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  1. #61  
    Update... I went to a local VZW store today and it appears that when the rep on the phone the other day said "we can't enable this option b/c you aren't signed up with any data plan" he truly meant ANY data plan.

    A couple local CS associates were able to prove that MOU is not dead, it just appears to have to be linked to some other data-related features.

    Example:

    Option 1: Mobile Web @ $5/mo.
    Turning this option on and hitting some other, undisclosed option (presumably the MOU flag) got my account back up and running with Express Network immediately.

    Option 2: Pix Messaging @ Varying Rates
    If you have a Treo with a camera you might try signing up with a pix messaging plan as another way to get EN MOU activating again. Pix messaging appears to *require* EN to be active on your account and it obviously doesn't require an official data plan to do that - translation: backdoor to EN MOU. I do quite a bit of txt messaging so I just signed up with the $8/mo txt/pix package, had them deactivate the Mobile Web package and am still running happily with EN on my just-activated Treo 600!

    I know these options may not be appealing to those in the "free then = free always" group, but I think adding a $5/mo Mobile Web option to, perhaps, a slightly higher voice plan is a perfectly reasonable way to keep top-speed network access on arguably the best network and customer service out there.

    And perhaps it's just a just a bit of corporate covering-up, but the helpful folks I worked with on this today did say that the reason increased safeguards against using EN MOU were put in place was due to less-savvy customers keeping data connections active, racking up massive airtime charges, and then demanding VZW remove them. Sure, we're "professional" Treo users here and know how to disconnect, but what about "recreational" users who don't have a clue (likely the majority)? Knowing how many times VZW has gone out of their way to remove charges from my account in the past, I could also see the ignorance the many leading to a huge billing dilemna for the company.

    At least now we know several ways to get EN back up and running.
    Other ideas? Perhaps we could compile these and get them as a sticky!

    Speed
    Last edited by speedracerx; 01/12/2005 at 09:40 PM.
  2. #62  
    Your solution is similar to my solution: it's a backdoor gateway to MOU. The new VZW policy is that MOU is no longer allowed on Treos, and VZW is auditing accounts to bring them up to compliance. I had a rep today enable MOU, but he was honest with me and said that he didn't know how long I'd be able to keep this, because it's technically not allowed. He told me this after I told him I was thinking of porting because of the lack of MOU. He was being very honest despite the fact that his honesty was going to cost Verizon a customer.

    I have two more days to return my phone before the worry-free guarantee is up, and I intend to return my phone. EN is working flawlessly right now using only my minutes, but do I trust that it will continue to work for the duration of my 1 year contract? That's not a $45/mo chance that I'm willing to take.
  3. #63  
    I have a question for those that are using MOU. When you use your minutes for a data session, do those minutes show up in your online usage report? I just started my month out, and I used a 2 minute data session, and then a 1 minute phone call. My off peak usage only says 1 minute: it has recored my phone call, but not my data call which took place first. Do data sessions take longer to report on your minutes, or am I set up incorrectly and still on a data plan?
  4. WiFi's Avatar
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    #64  
    Yeah,I found exactly the same thing,free lunch?
  5. #65  
    LOL, there's never a free lunch w/ VZW. I'm guessing we can't see the minutes during the month, then come bill-time we see all of our data minutes magically reappear. That would suck though, cause then you can't see if you should be more careful or carefree towards the end of your month.

    How long have you been using MOU WiFi? Have you ever noticed data minutes on your bill that you didn't see during the month?
  6. WiFi's Avatar
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    5 Posts
    #66  
    MOU for long time,got canceled w/o notice two times,called back to add the feature code 1XPP1 easily.Did some research on my last month call details,found several data calls missed,never count,but just several,not all,weird.
  7. #67  
    Hmm, thanks for that info. I remember seeing the feature code on here somewhere, but couldn't find it. I'm a little nervous about just telling the rep how to do his/her job, but if they aren't getting it done, then I guess I gotta do it myself. I'm real hesitant to leave VZW.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by speedracerx
    Option 2: Pix Messaging @ Varying Rates
    If you have a Treo with a camera you might try signing up with a pix messaging plan as another way to get EN MOU activating again. Pix messaging appears to *require* EN to be active on your account and it obviously doesn't require an official data plan to do that - translation: backdoor to EN MOU. I do quite a bit of txt messaging so I just signed up with the $8/mo txt/pix package, had them deactivate the Mobile Web package and am still running happily with EN on my just-activated Treo 600!
    This worked for me. I cancelled the 5mb plan VZW put me on after I realized that I was not using MOU. Then I was not able to use data at all. I called CS and told them I could not send a pix message and they added pix messaging to my account (no plan). Data is now back! So far #DATA shows no kilobyte usage only MOU.

    I did switch my network connection to the lower speed QNC one, not the default connection set by VZW. Does anyone know what this default network connection is? Seems as soon as you use it, VZW slaps a kilobyte plan on you.

    Anyone using the higher speed 1x data connection with MOU only? If so, could you please post the network settings you are using please. I am a little afraid to change things now that MOU is working. Is there a noticeable difference in speed for email and web? Can PDANet be used with QNC?

    Thanks.
    Last edited by antmelnat; 01/13/2005 at 01:30 PM. Reason: Additional Info
  9. #69  
    How were you able to edit the default connection settings? On my Treo, I can add connections, but I can't modify the existing connection. I can't even access the connection's details so I can give them to you.
  10. #70  
    Did not edit the defaut, just added a new connection to QNC.
  11. #71  
    I filed a complaint to the FCC about this matter, and Verizon is now reviewing htis
  12. #72  
    "Reviewing" this? What exactly are they reviewing and what exactly did you complain about? Any idea who (what deparment) is reviewing this?
  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by antmelnat
    I called CS and told them I could not send a pix message and they added pix messaging to my account (no plan). Data is now back! So far #DATA shows no kilobyte usage only MOU.
    Ohhh.. great idea! This would definitely appear to be the cheapest method out there (so long as you don't want to send pix - I use them to send crude maps/drawings re: driving directions)

    Anyone using the higher speed 1x data connection with MOU only? If so, could you please post the network settings you are using please. I am a little afraid to change things now that MOU is working. Is there a noticeable difference in speed for email and web? Can PDANet be used with QNC?
    I have no connection details - just the connection titled "Verizon Wireless" that they have locked on the phone to prevent tampering.

    On my older ported-from-Sprint-Treo600, I used the following settings to get Express Network up and running:

    username: mobilenumber@vzw3g.com
    password: vzw

    Details -> UNCHECK Mobile IP

    ...just checked and appears to still work on the VZW Treo.

    PS: In my experience I've found QNC to be *significantly* slower. I believe this operates at the standard 14.4 speeds.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by splufdaddy
    I'm guessing we can't see the minutes during the month, then come bill-time we see all of our data minutes magically reappear. That would suck though, cause then you can't see if you should be more careful or carefree towards the end of your month.
    From what I can remember, my total minute usage online included time used on data as well as voice - they were both included in the total.

    However... I just made a data connection during off-peak hours last night and forgot to turn it off until nearly 9am this morning. Clearly this enters into peak minutes time.

    The $1,000,000 question:

    If VZW charges you even for times when your data connection is in dormant mode AND calls spanning off-peak -> peak usage are based on the time the call STARTED, does this mean that you could start up a data connection at 9:01pm and (so long as you never disconnect) use only unlimited off-peak minutes for your MOU data connection?

    Even after leaving my connection on all night and morning I saw no change in my minutes online or through #MIN this morning. This seems almost too good to be true.

    Thoughts?
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by speedracerx
    Even after leaving my connection on all night and morning I saw no change in my minutes online or through #MIN this morning. This seems almost too good to be true.

    Thoughts?
    Your minutes did not change because you are probably being charged for data usage. Leaving your connection on, but idle, would not accrue any usage if you are being charged by kilobytes.
    Last edited by owenmhv; 01/14/2005 at 10:56 AM.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by splufdaddy
    "Reviewing" this? What exactly are they reviewing and what exactly did you complain about? Any idea who (what deparment) is reviewing this?
    I tried for about a month to get a clarification of this issue. Most of the time I was told I needed to subscribe to a monthly plan, though this was not what I understood when I signed up for my phone plan on the web. I accumulated hundreds of minutes because my Treo 'constantly was dialing up to the internet' even though I was not using it. I was told that this could not be disconnected and again that I needed to purchase a plan for up to $20/month and this might no even be enough. Ultimately I was told that the internet connection could be disabled. I was concerned that others were falsely under the impression that they needed to purchase a plan.
    It is easy to file a complaint on line at http://svartifoss2.fcc.gov/cib/fcc475.cfm the FCC web site.
    Verizon already has been scrutinized for its practices.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by speedracerx
    From what I can remember, my total minute usage online included time used on data as well as voice - they were both included in the total.

    However... I just made a data connection during off-peak hours last night and forgot to turn it off until nearly 9am this morning. Clearly this enters into peak minutes time.

    The $1,000,000 question:

    If VZW charges you even for times when your data connection is in dormant mode AND calls spanning off-peak -> peak usage are based on the time the call STARTED, does this mean that you could start up a data connection at 9:01pm and (so long as you never disconnect) use only unlimited off-peak minutes for your MOU data connection?

    Even after leaving my connection on all night and morning I saw no change in my minutes online or through #MIN this morning. This seems almost too good to be true.

    Thoughts?
    I'm pretty sure that VZW now spans your minutes across time periods. That means you'll be charged for the data call from 6:00 am - 9:00 am.

    I'm only two days into my billing cycle, and I have 50 offpeak minutes used. Looking at my Treo's call log, I've made only one 3 minute non-IN network call in the last two days, both peak and off peak. I think all of my data minutes are being calculated as off peak, whether they are actually peak or off-peak.. I'm going to use the internet very sparingly this month and then take a close look at my bill when it comes.
  18. #78  
    I just figured out another way to safeguard yourself if you're using MOU: create a dummy connection, and make it your default.

    Go into Prefs > Network, then Menu > New. Give it a name like "Dummy", and then for connection type, specify Cradle/Cable (IR would work too I would imagine). That's it. Leave this connection selected, and you can exit out of Prefs. Whenever you use a program that connects to the web, it will use this data connection, which doesn't take up any minutes. When you want to use your data connection, go into Prefs and switch to Verizon Wireless from Dummy. I think Treo Connection Manager would make this process more efficient, but I don't have it so I can't speak from experience. Just another suggestion, I'm sure many have thought of this already, but for Treo newbies, another tip!
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by owenmhv
    Your minutes did not change because you are probably being charged for data usage. Leaving your connection on, but idle, would not accrue any usage if you are being charged by kilobytes.
    Yes, I would agree with on this issue *if* I were subscribed to a KB data plan, but I am not. I think the question here really is how does VZW treat customers who are using picture messaging, as this is, fundamentally, what I am subscribed to.

    Think about it, how could VZW justify charging customers usage based on KB usage if they are already set up with monthly fees based on pix messaging? That would amount to double-charging for the same service.

    The VZW rep I spoke with in the store who was using the Mobile Web feature on his personal phone said he's only ever been charged the extra $5/mo for this plan.

    This leads me to believe that Mobile Web or Pix messaging plans *must* be set to allow unlimited data connections as well. I think the bigger picture with this whole abandonment of MOU on data is that (with other services using data connections) its getting to be a very gray area between online KB usage and simply other add-on packages like pix messaging continually making data connections.

    Besides, many of the pix phones have no way to even track KB and may not even have internet access capabilities, so how else would VZW handle these phones if they were charging KB usage fees on top of the pix/MW pricing? There's simply no way for the customer to disconnect and/or monitor their data connections as with the Treo.

    It may be too early to tell yet, but in the bigger picture this may all actually be evidence of an unspoken unlimited data strategy that is already in place. IOW, this may all be to the customers benefit, rather than detriment.
  20. #80  
    I got my mou working again by following the advice here and just had picture messaging added. What's funny is when you actually do send a picture message my phone connects to the internet but doesn't tell me, just a little at the bottom right, but then does not disconnect. If it wasn't for the fact that I know how to use the phone then my phone would always be connected to the internet just for sending a picture. For right now I just disconnect after I send a picture but how can Verizon charge me for minutes connected if I left my phone connected when it's a software problem in the phone.
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