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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by pogeypre View Post
    You might want to think of the HP/Palm stuff as a reboot. Obviously the first run through didn't go the way they wanted, so they are taking their time to do it right.

    I see a lot of Windows Phone 7 in the strategy. I hope it works just as well and brings great WebOs hardware to the market.
    I don't see anywhere near enough Windows Phone 7 in the strategy, and that's what concerns me.

    1) Microsoft is concerned with making this a great phone OS before even dreaming about putting it on other form factors. HP is trying to scale it to a range of devices, resolutions, processor kernels before 2.0 is even fully baked, and the SDK is STILL missing important APIs. I guess they're hoping the PalmPad will be the star of the portfolio in their mind, but what does that mean for phone customers?

    2) When Microsoft launched their new OS, they launched it HARD. Lots of carriers, countries, and phones. HP Palm seems almost incapable of hitting more than one of these at the same time. Not good. Also not good is...

    3) When are they finally going to make NON-"pre-production" Palm Pre 2 devices readily available in America? It's been a month now, and it's not like there's some huge demand in the rest of the world that the HP/Foxconn manufacturing machine is working overtime to fulfill.

    4) Where are the indepth demoes? Microsoft hit virtually every conference they could and had Joe B. doing demos and indepth interviews about their product in beta form. WebOS 2.0 has gone gold, the Pre 2 is finished and released yet both are pretty hard to find. Why is that?

    5) Commit to a date. NOW. Microsoft did NOT just release it when it was ready. They locked into a fall release window at the beginning of the year, and moved hell and highwater to make it on time so they wouldn't break customer expectations. Why can't HP do the same when they have much less development and manufacturing ahead of them than Microsoft and all of its Windows Phone 7 partners did?
  2. #42  
    Moving this thread to Cross-Platform in 3...2...1...
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
  3.    #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    They are carefully cultivating an air of indifference.
    Well, I have to admit that I was horribly, horribly, horribly wrong. I argued very strongly that HP/Palm would get behind this phone with some marketing to get WebOS to people who don't have smartphone yet. I've never been as wrong about anything in my life. Not only are they not marketing the device, they're almost anti-marketing it. They've release a device they don't want people know about.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by YankBoy View Post
    Well, I have to admit that I was horribly, horribly, horribly wrong. I argued very strongly that HP/Palm would get behind this phone with some marketing to get WebOS to people who don't have smartphone yet. I've never been as wrong about anything in my life. Not only are they not marketing the device, they're almost anti-marketing it. They've release a device they don't want people know about.
    it's cool because it's underground :P
  5.    #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by patricksmangan View Post
    it's cool because it's underground :P
    Corpses are underground too...
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    I don't see anywhere near enough Windows Phone 7 in the strategy, and that's what concerns me.

    1) Microsoft is concerned with making this a great phone OS before even dreaming about putting it on other form factors. HP is trying to scale it to a range of devices, resolutions, processor kernels before 2.0 is even fully baked, and the SDK is STILL missing important APIs. I guess they're hoping the PalmPad will be the star of the portfolio in their mind, but what does that mean for phone customers?

    2) When Microsoft launched their new OS, they launched it HARD. Lots of carriers, countries, and phones. HP Palm seems almost incapable of hitting more than one of these at the same time. Not good. Also not good is...

    3) When are they finally going to make NON-"pre-production" Palm Pre 2 devices readily available in America? It's been a month now, and it's not like there's some huge demand in the rest of the world that the HP/Foxconn manufacturing machine is working overtime to fulfill.

    4) Where are the indepth demoes? Microsoft hit virtually every conference they could and had Joe B. doing demos and indepth interviews about their product in beta form. WebOS 2.0 has gone gold, the Pre 2 is finished and released yet both are pretty hard to find. Why is that?

    5) Commit to a date. NOW. Microsoft did NOT just release it when it was ready. They locked into a fall release window at the beginning of the year, and moved hell and highwater to make it on time so they wouldn't break customer expectations. Why can't HP do the same when they have much less development and manufacturing ahead of them than Microsoft and all of its Windows Phone 7 partners did?
    Who's to say that their Windows Phone 7 like stategy won't be unveiled at CES? Just because you don't know the timeframe and strategy doesn't mean they aren't opperating off one.
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  7. #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    I think it's obvious that HP didn't acquire Palm just to write a big check to go towards advertising whatever they had in their pipeline. Thus far, it's "OK, so you have the Pre 2. Why don't you give it to the French and see how they like it?"
    I choked on my Garden Salsa Sun chips when I read that.
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  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by YankBoy View Post
    Corpses are underground too...
    and they are awesome, dexter's like my favorite show
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by pogeypre View Post
    Who's to say that their Windows Phone 7 like stategy won't be unveiled at CES? Just because you don't know the timeframe and strategy doesn't mean they aren't opperating off one.
    You can't have a Windows Phone 7 strategy if you put out a red-headed stepchild handset and let it - along with the new version of your recently acquired OS - languish in the shadowy corners of the marketplace.

    That's a Kin strategy.

    And why do people put so much on CES? What about MWC just a month later? There are typically way more substantial phone announcements made there. Or CTIA a month after that?

    If HP is serious about this, they need their own version of WWDC or MIX. Just throwing in announcements with the pack of competitors doing the same thing instantly dulls the impact.
  10. #50  
    It is possible that, like the Kin, the Pre 2 is a stop gap product. It may ultimately fail, but it keeps WebOs is a spotlight.... an awkward spotlight, but that's better than nothing.
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  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by pogeypre View Post
    It is possible that, like the Kin, the Pre 2 is a stop gap product. It may ultimately fail, but it keeps WebOs is a spotlight.... an awkward spotlight, but that's better than nothing.
    unless verizon doesn't end up releasing it at all, I wonder if we could get very good plans with that phone (like the kin coming back) just to sell the thing. Might b worth a carrier switch?
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by pogeypre View Post
    It is possible that, like the Kin, the Pre 2 is a stop gap product. It may ultimately fail, but it keeps WebOs is a spotlight.... an awkward spotlight, but that's better than nothing.
    Here's the disconnect I find with this: It doesn't jibe with the "Man, HP Palm is going to unleash hell at CES!" theory.

    We're talking a gap of, what, 4-8 weeks depending on whether you're starting from the SFR launch of the Verizon one? There's no specific advertising in sight. Rubinstein doesn't even talk it up when the spotlight is on him. It's not "stopping" any gap that I can see.
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    #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Here's the disconnect I find with this: It doesn't jibe with the "Man, HP Palm is going to unleash hell at CES!" theory.

    We're talking a gap of, what, 4-8 weeks depending on whether you're starting from the SFR launch of the Verizon one? There's no specific advertising in sight. Rubinstein doesn't even talk it up when the spotlight is on him. It's not "stopping" any gap that I can see.
    The only sense of that I can make is this:

    1) We already paid for the inventory

    2) Let's offload the inventory in a) the only market when someone bought this phone and b) via our website.

    3) Nobody will notice or care besides the hardcore and this will keep the interest of some of them and we can cut some of our losses.

    4) Start a proper relaunch with phone X and with marketing Y in Z.

    I can't see how this makes any sense as a stopgap and I don't think it's likely that HP will showcase anything at CES. I think the proper relaunch and attempt to turn WebOS from a dog to a the backbone of a successful product line will happen later - it might not even be a phone that comes out first.
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    #54  
    Did you see the RIM interview?
    Same concepts (open web, multiple development options - to the metal or high level), but MUCH better delivery!

    I'm not a big fan of AIR in general but you can't argue that he is doing a much better job of divulging important (key) ideas (NFP).

    Ruby blew it AGAIN
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
  15. #55  
    I fully agree with pogeypre on this. I think they are going to treat this as a reboot. Just like they do with movies. If the first series of movies suck, reboot it down the line with better stuff and act like the past movies never existed. As far as taking the Windows Phone 7 way, I agree with this too. Windows released their phone with their OS exactly how they wanted it and with a whole catalog full of apps. Who's to say that when the better devices come out that they wont have WebOS 3.0 on it which could have so much more to it and makes it better than WebOS ALREADY is. I don't see this as an OS problem though because webOS is an awesome OS as it is. I think he mentioned in the interview today that they "expect the number of apps for webOS to grow as HP / Palm invests more resources into the App Catalog." 2.0 and its APIs along with the apps HP apparently has their employees working on will boost the app catalog making the next device release be available with all these new apps people expect. Plus he mentioned (and its not the first time its been mentioned) that next year will bring more than just one device. They're going all out next year and I don't see how people think they aren't doing anything just because they aren't seeing anything NOW.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Well, if the Pre 2 is supposed to be a stop the gap between the current Pre hardware and whatever is coming next year then it isn't working because there is a gap right now with no US carrier offering the Pre line.

    This may ultimately be the difference between a company like HP and a company like Apple. You generally don't line up in front of a store to see the latest HP device because they put out so many - some that stick and plenty that don't. You have to admit, tough, that Apple is focused on their two or three mobile product lines so that each yearly iteration is an event worth paying attention to.
    And fortunately for their current customers, it's for the same carrier.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Almost exactly one year ago:
    These parts stick out like a sore thumb.

    Mr. Rubinstein says he expects developers will write for Palm devices, in part because Palm’s operating system, called webOS, is based largely on the same languages used to design Web sites. Android, by contrast, is based on Sun’s Java language, and Apple uses a variation of the C computer programming language.
    He discounts Android’s chances because, he says, it does not yet have mass appeal. “Android, and the Droid in particular, are designed for the techie audience,” Mr. Rubinstein said. “We are doing a more general product that helps people live their lives seamlessly.”
    “We think the Pixi is in the sweet spot of the market now,” he said. “It was designed for people who are transitioning from feature phones and getting their first smartphone.”
    Mr. Rubinstein said Palm is positioned to grow now that it has completed a revamping after an investment from Elevation Partners, a private equity firm.
    “We did what we said we were going to do,” Mr. Rubinstein said. “We have done a really good job of laying a foundation for the company moving forward. Now we need to move quickly.”
    It's staggering to see someone so wrong about everything.
    Last edited by HelloNNNewman; 11/16/2010 at 02:50 PM.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Well, if the Pre 2 is supposed to be a stop the gap between the current Pre hardware and whatever is coming next year then it isn't working because there is a gap right now with no US carrier offering the Pre line.

    This may ultimately be the difference between a company like HP and a company like Apple. You generally don't line up in front of a store to see the latest HP device because they put out so many - some that stick and plenty that don't. You have to admit, tough, that Apple is focused on their two or three mobile product lines so that each yearly iteration is an event worth paying attention to.
    There's no doubt that previous experience with Palm has adversely affected our trust in them. The one thing I know is that you don't go through what Palm did and then "ready, shoot, aim" again...

    They are either taking the thoughtful approach this time or are just waiting for enough toaster vendors to jump on board with the web connected toaster/printer.
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  19. #59  
    Wow....that Ruby interview.....
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Here's the disconnect I find with this: It doesn't jibe with the "Man, HP Palm is going to unleash hell at CES!" theory.

    We're talking a gap of, what, 4-8 weeks depending on whether you're starting from the SFR launch of the Verizon one? There's no specific advertising in sight. Rubinstein doesn't even talk it up when the spotlight is on him. It's not "stopping" any gap that I can see.
    My comment doesn't jibe with a comment I have never made? Curious.
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