If you are in an IT shop that won't give you an exception on the security policies, then no, you should wait until it fully supports it. I'm the exchange admin for my company, and I've got an exception set for myself, and will set an exception for anyone in the company that gets a pre until EAS support is there.
    My palm OS 755p and centro supported multiple exchange accounts.
  9. #49  
    Your Palm devices were also supported by an OS that had been out for a significant period of time. Not the same here at all.
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       #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    (My emphasis added). I'm sorry, but just as MSB misused the word "unique", you are misusing the word "most".

    While this missing ability may be a problem, "most" of the Pre owners (and potential market) do not need it.
    If you re-read my original statement that you quoted out of context, you will see that I was not referring to "most Pre owners." I was referring to the subset of corporate exchange users who - like me - have discovered that they cannot sync their work email and calendars. I stand by my statement that "most" of THOSE users (and/or THOSE potential users) will find this to be a show-stopper.
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by MSB View Post
    Yes, but why "happy"? Makes no sense.


    Right. Anybody that's worked in an corporate environment for longer than 5 minutes knows this is a completely silly statement.

    Happy cause now I am not dealing with what is quickly turning into a dud of phone.

    And you apparently have never worked in the realm of IT
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    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by nws0291 View Post
    Yep this is a known issue and has been since day 1. It sucks for people with that policy set. Palm said the fix will be here within 60 days.
    Do you mind posting a source for the "fix will be here within 60 days"? I'm really interested in locating some real facts on what will be fixed/added to the Pre.

    I constantly see users posting that this or that will be in an update or that they hope this or that will be in an update. It would be real nice to see a list of what Palm intends to add/fix.

    Thanks.

    Joe
  13. msb
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    #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by osidak View Post
    Happy cause now I am not dealing with what is quickly turning into a dud of phone.

    And you apparently have never worked in the realm of IT
    This is a dead-end conversation. You said you were "happy Sprint lied" - and that makes no sense in whatever context you try to put it in, so I give up trying to understand.

    If you are representative of your IT department, then I suspect you have a lot of frustrated users. Good luck to them.
  14. msb
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    #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobra977 View Post
    If you re-read my original statement that you quoted out of context, you will see that I was not referring to "most Pre owners." I was referring to the subset of corporate exchange users who - like me - have discovered that they cannot sync their work email and calendars. I stand by my statement that "most" of THOSE users (and/or THOSE potential users) will find this to be a show-stopper.
    So you think Palm should have pushed back their release date because the majority of a sub-set of a percentage of users will find this lack of support a show-stopper? I don't - and this number is even further reduced to the ones that buy a Pre in the time frame between launch and when they get this working. For the rest (I suggest MOST) they will never have known it was an issue at all.
  15. #55  
    ok MSB - guess I really have to spell it out for you.

    If sprint had not lied (about fixing an issue with my yearly S|P upgrade) to me I would have spent the money on 6/6 to purchase the pre - However they did lie to me and thus I was not able/willing to spend the $475 they wanted.

    So after all the issues that have come up since the Pre launched I am happy Sprint Customer Service sucks and that they lied to me about having everything worked out for me to purchase the Pre at $199 instead of the $475.

    And no - actually the users in my shop are very happy with the service I provide as the network is stable and they rarely have issues and can complete their jobs as they are expected to. I provide them with the tools they NEED.

    But you are right - this is a dead conversation as you are clearly one of those that thinks the Pre can have no negatives and if anyone says that it does they are simple out of touch with the rest of the world, and beside the iPhone sucked at launch. In reality it was a great idea that fell WAY short of the hopes of consumers and Palm alike. Poor choices where made at many levels I am sure. This phone in it's current state will not save Palm and may actually prove to be the mortal blow.

    I personally do not care if the iPhone was no better on launch - I would not and will not purchase a $500 phone to help them beta test the hardware AND software. If Palm has enough cash to continue to develop their O/S and come out with better hardware, I am all for it. Until then good luck and have fun. Hope your screen doesn't start cracking from the inside.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by jack87 View Post
    My palm OS 755p and centro supported multiple exchange accounts.
    I suspect we're talking different things. Did your Palm 755p support multiple Exchange servers using EAS?
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobra977 View Post
    If you re-read my original statement that you quoted out of context, you will see that I was not referring to "most Pre owners." I was referring to the subset of corporate exchange users who - like me - have discovered that they cannot sync their work email and calendars. I stand by my statement that "most" of THOSE users (and/or THOSE potential users) will find this to be a show-stopper.
    And on that, Sprint (and presumedly Palm) agree. That's why Sprint employees were instructed to qualify customers and not sell the Pre to those that had that need.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by osidak View Post
    ...
    This phone in it's current state will not save Palm and may actually prove to be the mortal blow.
    ...
    What an outrageously simpleton (and myopic) statement. Because it doesn't suit your needs, it won't save Palm?

    Have you seen their stock lately?
  19. #59  
    myopic - had you read the number of people either having to swap their phones or ditching them all together because of issues

    their stock has gone up ~ $1.12 or ~8% since they launched. Give the phone a month on the market before you say "have you seen their stock"

    The phone would suit my needs if it performed the functions that it can do reliably.
  20. msb
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    #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by osidak View Post
    myopic - had you read the number of people either having to swap their phones or ditching them all together because of issues

    their stock has gone up ~ $1.12 or ~8% since they launched. Give the phone a month on the market before you say "have you seen their stock"
    But you've got no problem signing Palms death certificate after hearing a few anecdotal reports in an online forum, eh? Kinda funny.
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