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  1.    #1  
    I have been buying Palms since the beginning, too many to count. Each time they produced a new model it was always deficient and lacking something, especially when they released the M505 with its dismal dim screen, one of their biggest mistakes. I have continued to be loyal to Palm and purchased their new models, one after the other, which always had 1 or 2 disappointing deficiencies. Sony gave them a jump start with their innovations and gave new life to the company. Palm implemented these into their units and there was hope with better models being produced. My Treo 600, again, had disappointing deficiencies, not enough memory, lo res screen, no removable battery, no Bluetooth. I recently sold my Treo 600 on Ebay in anticipation of the 650 thinking finally a unit that has "most" (no wi-fi) of everything. I pre-ordered the unit. Now, this memory issue, enough. This will be my last disappointment. I will be switching to PocketPC, and I am not alone. It is unfortunate that PalmOne will be responsible for its own destruction, not to be blamed on PocketPC.

    PalmOne Are You Listening?
    Last edited by fishnetb; 11/20/2004 at 09:02 AM.
  2. #2  
    don't let the door smack you on your *** on your way out...
    Paul Theodoropoulos
    <a href=http://www.anastrophe.com>www.anastrophe.com</a>
  3. #3  
    What memory issue are you refering to specifically?
  4. #4  
    there are at least 12 threads explaining the memory issue. I don't think we need to explain it in the 13th.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by fishnetb
    ...PalmOne Are You Listening?
    I do not care. It is too late. Can you say DOA?
  6. #6  
    You should try the new Motorola MPX220 with Windows Mobile....heard that it was a great smartphone. Good luck to you.

    And don't let that little recall by Motorola on the MPX220 bother you....
  7. #7  
    All of the 'memory' issue that I've read and responded to are all 3rd party initiated. So to say that there's 12 or 13 threads, really means there's two that I can tell. There's the 3rd party so-called memory issue and the large dB / NVFS issue. The later being a real issue for palmOne, but only affects a small percetage of users. None-the-less, this is a real issue.
  8.    #8  
  9.    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by anastrophe
    don't let the door smack you on your *** on your way out...
    Real Intelligent Response. People like you make these Forums a pleasure ,AxxHxxe
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by drknucklehead
    What memory issue are you refering to specifically?
    I do not know which memory issue he is refering to. What I am refering to is that there is not enough memory for me to port my 600 image to a 650. I think that is called DOA. I am not fixing blame, only stating facts.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by fishnetb
    I have been buying Palms since the beginning, too many to count. Each time they produced a new model it was always deficient and lacking something, especially when they released the M505 with its dismal dim screen, one of their biggest mistakes. I have continued to be loyal to Palm and purchased their new models, one after the other, which always had 1 or 2 disappointing deficiencies. Sony gave them a jump start with their innovations and gave new life to the company. Palm implemented these into their units and there was hope with better models being produced. My Treo 600, again, had disappointing deficiencies, not enough memory, lo res screen, no removable battery, no Bluetooth. I recently sold my Treo 600 on Ebay in anticipation of the 650 thinking finally a unit that has "most" (no wi-fi) of everything. I pre-ordered the unit. Now, this memory issue, enough. This will be my last disappointment. I will be switching to PocketPC, and I am not alone. It is unfortunate that Palmsource will be responsible for its own destruction, not to be blamed on PocketPC.

    PalmOne Are You Listening?
    Actually, I agree with you to a certan extent. There has always seemed to be something wrong, some deficient feature in many of the devices that PalmOne/Palm release:

    M515 - pathetic reflective color screen
    TT- again weak reflective screen
    T3 - wonderful device but horrible battery life and no wifi
    TC - no BT, no stereo heaphones etc
    T5 - no wifi, no vibrating alarms, no VR, and no Cobalt
    Z72 - peeling blue paint
    Treo 300 - no SD expansion, defective flip lid design
    Treo 600 - low rez sreen and no BT
    Treo 650 - limited 'ram' due to NVFS, no wifi drivers for SDIO slot, VGA cam

    And the list can go on. However, you can argue that a device will never be perfect b/c there is always a way to design something better, more creatively, or more efficiently. It also can be argued that a 'perfect' device is not in PalmOne interest b/c then why would anyone upgrade or buy another device later? I do not want to beleive the latter hypothesis b/c primarily I don't believe the 'perfect' device exists and nor do I believe that PalmOne is that manipulative (perhaps naivite on my part). Also, there are many business and cost/benefit considerations that the company has to make that most users like us are not privy too...for example the component costs and contract assoc with them and etc... I can understand all this and can even accept the explanations when given. However, this is not an isolated incident with PalmOne and is more a pattern with their devices. In fact, it has come to be accepted that PalmOne always seems to UNDER-DELIVER from their expectations. They always seem to fall short of what many users want. Perhaps they are not targetting the uber user that frequents a message board like this, but it is an evident trend of Palmone that is verified by the recent history of the devices they have released... it is very un-nerving imo...
    Last edited by Gaurav; 11/19/2004 at 07:29 PM.
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

    Current device: Palm Pre
    Device graveyard: Palm Vx, Cassiopeia E100, LG Phenom HPC, Palm M515, Treo 300, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Axim X50v, Treo 800w



    Please don't PM me about my avatar. For more info go here.

    Restore your Pre to factory settings using webos doctor and follow these instructions
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray
    I do not know which memory issue he is refering to. What I am refering to is that there is not enough memory for me to port my 600 image to a 650. I think that is called DOA. I am not fixing blame, only stating facts.
    Well, I don't think you should be trying to do that in the first place considering all the 3rd party app conflicts that could occur. Read this upgrade guide for more info...

    http://kb.palmone.com/SRVS/CGI-BIN/WEBCGI.EXE?New,Kb=PalmSupportKB,ts=Palm_External2001,Case=obj(14403)
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

    Current device: Palm Pre
    Device graveyard: Palm Vx, Cassiopeia E100, LG Phenom HPC, Palm M515, Treo 300, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Axim X50v, Treo 800w



    Please don't PM me about my avatar. For more info go here.

    Restore your Pre to factory settings using webos doctor and follow these instructions
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by fishnetb
    Real Intelligent Response. People like you make these Forums a pleasure ,AxxHxxe
    mmm-kay. do you have your 650 yet? no? but you're disappointed already, even though you do not know with any certainty whether the memory issue will affect you?

    mmm-kay. real intelligent post. 'my new treo 650 that i don't have yet sucks! i'm going to jump to a different platform that has a new and different set of deficiencies to keep me busy complaining!'

    come on. for crying out loud, WAIT UNTIL YOU HAVE THE THING AND TRY IT BEFORE YOU DECIDE IT SUCKS.

    sorry for shouting. and yeah, my first comment was unpleasant, i apologize. but being disappointed before even getting the thing is irrational.
    Paul Theodoropoulos
    <a href=http://www.anastrophe.com>www.anastrophe.com</a>
  14. #14  
    fishnetb, thanks for the links, but each one points to the later memory issue I noted in my reply. That is users with large dB's or files run out of user memory. As noted above, I agree this is an issue, but that that still leaves two memory issues and not the 12 or 13 you stated. The first being 3rd party related and the second being available user memory. Let's see how palmOne responds.
  15.    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by anastrophe
    mmm-kay. do you have your 650 yet? no? but you're disappointed already, even though you do not know with any certainty whether the memory issue will affect you?

    mmm-kay. real intelligent post. 'my new treo 650 that i don't have yet sucks! i'm going to jump to a different platform that has a new and different set of deficiencies to keep me busy complaining!'

    come on. for crying out loud, WAIT UNTIL YOU HAVE THE THING AND TRY IT BEFORE YOU DECIDE IT SUCKS.

    sorry for shouting. and yeah, my first comment was unpleasant, i apologize. but being disappointed before even getting the thing is irrational.
    Now that is an intelligent reply. PalmOne has admitted to the problem and is working to resolve it. They knew about it for months and they are still releasing the unit. This pisses me off.
    See the Link:

    http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...ad.php?t=62763
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by anastrophe
    come on. for crying out loud, WAIT UNTIL YOU HAVE THE THING AND TRY IT BEFORE YOU DECIDE IT SUCKS.

    sorry for shouting. and yeah, my first comment was unpleasant, i apologize. but being disappointed before even getting the thing is irrational.
    Actually its not. Thats what orgs like consumer reports are for. People want to know what they are getting before they get it. If you knew that 80 percent of the people that bought meat at your local store got Mad Cow disease would you still buy some? Even though the meat you buy may not be infected. Sort of kind of the same thing. If people are having issues and valid ones at that (even the people at P1 say its an issue) then I think its a valid argument. Buying the thing wont make them change it, returning it is only a hassle. The best thing to do is not buy one. That will make them do something about it.
    Im keeping my 600. Why? because the memory issue sucks. I have like 2M left on my 600 now. I can pretty much tell you (from others experiance) that the 650 wont cut it. And I dont need to spend 600 bucks to test it.

    Mark
  17.    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    Actually, I agree with you to a certan extent. There has always seemed to be something wrong, some deficient feature in many of the devices that PalmOne/Palm release:

    M515 - pathetic reflective color screen
    TT- again weak reflective screen
    T3 - wonderful device but horrible battery life and no wifi
    TC - no BT, no stereo heaphones etc
    T5 - no wifi, no vibrating alarms, no VR, and no Cobalt
    Z72 - peeling blue paint
    Treo 300 - no SD expansion, defective flip lid design
    Treo 600 - low rez sreen and no BT
    Treo 650 - limited 'ram' due to NVFS, no wifi drivers for SDIO slot, VGA cam

    And the list can go on. However, you can argue that a device will never be perfect b/c there is always a way to design something better, more creatively, or more efficiently. It also can be argued that a 'perfect' device is not in PalmOne interest b/c then why would anyone upgrade or buy another device later? I do not want to beleive the latter hypothesis b/c primarily I don't the 'perfect' device exists and nor do I believe that PalmOne is that manipulative (perhaps naivite on my part). Also, there are many business and cost/benefit considerations that the company has to make that most users like us are not privy too...for example the component costs and contract assoc with them and etc... I can understand all this and can even accept the explanations when given. However, this is not an isolated incident with PalmOne and is more a pattern with their devices. In fact, it has come to be accepted that PalmOne always seems to UNDER-DELIVER from their expectations. They always seem to fall short of what many users want. Perhaps they are not targetting the uber user that frequents a message board like this, but it is an evident trend of Palmone that is verified by the recent history of the devices they have released... it is very un-nerving imo...


    gfunkmagic,

    I am real impressed with your knowledge and rationale. I appreciate your thoughts, thanks.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    In fact, it has come to be accepted that PalmOne always seems to UNDER-DELIVER from their expectations. They always seem to fall short of what many users want. Perhaps they are not targetting the uber user that frequents a message board like this(
    At the DC roadshow, Greg Shirai gave a very good speeech on the Palm design philosophy, and why they are not, have not ever, and do not plan to ship absolutely cutting edge devices. That sounds worse coming from me than it did from him, but the takeaway message was that Palm makes device decisions based on usability instead of feature-count.

    He went on to talk about how the Palm is intended to be like a watch, quickly checked on a frequent basis. The opposite would be like a PC which you immerse yourself in and work with for extended periods of time. The penalty to change context with a palm (and especially a treo) is almost nothing. To switch in and out of the "PC mode" is much higher.

    To me that made sense, because I pull my 300 out check something, put it back, and repeat ad infinitum for the rest of the day. Or take notes as ideas come up. Or play a game to bid time waiting on queue

    Buttonholed afterwards by a mob of strident RAM/WiFi compl... begg... whin... hrmmm... "fans" Greg Shirai talked about the component costs on the RAM issue, that $15 more per unit for RAM would have meant a low-res screen or no bluetooth or keeping the slower processor. Maybe would have cost two of the three. The addition of the removable battery required NVFS, which increased the RAM costs - it's an iterative development, an evolution of the 600.

    If you judge the 650 by the 600, and not your desires for it, it's really hard not to see this a great device. I wanted 64 MB of RAM and WiFi as well, but I am going to have a lot of fun with what it is. I waited to upgrade (technically, I still am) from the 300 to the 650, maybe some of the more put-out 600 users should just calm-down and skip a generation for the 700 (or 900 - whatever)
  19. #19  
    Palm has certainly known about the memory problem for awhile. The 650 & Tungsten T5 both have the same memory issues with the slow flash. 3rd party developers, and users, are in an uproar. The best explanation of how Palm screwed up is in the Yahoo Groups forum for Pimlico Software's Datebk5. I hope Palm comes up with a solution quickly.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by fishnetb
    [COLOR=Blue]Now that is an intelligent reply.
    well, i wouldn't go *that* far.
    Paul Theodoropoulos
    <a href=http://www.anastrophe.com>www.anastrophe.com</a>
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