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  1. #21  
    Most of the issues I see as "preferences" that some may prefer either way, but this I'll comment on. I am not saying they are non issues for you....these are non issues for me though:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    1. Treo600 is by far more stable and had fewer hardware issues than the Treo650. This by the way is after the Firmware UPDATES.
    With maybe 2 resets that weren't caused by a rougue program (beta or known conflict), I can't say that stability is an issue with the Treo 650.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    2. Memory issues with the Treo650. Fortunately now resolved via the firmware updates.
    I am at 14.6 free w/ 106 programs nstalled....my memory update hasn't been officially released as yet so I expect I'll ahve even more room two weeks from now..

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    4. The Connector on the Treo600 was much better.
    Non issue for me, I only use a cradle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    6. The seperate Power Off/On button on top is missing on the Treo650.
    Non issue for me, can't think of why I'd want to turn it off....I'm getting a week between charges and it shuts itself down when I go to sleep.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    13. The Treo600 did not require you to have to open the back to reset it. Considering the number of times the Treo650 needs a reset, it really is a pain.
    Neither does the 650. Crash, Uninstall and other programs let you do this via the screen.
  2. #22  
    I think there is a need to remind people that the topic of this thread is "Things which were better on the Treo 600" and not whether these things are an issue for any one person in particular.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    With maybe 2 resets that weren't caused by a rougue program (beta or known conflict), I can't say that stability is an issue with the Treo 650.
    Stability with the Treo650 for a very large number of people is definately an issue, although it might not be so in your case. My statement was made in the context of a comparison between the Treo600 and Treo650 and I am sure, quite a few people will agree with me that as a comparison between the two, the Treo650 definately does have stability issues. Whether those issues effect everyone or one person in particular is not the point here.


    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I am at 14.6 free w/ 106 programs nstalled....my memory update hasn't been officially released as yet so I expect I'll ahve even more room two weeks from now.
    No offence, but I guess if you don't install any third party software, then even 8mb would be more than enough. But then again as a comparison between the two models, the fact remains that up until the firmware updates, memory was definately an issue. Quite simply put, I was unable to install the same amount of things on the Treo650 as I already had on my Treo600. That too me sir sounds like a major step back. By the way if there was no memory issue to begin with, then I wonder what is it that PalmOne is hoping to fix by the firmware update and I wonder where all this memory being reclaimed by people is coming from after applying the update.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Non issue for me, I only use a cradle.
    But that still does not change the fact that the connector on the Treo 600 was much better than that on the Treo 650. Again, I mean no offence, but that's like saying that since I use a handsfree kit, the speaker quality on the Treo 650 does not matter. I am sure the vast majority of Treo 650 users will never even buy a cradle and therefore to them this does matter. I hope you are not suggesting that every one must buy a cradle.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Non issue for me, can't think of why I'd want to turn it off....I'm getting a week between charges and it shuts itself down when I go to sleep.
    That is the whole point, I don't want to turn it off. But due to the placement of the power on/off button I and also others on this forum end up inadvertantly turning the phone off at times. Not to mention that is one less button that I can configure to my liking.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Neither does the 650. Crash, Uninstall and other programs let you do this via the screen.
    But what about the times when the Treo 650 just freezes up, therefore obviously one cannot even access the programs that allow you to reset, even crash does not work at such times. Thus one ends up having to remove the back cover and then reset. I am sure this frequent removing of the back cover is going to take it's toll, and just like and old remote battery cover, the treo back cover will also become lose.
    Last edited by Sanjay; 05/09/2005 at 03:45 PM.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
    TouchPad WiFi (32GB) - webOS 3.0.5 build 86
    App Catalog (US) - Vodafone (India)

    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    I think there is a need to remind people that the topic of this thread is "Things which were better on the Treo 600" and not whether these things are an issue for anyone person in particular.
    Sorry, I just don't see the sense in that. Put another way, I take it that the topic of the thread is "Things that one person thinks were better on the Treo and if anyone disagrees it's off topic." I am saying that design decisions were made to provide features that they deemed were more important to the community and felt, as I do, that many of these things were non issues for most people.

    Stability is an issue of compatability. The 600 / 650 doesn't enter into play here. When Palm program vendors "upgraded" their programs for the 650, they had basically litle to do. To upgrade programs for the 650 however they ahd to deal with a whole new file system......BIG difference and vendors are still catching up. The stability issues have been found to be associated with, in order:

    1. Incompatable Programs
    2. Carrier Issues (fixed by ROM upodates)
    3. Occassional lemons

    I don't knoiw how having 106 programs on my Treo can be described as "not installing any 3rd party software". But in my work as a licensed engineer, every desoign has tradeoffs. The same is true for product engineering. People are paying $2.75 a gallon for gas and they clamor for something that gets better mileage. Then they conmplain that their new subcompact doesn't seat 6 adults, the dog and enough luggage for a two week camping trip. Palm made a decision the make data integrity a high priority feature and this cut down on memory size. Once program vendors catch up and get their programs to work off the card, this issue should disappear.

    Again, does design have to be the best possible or be adequate for the purpose intended. I may design a building with an 8" beam and someone else might design it with a 6". If it only has to be 6" to support the intended load, what's the difference ? What's better a connector that will last 5 years or one that will last 10 years. The answer is obvious but who is going to be using their Treo 650 5 years from now ? I have a Wang APC computer built in 1983 in my office....it stll runs. They don't make them like that anymore but since all the resty of my PC's are on the trash heap after 4 years, that kind of longevity isn't important to me. Judging by the fact that just about every where you go, the cradle is out of stock, I'd say there is a pretty high demand for the cradle.

    I'm not sure I understand. If you never want to turn of the Treo, why do you want a power button ?

    I have had to take off the cover once and that was after I was stuck in a continuous loop after a ROM upgrade. I had to do a hard reset, so I took off the cover. The othe rtime I took it off was toc stick a towlette thingie under the cover for emergency screen cleaning and to stop the wiggle. Now there's an issue they shoulda cought preproduction....A bigger felt pad wa sneeded there.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I'm not sure I understand. If you never want to turn of the Treo, why do you want a power button ?
    Since the Treo 600's top power button was next to the antenna, it was hard to just bump into it and accidentally turn the phone on or off if it's in your pocket or in a bag. The front face buttons are much easier to hit, however.

    Also, I think the main point (as Sanjay already said) is that since there is no dedicated power button on top, palmOne instead took away the configurability of one of the front buttons.
  5.    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    Are you sure that is how it works? Personally I don't find any difference between the Treo600 and the Treo650 on this issue. They both behave exactly the same way depending on what preference you have selected in 'Display Preferences - Treo600' or 'General Preferences - Treo 650'.
    hm, perhaps I'm really a dumbhead, but I went through all the option menus in the phone application and the preferences folder and I cannot find this setting anywhere. Where EXACTLY is this? I have an Orange phone - perhaps they have "optimized" this away?
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by ursli71
    hm, perhaps I'm really a dumbhead, but I went through all the option menus in the phone application and the preferences folder and I cannot find this setting anywhere. Where EXACTLY is this? I have an Orange phone - perhaps they have "optimized" this away?
    I am not sure this applies to 'Orange' optimized phones since I recall seeing somewhere that they have a differently designd hompage. I have the Unlocked Generic GSM Treo650 so I can only tell you how to according to my phone.

    While in the Phone application, press the menu button. Then go to the Options Tab, there you should find the option 'General Preferences'.

    I hope this helps.
    Last edited by Sanjay; 05/11/2005 at 02:17 PM.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
    TouchPad WiFi (32GB) - webOS 3.0.5 build 86
    App Catalog (US) - Vodafone (India)

    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Sorry, I just don't see the sense in that. Put another way, I take it that the topic of the thread is "Things that one person thinks were better on the Treo and if anyone disagrees it's off topic." I am saying that design decisions were made to provide features that they deemed were more important to the community and felt, as I do, that many of these things were non issues for most people.
    You have every right to disagree, but if you were to say that you prefer something on the Treo 650 over the Treo 600, then it is relevant to this thread, but if you merely state that it is not an issue for you, for eg. "Non issue for me, I only use a cradle.", then it is not relevant to this thread. Since, that only suggests an indefference to something that does not effect you, but it is not taking a stance one way or the other.


    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I don't knoiw how having 106 programs on my Treo can be described as "not installing any 3rd party software"...... Palm made a decision the make data integrity a high priority feature and this cut down on memory size. Once program vendors catch up and get their programs to work off the card, this issue should disappear.
    Maybe I am just dumb, but can you please suggest how I can make programs that need to sync with my PC, do so while residing on the SD Card, for eg. almost anything with it's own sync conduit. Or for that matter how do I make programs like 'Uninstall, Backup, TreoGuard, Lightwave, etc. etc. etc... work while they are installed only on the SD Card.


    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Again, does design have to be the best possible or be adequate for the purpose intended. I may design a building with an 8" beam and someone else might design it with a 6". If it only has to be 6" to support the intended load, what's the difference ? What's better a connector that will last 5 years or one that will last 10 years. The answer is obvious but who is going to be using their Treo 650 5 years from now ? I have a Wang APC computer built in 1983 in my office....it stll runs. They don't make them like that anymore but since all the resty of my PC's are on the trash heap after 4 years, that kind of longevity isn't important to me. Judging by the fact that just about every where you go, the cradle is out of stock, I'd say there is a pretty high demand for the cradle.
    The issue is not how much the cradle is in demand, which by the way could be because it might now be a neccessity to cope with the poorly designed connector as suggested by you. Anyhow, I am still wondering how does any of this explain the need for PalmOne to redisgn the connector to begin with. After all there should be a purpose for doing so, right? What might these hidden advantages of the new connecor be? As per your arguement, PalmOne realized that there was no need for a robust connector like the one on the Treo600 and therefore they set out to redisgn one that would last a shorter period of time. Also, you seem to suggest that now we all be required to buy the cradle just so the poorly designed connector will last. Hmm.. maybe PalmOne ought to just make it mandatory or better yet simply package the cradle with the phone and jack up the price another $80.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I'm not sure I understand. If you never want to turn of the Treo, why do you want a power button ?.
    As 'stickb0y' so aptly has already pointed out, with the Treo600 the power button was placed in a manner that I 'Never' in my one year of usage, accidentaly turned off my Treo 600. Whereas with the Treo 650 I have, and others have reported the same, inadvertanty turned off the phone several times, during just 2 months of usage. By the way I always keep my phone in my pant pockets and maybe that has something to do with this. I hope you won't suggest that I simply stop keeping the phone in my pocket.

    Another thing, having one less configurable button on front is certainly a loss for myself and I am sure to many others also.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I have had to take off the cover once and that was after I was stuck in a continuous loop after a ROM upgrade. I had to do a hard reset, so I took off the cover. The othe rtime I took it off was toc stick a towlette thingie under the cover for emergency screen cleaning and to stop the wiggle. Now there's an issue they shoulda cought preproduction....A bigger felt pad wa sneeded there.
    I am glad you are so fortunate as to have a trouble free Treo 650, but others, and quite a few of us, are not so fortunate. The fact is that I am on my second Treo 650 and the damn thing crashes atleast 8 - 10 times a day, it was the same with the first one. By the way, before you put the blame on "third pary software", let me tell you that I have tried the Treo 650 for over a week absolutely 'virgin', meaning with absolutely nothing installed other than what comes preinstalled. The percentage of 'lemons', as you call them, in the case of the Treo 650 is too large by any standards. Please go thru all the complaint threads regarding the Treo 600 and compare that to the threads with complaints about the Treo 650 and it should give you an idea as to which is more stable.
    Last edited by Sanjay; 05/09/2005 at 04:40 PM.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
    TouchPad WiFi (32GB) - webOS 3.0.5 build 86
    App Catalog (US) - Vodafone (India)

    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  8.    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjay
    While in the Phone application, press the menu button. Then go to the Options Tab, there you should find the option 'General Preferences'.
    On my Orange phone, there is no such menu item. There is just "Sound preferences" and "Call preferences". No wonder I couldn't find the option!! I really wonder why they have to "Optimize away" things like that! I'm going to complain to Orange.


    I wonder, which preferences can you set in "General Preferences" apart from the one in question? I want to know what else I miss...
  9. #29  
    In the 'Treo 180/180g and Treo 270/300', upon pressing the keyboard keys, the phone was able to figure out whether you were making a search in Contacts or you were dialling a number and did the appropriate task automatically.
    I don't know if this is what you mean, but on mine (set to Typing Starts Contracts search), if I start dialing a number with only the number keys, it displays both the number and the letters at the top of the phone (while displaying the contacts), when it gets to the point where it can no longer be a contact (typically after 3 numbers), it switches back the phone screen.
  10. #30  
    When you're looking at the week, and you see all those various boxes and things that represent meetings, and you see the blue 'active' lines are essentially 'framing' the view of the week, press the center key - that will take the focus from the week as a whole, to each day. You can THEN scroll from day to day, and from meeting to meeting. In other words, using the navigator, you can roll from day to day, and from meeting to meeting WITHIN each day. Once you've landed on a specific meeting, on a specific day, you can then press the Center again, to go to and open THAT specific meeting on THAT specific day.
    That is a great tip, a much better way to look through my calendar.

    Also, make sure you're categorizing your events, with color codes - that way, when you're looking at the week (as well as month), you can get a good clue about each day's actions.
    I already do this in Outlook 2003 - does anyone know if there is a way to get the info mapped over via ActiveExchange to the calendar?
    Last edited by geneld; 05/11/2005 at 06:10 AM. Reason: fixed quiote tags
  11. #31  
    you guys don't use agendus it seems? I thought that was the end-all for the calendar/to do database
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Heinrich
    you guys don't use agendus it seems? I thought that was the end-all for the calendar/to do database
    For me, Agendus USED to be the be-all-end-all of calendaring applications. But since I got my Treo, I wanted less bloat-ware and something a lot MORE stable, so I switched to Datebk5 and haven't looked back. Yeah, Datebk5 is a lot more simple in terms of GUI, but it is a lot more stable (even when only in a beta) and is less bloated than Agendus.

    Just my $0.02.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by geneld
    I don't know if this is what you mean, but on mine (set to Typing Starts Contracts search), if I start dialing a number with only the number keys, it displays both the number and the letters at the top of the phone (while displaying the contacts), when it gets to the point where it can no longer be a contact (typically after 3 numbers), it switches back the phone screen.
    I'll be damned, you are absolutely right it does work that way. For once I must give credit to PalmOne for reinstating a feature that was part of the Treo line, but had been discontinued by Handspring with the Treo600.

    By the way the reason why it was not working for me earlier is that I have KeyContacts set as the default database for 'Phone Number Lookup' and apparently Keycontacts does not support this feature. Therefore I cannot use this feature, well atleast not until Chapura updates Keysuites to support this feature.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
    TouchPad WiFi (32GB) - webOS 3.0.5 build 86
    App Catalog (US) - Vodafone (India)

    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  14. #34  
    Stability is most definitely an issue on the 650.

    All I have loaded is the latest Verichat so I have nearly 19MB of free space on my 10 days old phone. Upgraded to 1.08.

    If I access Versamail or any other application or screen and if someone pings me on AIM through Verichat during the app-to-app transition, it either resets or goes to a blank white screen I cannot get out of. Other resets or freezes occur, but I can't duplicate or point to anything.

    This is completely idiotic. Shouldn't ever happen, but yet it does. I deal with it because the phone is the best combo out there. I am definitely "settling".
  15. jacobh's Avatar
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    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by BENJMNS
    Stability is most definitely an issue on the 650.

    All I have loaded is the latest Verichat so I have nearly 19MB of free space on my 10 days old phone. Upgraded to 1.08.

    If I access Versamail or any other application or screen and if someone pings me on AIM through Verichat during the app-to-app transition, it either resets or goes to a blank white screen I cannot get out of. Other resets or freezes occur, but I can't duplicate or point to anything.

    This is completely idiotic. Shouldn't ever happen, but yet it does. I deal with it because the phone is the best combo out there. I am definitely "settling".
    I have Verichat and haven't experienced this problem (probably because no one has ever tried to chat with me in the exact instant i'm changing programs), but it sounds to me like it's a Verichat issue, not a Palm issue. I'd talk to Verichat support about it.

    Cheers,
    Jacob H.
  16. #36  
    I'm thinking the same thing, but if Windows freezes, who are people blaming? Microsoft when in fact there are thousands and thousands of third-party software vendors creating apps for it and who knows what level of quality...

    same thing goes for the Palm OS. Shouldn't be happening. Verichat and Palm One are at fault.

    Don't they test this stuff out before releasing? Really sad and it's happening to a low demand user like me.
  17. #37  
    This was a fairly interesting thread. I don't visit TC much, but I have had a T600 for quite a while and have recently upgraded to a 650. Thanks to those that replied about the Calendar view functionality, it's sweet now!

    Here's what I would add:

    1. When accessing the CallLog, the default selection is on the cancel button. To get to the actual log data, I have to hit the left button twice to get it to select the first number in the list. This is retarded! Before it two me 2-3 click to get a call underway. I didn't see anything in preference to change this behavior.

    2. If you select a contact to call, or select an entry in the CallLog to call, it takes like 2 - 2.5 seconds before the call shows up on the screen. My T600 was much faster (nearly instant). One would think that the T650 would be faster in this regard. I am not sure if this is a carrier issue or not (I have Sprint). When I first started using the 650, I thought that I had not actually pressed the button to call someone, and so, I hit it again only to hang up on the call that I was trying to make. Does anyone else notice this?
    -w00t!
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