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  1. tdcrone's Avatar
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    #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tmair View Post
    I realy wouldnt put much stock in Apple being scared of the pre thus making them sue, IF they hold any patents that Palm infringed on then they have every right to sue, and should.
    Also patents do not last forever, I would think most of palms have ran out long ago, considering they haventmade any real changes for eons intil now.
    Terry
    Patent lifetime is 21 years, I don't think Palm's likely to be hitting that on anything in their portfolio. I doubt Apple is more 'scared' of the Pre than anything else, but it has basically the same target market as the profitable iPhone so they are right (from a business perspective) to try to squash it. They couldn't care less about WM and RIM because they target business users (until recently at least), and in the US at least most of the other brands fight in the low end. It's not mean or even anti-consumer, it's just business.

    To me, though, this seems typical; Palm and Apple will probably sign an agreement to cross-license patents x, y, and z, and it will be over. Companies violate each others' patents all the time, usually unintentionally, and this is normally the way things are settled.

    In addition Apple probably wants to spread some FUD to reduce market penetration (worked well against RIM by who-was-it) but honestly if they were trying to do this primarily they would have picked something more critical to the functionality of the device.

    Apple not suing anyone else over their patent is a black mark for them, by the way, even if it is for products that do not compete (iPod Touch would be a great counterpoint to that anyway), and I'm sure their attorneys know it. Maybe SCO fired their legal team and they needed something to do?

    Anyway, patent litigation takes -forever-, so Apple would be unlikely to get a meaningful injunction IMO. Maybe I'll eat those words, but at this point there's nothing that makes me not optimistic.

    If I'm right then I just have to convince my wife to let me buy a new phone sometime soon, though I think my chances are somewhat lower than Palm's.
  2. #42  
    I wonder if Palm hold a patent for threaded text messaging? Its the single best feature on my Treo/Centro and Apple have nicked it!
    HP Pre 3 (UK)
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by checkmate View Post
    I wonder if Palm hold a patent for threaded text messaging? Its the single best feature on my Treo/Centro and Apple have nicked it!
    WinMo also stole it!
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by checkmate View Post
    I wonder if Palm hold a patent for threaded text messaging? Its the single best feature on my Treo/Centro and Apple have nicked it!
    My Brand new Blackberry Storm does NOT thread sms messages and it is HORRIBLE... my inbox is filled with 3-4 of the same names several hundred times.. Everyone on crackberry tells me to use BlackBerry Messenger and that threads the conversation. BUT they don't understand that not everyone has a blackberry. My 4 year old Treo 650 did a great job.

    <Sigh> it's the little things.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by antonio3 View Post
    My Brand new Blackberry Storm does NOT thread sms messages and it is HORRIBLE... my inbox is filled with 3-4 of the same names several hundred times.. Everyone on crackberry tells me to use BlackBerry Messenger and that threads the conversation. BUT they don't understand that not everyone has a blackberry. My 4 year old Treo 650 did a great job.

    <Sigh> it's the little things.
    hey - that's not a little thingh. In past threads i;ve listed the TM messaging as my "killer app" for the treo. I sent hundreds of TM's a month. The way the treo handles them is excellent. love that feature.
    da Gimp

    Please note: My spelling sucks and I'm to lazy to check it.
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by jhoff80 View Post
    Yeah, I have a Dell XT tablet PC with capacitive touch and multitouch, including the rotate and pinch zoom gestures, but its been suggested they don't care about these usages because they're not other phones. Who knows.
    Well technically the Pre is a PDA that has a phone. A tablet pc could have phone capabilities via wifi or peripheral. The primary purpose of the Pre is as a PDA, it can be seen with the entire cloud integration. The phone is a secondary purpose since the Pre can fully function without the phone.
    --Nextel Blackberry 7520 -> Sprint Treo 700p -> Sprint Treo 755p -> Sprint Pre
  7. #47  
    Shouldnt the director of the Minority Report be the one suing? Seems like most of the functionality was built on that movie
  8. #48  
    Let's see...

    Apple stole the ringer off switch from palm.

    Apple stole the threaded text concept from palm.

    The whole idea of desktop sync? Palm's.

    A touchscreen smartphone? Palm was the original.

    Using an icon based OS where you tap the icon to navigate to the app? All palm. Whether apple improved upon it or not is debatable but they stole the concept from palm.

    But apple won't stand for anyone to rip off their IP even if its ok for them to do so.. As if touchscreen tech is their IP in the first place.

    Let's not forget Apple hiring Papermaster out of IBM. Talk about ripping off IP. IBM had to get a ruling to block his hire temporary.

    <<"The confidential information to which Mr Papermaster has become privy based on his membership in the I&VT and his employment with the company represents the product of IBM's substantial investment in research and innovation and is critical to IBM's success," reads the filing.>>>
    Last edited by cardfan; 01/23/2009 at 07:38 AM.
  9. #49  
  10. #50  
    They also list the flicking to the left or right to see the next picture in your photo album as something Palm supposedly stole from Apple....are you serious? Go ahead and sue HTC too then, because that is exactly how I look at my next picture in my photo album on my HTC Touch....Who is going to sue who over dialing numbers to reach a person....sheeeeeeesh!
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by MannyZ28 View Post
    They also list the flicking to the left or right to see the next picture in your photo album as something Palm supposedly stole from Apple....are you serious? Go ahead and sue HTC too then, because that is exactly how I look at my next picture in my photo album on my HTC Touch....Who is going to sue who over dialing numbers to reach a person....sheeeeeeesh!

    When you are in the phone section of My Treo 650... there are apps listed at the bottom.. and.. oh my goodness!! there are more apps on another page to the right??? realy!! and then you can go back to the left? Looks like apple may have taken the way they launch apps from the Phone section of the Treo 650p. But what the heck do i know.


    It's the greedy Palm execs that sat on their buts and collected bags of money and blew it on BS.. they sat on a great thing for a little to long. Now they are going in the right direction at least
    Last edited by antonio3; 01/25/2009 at 02:08 PM.
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by MannyZ28 View Post
    They also list the flicking to the left or right to see the next picture in your photo album as something Palm supposedly stole from Apple....are you serious? Go ahead and sue HTC too then, because that is exactly how I look at my next picture in my photo album on my HTC Touch....Who is going to sue who over dialing numbers to reach a person....sheeeeeeesh!
    My co-worker just got the Samsung Behold & I noticed that it also has the left/right flicking when viewing images. I doubt Apple will go after them as well. Apple is just threatened by a real contender.
  13. #53  
    Either that, or they want to license anything that they MIGHT have innovated to make more money, or deny the licensing so there won't be a competitor at all. "Love competition" my ***, I bet if Palm really just plain ripped it off from an Apple patented innovation, Apple would refuse to license it.
  14. #54  
    Patent holders must defend their IP vigorously or they will lose the ability to collect for them. The fact that Apple has not done so for some things in the past will not help their case.
  15. #55  
    Palm sure did include a removable battery that the iPhone doesn't have.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by cavingjan View Post
    Patent holders must defend their IP vigorously or they will lose the ability to collect for them. The fact that Apple has not done so for some things in the past will not help their case.
    Well right now they can't do anything because they don't hold the patents yet. All they can do is try and get people to convince others that they will get the patents and get them into early licensing.
    --Nextel Blackberry 7520 -> Sprint Treo 700p -> Sprint Treo 755p -> Sprint Pre
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by tdcrone View Post
    I doubt Apple is more 'scared' of the Pre than anything else, but it has basically the same target market as the profitable iPhone so they are right (from a business perspective) to try to squash it.
    Precisely, but id say its a combination of anti-competition and scared of losing marketshare to Palm theyve gained.

    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Let's see...

    Apple stole the ringer off switch from palm.

    Apple stole the threaded text concept from palm.

    The whole idea of desktop sync? Palm's.

    A touchscreen smartphone? Palm was the original.

    Using an icon based OS where you tap the icon to navigate to the app? All palm. Whether apple improved upon it or not is debatable but they stole the concept from palm.

    But apple won't stand for anyone to rip off their IP even if its ok for them to do so.. As if touchscreen tech is their IP in the first place.

    Let's not forget Apple hiring Papermaster out of IBM. Talk about ripping off IP. IBM had to get a ruling to block his hire temporary.

    <<"The confidential information to which Mr Papermaster has become privy based on his membership in the I&VT and his employment with the company represents the product of IBM's substantial investment in research and innovation and is critical to IBM's success," reads the filing.>>>
    precisely, Apple ripped off plenty of other patents and then patented it as their own. they try to patent every little thing they can and then sue people when anyone challenges them. Typical.

    Quote Originally Posted by cavingjan View Post
    Patent holders must defend their IP vigorously or they will lose the ability to collect for them. The fact that Apple has not done so for some things in the past will not help their case.
    very true. Look over some of Apple's patents, they are VERY vague. Basically theyre hoping they can patent whatever they can get through the Patent Office and then challenge anyone who makes anything substantially similar, which likely wont fly in court. Apple's practices are anything but classy in terms of their business practices such as patents to stifle any type of competition. im surprised they have been attacked by anti-competition claims yet for their practices in patenting anything that moves.

    i see little forseeable issues with Palm getting the Pre out due to these loose unsubstantiated threats by Apple, because they simply wont fly when it comes down to it.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomD View Post
    The bright side of this Apple threat is that, if it makes Apple THAT nervous, it must be pretty good.

    If I were considering an iPhone and Apple praised the Pre by suing for patent violation, then that would be a signal to me that Palm Pre is better than iPhone.

    It would be that best publicity that Palm could get.
    I agree... Palm may be able to save a few $$ from Ads as the Apple threat will generate enough publicity for Palm Pre. Hopefully Apple is not that stupid. Look how much discussion has been generated on Palm Pre since Apple's earning conference call.
  19. #59  
    Another point I would like to bring up is the accelerometer. Wasn't that first used in the iPhone? Who's got the patent for that? Lets see what other phone makers "shamelessly" used this technology in their phone....just off the top of my head that would be: HTC Diamond, HTC Touch Pro, Blackberry Storm, HTC G1,.....who else?

    Correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I remember, the iPhone was the first phone to have the accelerometer, but since Apple didn't try to go after RIM and HTC, I am guessing someone else is holding that patent? Fact is, everyone is trying to copy the iPhone, just look at the Instinct from Samsung, they did direct comparisons to the iPhone, more or less showing how they made the identical product, just "better". Touchscreen phones are the norm now, be it as smart phones, or dumb phones, but I guess since Apple never saw a thread in any of the iPhone Killer challengers (they didn't respond to all the aggressive Samsung Instinct ads at all), they never bothered with any type of lawyer tough talk, but with the Pre, they do see a challenger, hence the tough boardroom language.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by MannyZ28 View Post
    ...
    Touchscreen phones are the norm now, be it as smart phones, or dumb phones, but I guess since Apple never saw a threat(d) ...
    You aren't trying to perpetuate the myth that the iphone was the first touchscreen phone, are you?
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