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  1. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #1  
    ogg vorbis is (as you probably know) a free, open-source file format (.ogg) for saving music and sound files. It also saves files with smaller file size and better sound quality than mp3 or other file formats.

    So it would be great to use .ogg on a player like the Pre2 with limited storage.

    Now, I'm wondering: does the Pre2 play ogg vorbis files? I KNOW THE OFFICIAL SPECS DON'T LIST OGG VORBIS! However, I noticed (here's the link) that the Blackberry Torch actually DOES play ogg vorbis (and FLAC), even though these formats aren't listed on the phone's official specs.

    So, I wonder has anyone actually tried playing an ogg vorbis file on the Pre2 to see what happens? I know it's a longshot, but maybe the Pre2 would play vorbis.

    And I have to say also, that for the Pre2 to support "MP3, AAC, AAC+, eAAC+, AMR, QCELP, WAV" but not .ogg is kind of insulting to the open source community. I'm sure there's basically no technical or financial obstacles to supporting ogg--the only question is whether HP regards itself as for or against open source software.
  2. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #2  
    So, now that a few people actually have Pre2's, can someone test this please?
  3. #3  
    webOS 2.0 does not seem to have any new music capabilities. I believe we would have heard of that by now.
  4. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #4  
    Have you tested this kill Dano? I am especially interested to hear from anyone who has tested this.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by hopfrog View Post
    Have you tested this kill Dano? I am especially interested to hear from anyone who has tested this.
    Post a link to an ogg file to DL and I will try it
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       #6  
    Thanks pastorrich1. It probably won't work, of course--but, who knows, we could be in for a surprise like the BB Torch users were...

    Anyway, it looks like there are some sample files that one can download by right clicking to "save link as" available on the vorbis website:

    Vorbis.com: Music

    Thanks again.
  7. #7  
    It wont do ogg so it cannot possibly be subjected to the ringtones found on the Droid Pro.
    Try diplomacy first. You can always conquer them later...

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  8. #8  
    Okay, I tried it. I emailed one of the ogg files to myself. It doesn't play, but it does show up as a music file with a play button. You press play and nothing happens the press pause and it goes back to the play button.

    So it looks like it wants to play it.
  9. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #9  
    Ah, too bad. But thanks a lot for checking, pastorrich. At least now we know for sure. Here's hoping that the open source community manages to get ogg working on WebOS soon!
  10. #10  
    probably need the codec.
  11. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #11  
    As I understand it, the codec for .ogg is freely available. In fact, a lot of progress was made towards getting it on Pre's:

    http://www.precentral.net/gsm-wav-co...e-way#comments

    However, these efforts seemed to sputter out. Hopefully if WebOS starts catching on again we will see renewed efforts to make open source file formats usable on WebOS phones.
  12. #12  
    I hope these efforts don't fizzle out. 99% of my collection is in ogg format and I have no plans of moving off it. Maybe aeroplayer will work under Classic. I will have to try and get classic working and see if I can't get my Pre 2 to play. I'll post back when i've tried it.
  13. #13  
    Ok got Classic working - its seems so clunky on the Pre 2 though lol! Didn't seem that bad on the Tungsten T|X
    Anyhow I got Aeroplayer and aerovorbis plugin and it works!!

    Classic + Aeroplayer + Aerovorbis plugin = Ogg vorbis support for Palm Pre 2!!!

    This is far from an ideal solution.

    Hope someone will sort out true ogg vorbis support on the Pre 2, its ridiculous that we don't have this in 2010!! Come on webOS community we should have this.
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  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by msdavies View Post
    Hope someone will sort out true ogg vorbis support on the Pre 2, its ridiculous that we don't have this in 2010!! Come on webOS community we should have this.
    I had never even heard of the format until a few days ago when I read this thread. I have been active in the tech world for over 20 years now. Not on the media side really, but hardware, software (OS and app) and Network administration.
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  15. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #15  
    msdavies: "its ridiculous that we don't have this in 2010!!" I couldn't agree more.

    Support for Vorbis is generally a way to tell whether a company is sincere in its support of open source software solutions, and HP's lack of support for ogg should therefore be worrying, if not discouraging, to those who support software development on the open source model. I hope the omission of ogg is just an oversight that will be fixed quickly.

    Pastorrich: there are lots of resources for learning about ogg if you wish to use ogg in developing applications. It's a very big deal in the Linux and open source community, since its both open source and superior in important respects to proprietary solutions like mp3/wmv,. etc. It's the standard sound format for Wikipedia and lots of video game developers who don't want to bother using a licensed proprietary format. I hope that you'll consider using and supporting ogg vorbis. (And of course that you're not suggesting that WebOS shouldn't support ogg vorbis simply because you hadn't heard of it until recently!)

    In case others are also wondering about ogg, this Wikipedia article is a great place to start, as is the vorbis website. It's not only Blackberry that's supporting .ogg; Motorola Droid phones play it, along with various Samsung, Symbian and HTC phones. It's surprising indeed that HP hasn't yet included support for ogg vorbis, especially if they want to generate enthusiasm for their platform among the open source developer community.

    The Vorbis format has proven popular among supporters of free software.[18] They argue that its higher fidelity and completely free nature, unencumbered by patents, make it a well-suited replacement for patented and restricted formats like MP3.

    Vorbis has different uses for consumer products. Many video game titles such as 18 Wheels of Steel, Halo, Unreal Tournament 2004, Unreal Tournament 3, Mafia: The City of Lost Heaven, Jets 'n' guns, Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas, Crimsonland, Devil May Cry 3, Live For Speed and Guitar Hero: On Tour store in-game audio as Vorbis. Popular software players support Vorbis playback either natively or through an external plugin. A number of Web sites, including Wikipedia, use it. Others include Jamendo and Mindawn, as well as several national radio stations like JazzRadio, Absolute Radio, NPR, Radio New Zealand and Deutschlandradio. The Spotify audio streaming service uses Vorbis for its audio streams.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by hopfrog View Post
    (And of course that you're not suggesting that WebOS shouldn't support ogg vorbis simply because you hadn't heard of it until recently!)
    No, I wouldn't suggest that, I just don't find it ridiculous that it isn't supported. I hope that WebOS supports everything it can without becoming fragmented or along the fringe of things. Ogg might be a well known open source developer format and for that purpose need support, but it isn't known very well (if at all) among the average consumer.
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  17. #17  
    It is more than simply including an open-source codec for ogg vorbis. According to Ben from Developer Relations, HP has to get special codecs from "their codec supplier" that make use of the DSP in the chipset (each different chipset, the Pixi has a different DSP) to play back the format without using the CPU. The way he phrased it makes me pretty sure that they have to pay them to develop the tailored codecs to include in the OS, even though use of the ogg-vorbis codec itself is free (to my understanding). I am sure it was a bottom-line decision, and there just aren't enough people demanding ogg support to justify the cost, especially at the time they developed the specs for the Pre.

    Regarding ogg itself... I can't remember for sure whether I had heard of it before I got a Samsung MP3 player that supported it back in 2005 or not. However, I rip all of my music in mp3 format because it's supported on all players, so I am not limiting myself (plus I don't use that one anymore, and my current one does not support ogg) to the limited subset of players that do support it.
    Last edited by Grabber5.0; 11/27/2010 at 12:16 PM.
  18. #18  
    Yep, that makes sense. Decoding in software should be easy but would gobble battery. Doing on the DSP is efficient, but the DSP chip has to support it. Costs money for someone to implement it.
  19. hopfrog's Avatar
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       #19  
    Actually, I just noticed that the "Media Handling" section on the HP/Palm Developer center states that .ogg is already supported:

    Playing Audio

    Supported audio formats:

    * Ogg Vorbis
    * mp3
    Link: PDK - Media Handling - HP Palm Developer Center

    _
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by hopfrog View Post
    Actually, I just noticed that the "Media Handling" section on the HP/Palm Developer center states that .ogg is already supported:



    Link: PDK - Media Handling - HP Palm Developer Center

    _
    Interesting... I don't remember seeing anyone report that they were able to play ogg though.
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