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  1. JDELUNA's Avatar
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       #1  
    A few days ago I e-mailed PocketPCTechs and asked if they have looked at a Treo 650 to see if they can do a RAM upgrade. The reply that I got back was that they have not and that they did not have one too look at. Well I told them that I had a brand new Verizon Treo 650 that I got at the begining of October 2005 that I just updated to the latest ROM and that I would send it to them so that they can take a look at it. I just sent it off yesterday and they should receive it either tomorrow or Thursday at the latest. I figure it will take them a few days to look at it and hopefully they will let me know something by the end of next week. I would love to have an upgraded Treo 650 with 128mb or even a 256Mb internal RAM !!! So for now I am using my Samsung i730. I wonder if they can upgrade this too ??? God Bless.
  2. #2  
    Wow, let us know how this goes.
    Jimmie Geddes
  3. #3  
    That is very interesting.

    I've sent in a contact form request to ask if they have any upgrades for it. Hopefully they will get the idea there is interest!
  4. #4  
    I wonder if they can do it, if it will be contiguous memory, or chopped up, with the added memory being mounted as a card.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  5. slinky's Avatar
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    #5  
    Whatever it is, it will not be worth it unfortunately. The solution was for Palm to add another $2.72 worth of RAM into the phone since if you're already spending several hundred dollars on a phone then you'd be happier than heck to have not to worry about RAM problems for $5.
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Whatever it is, it will not be worth it unfortunately. The solution was for Palm to add another $2.72 worth of RAM into the phone since if you're already spending several hundred dollars on a phone then you'd be happier than heck to have not to worry about RAM problems for $5.
    An incremental update would have cost them real dollars.

    Follow this example. The price point for the phone is $599. They sell 1 million units. Your $2.72 upgrade would cost them $2.72million. They would not change the price point to be $601.72 or $604. So that $2.72million comes out of their bottom line....pure profit loss.

    This is the sad reality of the situation. If people would not buy it with only 32mb, they would have increased it, but since it would sell that way, that's what they offer. They are not making these things because they think they're are "cool". They are a business trying to make as much money as possible.
    "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen."
    - Albert Einstein
  7. DHart's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraOrdinaryJo
    This is the sad reality of the situation. If people would not buy it with only 32mb, they would have increased it, but since it would sell that way, that's what they offer. They are not making these things because they think they're are "cool". They are a business trying to make as much money as possible.
    Thank you, Jo. Right on the money. Palm is a company trying to make money. When we hear whining here about how stupid Palm is for not doing this or not doing that, I ask myself what each of the whiners would do if they were placed in Palm's shoes. Palm has to generate enough profit to fund the next generation of phones, turn on the lights at the offices, pay for the heat, etc. And yes, the employees like to eat out, go on vacations, and buy nice cars just like the rest of us.

    Now if those idiots would just add WiFi. http://discussion.treocentral.com/im...es/biggrin.gif
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraOrdinaryJo
    An incremental update would have cost them real dollars.

    Follow this example. The price point for the phone is $599. They sell 1 million units. Your $2.72 upgrade would cost them $2.72million. They would not change the price point to be $601.72 or $604. So that $2.72million comes out of their bottom line....pure profit loss.

    This is the sad reality of the situation. If people would not buy it with only 32mb, they would have increased it, but since it would sell that way, that's what they offer. They are not making these things because they think they're are "cool". They are a business trying to make as much money as possible.
    Throw a little math at that...

    Your projected sales:1 Million Units = $599,000,000
    Cost of Additional Ram: $2.72/unit = $2,720,000
    Pure Profit Loss: .45%

    For yucks, though, consider that the increased memory could trigger a half of one percent growth in additional sales (.5%)...

    Increased sales: 5,000 Units@$599 = $2,995,000
    Subtract cost of add'l RAM in 1,005,000 units: $2,733,600

    ADDITIONAL PROFIT! = $261,400

    Okay, that is all just fun! And it doesn't mean anymore than your post did...

    Palm IS making a TON of money on the Treos (and using it to bolster its dying PDA business).

    There are a lot of elements that go into product design/manufacturing/cost/price/marketing...

    The reason it didn't have more memory is that additional memory is NOT an "incremental update" on the Treo platform--it is a new product!

    They didn't want to redesign the ENTIRE product and RE-WRITE all the software too.

    Palm is in CASH COW mode and that won't be changing with the 700w either.

    That means YOU get milked...

    Stated a little differently...and Palm has alluded to this before...the Treo isn't really a "platform"--it is a "one-off device". That is part of why it has to be so painstakingly modified for every network carrier.

    And that is a major reason the 700w will be more like the 650 than a "next gen" version...

    To paraphrase Secretary Rumsfeld, you don't make money building a NEW device for WM5--you make money by shoehorning WM5 into the hardware device you have.
    Last edited by delta_baggage; 11/02/2005 at 01:26 PM. Reason: decimals suck ;~)
  9. #9  
    I hope you are talking about upgrading the real RAM, not the NVFS disk. NVFS disk is same as SD card, so it doesn't worth upgrading at all. But the real RAM is only 32MB, of which only 10MB is available for program use. I do hope it can be upgraded to at least 64MB, so that we have 42MB for real use.
    Treo 750 unbranded T-mobile, HTC WIZARD 8125 T-MOBILE (broken), Treo 650 T-mobile 1.43/1.14 OS 5.4.8 Garnet (sold).
    Dell X50v, X30 624Mhz and HP ipaq h2210 h1945.

    Treo 750 hacks thread.
  10. JDELUNA's Avatar
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       #10  
    Ok got word that they recieved my TREO 650 and have opened it already.........Good news and Bad news, here is the e-mail that I received and my reply back to him:

    Yes I believe that is what I had for FREE MEMORY as there was only about 32Mb total. Let me post this on the Treo Forum and maybe someone could help answer your question as to where else to go or do. Thanks for letting me know.



    Thanks,

    JULIAN
    ______________________________________


    Hi Julian,

    Ok. Good news and bad news.

    We've removed the RAM chip, checked out the motherboard and the physical line is there to see more memory.

    So we've upgraded the system. But I don't think it's recognizing it. It shows 22.4MB total memory. Is that what was there before? I've never played with the Palm OS so I'm not sure where to go from here.

    any suggestions.

    Thanks,

    Leonard
  11. JDELUNA's Avatar
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       #11  
    Any suggestions from anyone ???
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by jdeluna
    Ok got word that they recieved my TREO 650 and have opened it already.........Good news and Bad news, here is the e-mail that I received and my reply back to him:

    Yes I believe that is what I had for FREE MEMORY as there was only about 32Mb total. Let me post this on the Treo Forum and maybe someone could help answer your question as to where else to go or do. Thanks for letting me know.



    Thanks,

    JULIAN
    ______________________________________


    Hi Julian,

    Ok. Good news and bad news.

    We've removed the RAM chip, checked out the motherboard and the physical line is there to see more memory.

    So we've upgraded the system. But I don't think it's recognizing it. It shows 22.4MB total memory. Is that what was there before? I've never played with the Palm OS so I'm not sure where to go from here.

    any suggestions.

    Thanks,

    Leonard

    Post it over to Shadowmite's site. If anyone will be interested and have an idea how to proceed it will be Shadowmite. He's the Treo Wizard.
  13. JDELUNA's Avatar
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       #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by jgm
    Post it over to Shadowmite's site. If anyone will be interested and have an idea how to proceed it will be Shadowmite. He's the Treo Wizard.

    Thanks I just did that Hopefully he will have some suggestions, I did send instructions to PPCTECHS for them to do a HARD RESET to see if it will see the new memory if they have not done that already. God Bless.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by jdeluna
    Ok got word that they recieved my TREO 650 and have opened it already.........Good news and Bad news, here is the e-mail that I received and my reply back to him:

    Yes I believe that is what I had for FREE MEMORY as there was only about 32Mb total. Let me post this on the Treo Forum and maybe someone could help answer your question as to where else to go or do. Thanks for letting me know.



    Thanks,

    JULIAN
    ______________________________________


    Hi Julian,

    Ok. Good news and bad news.

    We've removed the RAM chip, checked out the motherboard and the physical line is there to see more memory.

    So we've upgraded the system. But I don't think it's recognizing it. It shows 22.4MB total memory. Is that what was there before? I've never played with the Palm OS so I'm not sure where to go from here.

    any suggestions.

    Thanks,

    Leonard

    They need check the dbcache. They may already got 42mb dbcache, but they don't know. I can say that they don't know the difference between NVFS and RAM. 22.4MB is the ROM, for PPC.
    Last edited by cellneuron; 11/03/2005 at 01:39 AM.
    Treo 750 unbranded T-mobile, HTC WIZARD 8125 T-MOBILE (broken), Treo 650 T-mobile 1.43/1.14 OS 5.4.8 Garnet (sold).
    Dell X50v, X30 624Mhz and HP ipaq h2210 h1945.

    Treo 750 hacks thread.
  15. #15  
    PalmOS doesnt recognize it but WM5 does. Too bad, WM5 is device's specific or it won't run.
  16. #16  
    All I can say is I am watching this thread like a hawk..

    I am very interested in getting more memory.
  17. #17  
    From what you post in shadowsite, I can say you don't know the memory structure in treo 650. Treo 650 has 32MB ROM, in which 9MB is reserved for zipped system OS, the rest (22.4MB) is for NVFS (same as ROM in PPC) disk. Treo 650 also has 32MB RAM, in which 22MB has been reserved for unzipped system, the rest (10MB) is for program use (Dbcache) (Same as free program RAM in PPC). Since PocketPctech guys already replaced one memory chip, but still can run the treo 650, it means they didn't touch the 32MB ROM at all (otherwise there is no OS). What they replaced is RAM, which can only be observed by checking DBCACHE. The 22.4MB they saw is ROM, which of course has no change.

    You may email them to check the dbcache using dbcache tools. I am pretty sure they already succeeded in upgrading your treo 650.
    Treo 750 unbranded T-mobile, HTC WIZARD 8125 T-MOBILE (broken), Treo 650 T-mobile 1.43/1.14 OS 5.4.8 Garnet (sold).
    Dell X50v, X30 624Mhz and HP ipaq h2210 h1945.

    Treo 750 hacks thread.
  18. #18  
    They should run Memory Info (attached) on the "upgraded" device after doing a hard reset and see what the numbers are for Storage Heap (FLash), NVFS Cache (RAM), and Dynamic Heap (RAM).

    Perhaps things will just "magically" increase.

    -Warr
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Progress? Well, at least I can get color traffic maps now...
    Psion 3a -> Psion 3c -> Palm IIIXE -> Palm VIIx -> Kyocera 7135 -> Treo 650 -> Centro
  19. JDELUNA's Avatar
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       #19  
    Everyone thanks for your suggestion and I will pass that file MEMROYINFO.PRC on to them to have them check. I will try to keep everyone updated. Please keep the suggestions coming. God Bless.
  20. #20  
    Okay - here I go exposing my ignorance, but isn't what you are all calling RAM actually shadowed in the NVFS; that's why it's persistent? If that is so, don't you have to upgrade both in order to exceed the 22.4 you're seeing?
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
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