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  1.    #1  
    As a long time Treo user (90-300-600-650) who recently converted over to a PPC for the first time (a week with the Thera doesn't count) I wanted to share my experience and compare and contrast the two devices. A lot has been said, but most of it has been biased one way or the other. The other thing is that there are a lot of comparisons done between the 600 and PPC. We all know that the 650 is light years ahead of the 600 so comparing an 18 month old Treo to a PPC that came off of the production line 60 days ago is not fair. These are my opinions after using both as my primary device for multiple weeks.

    Size:
    I am not going to waste time listing out the specs in millimeters, we all know the treo is smaller. However, the PPC is thinner. Noticeably so, actually. I actually prefer carrying the PPC around because it does not bulge out of my pocket quite as much. The extra weight does not bother me. This is I, a male that carry's these things in my front pocket with no case. I have always appreciated the thinnest designs and am willing to sacrifice other physical attributes. As always YMMV.

    Screen:
    The PPC has a 240x320 and the Treo uses a 320x320. The PPC does offer more real estate, which is nice, but the Treos screen is in a completely different league. Pictures on the PPC look somewhat pixilated and blurry in comparison to the razor sharp 650 screen. The PPC can do more, landscape/portrait but regardless of the orientation the Treo just looks better and even my fiancé and friend (neither who are into this kind of stuff) spotted the lower resolution of the PPC immediately.

    Web Browsing:
    The PPC wins here even though graphics look slightly better on the 650s. The speed is faster; not the network side but processing. I check the classifieds on audiogon.com a lot, and I can scroll all the way down on the PPC with out any slowdown or pause. The Treo could load and scroll almost as fast, but I always experienced some slow down. Also with the PPC you can go landscape and then use a utility like SPB Pocket Plus to blow out into full screen. This is really killer and wins big points. Also, sites like paypal can be accessed on the PPC. I do favor the method the Treo uses for accessing favorite sites, and for viewing graphics but the PPC with it larger screen, more robust browser and landscape mode is more than the Treo can match.

    Interface:
    This is where the Treo is king. The PPC does not even begin to match the integration that the Palm device offers. Some of the PPCs limitations are shocking; Here are a few:

    1. Cannot dial hotlinks. If you get an email that has a phone number in it you are taking out the stylus and cutting and pasting. (some will say used Voice Command but I did not like it- more to follow)

    2. If you highlight a contact in the contacts app and hit the green phone button, the phone app is initiated and the numbers are populated, but there is still a need to hit the green button again to actually dial!

    3. Writing an email. Tap out your message and hit send. Mails sent right? No- you need to go and establish a connection by pressing another icon on the default folder view. Not a huge pain, but again-why not just send when "send" is hit???

    One handed operation: You can do okay with the PPC, but you cannot scroll through different fields on a given page by pressing left/right on the five way. I have gotten used to actually pressing the touch screen, which is not bad, but even with this method the icons are not designed to be hit using a finger. Many are too small. The Treo handedly wins here again.

    Today Screen/Default View: Phone vs PDA here but I have always loved the today screen on PPC. (Today for Palm is a joke in comparison) I can look at the device, see my upcoming appointments, see if there are new sms, or emails- and which accounts they are associated with. I also use a weather plugin that has 5 day forecasts with icons that updates automatically or manually. PPC here for me. Some will say the Treo can do most of this as well, but I prefer the look of the today screen.

    SMS:
    Is another Treo stronghold. Hopefully a 3rd part app offering threaded SMS will become available soon for PPC. Until then this is not even worth comparing.

    Camera:
    More robust on the PPC offering a flash and more settings but under ideal conditions video/pics will look better shot on the Treo. The PPC can shoot video and with a simple registry hack is only limited by the size of the SD card. (Thanks Hobbs!) These cameras both suck for anything but screwing around so I don’t see much or a +/- here anyway.

    Phone:
    While some things on the PPC annoy me, the sound quality is significantly better. (This is before 1.08 Treo update which I have not tested) I do not mind holding the device to my head, and all complaints about choppiness and echo have ceased since swapping the 650 for the 6600. Big win here for the PPC.

    What I do miss about the treo is the ability to assign a home area code for 7 digit dialing.


    PIM:
    Both are strong here. I like the PPC better, but this is dependant on the user.

    Synchronization:
    Activesync crushes hotsync in every way. My ppc is always synched when in the
    cradle. It also talks to outlook flawlessly and fixes errors on its own. File sharing is also much better, drag and drop on the desktop and a real file manager on the PPC. In addition, if the device is in the cradle, and it needs to update the weather, or check/send email/business connect it knows and can use the data connection on the desktop. It does not launch 1xrtt when in the cradle. No configuration here either. Fantastic. This is another PPC strength.

    Battery:
    In stock form the Treo wins hear handedly. I was out on the road last Tuesday with the PPC and had 22 emails pushed via bc, 7 calls for 20 minutes, and another 15 minute conference call (on speakerphone). By the time all that had been done the device was down to about 30 percent (1pm). The Treo probably would have been around 60-70. The worst part is that I knew it- and made adjustments to keep me off of the phone. Not good. By 7 pm the device was at 2%.

    There is news of 3rd party 3300mah and 2200mah batteries but they expensive and I think that a device should be able to get you through a day out of the box. Treo wins.

    Keyboard:
    Both are good. I will say that the always exposed keyboard of the treo makes life a little easier, dialing on keyboard, contact find etc. But the 6600 keyboard when exposed is just as good as the Treos. The backlight on the PPC is nice too. Both keyboards are ready for primetime road warrior use.

    Overall:
    I have little doubt that the Treo is the better integrated device. However, I am keeping and like the PPC better. It is more powerful, more flexible and better for what I need it to do. At the same time, if you are wondering what is better for you- than you have probably already answered your own question. The Treo. The PPC is going to appeal to specialized users who want to do specific things. The Treo is an easier to use more intuitive device that should appeal to a more mainstream crowd.

    My final 2 cents though is that once a few relatively easy to fix issues are addressed on the PPC (hotlinks, sms, phone integration) Palm is really in trouble.

    Thanks for reading.
    Neopoint 1000, I300, Treo 300, i330, Toshiba 2032, Treo 600, T608/UX50, I500,Treo 600, G1000, Treo 650, PPC-6600, PPC-6700, Treo 650, Blackberry 7250, Treo 700wx, Motorola Q, PPC-6800, 700wx, Motorola Q9c, Sprint Touch, Sprint ACE, 700wx, 800w, Touch Pro, 800w, Touch Diamond, 800w, Treo Pro, Palm Pre, HTC Hero, Palm Pre, EVO 4G warm2.2
  2. #2  
    very balanced, refreshing read.
    The ONLY bias i have against the PPC is its size and its 'unphonelikeness' - thats it.
    As soon as a slimmer ppc phone is released with a full keyboard i'll certainly take it for a spin...my loyalty lies only to the company that delivers the better product
  3. #3  
    I'd probably like the ppc more if I just dropped $500 on it. I messed with a 6601 and thought it was huge- very uncomfortable to carry around. The screen is just horrid compared to the 650. I have casio em500 which has an identical screen that's like 3 years old. The whole concept of a vertical screen is amazingly useless.

    The thing that makes the PPC so great is the software support. The PPC software development community is so much stronger than Palm's. I just hope the newer high powered Palm devices can reverse that trend. I think we'll see some major positive changes when Palm releases their linux powered OS.
  4. #4  
    I have handles the PPC phone and have to say formfactor plays in a lot. The fact it is much wider, maybe half an inch, is a big thing. I think a phone shoulg fit comfortably in one hand. Also I have to disagree about the keyboard. The PPC has a slid out design which I like, but if doesn't have keys with tactile response. keyborad feel is important because I text a lot with friends and my wife.

    The processor and memory are a big win in the PPCs corner. Even the magazine Maximum PC edged out the PPC because of this. There is an Ipaq from HP for T-Mobile that has a formfactor similar to the treo -> Here. I think its a little old in the tooth and I don't know how it performs but it comes close to the treo for the Ipaq crowd.

    A final thought about the PPC vs palm debate is what are you looking for. I want a phone with extras so I prefer the palm. If you want a pocket PC with phone capabilities the PPC is for you. It really comes down to preferance.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by BIGtrouble77
    I'd probably like the ppc more if I just dropped $500 on it. I messed with a 6601 and thought it was huge- very uncomfortable to carry around. The screen is just horrid compared to the 650. I have casio em500 which has an identical screen that's like 3 years old. The whole concept of a vertical screen is amazingly useless.
    It's not an identical screen at all. Resolution wise it is the same, but the old Casios used a HAST TFT screen, rather than the current Reflective (or transflective) TFT screens. They were great indoors, not nearly as good as the new displays are outdoors.

    But even at 320x240, I miss my old E-125's display.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  6.    #6  
    [QUOTE=BIGtrouble77]
    I'd probably like the ppc more if I just dropped $500 on it. I messed with a 6601 and thought it was huge- very uncomfortable to carry around. The screen is just horrid compared to the 650. I have casio em500 which has an identical screen that's like 3 years old. The whole concept of a vertical screen is amazingly useless.
    QUOTE]

    If i wanted the treo, I would get another one. I lam in no way financially or contractually tied to the ppc. I like the browsing experience and sheer PDA power.

    I tried hard to be fair in attempt to avoid comments like yours.

    -rob
    Neopoint 1000, I300, Treo 300, i330, Toshiba 2032, Treo 600, T608/UX50, I500,Treo 600, G1000, Treo 650, PPC-6600, PPC-6700, Treo 650, Blackberry 7250, Treo 700wx, Motorola Q, PPC-6800, 700wx, Motorola Q9c, Sprint Touch, Sprint ACE, 700wx, 800w, Touch Pro, 800w, Touch Diamond, 800w, Treo Pro, Palm Pre, HTC Hero, Palm Pre, EVO 4G warm2.2
  7. #7  
    robber,
    I liked the review too. VERY BALANCED. Thanks for the insights!

    Dave Lindberg :0)
  8. #8  
    Great review. Similar to the one in Maximum PC that just came out where the Treo got an 8 and the PPC got a 9 -- mainly due to lack of DUN on the Treo and faster internet on the PPC. However, how much is a dataplan on a PPC? On Sprint it's between 0-15 bucks for the Treo (depending on what plan you have). Also, I sometimes wonder how much these reviewers actually USE a device before they post a comparison. They did not even mention the crashing issues with the Treo (which so far, the patch seems to have helped, especially the versamail update.) And I got 5 more megs. That's what, almost 25% more. With the free 128MB card, I am very pleased on that front.
  9.    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by mausalot
    Great review. Similar to the one in Maximum PC that just came out where the Treo got an 8 and the PPC got a 9 -- mainly due to lack of DUN on the Treo and faster internet on the PPC. However, how much is a dataplan on a PPC? On Sprint it's between 0-15 bucks for the Treo (depending on what plan you have). Also, I sometimes wonder how much these reviewers actually USE a device before they post a comparison. They did not even mention the crashing issues with the Treo (which so far, the patch seems to have helped, especially the versamail update.) And I got 5 more megs. That's what, almost 25% more. With the free 128MB card, I am very pleased on that front.
    Thanks. In regards to data pricing- the only time people seem to be running into issues is on new activations- new plans. If you are doing an esn swap on the same account than the data plan remans the same. I pay $10 for vision on the 6600.

    -rob
    Neopoint 1000, I300, Treo 300, i330, Toshiba 2032, Treo 600, T608/UX50, I500,Treo 600, G1000, Treo 650, PPC-6600, PPC-6700, Treo 650, Blackberry 7250, Treo 700wx, Motorola Q, PPC-6800, 700wx, Motorola Q9c, Sprint Touch, Sprint ACE, 700wx, 800w, Touch Pro, 800w, Touch Diamond, 800w, Treo Pro, Palm Pre, HTC Hero, Palm Pre, EVO 4G warm2.2
  10. #10  
    Good read... I was on the fence between these two devices... but the treo won me over for form factor, and price of data plans... but if MS ever manages to develop a ppc with a qwerty board & the size of a treo. I'd definately take it for a spin.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by robber
    My final 2 cents though is that once a few relatively easy to fix issues are addressed on the PPC (hotlinks, sms, phone integration) Palm is really in trouble.
    I enjoyed your review and please don't take my comments below as flames.

    - Why do you think thses issues are easy to fix? Phone integration, for one, may require a lot of work. I don't know the answer, but I am just curious.
    - You are assuming that P1 and Palmsource will stand still while HTC/Microsoft make the improvements.
    - The thing about smart personal devices is that there is no such thing as "better." It is all about perferences. Is iPod the best MP3 player out there? Many would disagree, but the proof is in the sales number.

    Just my 2 cents.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by R1_Rydah
    Good read... I was on the fence between these two devices... but the treo won me over for form factor, and price of data plans... but if MS ever manages to develop a ppc with a qwerty board & the size of a treo. I'd definately take it for a spin.
    Check this:
    http://www.brighthand.com/articles/p...AdVar=PocketPC

    It will replace the 6315 that, btw, T-Mobile stopped selling.

    BenQ P50 is similar too;
    http://www.brighthand.com/articles/p...AdVar=PocketPC
  13. #13  
    I received my PPC in November to replace my T600. Great PDA but not intuitive to use as a phone. I returned my HP4700 because the Audiovox (short of VGA screen) was adequate. One month ago, I purchased a Cingular T650. I still have service (Sprint) on the PPC but rarely use it now as a phone. The Treo650, buggy at times, wins hands down for me. If the PPC phones ever become smaller, have adequate memory and function better as a phone, I would consider a switch.
    Pocket Addict

    Clie UX50/Ti68/Nextel BB 6510/Treo600/SE T637/Audiovox 5600/HP 4700/Audiovox PPC 6601
  14. #14  
    I had 3 ipaqs prior to 650. Three significant observations 1) the PPC is a richer environment in which apps can be built, 2) you can't read naive word, excel and pointpower on the PPC (a big mistake by Microsoft)...an issue when one wants to read an email attachment, and 3) I found that I had lock-ups....having to reboot PPC fairly often (though not as much as 650). Long term, unless Palm does some major innovating (and focuses on builting a highly stable platform...a key issue for a cell phone and email device) then Microsoft will win. And the Microsoft solution is not overly appealing (when I look at Windows Mobile 2005 vs. 2003 vs. 2002...not much in the way of new clever stuff).
  15. #15  
    Thanks, quite balanced and non-rhetorical. Don't think I'd jump ship, though. I've had exactly one PPC experience (see sig) and it was one too many. Kinda reminded me of the Win95 days, and the five subsequent years I spent running Linux until MS got its act together with 2000 and XP. Hope they eventually reach the same level of maturity on their mobile platform.
    PEG N760C>Treo 600>iPaq4350>Zaurus SL-5600>Zaurus SL-6000L>Treo 650
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by R1_Rydah
    Good read... I was on the fence between these two devices... but the treo won me over for form factor, and price of data plans... but if MS ever manages to develop a ppc with a qwerty board & the size of a treo. I'd definately take it for a spin.
    The upcoming Samsung i730 fits your description....Treo size and slider qwerty keyboard:
    http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=1044
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by kebel21
    The upcoming Samsung i730 fits your description....Treo size and slider qwerty keyboard:
    http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=1044
    The i730 is much bigger than the Treo when you count the keyboard. So is the PPC (which also has a qwerty keyboard) that everyone's talking about here.
  18. #18  
    I had the PPC 6601 for about a month and I agree with your review for the most part - except for on the voice quality. I went through two 6601s, both had major problems with dropping calls and horrible echo.

    Ever since I got the 650 (which I wanted originally but they took so long to come out with the cameraless one), I haven't had a single dropped call and the quality is 100% better.

    Also, I thought the slide-out keyboard would be nice, but it proved to be very annoying. When I'm looking for a contact on the Treo, it's very easy to hit the first couple letters to find the contact... you couldn't do that easily on the PPC.
  19. #19  
    Sorry I upset you. The truth is, you look at 99% of consumer reviews and they will favor whatever their most recent purchase is, especially if it's a significant one.


    If i wanted the treo, I would get another one. I lam in no way financially or contractually tied to the ppc. I like the browsing experience and sheer PDA power.

    I tried hard to be fair in attempt to avoid comments like yours.

    -rob

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