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  1. #341  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gekko View Post
    why are you in the Official 'I'm returning my Pre!' [Because] thread then?
    I didn't mean stop this thread, I just would appreciate if you kept this to here rather than going into other topics and continuing to rant in them. I am completely fine with you doing as you please in your own topic
  2. #342  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gekko View Post
    but the salt in the wound stings that much more for long time PalmOS users. because this is the company that we knew and loved for 10+ years setting the standard for PIM and Contacts and Calendar management. and they threw 10+ years of history and what made them successful right out of the window. i don't expect great PIM from Apple or BB - i expected it from Palm.

    and i'm not saying live in the past. clearly Palm had to make some changes - but Colligan should have said - "change whatever you want, but do not materially F with the basic core functionality/beauty/simplicity/zen/efficiency/productivity of the PIMs!"
    I get you on that. I really do.

    I will add this. Palm didn't seem to "finish" (or provide a gold version of) any aspect of webOS yet no matter if your looking at it from PIM point of view, media point of view, apps, games, use as phone, etc.

    Name a feature and it needs improvement.

    Name some standard features and they're missing. Voice recorder? Video recorder? Etc.

    So yes, i understand your business needs gripes. But keep in mind that nothing is really that finished and updates will be needed to address just not PIM but the rest as well. But i do agree they should've nailed what they're known for a bit better.

    You have to think of this as a beta right now, but with a phone, you are paying for it. The benefit is being an early adopter and all that.
  3. Loolaw's Avatar
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    #343  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gekko View Post
    of course. but fanboys don't have a lot on their calendars so why would they care?
    This is where you lose credence. I am an outsourcing account manager with 5 sites around the US. I rely heavily on my calendar and task entries to get me through any day. While I agree that NOTHING has so far been able to hold up to the traditional POS, I am not willing to get stuck with a dead app and no where to go for support. I like the Pre for many things, but like you find the PIM features lacking when I try to do things the way I've always done them.

    For now -- 30 days at least -- I wll try to acclimate myself with the current tools and see if I can make them work for me (just the way I once had to discover how to make Palm PIM apps workable). Things are better today than they were yesterday. It is, unfortunately, starting from scratch which is painful, but I'm optimistic.

    Definitely not a fangirl -- I've been lured from Palm in the past. Honestly didn't think the Pre form would work for me but after test driving I was pulled in and am so far very happy with my experience.
  4. #344  
    There is a serious problem with reception on the pre and i dont know if its sprints end or palms end but it is there. With my Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 755, blackberry curve all PERFECT at my home, but with the pre all i get is about 3 bars TOPS on a good moment.
  5. #345  
    I returned both of mine - first and second one (first's replacement) had the same problems, that is constant overheating and battery dead after 4 hours.

    Sorry PALM...but noone should have to go through this experience..spending this amount of money for defective phones is unacceptable. It just makes me wonder how much testing went into this phone before it was released!
  6. #346  
    Quote Originally Posted by cooneyca View Post
    This is where you lose credence. I am an outsourcing account manager with 5 sites around the US. I rely heavily on my calendar and task entries to get me through any day. While I agree that NOTHING has so far been able to hold up to the traditional POS, I am not willing to get stuck with a dead app and no where to go for support. I like the Pre for many things, but like you find the PIM features lacking when I try to do things the way I've always done them.

    For now -- 30 days at least -- I wll try to acclimate myself with the current tools and see if I can make them work for me (just the way I once had to discover how to make Palm PIM apps workable). Things are better today than they were yesterday. It is, unfortunately, starting from scratch which is painful, but I'm optimistic.

    Definitely not a fangirl -- I've been lured from Palm in the past. Honestly didn't think the Pre form would work for me but after test driving I was pulled in and am so far very happy with my experience.
    now this is where you lose credence. i've been using Palms EXCLUSIVELY since 1999. unlike you, i NEVER left. why? because of the PIMs. with the PIMs now gone, i have no reason to stay - unless they keep PalmOS around (which is doubtful) but then i'm stuck with an antiquated OS with great PIMs.

    and with great PIM applications, you don't have to "force" or "make them workable" or "acclimate" yourself to them. they should be intuitive and beautifully easy right out of the box. in 1999 i bought my first real PDA - a MS WINCE. a played with it for a day and thought it was awful. i took it back and got a Palm III and never looked back. it was so intuitive that RIGHT AWAY - IMMEDIATELY i could use easily use them. millions of people felt the same way which led to Palm's initial success. the magic was in the PIMs - and still is for real business users. and that's all gone now.
  7. #347  
    question for all - are we all paying the price for a BETA product that was necessarily RUSHED to the marketplace?

    Rubinstein scrapped several products in the pipeline and put the company on a path to design a novel handset in 15 months instead of the usual 18-month development cycle. The device needed to appeal at once to corporations as well as consumers, something that neither the BlackBerry nor iPhone has done.

    How Palm Designed The Pre - Forbes.com
  8. #348  
    Quote Originally Posted by advocate2 View Post
    Brought mine back to Best Buy this morning. Absolute disaster getting things back to Verizon the way they were before. 5 hours so far.

    Tethering, and syncing to a computer rather than internet were my main problems. Didn't like the surface or keyboard but these were minor problems.
    the bottom line is that this phone is not for business users and is not in the Palm tradition. A company called Palm is making the Pre, but the phone and software are only distant, very distant cousins from prior Palm devices.

    My view is that the company was going broke, they sold their software to stay alive and then brought in some Apple folks to create an Iphone competitor. It was not about continuing the Palm tradition, it was about survival.

    In what way, if any, does the Pre resemble older palm devices?

    Yes. They both have keyboards. On the old phones you could use either the stylus or your finger. No longer. No more pinpoint touching with a stylus. Finger touch sensitivity only.

    I waited a long time for Palm to improve upon prior phones. They didn't. They through the baby out with the bathwater. I am sad because I know that my 755p will become a dinasoar and become extinct.
    I completely disagree. Small and mid-sized businesses in particular today do not want to have to worry about setting up specialized servers or managing constantly updating desktop clients and sync cables; they want a mobile workforce with whom they can communicate quickly and conveniently. While the Pre still has some software deficits (most notably memos!), Palm has once again looked at how users actually *use* smartphones, and for what purposes, in designing the Pre. Combining physical keyboard, multitouch screen and compact size with the multitasking WebOS and easy-to-use development environment (once the SDK gets widely released, of course!) was the right move, and fills the huge gap between corporate server-based BlackBerries and iTunes-tethered iPhones. {ProfJonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
  9. #349  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gekko View Post
    question for all - are we all paying the price for a BETA product that was necessarily RUSHED to the marketplace?

    (quotation from article snipped)
    I suspect it was rushed slightly to market to meet both Palm's promise of 1st half 2009 and Apple's WWDC plans, but the hardware is solid (other than some size quality control on a small number of batteries). The issues that have arisen have largely been software-driven (especially the battery life, mainly traced to Hotmail and AIM bugs) and Palm's choice of OTA updating means those can be quickly fixed. {ProfJonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
  10. Loolaw's Avatar
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    #350  
    Quote Originally Posted by ProfJonathan View Post
    I completely disagree. Small and mid-sized businesses in particular today do not want to have to worry about setting up specialized servers or managing constantly updating desktop clients and sync cables; they want a mobile workforce with whom they can communicate quickly and conveniently. While the Pre still has some software deficits (most notably memos!), Palm has once again looked at how users actually *use* smartphones, and for what purposes, in designing the Pre. Combining physical keyboard, multitouch screen and compact size with the multitasking WebOS and easy-to-use development environment (once the SDK gets widely released, of course!) was the right move, and fills the huge gap between corporate server-based BlackBerries and iTunes-tethered iPhones. {ProfJonathan}

    exactly -- IT at my company will no longer support any P-OS syncing. In fact they haven't done so for about 3 years now. I've also been a Palm user since 1999 - as Gekko mentioned he has been above -- but have recently found it necessary to venture out to find viable alternatives.
  11. #351  
    You so called lovers of the old Palm OS has gotten Palm nothing but the brink of being near bankrupt. So this fresh new design will appeal to the new savy business people of today and the future. It is not always about right now. Remember that. I look forward to being able to watch my Pre grow and grow each and everyday with updates and new apps. It's already begun, my battery life has improved dramatically since day one. Yesterday I went all day on a single charge. From 7am till 11pm and I still had 37% remaining. All good things are worth waiting for.
  12. #352  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I get you on that. I really do.

    I will add this. Palm didn't seem to "finish" (or provide a gold version of) any aspect of webOS yet no matter if your looking at it from PIM point of view, media point of view, apps, games, use as phone, etc.

    Name a feature and it needs improvement.

    Name some standard features and they're missing. Voice recorder? Video recorder? Etc.

    So yes, i understand your business needs gripes. But keep in mind that nothing is really that finished and updates will be needed to address just not PIM but the rest as well. But i do agree they should've nailed what they're known for a bit better.

    You have to think of this as a beta right now, but with a phone, you are paying for it. The benefit is being an early adopter and all that.
    Interesting that "video recorder" is a standard feature, when it was just announced this week by the supposed smartphone leader, namely Apple. The fact is that most of the "missing features" are software, and that Palm (by avoiding the mandatory vendor blessing that iPhone apps need) has once again set the stage for a tremendous wealth of apps, even those that compete with apps written by Palm, as it had with the original PalmOS. Hopefully, Palm will also take the best of 3rd party features (anyone remember Hackmaster and its many hacks, most of which were adopted as features in subsequent PalmOS releases) as WebOS evolves, raising the bar even further for developers. {ProfJonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
  13. #353  
    Quote Originally Posted by ProfJonathan View Post
    Interesting that "video recorder" is a standard feature, when it was just announced this week by the supposed smartphone leader, namely Apple.
    Sigh...I do get tired of people pointing to what Apple does. Video recording has been on Treo's for years. Voice too. It's standard just like cut n paste.

    I'm glad you're getting the point now that what Apple's 3.0 basically is doing is adding missing features that smartphone's have had for years.

    Yet, this is reality. I can gripe about it or live in it. Apple will, for all intents and purposes, reinvent or reignite video recording in smartphones. Palm, if they're savvy at all, will answer it. This isn't something we didn't see coming though so hopefully Palm was just waiting to see what they have to answer. Yet, Palm has stated over and over again that they are not looking to compete with Apple media wise. This may just be wishful assuming..
  14. #354  
    Quote Originally Posted by hermetics View Post
    I have been a phone junkie for a while now, from Iphone to Bolds and I can say for sure that this phone is not ready for prime time. No support for corporate email using RSA and unusable battery life for a typical work day means "Palm is out of business in a year". I must say that without a trackball like feature one handed operation is truly not easy; the same could be said for the Iphone but I digress.

    Blackberry has earned and continues to earn my respect......palm should take a lesson from BB and get their game right befroe they waste peoples time and money.
    Can't let this go without at least some response. First, did you see the disaster that was the release of the BlackBerry Storm? Second, BlackBerry works well in a corporate environment that can afford its server and support costs; for smaller and mid-sized businesses, those costs far outweigh any benefits. Pre is a better choice for them. {ProfJonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
  15. #355  
    Quote Originally Posted by crogs571 View Post
    The problem isn't the phone, it's the OS on a whole. So the EOS/Pixie or Pre2 would still put you in the same boat. Palm killed off an OS with a highly functional PIM and created a glorified multitasking dumphone OS that alienates many of its longtime PalmOS users. Regardless if we're not their target audience, it still seems like a dumb move to remove basic features people take for granted in a PIM. I used to be quite excited about the Pre, and now I'm down to just giving it a shot because it's new tech, and Sprint is my only option. I received a Pro today by mistake, and I actually started to consider keeping it. If the Pre goes back, I just might pick up the Pro or live with the Centro until an HTC or Samsung Android phone comes to Sprint.
    You've got to separate WebOS from its apps, just as the functionality of the PalmOS PIM apps does not make up for the increasingly overwhelmed PalmOS. I agree that Palm should (and will) provide PIM apps with at least the capability of those in PalmOS, but it has first created a platform on which such apps and so many more can run. {ProfJonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
  16. #356  
    Well this is my first post so here goes..... As I type this there are many Palm analyst and developers who are reading everyone of these post and compiling spreadsheets of every complaint and like and dislike of this new phone.. They use these medium of communication to improve there products for us... So keep on giving your opinions as this will only help in fast revisions of the problems you are having.. As for me I have never owned a smart phone but have been a avid Palm TX user for 5+ years.. I was at first going to be front and center getting this phone.. But now I am going to be patient and wait for the third part apps, tether and PC sync capabilities , msn mail support to be introduced before I take the plunge... Right now it won't completely replace my TX but in a month or two it will be much closer to doing just that...
  17. #357  
    I am totally bummed with the Pre. As a 16-year palm user it's unbelievable that the Pre has such horrible Task and Memo apps, not even usable. The tasks can't even be ordered by priority! Come on palm geez.

    I tried using Classic to run old-style Task manager but then last night the keyboard stopped working and I had to do a hard reset to make it work again. Even though I was backed up to Palm the PIM in the Classic app is not, so the Classic app basically became worthless as a bridge to hold me over until some Pre updates comes. Also I discovered that bookmarks are not backed up to Palm.

    Oh and the battery lasts 6 hours tops. I'm returning it and going back to my 755p for now. Then and iPhone or BB. Palm I gave you every chance I could, you blew it.
  18. #358  
    Quote Originally Posted by tangozebra View Post
    I am totally bummed with the Pre. As a 16-year palm user it's unbelievable that the Pre has such horrible Task and Memo apps, not even usable. The tasks can't even be ordered by priority! Come on palm geez.

    I tried using Classic to run old-style Task manager but then last night the keyboard stopped working and I had to do a hard reset to make it work again. Even though I was backed up to Palm the PIM in the Classic app is not, so the Classic app basically became worthless as a bridge to hold me over until some Pre updates comes. Also I discovered that bookmarks are not backed up to Palm.

    Oh and the battery lasts 6 hours tops. I'm returning it and going back to my 755p for now. Then and iPhone or BB. Palm I gave you every chance I could, you blew it.
    I gotta say I have to agree with you on some level. As much as I love the Pre, I was hoping for a little more "Palm" in WebOS, especially in the PIM department. For example, I can't seem to get my Pre to remind me of birthdays. How am I supposed to call a client and wish them a happy birthday if I'm not reminded?! And Tasks definitely need to be stepped up as well. The OS has a bunch of potential. I just came off an iPhone 3G, so living with these limitations was sort of a day-to-day thing if I ever used it for business. I'm hoping Palm shoots out some updates to resolve these problems.
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    #359  
    Mpidfjtysk
    Last edited by groovy; 06/10/2009 at 07:42 PM.
  20. #360  
    I am pretty confused by all the anger......am i the only person who has ever bought a brand new video game system, online video game, phone on launch day, first model year car...etc. I mean it JUST came out and no matter how much testing goes on you will never work out all the kinks at first. If i had reason to belive that Palm wasnt going to try and fix everything then i would be angry but this company is fighting for their survival i highly doubt most of these issues wont be addressed. You have a 1st gen product its going to have problems compared to your previous 10th gen PALM. Everyone needs to calm down and help each other out instead of freaking out.

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