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  1. slinky's Avatar
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       #1  
    I need to vent amongst fellow Treo owners VZW subscribers. I hate Verizon Wireless. They have wasted too much of my life. Since I was switched to a Treo 600 and found out that my $5 per month "pay for time" usage was no longer available, I have gone through billing hell.

    I only found out about the "new" VZW $45 unlimited plan months later after receiving my Treo 600 since nobody at VZW tells you. I never signed up for a new plan because VZW replaced my Smartphone Samsung i600 that cost me too much in software and put itself into neverending loops (even with hard resets) five times. Thus I ended up with crazy bills the next four months because VZW reps kept claiming my phone was automatically connecting once a day with the Treo -- it was laughably bad that for months the VZW reps didn't understand jack with regard to how the Treo works and that it didn't "automatically connect once a day and not hang up" but that my plan was switched because the Treo didn't use the old network any more, at least that is what I understand after all was sorted out after speaking to perhaps 20 people at that time.

    Now in the months that followed I had an unlimited account for a month or two, switched to a pay as you go, and then in August I got an unlimited. Well, EVERY damned month Verizon bills me for usage. I go through the bloody charade with VZW reps calling me to make payments when I shouldn't. I just got a $1,300 credit after speaking to customer service for who knows what time after my phone was turned off because the credits were not being properly applied to my phone.

    Get this month's bill. $359. Another damned call to VZW. It's ridiculous.

    Now I need to make a choice. I have unlimited mobile to mobile with my family, all of whom have VZW plans. That really keeps you in the network. I realize we don't even use it that much so maybe switching now would be a perfect time. I'm considering Sprint in the NYC area and don't know what current coverage is like. T-Mobile is definitely out because my friends can't even get a signal in Central Park, the middle of Manhattan. That is completely absurd and unacceptable. Haven't had Cingular/AT&T so I can't vouch for them.

    I do know this... unless the next Treo has WiFi in some capacity I will not get one. $45 per month for data access is out of control. I have a WiFi subscription and can jack in at many locations in the city making the EVDO/Wireless benefit relatively meaningless and an extra cost. I wonder when the next one is coming out and at what price. I think I will shortly make (1) the move to another provider with help from people here and (2) will have to consider whether the just jet the Palm devices forever as well and consider another device...

    Thanks for listening and thoughts on the above questions concerning providers in NYC are appreciated.
  2. #2  
    Hey... I feel bad for what you've been through. I also agree that 45/mo for data access is a blatant rip off. But to verizons credit, and I've been a custome with them for years, my billing has always been right on and I'm pleased to say they've always been very helpful and responsive.

    They should be able to give you a plan that you can count on.
  3. #3  
    Sprint has free sprint to sprint calls. And I pay like $15 for unlimited internet and emails.

    I've a gal who works in the city (Estee Lauder). She's a "bridge and tunnel" person. I often speak to her while she's on foot in the city. The only time I have issues is when she's in Penn. She gets a signal, but the background noise is too loud to hear thru. I have talked to her several times while she's on a train.

    Go find a Sprint rep, and tell them yer woes, and that "gee, I wish there was an alternative...", he'll figure out a way to get you into Sprint
  4. #4  
    I have tmo and it works just fine in CP. In fact, I have been with T-mo/Voicestream for over 5 years and have been very happy. Coverage in the boonies of upstate NY is spotty, but I have not had problems anywhere in NYC. In fact, my phone seems to work many places my non-tmo friend's doesnt. You really should rethink tmo. It is a great value. Don't forget the ability to get unlimited data for 2.99/mo.
    Factory unlocked/unbranded GSM 650 - Tmobile; FW: 1.71; SW: 1.20-ENA; Carrier DB: 255; HW: A

    If I'm repeating what someone has already said look at how long the thread is and ask yourself if you really expect me to read the whole thing.
  5. #5  
    I've been a Verizon customer for years, and I've really like the service. I really don't have any problems with a signal anywhere except the subways, and even in most stations I can get a signal and surf the internet. The unlimited data plan is admittedly expensive, although they are offering new plans now that give a little bit of a discount.



    I've had terrible problems with Sprint Customer Service and reception in the past, so I'm not going back to them. I'm closely watching the GSM people to see if they're NYC coverage eventually comes up to par. So far, many people on GSM say they have good coverage, but usually don't realize how much better coverage is with Verizon.
  6. #6  
    Verizon just f'd up my bill and charged me an extra $1000 for last month (I guess they forgot I've been paying $45 a month for unlimited data) It's taken them over a week to get it fixed now and it's still not taken care of.

    Yes, I hate them, but I don't think there's anyone that much better, honesty.
  7. Pierce02's Avatar
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    #7  
    Slinky you can create a new network connection that connects to nothing and thus avoid the unwanted connections.
    On another note. I have been with six wireless customers in twelve years, they all make mistakes but Verizon has been the best, quickest and most responsive in correcting their mistakes. Good luck to you with your problem.
  8. #8  
    Wow...sounds like Verizon doesn't have their $hit together...I don't think Sprint has ever screwed up my bill, except for the one time I say no to adding a line, but they added it anyways, but luckily it was free for the first month, so I just cancelled with no charges or refunds necessary.

    I have heard more billing issues with Verizon than Carter has pills.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by MadlyAlive
    Wow...sounds like Verizon doesn't have their $hit together...I don't think Sprint has ever screwed up my bill, except for the one time I say no to adding a line, but they added it anyways, but luckily it was free for the first month, so I just cancelled with no charges or refunds necessary.

    I have heard more billing issues with Verizon than Carter has pills.
    In the last year I have had 2 billing periods where the charges were correct. I usually look forward to calling Sprint and reaming them for over charging me by an average of $100. I am always remain calm and couteous on the phone and I usually end up getting something for free or a credit.
    Who am I, sir? A Utah man am I A Utah man, sir, and will be till I die!
  10. slinky's Avatar
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       #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Pierce02
    Slinky you can create a new network connection that connects to nothing and thus avoid the unwanted connections.
    On another note. I have been with six wireless customers in twelve years, they all make mistakes but Verizon has been the best, quickest and most responsive in correcting their mistakes. Good luck to you with your problem.
    Actually... you can't. This is a wonderful new scam cooked up by the biz dev department. I tried doing that but they told me that now their computers will not accept "no data plan" and you only have a choice of "pay as you go" and simply not use it. In this way Verizon can rape you blind for mistaken connections that happened all too often with Treo 600s right out of the box...

    Thanks for all your comments. In a way you are correct since all of the providers have their issues but my problem seems that my record, like sunspot_mike's, are in some area of their system where they just have little control. It's like a vicious cycle that will continue to consume you until excised.

    As far as signal goes, I had a Sprint phone for a while and reception was very decent in NYC, although Verizon did have somewhat better coverage. But for $15/mo internet access I'd consider Sprint. TMobile... well... maybe it was the phone he was using. Will take another look and yes, that data plan at $3 is amazing and tempting.

    I wonder how much of these "errors" aren't a part of the new business paradigm of the 21st century -- "creating" new revenue streams via the rebate methodology. Find ways to "erroneously" charge consumers and make it as difficult as possible without inciting a class action lawsuit to get that money back...
  11. #11  
    I have to admit that VZW's $25 for 10 mb and $45 for unlimited is high compared to others but regarding all other factors, I prefer them over the rest. I've been with practically all the other carriers when it came to just cell phones and was never happy. I like the *228 feature to update the phone's programming and above all else my recent experience with them fortified my devotion. I had called VZW to see if I was able to upgrade to a new phone (the 650). After being told I could and hanging up with the rep, he calls me back telling me that he took a look at our family plan usage and said we can actually save money by going to a newer, cheaper plan with more minutes as part of the package. Good times. It is unacceptable when they f-up like they did with slinky's situation. Good thing it was caught and hopefully it can be fixed some way or another.
  12. #12  
    Okay, I have been through all this. There is an issue, but it is not a faulty billing system per se.

    Let me give you an analogy. Suppose you go into a restaraunt and order the lunch special for $4.95. Your friend orders off the menu without looking at the prices assuming that a menu item will be a few dollars more than a lunch special. You get the bill and the menu item was $10,000.

    That is what Verizon is doing.

    So, if unlimited is $45 you would assume that if you used the internet all month with pay as you go, it would cost $50 or something a little more.

    In fact if you left your phone connected to the internet all month the cost would be thousands and thousands.

    1) If they can charge you $45 for unlimited and make a profit, charging thousands for the same service is unethical.

    2) If you sign up for pay as you go they double charge you for things like picture messages. A picture message will cost you the per picture charge and the data charge. When I try to argue that if I had a phone without internet then I would only be charged once, they argue that in fact I would be charged voice air time. But if I have unlimited voice, there is essentially no charge.

    Now let us look at $25 for 10mb. 10mb can be used up in like a few minutes. So again, I feel that kind of charge is unethical considering unlimited is $45.
  13. slinky's Avatar
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       #13  
    professordave, I don't agree with you at all respectfully. With the change from my Smartphone to my Treo, they simply didn't tell me that I was getting a different more expensive service. The reps were given training from the top down to parrot some stupid crap about how the Treo connects to the Internet once a day and you have to be responsible for the charges because it never disconnects. (I noticed that once a day it DOES seem to connect automatically (at night) in my sync cradle to something. But it doesn't do the above and my charges had nothing to do with that fact)

    Here is what Verizon did which is what many other companies in the US do. I would love to add "flogging executives and other decisionmakers" into the penal code. They should be paddled with impunity for this.

    I call this the "rebate scam." The companies make all sorts of "errors" in your bill and you are required to correct them or you pay it without realizing and have little or no recourse months later if you do. These days it's really easy to have "programming errors." This is a source of "found revenue" and in some cases it's more subtle, like a notice in the mail that looks like junk mail to you about some change in service that you only realize later or in others it's more direct and completely illegal but it's difficult to prove and prosecute unless someone really takes the time to do so. In many web sites it's about having a subscription to some service you never really wanted. You then discover that it has been billing on your credit card quarterly for the past year. You'll get one of the four charges back because it was your responsibility to check every of your numerous charges each month. Regarding your phone bill, same thing. For me, I'd need a full time secretary. These companies know this. Now I'm not saying it's always deliberate but it SURE is fishy when my bill keeps changing from unlimited internet to pay as you go SEVERAL times. It keeps happening even when my bill is corrected. For this past month, if I didn't take notice of the separate data charge I would have thought I missed last month's payment and was paying for 2 months. I'm glad I caught it.

    I'm also glad I live in the 70s and 80s. In the 21st century, everything is a scam and I don't see the "greed is good" ethos changing. Long gone are the days when people "made money the old fashioned way... they earned it."
  14. #14  
    Cell phone companies are criminals.

    In the past twenty years, American consumers have made a choice: lower prices are better than quality customer service. When we have problems, we pay in our time and sanity what we could have paid from our wallets in the beginning by choosing the companies with better customer service over the just the cheapest thing we could find.

    I adore the Treo. I might get carpal tunnel from how much I use it (gotta get the Palm keyboard), so I went with unlimited data right away. They still f'd up my charges. Verizon fixed my bill today, but it's about the fifth time I've had to have them adjust it. And they don't refund the taxes until the next month when they adust your bill.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by sunspot_mike
    Cell phone companies are criminals.

    In the past twenty years, American consumers have made a choice: lower prices are better than quality customer service. When we have problems, we pay in our time and sanity what we could have paid from our wallets in the beginning by choosing the companies with better customer service over the just the cheapest thing we could find.

    I adore the Treo. I might get carpal tunnel from how much I use it (gotta get the Palm keyboard), so I went with unlimited data right away. They still f'd up my charges. Verizon fixed my bill today, but it's about the fifth time I've had to have them adjust it. And they don't refund the taxes until the next month when they adust your bill.
    This post made me think of Exxon's 9.9 Billion dollar profit annouced today...we're all suckers!
    Who am I, sir? A Utah man am I A Utah man, sir, and will be till I die!
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by elder_shawn
    This post made me think of Exxon's 9.9 Billion dollar profit annouced today...we're all suckers!
    Big difference between f-ing up a bill and overcharging you than charging a premium on a high, in demand good.
  17. slinky's Avatar
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       #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by arabian
    Big difference between f-ing up a bill and overcharging you than charging a premium on a high, in demand good.
    Agreed. Unfortunately the end result is the same... the little and average guy wrongly pays up the wazoo.
  18. #18  
    I too have had horrible experiences with Verizon Wireless, though not with their landline service. When they decided to mysteriously overcharge my wife nearly a thousand dollars when she upgraded her phone (somehow this messed up her free Verizon in network feature and who knows what else?), and refused to refund it after a crazy wild goose chase trying to get this resolved, we took the early termination hit and now she is on Sprint.

    On the other hand, I have had these sorts of bad experiences with most cell phone service providers, so it's hard to single out Verizon Wireless. I think cellular providers hate their customers. They're all bad.

    Sprint has been good, so far anyways.
    -Carl Gundel, author of Liberty BASIC
    http://www.libertybasic.com
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Agreed. Unfortunately the end result is the same... the little and average guy wrongly pays up the wazoo.
    Then let's lynch the florists the day after Valentines.
  20. slinky's Avatar
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       #20  
    Just looked at the latest bill Verizon sent me. Apparently Verizon's billing mistakes are worse than I thought. VZW has been billing me $45 per month for the unlimited data plan -- and they have that correctly on my bill. Then they have also been charging me for data used! Apparently the bug in their system is worse than just switching my plan...

    Looks like it may be time to move from them but I may wait just a tad longer. I have a huge investment in Palm software which is very sad since my next device will probably be a PPC. With Palm deciding to continue to play silly games with consumers and not offer a device with considerably more RAM and built-in WiFi (requiring me to continue to play up the wazoo for a wireless data plan), game is about over. With the 700w coming out I think it also spells a death knell for Palm OS... and the fact that skype hasn't been considered in the works for the Palm for over a year says just how important WiFi is and where the industry might think of the future of the Palm OS...
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