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  1.    #141  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    First of all, you continuously make statements as if you were an official Palm employee. You are not, and therefore shouldn't speak as you are. You have no idea what Palm has taken into consideration and what they did not.
    You got me there, sir. I simply read statements from official Palm employees Jon Rubinstein, Roger McNamee (Elevation Partners owns a significant stake, so he can be included...) and Ed Colligan in which they repeatedly mentioned the Blackberry, iPhone, and Android at various times (and McNamee actually carries them all with him daily and pointed this out in a video interview). Why I would take this to mean that Palm took the entire market into consideration is a mystery for the ages, I guess?

    You have also not had any hands on time with the Pre so its hard for you to justify comments about what the Pre has achieved and what it has not.
    Well, again, you have me cold. I simply used my eyes to view demos proving that the Pre offers functionality not existent on other devices. I mean, I used the same eyes to read reports that are proof of iPhone sales and marketshare, but because I personally didn't verify each of their 20+ million supposed customers, we should probably take that with a grain of salt, too.

    Again, I offered my opinion as to why Palm should consider the competition in setting its release schedule. You clearly do not share my opinion. Lets just agree to disagree and move on
    And not only did I agree with you that Palm should consider the competition, but I just mentioned at the beginning of this post PROOF that they did. Where you are disagreeing with me is in whether they should consider a phantom release date of a phantom iPhone in setting the release schedule.

    And it's so odd to me that a man who seems to demand empirical proof so much - as you did in this very post I have quoted here - would then base the release of such an important device upon something with no substance or empirical proof behind it whatsoever.

    That's not opinion. That's you contradicting yourself. The agreement to disagree is occurring squarely within your own being.
  2. #142  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Wow, the same attack from the same person in multiple threads. Awesome, I have a stalker. I plan on buying a Pre. I also own a iPhone, and a Blackberry. If the iPhone was "the best ever" at everything I wouldn't also carry a blackberry. Are we not allowed to discuss any issues, questions, or anything else that we may not love about the Pre?
    LOL..i apologize. Wouldn't want you to think you've a stalker on you. I enjoy debates so i'll leave it at that.
  3. #143  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    HTC is doing just dandy. Windows Mobile as an OS is not. From Q3 of 2007 to Q3 of 2008, both RIM and Apple came from WAY behind to beat out WM in smartphone OS marketshare despite each offering far fewer models than all of the various Windows Mobile handset manufacturers.
    .
    Duh, that is called market segmentation. The point is WM is still growing. It is not as if it in decline. More people are buying windows mobile every single day.

    The third largest cell phone maker in the world just signed a deal to have WM on its upcoming smartphones.
  4. #144  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Doesn't really matter. There will still be lines at every Apple store when the next iPhone gets released, and it will be covered on news stations all across America. There will be nothing like this when the Pre gets released. It has a lot to do with brand excitement and loyalty. Apple has spent years building a strong relationship with its customers. Palm has spent years ruining its relationship with its customers.
    AppleInsider | Apple leads 2009 customer satisfaction survey
    That is the truth
  5. #145  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    FCC approval?
    Sprint testing?
    Sprint custom ROMs?
    Marketing setup?

    Think about it.
    FCC approval is typically done six to three months before launch. Palm isn't workign on that, ti is done. Don't confuse public release of FCC approval with actual testing and approval.

    Sprint will be doing almost all the marketing, not Palm.
  6.    #146  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Duh, that is called market segmentation. The point is WM is still growing. It is not as if it in decline. More people are buying windows mobile every single day.
    Marketshare is still one of he most important metrics for your business, and WM IS in decline. I'm not sure why you keep trying to talk your way around it. Do you think Microsoft was happy to see their year-over-year numbers drop so badly as their competitors excel? Do you not realize that not only means that their competitors are growing stronger and more profitable in the mobile arena, but that they are taking the strength and profitability FROM Windows Mobile?

    The third largest cell phone maker in the world just signed a deal to have WM on its upcoming smartphones.
    You keep repeating this, too. I've never disputed it. Why would I? Obviously, superior volume sales is doing nothing to help Microsoft if Apple is outselling them with ONE handset (well...two between the 8GB and 16GB models).
  7.    #147  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    FCC approval is typically done six to three months before launch. Palm isn't workign on that, ti is done.
    The FCC testing is done. The FCC approval is not (or at least not publicly in any way you can verify). Why you think I am saying Palm is somehow working on FCC testing is a mystery. The point is that there are many stages and many actors involved in the release of a phone, and mere "hard work" from Palm will not make it appear faster on Sprint and Best Buy shelves. Sprint's not selling it until it goes through their sausage factory too.

    Don't confuse public release of FCC approval with actual testing and approval.
    I didn't.

    Sprint will be doing almost all the marketing, not Palm.
    Maybe you're not familiar with context, but by placing "Marketing Setup" directly after two items beginning with the word "Sprint", you're meant to understand that it is SPRINT marketing setup without me having to type it again.
  8. #148  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    If I was this CEO and I was releasing a device thats success was needed to save my company I would definitely have to consider the release schedule of my competitor. I would need to take into account that the technical advantages I would have against the competitors current model may no longer be there at the time of my release. In addition my competitor new model may actual now be better than my current unreleased device.
    I agree 100%.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  9. #149  
    Quote Originally Posted by NachoB View Post
    I agree with this 100%. Imagine yourself as CEO of a troubled company with an as yet to be released device that could possibly pull you from the grave. Are you going to worry more about it's release date than it's readiness to be released? I think you would focus more on getting it release ready and less on when that date actually is. Not saying the release date doesn't play an important role, but it shouldn't come to "okay, we've reached a certain date, we'll just release the phone as is".


    I think Palm should focus on releasing a stable, mostly bug free device and less on who is realeasing what and when. Palm Pre is going to be what it is regardless of what others release.
    Maybe my thought process on purchasing a cell phone is too simplified. I either like it and buy it, or I don't like it and don't buy it.

    But Palm is in a catch 22 that it placed itself in. Timing your "do or die" device to be released nearly at the same time as a huge competitor is a bad move. But you're right, releasing an unstable device would be a bad move also for Palm. Palm should have taken timing into account and did the best they could to make sure the device would be ready BEFORE the next iPhone release.

    I really don't want to see them released at near the same time because unless Palm does something out of character and blasts the iPhone straight out for what it doesn't have and what the Pre does have(advertising), iPhone is likely to win too much share again.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #150  
    IMO I don't think much thunder was stolen at all.

    MWC showed that there aren't even any phones in development that are in the same league as the Pre and WebOS combination. If anything I think Palms small show at MWC HELPED them. The Pre would have most likely failed to "wow" people next to the flood of enormous 3.6-4.1 inch screen phones. Especially since Palm isn't giving hands on demos.

    WM6.5, unless it goes through some BIG changes, is going to be nothing more than a 6.1 skin thats inferior to something like Touchflow 3D and appears to even fail in comparison to newer skins like the one on the Toshiba TG01.

    I think Windows Mobile's perception is going to change GREATLY once people start getting test units of the Pre and once Android makes its way to some lower end phones. Even with all the fancy skins WM6 hasn't proven that it can compete with the OS's designed specifically for touch interfacing... Which is a shame because there were a lot of amazing looking WM6 devices at MWC.

    The only events that could happen in Q1-Q2 which have any shot at stealing potential (mainstream)buzz from the Pre are the announcement of the American HTC Magic/G2, or the launch of the next iPhone, but I'd bet that the next iPhone STILL won't have an OS on par with WebOS...

    As long as Sprint gets the Pre out of the door before either of those things happen, the Pre has still has its shot at making a big splash in the mainstream.
  11. #151  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    First of all, you continuously make statements as if you were an official Palm employee. You are not, and therefore shouldn't speak as you are. You have no idea what Palm has taken into consideration and what they did not. You have also not had any hands on time with the Pre so its hard for you to justify comments about what the Pre has achieved and what it has not.
    Again, I offered my opinion as to why Palm should consider the competition in setting its release schedule. You clearly do not share my opinion. Lets just agree to disagree and move on
    I'm not totally convinced of anything yet, despite what people say they are or aren't. To defend a product and corporation so vigorously that you supposedly have no stake in makes me wonder.

    Although I've seen it happen before many times with the iPhone(yes I went there, LOL), but those are usually fanpeople who actually OWN the product and have it in hand.
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 02/19/2009 at 08:52 PM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  12. #152  
    Are there any video game fans that don't think the Xbox 360 coming out well before the Playstation 3 was important to its market share lead? Obviously a great business strategy on Microsoft's part.
  13. #153  
    I agree that MSFT being first to the table certainly helped. But to be fair, there were also a number of other factors concerning video game consoles.

    Sony was late getting the first one out, then pretty expensive. Less games(good ones but still less) and no online fan community until recently. Current refusal to lower prices even though MSFT did so. Current removal of good features(no backwards compatibility for PS2 games, less USB ports, no memory card slot). Even though PS3 is actually better IMO, it doesn't have the fun factor Xbox does. PS3 has more adult features, which is why I prefer it, but Xbox just seems more fun. Serious gamers(I'm not one) claim to prefer it. Xbox continues to rack up sales while PS3 remains for those who decide they can afford the extra expense, LOL!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  14. #154  
    I agree it wasn't the only factor, but I think it was very important. By getting the Xbox out early, Microsoft was in a position to be able to lower it's price when the PS3 came out.

    By hardware specs, clearly the PS3 is the winner, but sales don't show that. Yes Xbox Online is a big differentiator, but Microsoft getting out of the gate early was certainly a huge factor.

    If both of the devices were released the exact same day, I think the numbers would look very different for Sony.
  15. #155  
    Had to have bluray for me.

    With either though, video fans knew both inside and out before choosing. Both got the benefit of a lot of media attn. Both ruled the market with previous models.

    I can't say the same for iphone vs Pre. People know iphone pretty much and only the tech geeks know of the Pre.

    And i guess that's the thing. When the Pre gets close to launch and the reviews hit, just how much excitement and press they'll get. And will it be enough to get the masses to notice? Will the marketing be any good?

    It still won't compete with just how common the iphone is and how the media will erupt when they make their announcement.

    Then again, if both do launch next to each other, it will be hard for the media to ignore one while mentioning the other. It's not like apple's new phone will have the significance that the 3g had along with its app store. The palm pre may be just what the media uses to make the apple launch more interesting. Both could get played up, pre vs iphone articles written, and that works in palm's favor..and not because i think the Pre is better..its because pre vs apple articles simply will make people more aware of the Pre.

    Or in other words..palm could ride the apple wave.
  16.    #156  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    [COLOR="navy"]But Palm is in a catch 22 that it placed itself in. Timing your "do or die" device to be released nearly at the same time as a huge competitor is a bad move. But you're right, releasing an unstable device would be a bad move also for Palm. Palm should have taken timing into account and did the best they could to make sure the device would be ready BEFORE the next iPhone release.
    "Catch 22" doesn't mean what you think it means, BTW.

    And Palm made the correct decision not to quake in their boots at rumored timing of a phantom device with phantom specs that wouldn't be offered on Sprint anyway. Sprint customers are where the sights must be aimed before even thinking about thinking about dreaming about poaching customers from other carriers. No healthy launch among Sprint customers - a captive, hungry audience for fancy smartphones if ever there was one - means even dimmer prospects when the exclusive ends and it goes to carriers with iPhones, Storms, and such.
  17.    #157  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    I'm not totally convinced of anything yet, despite what people say they are or aren't. To defend a product and corporation so vigorously that you supposedly have no stake in makes me wonder.

    Although I've seen it happen before many times with the iPhone(yes I went there, LOL), but those are usually fanpeople who actually OWN the product and have it in hand.
    I get no small amount of laughter from paranoid posts like this. Do people at, say, theiphoneblog.com find it suspicious when someone liking their Apple product talks about what the company is doing right and defends it from detractors?

    It's like BizarroWorld here sometimes.
  18. #158  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I get no small amount of laughter from paranoid posts like this. Do people at, say, theiphoneblog.com find it suspicious when someone liking their Apple product talks about what the company is doing right and defends it from detractors?

    It's like BizarroWorld here sometimes.
    I do find it odd that there are so many obvious iphone people standing in this queue. Many seem unconvinced but are nevertheless afraid that they might miss out on something. Very odd!
  19. #159  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I get no small amount of laughter from paranoid posts like this. Do people at, say, theiphoneblog.com find it suspicious when someone liking their Apple product talks about what the company is doing right and defends it from detractors?

    It's like BizarroWorld here sometimes.
    Defending Palm is one thing. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid is another.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  20.    #160  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    Defending Palm is one thing. Keep drinking the Kool-Aid is another.
    I'm drinking Kool-Aid because I don't think Palm should live in fear of imaginary handsets? Ok.....interesting opinion on a Palm discussion board.
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