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  1.    #1  
    I think Palm did an extraordinary job on the development of this phone and the new operating system. You can see how much attention they paid to what the majority of consumers wanted/used over the past 2 years, while developing it.

    It's certainly an amazing device; the question is, now, is it for me?

    Im a GSM user (currently treo 650, unlocked, on its last legs, T-Mobile). Im not considered a heavy user, but, for my work and home life, I have applications that I use, a few games that I play while waiting for appointments, and defintely use it for playing my mp3's that Ive ripped from my own CD's and put onto an SD card, which is an amazing improvement of quatility of time when Im in an airport, or in flight.

    I do text (sms, sometimes MMS, if pictures are needed), and use the stylus more often than not, for accuracy on the screen, particularly when typing an sms. I also use it to draw in 2 of my applications.

    I don't use it for email; I have a laptop for that, and that's where it will stay - its just how Im orgainized, personally, but, the address book/contact list is very important to me, to be on my phone.

    Having said the above, the Pre, in its current and inital offering isn't for me for the following 3 reasons:

    1. I want and need a memory card slot. I don't use I-Tunes or some other MP3 software to manage and synch, I rip my songs and put them onto my SD cards.

    2. The use of a stylus is necessary for me. Maybe not for everyone. I can't speak for everyone, but, for me, accurate and quick cursor placement is vital, and the ability to draw like I draw with a pencil (not my finger) is also essential. And, the one game I enjoy playing is Minesweeper (incredible for logic building, I feel), which will be much slower using my fingers, I think.

    3. I'm not switching to Sprint. I have a great plan with T-Mobile, grandfathered now, and my whole family is there too. Since Sprint is CDMA, and T-Mobile is GSM, I can't even buy the phone and unlock it and use it on my current T-Mobile account.

    I'm sure Palm had their reasons for removing the stylus, eliminating the SD card slot, and going CDMA first, but, despite the incredible (and I do mean INCREDIBLE) offerings the Pre has, these 3 will prevent me from jumping on the bandwagon, for its initial release.

    Hopefully, the GSM version, or another phone, will address my own personal concerns as Ive indicated above, within the next 6 - 8 months, because, that's about how long I have until my 650 dies, I think.

    Perhaps a less costly solution would be a WebOS Treo Pro GSM unlocked?
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  2. #2  
    Well as long as you know what you want, thats great. There will never be an all around one device for everyone. Just have to wait and see what the other form factors Palm has in plan for WebOS devices.
  3. #3  
    I know this is off topic, but man I sure don't miss my T-Mobile days with the unlocked 650. Especially going from EDGE to EVDO. It is ashamed that T-Mobile doesn't get new Treo devices. I moved to Sprint about 2-3 years ago and have not had any regret. I was in the same boat as you with the whole family on T-Mobile so I got everyone to move to Sprint on SERO accounts and they have all been happy. They did have good service and I had a pretty good plan at the time but it could not touch SERO. I remember the T-Mobile retentions dept. arguing that there is no way Sprint can give me the package I described to them. They said it was a trick and that I was being lied to. I understand you can't/don't want to switch, and I am in no way trying to convince you of such. I just had to post because it brought back memories.
  4. iatricjb's Avatar
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    #4  
    Did you notice that Palm didn't announce pricing. My guess is that is pricey compared to the iPhone and they didn't want that to distract from the presentation. However this may be good news. My guess is that Sprint wasn't willing to make the deal that Apple and AT&T made. Hence my hope is that this may reduce the exclusive time period for Sprint in the US. Having said all that I'm not sure I see a US GSM Pre in 2009. Maybe I should call my rep at AT&T to see what he says...
  5.    #5  
    Somewere in the forums, a pricing of either $149 or $199 for contract and $349 or $399 for non contract for Sprint Pre was confirmed by a palm executive.

    That would be VERY competitive to an iPhone.

    Also, there is no way Palm would go the rest of 2009 without a GSM Pre. We already know that hey are planning one for the EU. They have also indicated that a GSM unlocked is also in the works.
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  6. iatricjb's Avatar
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    #6  
    Then why wouldn't they announce it? Are we really expected to believe they haven't negotiated the price with Sprint yet?
  7.    #7  
    iatricjb;

    I am assuming that they wanted to concetrate on the device at CES, and not the buisness aspects.

    We do know a few things:

    1. Palm needs this product and OS to succeed.
    2. Sprint's 3G network is likely the best in the US.
    3. Speed is king with smartphones that access the internet.
    4. Sprint has, with all of its sub-carriers, upwards of 30 - 40m subscribers. Thier unlimited data/calling plan is already in place with many of them, and the Pre is a natural fit for those subscribers to upgrade to, not to mention those who haven't unil now for other reasons.

    They promised to release the Pre for sale with Sprint sometime in the first half of 2009, with the phrase "as soon as possible" used by Ed C. himself.

    As in my original post above, I don't fault them for these decisions. If this is where they see the ability to gain a strong foothold in the middle of the smartphone market, then they seem to be right on target for that.

    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  8. iatricjb's Avatar
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    #8  
    Do you get the feeling that this is still an uncompleted project that may take months more development to get out the door? Missing video, missing GPS, not willing to talk about much more than they showed. I have a sense they got enough done to show it at CES.
  9.    #9  
    Actually, they said they are just needing final certification (FCC). The other thing they indicated in the keynote address at CES was that they are still forging agreements with other partners (for example, Flash support wasnt announced yet, and that is VITAL for not just content, but development, particularly since they are providing an HTML based development environment - heck, I program in Flash, myself ).
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  10. dpc
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    #10  
    GSM is the only sticking point for me. It's too bad that I'd have to wait for the Sprint launch, and then the GSM launch. I hope there isn't that big a gap between the launch dates.
  11. iatricjb's Avatar
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    #11  
    I'm worried that the Sprint launch will be late in the 2nd quarter 2009. Then I can't believe Sprint would allow another vendor in the US market before Christmas 2009. I suspect an early 2010 AT&T GSM US launch. Then there will be early bugs that need to be fixed (like Storm) so I don't expect a solid stable US GSM version until the second half of 2010. Haven't spoken to my AT&T source yet though...
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    2. Sprint's 3G network is likely the best in the US.
    3. Speed is king with smartphones that access the internet.
    Im surprised more people dont talk about this when comparing these types of devices... because to me the 3g network is the most important aspect of these internet connected phones (and the pre will be the most internet connected phone yet). its debatable who has the larger network between sprint/verizon but both of them are quite a bit better than at&t or tmobile.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by iatricjb View Post
    I'm worried that the Sprint launch will be late in the 2nd quarter 2009. Then I can't believe Sprint would allow another vendor in the US market before Christmas 2009. I suspect an early 2010 AT&T GSM US launch. Then there will be early bugs that need to be fixed (like Storm) so I don't expect a solid stable US GSM version until the second half of 2010. Haven't spoken to my AT&T source yet though...
    I agree that an AT&T Pre is unlikely before 2010. However, I would think the bugs would be worked out by then.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by jagowar View Post
    Im surprised more people dont talk about this when comparing these types of devices... because to me the 3g network is the most important aspect of these internet connected phones (and the pre will be the most internet connected phone yet). its debatable who has the larger network between sprint/verizon but both of them are quite a bit better than at&t or tmobile.
    Some of us still believe that the most important function of a cellphone is to make phone calls and the second most important is to receive emails in a timely manner. EDGE is plenty fast enough for email.
  15. cgk
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    Some of us still believe that the most important function of a cellphone is to make phone calls.
    That's an age thing - there is a relationship between age and the most used function of a phone. 18-24 year olds predominately use their phones as texting devices (averaging about 1800 texts a month), while people over 30 (like me) use them mainly as phones (I sent about 100 text maximum a month).
  16. jagowar's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    Some of us still believe that the most important function of a cellphone is to make phone calls and the second most important is to receive emails in a timely manner. EDGE is plenty fast enough for email.
    odd.... because thats what my friends on tmobile and at&t always complain about. dropping calls and not being able to make them. where in my 2 yrs on sprint i have not had a single problem yet.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    I think Palm did an extraordinary job on the development of this phone and the new operating system. You can see how much attention they paid to what the majority of consumers wanted/used over the past 2 years, while developing it.

    It's certainly an amazing device; the question is, now, is it for me?

    Im a GSM user (currently treo 650, unlocked, on its last legs, T-Mobile). Im not considered a heavy user, but, for my work and home life, I have applications that I use, a few games that I play while waiting for appointments, and defintely use it for playing my mp3's that Ive ripped from my own CD's and put onto an SD card, which is an amazing improvement of quatility of time when Im in an airport, or in flight.

    I do text (sms, sometimes MMS, if pictures are needed), and use the stylus more often than not, for accuracy on the screen, particularly when typing an sms. I also use it to draw in 2 of my applications.

    I don't use it for email; I have a laptop for that, and that's where it will stay - its just how Im orgainized, personally, but, the address book/contact list is very important to me, to be on my phone.

    Having said the above, the Pre, in its current and inital offering isn't for me for the following 3 reasons:

    1. I want and need a memory card slot. I don't use I-Tunes or some other MP3 software to manage and synch, I rip my songs and put them onto my SD cards.

    2. The use of a stylus is necessary for me. Maybe not for everyone. I can't speak for everyone, but, for me, accurate and quick cursor placement is vital, and the ability to draw like I draw with a pencil (not my finger) is also essential. And, the one game I enjoy playing is Minesweeper (incredible for logic building, I feel), which will be much slower using my fingers, I think.

    3. I'm not switching to Sprint. I have a great plan with T-Mobile, grandfathered now, and my whole family is there too. Since Sprint is CDMA, and T-Mobile is GSM, I can't even buy the phone and unlock it and use it on my current T-Mobile account.

    I'm sure Palm had their reasons for removing the stylus, eliminating the SD card slot, and going CDMA first, but, despite the incredible (and I do mean INCREDIBLE) offerings the Pre has, these 3 will prevent me from jumping on the bandwagon, for its initial release.

    Hopefully, the GSM version, or another phone, will address my own personal concerns as Ive indicated above, within the next 6 - 8 months, because, that's about how long I have until my 650 dies, I think.

    Perhaps a less costly solution would be a WebOS Treo Pro GSM unlocked?
    At least the 8gb internal memory can be used as mass storage which means drag and drop as the Pre would show as an 8GB USB drive, so i'm fine with that. Most times i have to sit in front of my PC, take out card from 700wx, put in card reader, transfer stuff, eject, put back in 700wx and i'm off.
    I see no difference in that behaviour with the Pre, except when i would rather have a bigger storage as my needs grow, but on the other hand from that, i have a 4gb SDHC in my 700wx right now and even with 2gb TomTom data on it and other things, i've not filled it up yet.
    I literally stumbled upon an 8gb SDHC the other day (as in free) and decided to just drop it in my Nikon D40 instead.

    Ever since my first Treo 650 i've used the stylus less and less. That was a key selling point of the Palm Treos, the niceties Palm put in where most functions could be performed sans stylus.

    Apps/programs and (maybe) games will come in time. I'll bet the first ever Palm OS device didn't have minesweeper on launch day. It took time. You don't have to take the plunge on day one, you can wait a few weeks to see what will develop for it.

    Just like i won't switch to another carrier because of the juicier-than-crack plan i have with Sprint, i wouldn't expect you to leave T-mobile. At least there's an unlocked GSM version in the offing, that's a good thing.

    Sprint has always been good to Palm ever since the Handspring Visor-phone days (if anyone remembers those), Treos 300/600/650/700p/700wx/755p/Centro and it's only natural that their loyal partner would get the first shot at the Pre.
    T-mobile by contrast last officially carried the Treo 600 ages ago, plus their 3g just came on the horizon merely months ago, so it's understandable on Palm's part. (even though EDGE is good enough for some people).
    .....Life is But Such Sweet Sorrow.....
  18. #18  
    8GB is NOT much for a multimedia phone that includes applications. I've been testing out an 8GB iTouch for a couple months and that 8GB fills up pretty quick - you load up enough music for a weeklong trip, maybe a short movie, and your 144 or so applications - and it's BEYOND maxxed out - you gotta start pulling off music. Happens quick! When 8GB Class 6 microSD is selling for $16.00 nowadays, with 16GB cards already released, Palm has shot themselves in the foot yet again by jamming the transmission into 2nd gear instead of overdrive.

    Palm has been cheap and stupid about memory for years and years. They've been dragged kicking and screaming into nearly every innovation from color screens and removable flash, to internal memory increases. Why in the world they would try to create an "Iphone killer" without keeping removable flash is incredibly shortsighted. When you hardcode an 8GB maximum you have made your device unusable for anyone who needs 8.2GB now or two years from now. A card slot would have solved that issue, but they oddly copied a major downside of the iPhone instead.
    Treo 755s in good condition available on ebay for $50-$75. No need to pay for insurance or buy a Pre.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by jagowar View Post
    odd.... because thats what my friends on tmobile and at&t always complain about. dropping calls and not being able to make them. where in my 2 yrs on sprint i have not had a single problem yet.
    My experiance has been that you are better off sticking to the big 2 for coverage (Verizon & AT&T). If you also want to use your shiny smartphone in Europe then AT&T is pretty much the only choice.

    I have AT&T and T-Mobile. AT&T is definitely better than T-Mobile. I used to have Verizon. It was pretty much as good as AT&T except it didn't work as well in my Manattan apartment and doesn't work at all in north western Connecticut.

    I never tried Sprint, several of my friends did and warned me not too. They apparantly have the biggest churn rate of the four and the least credit worthy customers. I am sure there is a reason for that. I suspect a weak network and poor customer service.
  20. cgk
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Joad View Post
    When you hardcode an 8GB maximum you have made your device unusable for anyone who needs 8.2GB now or two years from now. A card slot would have solved that issue, but they oddly copied a major downside of the iPhone instead.
    Companies work this out using averages - What do you think is the average number of music files (using that as an example) held on a personal computer? To the nearest 1000?
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