Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 72
  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Judging by yesterdays financials, the Pre needs to be a big success, or Palm simply won't be able to survive. I would be a little concerned when buying a Palm phone wondering if they will still be around a year later to support it.
    I wouldn't worry. It only needs to be a big success on Sprint in the short term, and that's virtually a lock.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I wouldn't worry. It only needs to be a big success on Sprint in the short term, and that's virtually a lock.
    Its a lock the Pre will be a success?

    That's almost as crazy as people assuming its a lock Palm will support the Pre better than they have past products.
  3. #23  
    Assuming a launch with no real problems and no real defects or device killing bugs...then i would call it a lock.

    @Mobileman You seem to slam palm every chance you get. I know you use an iphone, have experienced others and probably have an interest in the Pre, but it gets old seeing the anti palm stuff.

    Just for kicks can you name anything you like about the Pre? Consider listing something you like over the iphone a bonus.

    FWIW, i've praised the iphone. I've also bashed palm when they deserve it which has been plenty. I'm getting a Pre, but its not a lock til i've given it a good try out. Not exactly getting rid of my iphone til then.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Assuming a launch with no real problems and no real defects or device killing bugs...then i would call it a lock.

    @Mobileman You seem to slam palm every chance you get. I know you use an iphone, have experienced others and probably have an interest in the Pre, but it gets old seeing the anti palm stuff.

    Just for kicks can you name anything you like about the Pre? Consider listing something you like over the iphone a bonus.

    FWIW, i've praised the iphone. I've also bashed palm when they deserve it which has been plenty. I'm getting a Pre, but its not a lock til i've given it a good try out. Not exactly getting rid of my iphone til then.
    Hey, my stalker is back!!! Hard to say what I like over the iPhone or Blackberry yet since nobody has touched the Pre.


    Things about the Pre that interests me..........
    1. notifications
    2. multitasking
    3. touchstone (though my electric toothbrush has been doing this for years)
    4. screen looks nice (wish it was bigger though)
    5. Its a new gadget (I love gadgets)


    Things about the Pre that I do not like..
    1. Synergy doesn't really interest me.
    2. Palm past support track record
    3. sliding keyboards
    4. small screen
    5. lack of itunes integration (my blackberry does this)
    6. concerned about battery life
    7. 3rd party apps in jscript probably wont be that great
    8. who knows if palm will be around in a year
    9. I hate Sprint with a passion
    10. The accordian calendar looks annoying
    11. No direct sync to outlook without cloud (maybe)
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    I've said that all along sort of. The Pre launching close to the iphone 3.0 will undoubtedly cause everyone to do comparisons and in so doing, create buzz for the Pre.

    Anyone doing iphone reviews will mention the Pre.
    Respectfully, I dont think that is supported at all by the evidence out there. I think it reflects a bias ( a POV bias, not a malicious or ignorant bias) from looking at Pre articles. Pre articles mostly mention iPhone, but the converse is not true, iphone articles do not in fact mention pre much.

    It isn't just the press, this forum itself has the Pre fans obsessed and fixated on iPhone, and looking at iphone forums, you simply don't see the converse.
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    4. People on Sprint (of which there are 50M or so) will have strong iPhone envy around the release of iPhone 3.0.
    more like 30 million if you take away prepaid and nextel PTT.
    Also I am a Sprint customer and have zero "iPhone envy."
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    6. Happy Sprint customers line up in droves to buy the Pre!
    People on Sprint contracts don't "line up".
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    Most sales people would say that you have to make the customer feel pain in their current situation and then show them how your product eases their pain.
    Maybe for snake oil it does, but not in much else. Brand matters.
    Quote Originally Posted by HChristianS View Post
    thats not new. It's been said many times before, Final testing begins April 1st.
    that rumor has some serious credibility problems now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mahootzki View Post
    Polishing, means finishing. They are doing final testing, and if they notice something they "polish" it.
    I work with software developers quite often and "polishing" usually means final is a few months away. It is a term used long before beta. Beta and follow up on a do or die complex device would be one month at least.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Its a lock the Pre will be a success?

    That's almost as crazy as people assuming its a lock Palm will support the Pre better than they have past products.
    Actually, the two have nothing to do with each other, but you seem proud of the comparison anyway.

    The Pre succeeding on Sprint is a virtual lock. It's a 49 million strong carrier devoid of a flagship feature phone. The Pre will sell incredibly well. I would put any amount of money I have on it.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Actually, the two have nothing to do with each other, but you seem proud of the comparison anyway.

    The Pre succeeding on Sprint is a virtual lock. It's a 49 million strong carrier devoid of a flagship feature phone. The Pre will sell incredibly well. I would put any amount of money I have on it.
    Sorry, just because you believe it, does not make it logical.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912
    The Pre succeeding on Sprint is a virtual lock. It's a 49 million strong carrier devoid of a flagship feature phone. The Pre will sell incredibly well. I would put any amount of money I have on it.
    You can really make such a bold claim before we even know how much they'll charge for it? Palm's track-record here hasn't been great, either, as they've usually tried to charge high, rather than appeal to the mass-market with a mass-market-friendly price. Now, I suspect this will be different, but given how bad their financial situation is, I don't know that they'll be in a position to gamble on taking too slim of a profit margin with the hopes of selling 10 million. Rather, they'll more likely try to get a somewhat decent profit margin, which could put them in a less competitive situation compared to the iPhone or other upcoming devices.
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Sorry, just because you believe it, does not make it logical.
    Well, that would be me, most of the tech media, Sprint, Wall Street (as evidenced by their stock buoyancy), their financiers at Elevation Partners...

    I'm pretty comfortable with who's on my side of this argument.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Well, that would be me, most of the tech media, Sprint, Wall Street (as evidenced by their stock buoyancy), their financiers at Elevation Partners...

    I'm pretty comfortable with who's on my side of this argument.
    Please show me the direct quote from each of these sources that say the Pre's success is "a lock". In fact, I will say that I have not read that at all. As for Wall Street, your right, they have never been wrong before.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Please show me the direct quote from each of these sources that say the Pre's success is "a lock".
    Don't be daft. Sprint is virtually betting the company on this, Wall Street's "direct quotes" come in the form of stock valuation, Elevation has put their money where their mouth is, and I'll leave it to you to comb through the vast volumes of gushing Pre coverage to get what you need.
  12. #32  
    Just to add to my last post...the financial position of Palm (and Sprint) does not bode well for the Pre's success. I remember how much promise the Tapwave Zodiac had (so much so that I started up a website - Tapland - around it). But the company didn't have enough cash to advertise or give them the clout they needed when trying to get big-name game developers to sign on.

    I think my fellow Treo users here aren't taking a realistic view of the outside world. Sure, we know about the Pre, and even engadget knows about the Pre, but how much of the mass-market really even knows about? Heck, Sprint customer service still gets confused and thinks you're talking about the Treo Pro.

    I somewhat agree with the sentiment that a lot of people who are interested in the iPhone will look to see what their carrier of choice has to offer that's iPhone-like. But this will also benefit devices like the Instinct or any crappy large touchscreen knockoffs that come out. I've encountered many a person who has some crappy iPhone-like device. They aren't the type who research things to death or compare the user-experiences of several devices first-hand. They see the pretty big screen, and think it's "just like an iPhone" and is cheaper and/or on their network of choice, so they get it. I suspect that the Pre will cost more than the Instinct at launch (and there's a new Instinct coming out on Sprint), so that won't work to Palm's benefit.

    Will Palm have enough cash on hand to clobber the mass-market with a big television ad campaign comparable to what Apple can afford? Around the Pre's launch, I wouldn't be surprised to see more iPhone ads than Pre ads. Apple can afford it.

    At the time of the Pre's release, the Pre will be an infant: still buggy, very little 3rd party apps and accessories available, and available only in the USA and only on Sprint. Whereas the iPhone will be on 3.0 software, may even have new hardware available, has tons and tons of 3rd party apps and accessories available, and is available outside the USA.

    I know this sounds like I'm bashing Palm here. That's not my intent. I really hope they are successful. I may want a Pre and, even if I decide to get an iPhone (or something else) as my next phone, I'd like the Pre to be successful so as to add competitive pressure to Apple and AT&T.
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Don't be daft. Sprint is virtually betting the company on this, Wall Street's "direct quotes" come in the form of stock valuation, Elevation has put their money where their mouth is, and I'll leave it to you to comb through the vast volumes of gushing Pre coverage to get what you need.

    The Pre might have impressed people technically at CES, but no one is foolish enough (except you) to call it's success a lock. You would think you could produce at least 1 quote.

    By the way, there have been many companies that have backed products that have failed. Supplying investment money has never been, and should never be considered proof that the product will be successful.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    more like 30 million if you take away prepaid and nextel PTT.
    Also I am a Sprint customer and have zero "iPhone envy."

    People on Sprint contracts don't "line up".
    Maybe for snake oil it does, but not in much else. Brand matters.
    Ouch. Dissed by aero. Alright, well, you're the marketing guy. I defer.

    However, I have to debate one of your points. People on Sprint contracts do line up when they are eligible for the rebates on a new device. If you consider that at least one twelfth of those on contracts are eligible for a new device, there are potentially a lot of people who might form such a line. 30M/12=2.5M.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    The Pre might have impressed people technically at CES, but no one is foolish enough (except you) to call it's success a lock. You would think you could produce at least 1 quote.
    Since no one in a professional capacity has been posed the question whether or not this is the case, perhaps you are the foolish one to expect a direct quote.

    Actually, scratch "perhaps".

    By the way, there have been many companies that have backed products that have failed. Supplying investment money has never been, and should never be considered proof that the product will be successful.
    But the money is only provided when the company has the belief that it will be. I believe it, Elevation believes it, most of the tech and mainstream media believe it, Wall Street believes it, and you...do not. I'm more than comfortable standing with the vast majority here.

    But let's make this binding: Give me a timeframe, amount of revenue and/or sales figures. When we're agreed on each of those numbers, we can post them here for posterity, and one of us can have bragging rights down the road when the numbers show one of us to be full of it.

    If you'd like to put money on it, I'm down for that too.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by jbg7474 View Post
    Ouch. Dissed by aero. Alright, well, you're the marketing guy. I defer.

    However, I have to debate one of your points. People on Sprint contracts do line up when they are eligible for the rebates on a new device. If you consider that at least one twelfth of those on contracts are eligible for a new device, there are potentially a lot of people who might form such a line. 30M/12=2.5M.
    Not dissed. I think you are right on a number of points, Just a couple of points I disagreed with.

    And actually 1/24 per month given that two year contracts are the rule, only a limited number of people get a a 12 month discount and that discount is on average much less than half the 12/month discount.

    I also wanted to point out that although I don't have iphone envy I find the Pre quite compelling. Don't take my skepticism at some of the pre gushing or unsupported claims as an indication I am not glad about the entire thing. I am glad and hopeful for Palm, and especially for Sprint.
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Don't be daft. Sprint is virtually betting the company on this, Wall Street's "direct quotes" come in the form of stock valuation, Elevation has put their money where their mouth is, and I'll leave it to you to comb through the vast volumes of gushing Pre coverage to get what you need.
    I see that as "daft."
    Sprint isn't betting the company on it at all. it will be a fraction of their phone sales.
    It is palm that is betting the company, and guess what -- they had no other choice after destryiong their brand with failure to back up product.

    and palm's valuation does not indicate a runaway success, it indicated a measure of possible success after the company stock numbers were nearly penny stock. Palms stock numbers do not indicate a "lock".

    claiming that the tech press sees a lock is frankly and patently incorrect. Gizmodo and engadget laud pump and gush about myriad products that flop. the rest of the tech press is more circumspect given Sprint, and Palms history.

    What you have is a point of view problem similar to saying Mickey Rourke is back and is a "lock" for carrier success. When you are rock bottom a possibility of success is notable, newsworthy and increases your value -- it is no guarantee.

    to get back to the original posted article, the bad cash position does call into question Palms ability to market and support two new, untested and interdependent products, the Pre and WebOS, and this is compounded by the poor economic conditions/
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R View Post
    Just to add to my last post...the financial position of Palm (and Sprint) does not bode well for the Pre's success. I remember how much promise the Tapwave Zodiac had (so much so that I started up a website - Tapland - around it). But the company didn't have enough cash to advertise or give them the clout they needed when trying to get big-name game developers to sign on.

    I think my fellow Treo users here aren't taking a realistic view of the outside world. Sure, we know about the Pre, and even engadget knows about the Pre, but how much of the mass-market really even knows about? Heck, Sprint customer service still gets confused and thinks you're talking about the Treo Pro.

    I somewhat agree with the sentiment that a lot of people who are interested in the iPhone will look to see what their carrier of choice has to offer that's iPhone-like. But this will also benefit devices like the Instinct or any crappy large touchscreen knockoffs that come out. I've encountered many a person who has some crappy iPhone-like device. They aren't the type who research things to death or compare the user-experiences of several devices first-hand. They see the pretty big screen, and think it's "just like an iPhone" and is cheaper and/or on their network of choice, so they get it. I suspect that the Pre will cost more than the Instinct at launch (and there's a new Instinct coming out on Sprint), so that won't work to Palm's benefit.

    Will Palm have enough cash on hand to clobber the mass-market with a big television ad campaign comparable to what Apple can afford? Around the Pre's launch, I wouldn't be surprised to see more iPhone ads than Pre ads. Apple can afford it.

    At the time of the Pre's release, the Pre will be an infant: still buggy, very little 3rd party apps and accessories available, and available only in the USA and only on Sprint. Whereas the iPhone will be on 3.0 software, may even have new hardware available, has tons and tons of 3rd party apps and accessories available, and is available outside the USA.

    I know this sounds like I'm bashing Palm here. That's not my intent. I really hope they are successful. I may want a Pre and, even if I decide to get an iPhone (or something else) as my next phone, I'd like the Pre to be successful so as to add competitive pressure to Apple and AT&T.
    I agree with just about everything you've said -- and have myself said as much in the infamous "Skunk at Your Picnic" thread ...

    Launching an expensive new gadet is always a tricky enterprise -- even for well funded companies in prosperous times.

    Neither Palm nor these times, are prosperous -- and Palm is absolutely not well funded.

    They need to close every possible sale if they are to have success and survive ... (I hope they have both)
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    I see that as "daft."
    Sprint isn't betting the company on it at all. it will be a fraction of their phone sales.

    It is palm that is betting the company, and guess what -- they had no other choice after destryiong their brand with failure to back up product.

    and palm's valuation does not indicate a runaway success, it indicated a measure of possible success after the company stock numbers were nearly penny stock. Palms stock numbers do not indicate a "lock"...

    to get back to the original posted article, the bad cash position does call into question Palms ability to market and support two new, untested and interdependent products, the Pre and WebOS, and this is compounded by the poor economic conditions/

    yup aero -- dead on ...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    But the money is only provided when the company has the belief that it will be. I believe it, Elevation believes it, most of the tech and mainstream media believe it, Wall Street believes it, and you...do not. I'm more than comfortable standing with the vast majority here.

    But let's make this binding: Give me a timeframe, amount of revenue and/or sales figures. When we're agreed on each of those numbers, we can post them here for posterity, and one of us can have bragging rights down the road when the numbers show one of us to be full of it.

    If you'd like to put money on it, I'm down for that too.
    Again, I have yet to see "mainstream media and most of the tech media" say its a lock for success.

    I have no interest in betting you.
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions