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  1.    #1  
    F1 made a mess of the Treo 600 - a great design spoiled by el cheapo construction quality. They then had a year to regroup and fix what was missing from the Treo 600.

    All F1 had to do was add:

    - High res screen
    - Bluetooth
    - More memory
    - Removable battery
    - Proper construction quality
    - Lower price

    Other stuff like a switchable landscape screen, Wi-Fi, ditching the stupid external antenna, making it smaller/lighter, etc could have waited until next year.

    F1 also needed to add a cheap REGULAR style phone running Palm's OS ASAP to bring in some of the many normal customers that think paying $650 for a phone is absurd.

    Instead we get crippled Bluetooth and what amounts to LESS memory at the same high price, potentially making the Treo 650 useless to a lot of people. And more importantly, no cheap Palm OS phones appear to be on the horizon from F1. (How hard would it be to get HTC to put the Palm OS into one of their smaller phones? This isn't rocket science!)

    F1 thinks people and companies are dumb enough to keep buying second rate hardware at inflated prices. They also seem to think they have no competition. Guess again. By the end of 2005, F1 will become an also-ran in smartphones just as they've already become an also-ran in PDAs. The Treo 650 is very similar to Palm's odious Tungsten 5: Too Little, Too Late, Too Expensive.

    I think the market's going to call Palm's bluff on this one and they aren't holding any cards. The Windows based smartphones and Samsung should be able to destroy Palm if they manage to get off their a$$es and actually release some phones. And without those juicy, bloated, high margin cellphone profits padding their bottom line, Palm will implode.

    Way to go Palm.

  2. alee's Avatar
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    #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Chupacabra
    Instead we get crippled Bluetooth
    Carrier issue... take it up with Sprint, not PalmOne.
  3. #3  
    I remember the uproar last year over the lack of voice recording and the delay in the firmware upgrade. This seems similar to me. My prediction: Palm will recover (and possibly have a firmware upgrade) - the shouting that's occured over the last couple of days will subside, folks will buy the 650 in droves, and all will be right in the world.
  4.    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Albert C. Lee
    Carrier issue... take it up with Sprint, not PalmOne.
    Good point - hobbling Bluetooth was done at Sprint's request. But that doesn't change the other issues raised in the post.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Chupacabra
    The Windows based smartphones and Samsung should be able to destroy Palm if they manage to get off their a$$es and actually release some phones. And without those juicy, bloated, high margin cellphone profits padding their bottom line, Palm will implode.

    Way to go Palm.

    I wish I could disagree with you.

    Too bad Samsung and some of the other socalled smartphone manufactures have an even crappier legacy as to releasing quality stuff on time.

    I think the end result is P1 limping along, continuing to overpromise and underdeliver, and other will do the same until someone finally gets it right.
  6. #6  
    Great...yet another complaint thread

    Maybe it's time to start another forum here so those of us that have 650's and plan on keeping them don't have to wade through all the negative predictions and complaints. If some of you saw someone start 10 threads with the same question, you would be all over them. But for some reason you think it's OK to start 20 threads complaining about the same thing. If you are not happy with the 650 you can return it and buy something else. Those of us staying with the 650 wish you the best with your new device.

    ctdw
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by RWerksman
    I wish I could disagree with you.

    Too bad Samsung and some of the other socalled smartphone manufactures have an even crappier legacy as to releasing quality stuff on time.

    I think the end result is P1 limping along, continuing to overpromise and underdeliver, and other will do the same until someone finally gets it right.

    Samsung is one of the worst offenders for vaporware. I think they're now up to three Palm OS phones and counting that have been "announced" and never released. I got a Treo 600 after giving up on Samsung releasing their "Next Big Thing" last year. HTC (who I believe makes the Treo 650) makes a lot of Windows smartphones also. All a company needs to do is ask HTC to produce a phone for them and then, "BOOM" they've got one almost overnight. No R+D hassles, no year-long waits. If Palm thinks they can keep putting out minor upgrades a year at a time and maintain any lead on their competitors, they're nuts.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by ctdw
    Great...yet another complaint thread

    Maybe it's time to start another forum here so those of us that have 650's and plan on keeping them don't have to wade through all the negative predictions and complaints. If some of you saw someone start 10 threads with the same question, you would be all over them. But for some reason you think it's OK to start 20 threads complaining about the same thing. If you are not happy with the 650 you can return it and buy something else. Those of us staying with the 650 wish you the best with your new device.

    ctdw
    And those of us who expect a little more than what has been put forth kindly ask you not to thread crap.

    You know where the thread is going. Dont read it.
  9. #9  
    Interestingly, I can't figure out what F1 stands for. I thought it was a racing term or something, but that appears not to be the case.

    Personally, I would have traded all the things you listed for wifi. I don't know what I'd do with landscape mode on a square screen.
  10. #10  
    The Treo600 saved handspring. The Treo650 is selling like hotcakes. PalmOne has the best PDA-based smartphone out there (though there have recently been some improved PPC offerings). If the 650 is a swansong, it isn't because they dropped the ball, but rather because the whole smartphone segment is rough.
  11. #11  
    What is this F1 stuff i keep hearing? is that some sort of derogatory term for palmone?
    Treo 800w 8/08
    Nokia N800
    previously: Treo 700wx 12/06, Sprint 6700 3/06; Treo 650 11/04; Treo 600 1/04 (gone); Samsung i500 (gone); Hitachi G1000 11/03 (gone); Nokia 7110 5/00(best phone ever)
  12. #12  
    I guess so
  13. #13  
    KR,

    I hope that is not going to last long.I think palmone is still enjoying the power handspring handed over to them.It will take just one good product from manufacturers (i.e Ben q , MPX,SE) to bring an end to this.
    Many of the PPC are almost becoming a close choice, unlike the initial days of treo 300,when there was a major diference in form factor and other features
  14. #14  
    Yeah... F1 is some negative reference to P1...

    Frankly, KRamsauer is right... the T650 is the hottest thing in the phone or PDA market right now.... it saved Handspring and P1 will make oooodles of $$$ on this device... in this form or any other that gets released in the near future. it is far and away the golden child in the "smartphone" market...

    As a matter of fact, Handheld Computing magazine just reported, that Palm One has the Top 5 Selling PDA devices...

    They're goin' no where...

    Hope for fixes to what you think are bugs and something to improve the fashion in which the memory is handled...

    It's still one hell of a toy and an upgrade from the T600...
  15. #15  
    Hey, at least the got the screen, keyboard and construction thing down...
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    Interestingly, I can't figure out what F1 stands for. I thought it was a racing term or something, but that appears not to be the case.

    Personally, I would have traded all the things you listed for wifi. I don't know what I'd do with landscape mode on a square screen.

    If WiFi is so important , why don't you just forget about the Treo and get yourself a Tungsten C instead???? You can pick up a brand new one for less than $300 these days.
  17. #17  
    If palmOne goes away, it won't be because of the Treo. It's a big hit in all kinds of ways. They did a great job designing the form factor (despite the huge problems with trying to cram these things into a single device that fits comfortably in the hand and looks like a phone), it's aesthetically good-looking, it works well (yes, there have been lots of issues with the Treo 600, but it still gets very good user reviews compared to other "sibling" devices, so they did something right). Treo is a very well-known brand in the smartphone market, with much better recognition than any other brand out there.

    As mentioned in the roadshows, palmOne is trying to establish the current Treo as the foundation for a number of branching product lines - low-end devices for users who don't need or want or can afford luxury phones, niche phones for specific market segments, etc. Given that plan, the positioning of the Treo as a product is pretty darn good. Not perfect, but pretty darn good.

    If palmOne does go away, it will be because they lose their carriers (instant death for a mobile device vendor), or the PDA/smartphone market softens, or they get marginalized by a platform that dominates the market (PPC or Symbian or...). Given the first risk, the decisions they made with the 650 make a lot of sense ("Sprint says disable BT DUN" - "Yes sir, right away") ("The carriers don't have their WiFi business models sorted out yet, and most users don't list it as a high priority" - "Fine, leave it out, if either of those things change we'll add it in a later model").

    The memory decision was the only one I can point to that was just plain stupid on their part. But if they come up with a decent response, they can minimize the damage to what will most likely be a very successful product either way.

    Now, getting back to the original post, I don't think the Treo 650 will have any impact whatsoever on Formula One. The new Red Bull team, on the other hand...
  18. #18  
    F1 was coined by me.

    it describes what P1 is...effed up.

    it is not Sprint's fault

    BT 1.2 was not used - F1 choice
    File system changed - F1 choice
    23MB Ram - F1 choice.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikec
    F1 was coined by me.

    it describes what P1 is...effed up.

    it is not Sprint's fault

    BT 1.2 was not used - F1 choice
    File system changed - F1 choice
    23MB Ram - F1 choice.
    Whoa, dude...
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rome
    If WiFi is so important , why don't you just forget about the Treo and get yourself a Tungsten C instead???? You can pick up a brand new one for less than $300 these days.
    How would I receive a phone call on that? That puts me back to having two devices, spending $300 more dollars, keeping a 2nd device charged, and keeping all the contacts and programs in sync.

    Realize the wastefulness of having two Palm OS device, two screens, two sets of memory, two of basically everything. Alternatively, with just some software the PalmOne wifi card could work and it's done.
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