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  1.    #1  
    I am looking for Palm OS software that would facilitate input of Japanese kana and kanji.

    I am using CJKOS on an English language version Visor Deluxe. CJKOS is a Palm OS enhancement, which supports viewing of Chinese, Japanese and Korean characters, but the Japanese input method is simple and only supports input of kana. Kanji input is not supported.

    I assume that some of the applications that make up the Japanese language version of the Palm OS could be used with the English language version paired with CJKOS, but I have no way of knowing whether or not this software is available separately, because Handspring has not responded to my inquiries.

    <A HREF="http://discussion.visorcentral.com/Forum1/HTML/002050.html" TARGET=_blank>Taki’s post</A>, mentions third part applications which support entry of Japanese characters directly, as opposed to via a romaji input method. I am most interested in this type of software, but I am also partial to Microsoft’s Global IME for Windows, which utilizes romaji.

    I am a student of the Japanese language, but my Japanese is still minimal and not enough to help me navigate the many pertinent Japanese websites. Therefore, any information is welcome, especially links to downloadable software of the type mentioned above.
  2. Taka's Avatar
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    #2  
    Hi,

    Take a look at this page.
    http://www.tt.rim.or.jp/~tatsushi/pilot2.html

    J-OS 1.9 is what I use. If you want better version there is a shareware version.
  3.    #3  
    Taka, thank you for your input.

    I looked into J-OS before deciding on CJKOS. I went with CJKOS because nowhere did I read of any problems with CJKOS. In addition, CJKOS appeared to be a much more straightforward extension to the Palm OS.

    CJKOS has performed flawlessly without interfering with my original operating system and applications. Although I can only input kana, I can view and edit Japanese characters in any application, including e-mails and Japanese software that I have downloaded.

    Accordingly, I can cut and paste kanji from KDIC, for instance, into any document I am working on, but this is, of course, too tedious to be an effective means of communication.

    That’s why I am looking for some sort of input method that supports kanji and more complex Japanese words and phrases. Something similar to <A HREF="http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/ie/Features/ime.asp" TARGET=_blank>Microsoft’s Global IME</A> would be great, but as I mentioned before, I would prefer to be able to utilize the Graffiti writing area for entering Japanese characters directly.

    [This message has been edited by Thomas Kjolsing (edited 08-11-2000).]
  4.    #4  
    A reply by Taki, posted 07-13-2000 11:29 AM, mentions ATOK, “a program for Japanese language entry.”

    This software is apparently bundled with the new Sony PEG. Does anyone have any additional information about this or similar software, including whether or not it is available separately?
  5. #5  
    I think you are talking about J-OSIII. This software is the Japanese version of the Palm OS 3. It is sold in Japan for about $70.00 and is an add-on software. Unfortunately I have not yet had the chance to try this and therefore it may not support Kanji input. For the time, I use J-OS 1.9.
  6. #6  
    I would be interested in a basic word processor too. I don't know much about word processors though. I use NJStar to type up things for class on my desktop. Now that I have a Stowaway it would be great to have a program for PalmOS I don't know if you could have anything beyond kana support though.

    Maybe Taki could enlighten me here as to how much space would be needed. If it's substantial how about a springboard word processor/Japanese Operating System program! Hmmm that would be really niche though, doubt we could get someone to make one.

    ------------------
    -Vincent

    Turn your back and run now, you haven't got a chance now
  7. #7  
    Hi Thomas & all,

    I use English OS Visor & J-OS IV. I've never had any problems with this combo. I tried CJKOS but couldn't make it work. I think close to 100% people with English PalmOS machine use J-OS IV to enable Japanese input. In fact the person who wrote J-OS (Tatsushi Yamada) is known as "god(goddo)" among Japanese Palm users.

    J-OS IV(the latest version) can be downloaded from Ikeshop. If you don't own registered version of J-OS III, you can use this J-OS IV until Oct. 1. I strongly recommend J-OS...it is very similar to MS GlobalIME.

    Also to use ATOK & gogo-pen(the program that recognizes hand-written Japanese characters)you have to have either Japanese Palm OS or J-OS.

    In a way, J-OS may be easier to start with because you can use plain old grafiti you already know to input romaji(just like GlobalIME).

    The only down side is, J-OS & Japanese fonts are pretty memory consuming(almost 700K). Hope this helps! J-OS IV is about 6,000 yen($60)...it sounds expensive, but to me it's worth the price.

    If you don't want to pay the price, an earlier free version of J-OS someone mentioned above would work pretty good, too. The difference is, the free version of J-OS is a hack. Also it lacks some of the bells & whistles J-OS IV has(such as support for color & different fonts).

    Vinny, I think both Stowaway & GoType works with J-OS. I heard there are some problems but they are minor(e.g. certain buttons does not work) but I'm not positive. BTW NJStar is a good program for the price. I used it before MS GlobalIME because I was using it mainly for e-mail(I don't do much wordprocessing in Japanese).

    P.S. If you can read Japanese & your computer can display Japanese, try PALMLINK. It automatically displays most-recently renewed Japanese Palm web sites(renewed every hour).

    [This message has been edited by Taki (edited 08-11-2000).]
  8. #8  
    Thanks for the link and J-OS advice Taki. I am downloading it tonight. Now I might be able to take Japanese notes on my Visor too! Woohoo!

    ------------------
    -Vincent

    Turn your back and run now, you haven't got a chance now
  9. #9  
    Excuse for Jumping in.
    As Taki has stated, J-OS line of software is de-facto standard for Non-Japanese Palm devices to enable Japanese input and display method. J-OS has started long before Japanese version of Palm/workpad products were introduced for Japanese market. Hence, much of Palmware from Japan will actually work better on J-OS equiped palm than Japanese version of Palms. The latest version of the software is J-OS IV, which you can download from Ike-shop as Taki has mentioned.
    Nice thing about this new release is that it is now possible to toggle Japanese and English mode without soft reset, as well as ability to selectively disable Japanese mode for specific applications (You don't want Japanese mode in Calculator.) The one you download can be used as an updater for J-OS IIIx, or can be used as a demo that will expire on October 1. The last time I checked, Ike-shop was not taking order from overseas( I admit it was long time ago). So, how do you buy it if you really liked it?
    1) Hope Ikeshop has changed their policy and take on-line order from abroad. or
    2) There is a on-line store located in Calfornia. WWW.arkusa.com/palm will sell you J-OS IIIx for about $90. Yes this is not cheap, and hopefully they will start selling J-OS IV soon. However, it really does not matter if you buy J-OS IIIX. . Once you receive J-OS IIIx, you just install its key-file ONLY to your palm and your J-OS IV demo will become a legal copy. J-OS 1.9 on the other hand, is freeware although it does not have many convinient feature of commercial version.
    Capability of Japanese input method for J-OS is, well, moderate. It's originated from university developed public domain code and altough it does its job adquately, if you are spoiled with Windows 98 style IME, you feel like you are thrown back in time for about 10 years. ATOK sounds promissing, but Just-system (creater fo ATOK) has not made any announcment for selling this product as standalone. It is only availabe with purchase of Sony Palm
    As for directly entering Japanese kana rather than hiragana, there are some software available. Hirapa 1, Hirapa2 (Those two are different in functionalities) and PO-Box come to mind. If you are using MS IE5 as your browser, download Japanese extention to enable Japanese display and point your browser to www.muchy.com. You will find more in there.
  10. #10  
    Adachi-san, arigato gozaimasu for your nice follow-up!! I live in the U.S. but bought J-OS III from Vis-a-Vis. They usually don't ship overseas but they make exception for J-OS CD-ROM.

    [This message has been edited by Taki (edited 08-12-2000).]
  11. #11  
    Taki-san or Adachi-san:

    Did I read somewhere up above that there's a program that lets me input kanji directly, instead of using the romaji-kana "henkou" method?

    That'd be great! If there is something where I could actually write the characters instead of having to write down the romaji first, honto ni tasukaru!

    oshiete itadakereba....

    By the way, I'm using a Japanese pilot which I just purchased from Sofmap. It's more expensive than the English version, but cheaper than buying the English pilot and the Japanese OS add-on, PLUS, you still have the full 8 meg of RAM left....

    Onegai itashimasu.



    [This message has been edited by KENT (edited 08-13-2000).]
  12. #12  
    Kent-san,

    I think GOGO-Pen is the program you asked about. You're in luck! It only works with Japanese Palm OS. Let me know how it works. I can't use it because my Visor has English Palm OS. Also seePink Visor thread.

    [This message has been edited by Taki (edited 08-13-2000).]
  13. #13  
    Originally posted by Taki:
    Kent-san,

    I think GOGO-Pen is the program you asked about.
    Taki-san,
    Arigatou gozaimasu. Honto ni pittari "exactly what I wanted" de****a.

    o sewa ni narima****a.

    Here's another question:
    Does anyone know of a *good* Palm alternative to *ekisupaato* train software? Even just the Tokyo area would be great! I tried *TRAIN* but it just didn't work any where nearly as well....

    yoroshiku onegaishimasu.
  14. #14  
    Hi

    This is kind of embarassing and off-topic, but Taki's e-mail isn't listed so I'll ask here. How do you get double 'n' to show up? For example, I want to write 'onna'. I type in o, then n and then na. I only get the o, n and then an a hiragana (is that the right singular form?) Why doesn't it show up as a 'na', and go into the kanji when I press spacebar? I'm very new to Japanese so please excuse my ignorance .

    Thanks for the JOS advice Taki! It's great! It's seamless with English. It became a lot easier to use once I figured out that you can automatically put something in hiragana (which I use a lot more because of my currently very limited kanji knowledge) automatically by pressing enter instead of spacebar. I can have Japanese writing for stuff in Japanese this year now, who needs color to distinguish!

    ------------------
    -Vincent

    Turn your back and run now, you haven't got a chance now
  15.    #15  
    Vinny, to write "n"+"na" in words like onna, you will have to enter "nnn" (&lt;n&gt; three times followed by the appropriate vowel).

    I have found that this is true for most input method editors (IME).

    On this same topic, there are other symbols, necessary in Japanese orthography, that are difficult to find without a Japanese keyboard.

    I have figured out that most IME will produce the Japanese postal symbol when “yuubin” is input.

    I cannot, however, figure out how to produce the Japanese character set ellipsis “...”, for instance.

    “Nakagura” (meaning “black dot”) is another example. It is sometimes used to separate the different parts of compound loan words written in katakana. It is commonly seen between Western given and family names when written together as one compound word.

    This dot is similar to the “bullet” commonly found in Western character sets, except that “nakagura” is smaller and actually part of the Japanese character set. In addition, the “bullet”, of Western character set origin, is not compatible with Asian character sets. When used together the combination usually results in garbage characters.

    The logical means of bringing up “nakagura” would be to enter the “bullet” (found in the Graffiti alphabet) and have the IME substitute “nakagura.” Entering “.” (period) produces “maru”, the Japanese equivalent, but the same is not true for “nakagura” or, for that matter, the ellipsis.

    Any input on how to input these and other mystery characters is welcome.

    By the way, I want to thank everyone for the wealth of valuable information in this topic!
  16. #16  
    Thanks for your help Thomas! I didn't know what I'd do without a woman . I hadn't tried to put a 'nakagura' in text yet, I do use it when I write normally--that might be nice to know how to do though.

    ------------------
    -Vincent

    Turn your back and run now, you haven't got a chance now
  17. #17  
    Kento-san, douitashimasite.... I'm glad it worked for you! But I can't really help you with train time table programs. Train worked okay for me when I went back to visit my family this year. But it was a pain to make a time table for the lines I had to take. You might want to search Muchy's Palmware review(http://muchy.com/).

    Vinny, hey, don't be embarrassed! It took me a while to figure out about na, too. I tried entering apostrophe in between two n's since it works for some input method, but not with J-OS. Hope J-OS helps you to ace Japanese this semester!

    Thomas, With J-OS, you can't enter nakaguro. It's a known bug. However, there is a program that let you input nakaguro, kome-jirushi, stars, arrows & so on. Actually, it is a dictionary that makes conversion from hiragana to kanji more efficient. I can't remember the name of the program or where I downloaded it from, but I'll search for it tonight & let you know. As for Japanese quotation marks, just enter the word kakko and then convert it to kanji. Probably the first choice is the word kakko in kanji but it'll show up eventually.

    [This message has been edited by Taki (edited 08-16-2000).]
  18. #18  
    Thomas, Vinny,

    Found it! It's dic-tk. There are several different versions you can choose from depending on how much memory you are willing to spare. It will automatically replace the existing dictionary you installed with J-OS.

    I noticed a marked improvement in kanji conversion after I installed it(I use version 2.1). It has more combination of yomi & okurigana than the dictionary comes with J-OS. For example, J-OS can convert tokei(watch, clock) but not hidokei(sundial). This is because J-OS dictionary registered ŽžŒv (I hope Japanese IME works with this board!) only as "tokei". But dic-tk added "dokei", too. Therefore, it'll give you more options & improve conversion efficiency.

    The way to enter Japanese quotation marks I described above may be only good with dic-tk. To enter nakaguro, just enter nakaguro. Also if you enter kigou, it will show all the available symbols. Refer to the table at the web site.

    I strongly recommend dic-tk. Let me know if you have any questions.

    [This message has been edited by Taki (edited 08-16-2000).]
  19.    #19  
    Whoo-ee! JACKPOT!

    I always knew there had to be some key to entering symbols in IME, and now I know it! "Kigou" did the trick. I tried it in J-OS IV and MS Global IME. It worked on both, showing all of the symbols I have ever wondered about and many I could never have imagined existed.

    In fact, "nakaguro" is there too. If you haven't already figured it out, however, the reason I couldn't bring it up before was because I was spelling it incorrectly

    Thank you very much for you help Taki.

    [This message has been edited by Thomas Kjolsing (edited 08-16-2000).]
  20.    #20  
    Taki, why did you decide to go with dic-tk 1.2?

    I am considering using ME 2.1 because it's the biggest and newest of the dictionaries and I can afford the memory, but I would like to know if you think 1.2 has any advantages.
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