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  1. joele's Avatar
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    #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by beelzebueb
    tks acajigas to picking up on the subject - and handless king stop proving you're clueless. arrogancy has no place in this forum. acajigas is right, thats all.

    people not caring about wi-fi are the ones not leaving their homes, not travelling internationally, perhaps even non-american.

    there is another world out there P1. if you dont get that, you dont get their money.
    I don't think Palm or most people on this forum realise or maybe more to the point care that there is a world outside the US.
    Last edited by joele; 11/01/2004 at 03:40 AM.
  2. joele's Avatar
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    #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by HighRollN95
    Ok Wi-Fi people out there.....please explain to me the exact benefit for having Wi-Fi in a phone as to having a phone with the internet service GSM/GPRS or CDMA from the service provider which gives you unlimited access to the internet wherever you please....I work with Palmone sales and everytime I get someone calling me asking me about wi-fi or getting mad about it because it's not offered with the phone, it just makes me wonder, what's wrong with these people, because you are not seeing the advantage of having GSM or CDMA as to Wi-Fi just for about 20 bucks extra you can have you're own email account and unlimited or massive amount of internet access...and all the service providers we use in the US have that capability...believe me if you're somewhere that doesnt have a hot spot and you need internet what are you going to do?...now if you have a treo with a data plan in the same situation what are you going to do? easy, access the web browser exactly where you're at Wi-Fi is more of an advantage for regular PDA's without the phone attributes or atleast from the categories of products i've been working with.

    Because the world doesn't go from the US east coast to west coast, GPRS is overpriced outside the US, and most people don't care, as there are lots of free wifi hotspots and pretty much ALL PPC devices support wifi (internally or via card), as I said Palm only care about 1 market, which I think is short sighted. What burnt me, and meant that I would never buy a Palm product again (after 9 years as a happy Palm user) was their lies. Made worse by them 'apparently' doing all they could to make sure no drivers appeared for the sandisk wifi cards, as Palm wanted to eventually release their own limited compatability overpriced rebadged wifi card. (too little, too late)

    http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...ad.php?t=59073

    Ohh well, move along, leave Palm if you don't like their crap, and the rest of you keep flaming each other for daring to bring up valid problems in Palm products, its very funny, if not a little sad!!!
    Last edited by joele; 11/01/2004 at 03:41 AM.
  3. #63  
    Well, some people need access to their home/work LANs too via Wi-Fi...its not just the internet.

    Just my view....
  4. #64  
    Why would I leave Palm over one thing, ok if it was that personal then sorry didn't mean to stab that hard...I just see an advantage to what i view but I'm just an associate/ average teenager that's been using the internet, data transfer and what not through my phone carrier and I don't travel but hey if you guys travel alot then I guess you see an advantage through WiFi..
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by vish0402
    Well, some people need access to their home/work LANs too via Wi-Fi...its not just the internet.

    Just my view....
    Thats what computers are for
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by joele
    I don't think Palm or most people on this forum realise or maybe more to the point care that there is a world outside the US.
    To say that people who think Wi-fi is unnecessary in a smartphone "don't know there is a world outside the US", is utterly absurd. How did we go from having a debate over Wi-fi to calling Americans ignorant? I'm not getting this angle
    There's no place like 127.0.0.1
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by g.711
    I work in a secure building, Leaded windows and all. So we have WIFI in my department and it would be great to connect if available.
    If the building is supposed to be secure, they shouldn't be allowing cell phones in, certainly not ones with built in PDAs and definately not phones with a camera!
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by HighRollN95
    Ok Wi-Fi people out there.....please explain to me the exact benefit for having Wi-Fi in a phone as to having a phone with the internet service GSM/GPRS or CDMA from the service provider which gives you unlimited access to the internet wherever you please.....
    It is not a deal breaker for me, but the advantages for my situation is invaluable. I am on the road alot with work (and since a share of Treo users are travelling business people I am probably not alone).

    Even though Sprint has a pretty good coverage area, I am often times in roaming mode in backwaters, OR, ID, CA, and WY. When you roam...No Vision...No Vision then No Data....No Data then No Internet....No Internet then No Email or Web Access. No Internet or Email Access then I am forced to lug my laptop with me and find a hotspot or a place to plug in, download and sync.

    Is there a need? Yes.

    Will EVDO, which is not available with the 650, resolve it? Only if it can work while Roaming.

    Does everyone need it? Only customer demand can answer that.

    Could I use it or have need for it? Yes.

    Would I buy a 256 meg Wifi card? Yes because I personally need it, especially if that ended up being a price difference if included.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 11/01/2004 at 12:39 PM.
  9. #69  
    alright let me try to understand this. You want Wi-Fi to connect faster to the internet, and because you will be able to connect in secure buildings. Do you not own a computer!!!! This is rediclous! If you want a faster internet buy a computer. If you want to connect to the internet in a secure building buy a computer. Gosh it seems like you lives are connect to a smartphone! What the hell are you going to be downloading if you need a Wi-Fi connection. Porn? Grow up! I cant believe people think that this is going to be the end of the world.

    If you're not going to buy a 650 becuase of Wi-Fi then its more than likely you wouldnt even buy it at all. If it wasnt Wi-Fi then it would be the camera, if it wasnt the camera it would be the color, and it would always be something. Dont buy it and leave this forum to people who want it. Enough Said. Gawd!!!
  10. Iceman6's Avatar
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    #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeos
    alright let me try to understand this.
    Actually, Zeos, I don't see you trying very hard to understand this. For one thing, nobody carries their laptop around the house/apt. with them. But people pretty much carry their cell phones everywhere. Someone on this forum suggested that it would be fun to log on to ESPN and check stats while watching a game on TV. I have to admit I never thought of that, but yeah that would be fun. If you have your house wired for wifi, you can browse a lot faster if your phone can make use of it.
  11. #71  
    I think I see now why the 650 is bashed for not having WiFi from the reviews.....it's all from data accessing advantages....say you have verizon like Hobbes said, you're in a tight spot and need some info or need to transfer some important files or data from a website or through the business....your phone starts roaming, you won't be able to access it with that or if your phone cuts out you can't access it through that...so I'm guessing with having WiFi you can just switch to Wi-Fi and just access whatever you need through the 802.11b anytime you are in a bad spot...that is true that some service providers don't have really good connection or not that big of zones so it probably would be a better gain in certain situations with Wi-Fi....So I guess there is good gains with Wi-Fi...I've just have T-Mobile(which sucks) with the National Get More plan and it seems fine to me but I can see where Wi-Fi would be considerable in most situations....
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman6
    Someone on this forum suggested that it would be fun to log on to ESPN and check stats while watching a game on TV. I have to admit I never thought of that, but yeah that would be fun. If you have your house wired for wifi, you can browse a lot faster if your phone can make use of it.

    I actually did that during the Cowboys game. I was browsing and posting on a sport forum using my PDA2k while watching the game. It was pretty cool.
  13. #73  
    I think I was one of the people that suggested using wifi to browse ESPN while watching a game. People say use a computer, but I don't want to get up every batter and do that on my desktop. I have a laptop, which works, but laptops are kind of big to have on your lap for a 3 hour game. It's just not a comfortable solution. Everyone would have to admit that something like a Treo to get a stat would give you a better experience than a laptop. If you have an issue with that, then I suggest you sit through a few games with a laptop on your lap vs. a Treo in your hand.

    Secondly, wifi opens up new applications. I could suddenly develop an application that would stream music over wifi taking advantage of my 200GB hard drive upstairs. Suddenly I have something fairly equal or better than iPod when I'm at home. I can bring it anywhere, connect it to some speakers (perhaps even through an iRock), the whole room has music. Who wouldn't want this capability?

    You know what, I could even stream video over the wifi connection. Suddenly, I can see an application where I send broadcast TV from my computer (with a TV card) over wifi and watch the game outside in my hammock. Who wouldn't want this capability?

    There are the extra things that you "could" do. However, even if these application didn't appear (and I guarentee they would), it would still be nice to load 5 stories on www.cnn.com in less than 10 minutes. I don't know about the rest of you, but it's very rare that I find exactly what I'm looking for on the Internet on the first try. It takes me a few tries to find some obscure data (even with Google). Each attempt doesn't cost me 2 minutes of waiting with wifi and that's a Very Good Thing.

    Please cease the following arguments:
    1. "Wifi eats batteries too much." First off, it finds the data so much faster that you aren't using wifi very long. One minute of wifi use is equal to at least 10 minutes of cellular data use. So if it takes up 10 times the battery power, it's wash as far as battery power is concerned. Plus with removable batteries this is even a worse argument.
    2. "Cost to the end user." We aren't talking built-in, just via a card that PalmOne already sells. The Treo wouldn't cost an additional nickel if they just let that card work.
    3. "But I already have data everywhere with the cellular plan" - Actually you don't. I just got back from Aruba and plenty of wifi data available, no cellular data. Also cellular data isn't "all you can use" in many countries, thus wifi is a key way to save money for some people. People who use this argument don't understand that it's not an either-or situation. It's okay to have both -- it really is. Even if they interfere with each other, that's not a problem, I don't see myself using both at the same time anyway.
    4. "Don't buy a Treo if you need wifi." The most short-sighted of all arguments. What would you recommend I buy that has PalmOS, keyboard, compact size, and phone/messaging capabilities?
    5. "3G networks will be here next year so wifi is pointless" The 3G networks won't approach the speed of wifi. Maybe the 4G networks will, but that's far away. Also, I've been hearing "next year" for quite some time now. It never comes or only comes to some cities. And if it does ever come, you can be fairly sure that the premium 3G technology will come at a premium price. And that's a price that you'd have to pay MONTHLY as opposed to wifi's one time purchase of a card. If the new 3G service is $75 a month (not a stretch) there's no way that's an option for me vs. my $10 Vision plan, plus a $129 wifi card. I think most everyone would take the combo of super fast in some areas and kind of fast in all areas for $10 a month vs. pretty fast in all areas for $75 a month.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    4. "Don't buy a Treo if you need wifi." The most short-sighted of all arguments. What would you recommend I buy that has PalmOS, keyboard, compact size, and phone/messaging capabilities?
    I made this point in this or another thread, and I stick by it. It's not short-sighted, it's just based on the facts at hand. If you buy a Treo, you might get WiFi support, but palmOne hasn't guaranteed anything on this front. To put it another way, if someone asked me to recommend a Smartphone and said that WiFi was a requirement, I could not recommend the Treo. If someone (like yourself) additionally required that it be a PalmOS Smartphone, I'd have to tell them they are out of luck at the moment.

    Again, I intend to buy a 650, so I'm not arguing against the Treo. I just see very little value in complaining about the lack of WiFi on the Treo. Take it for what it is and plan around it (including the possibility of buying a different phone), make sure your complaint is registered with palmOne, and hope that you are heard over the din of their carriers, who are trying to strategize against the onslaught of broadband services, like VoIP and WiMAX.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman6
    Someone on this forum suggested that it would be fun to log on to ESPN and check stats while watching a game on TV. I have to admit I never thought of that, but yeah that would be fun. If you have your house wired for wifi, you can browse a lot faster if your phone can make use of it.
    alright if you are watching the game and need stats I dont think you need Wi-Fi! What the HELL is wrong with using your data plan?!?! My brother has the sprint vision plan on his regular camera phone and it works just fine! What you cant wait about 30 seconds for the stats? Is it that important!
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    Secondly, wifi opens up new applications. I could suddenly develop an application that would stream music over wifi taking advantage of my 200GB hard drive upstairs. Suddenly I have something fairly equal or better than iPod when I'm at home. I can bring it anywhere, connect it to some speakers (perhaps even through an iRock), the whole room has music. Who wouldn't want this capability?

    You know what, I could even stream video over the wifi connection. Suddenly, I can see an application where I send broadcast TV from my computer (with a TV card) over wifi and watch the game outside in my hammock. Who wouldn't want this capability?
    JSKDJFLKAJLIE!!! Thats is what Im screaming right now! Stream music?!?! Have you heard of a s-t-e-r-e-o(say it slowly so you understand) or s-p-e-a-k-e-r-s? Geez if you need to stream music that bad you have issues? If you want streaming music that bad buy a TiVo. You'll be able to do all that and plus if you have a surround ound system you can hear it a lot better tahn some little speakers.

    And with watching the game outside on a 320x320 screen... now you just streching it. I dont even need to comment on that.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeos
    alright if you are watching the game and need stats I dont think you need Wi-Fi! What the HELL is wrong with using your data plan?!?! My brother has the sprint vision plan on his regular camera phone and it works just fine! What you cant wait about 30 seconds for the stats? Is it that important!
    ESPN.com takes over 2 minutes on my Sprint Treo 600. To actually navigate to some player's stats it would take another couple of page loads of 2 minutes. In that 5 minutes or so time, the batter is already is already likely to have completed his at bat (using baseball as an example). If it was really 30 seconds to get through 3 or 4 pages that would be fine, however it is not. And no it's not that important, but it is more important to me than taking really lousy pictures with the camera. I'm not saying it's like that for anyone else, but just using that as an example.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeos
    JSKDJFLKAJLIE!!! Thats is what Im screaming right now! Stream music?!?! Have you heard of a s-t-e-r-e-o(say it slowly so you understand) or s-p-e-a-k-e-r-s? Geez if you need to stream music that bad you have issues? If you want streaming music that bad buy a TiVo. You'll be able to do all that and plus if you have a surround ound system you can hear it a lot better tahn some little speakers.

    And with watching the game outside on a 320x320 screen... now you just streching it. I dont even need to comment on that.
    LOL, I have a stereo surround system, but that only has a CD player which can play, well 15 songs or so, not nearly the 800 CDs that I have on my hard drive in my office. And if I want to create a mix of songs, I'd have to burn a CD and then put that in. It's far better to stream. I understand if you've never streamed music before or experienced having every song in your collection available anywhere. As for buying a Tivo, I have a ReplayTV and that does have some networking and may even work in my living room, but it's not portable. Having music in my bedroom would require me to buy yet a 2nd Tivo (not to mention probably have a TV in there, which I do, but it would be nice not to need one).

    It's a much better solution to have a handheld device that I can hook up to those s-p-e-a-k-e-r-s (yes I mentioned them originally) and play through them. The Treo would have this ability if it had wifi as it has a good audio out jack.

    I don't think I'm insane for wanting to stream music through my house. If I am there are plenty with me, because there are a number of products that do this. And while I could (and actually have) purchase(d) those products (waiting for my Gateway Connected DVD player at this very moment) it's still just an example of something very useful with wifi.

    As for the watching TV outside, there are plenty of people that watch TV (well DVD Movies) on the 160x160 screen of the Treo. See the article at http://www.treocentral.com/content/Stories/448-1.htm. Now with 320x320 and more colors it just gets four times better, meaning that it will appeal to even more people. And while I admit that it's kind of useless indoors (unless you really wanted to watch two games at the same time without moving TVs) it's perfect for watching in a hammock outside. Maybe it takes a true sports nut to appreciate this, but I love football and baseball and watch a lot of games. However on those nice summer or crisp fall days it would be good to be outside and get some fresh air without having to miss the action.

    Again these are just two of the many possible applications that came to my head in 4 minutes. If these two aren't for you that's fine, but I think they are for some people.
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by jimf
    I made this point in this or another thread, and I stick by it. It's not short-sighted, it's just based on the facts at hand. If you buy a Treo, you might get WiFi support, but palmOne hasn't guaranteed anything on this front.
    And that's what it really comes down to. I'm hoping PalmOne hears this and sees the possibilities of wifi. Until that time, there's not enough incentive for me to upgrade from my Treo 600 to the Treo 650.
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman6
    Actually, Zeos, I don't see you trying very hard to understand this. For one thing, nobody carries their laptop around the house/apt. with them. But people pretty much carry their cell phones everywhere. Someone on this forum suggested that it would be fun to log on to ESPN and check stats while watching a game on TV. I have to admit I never thought of that, but yeah that would be fun. If you have your house wired for wifi, you can browse a lot faster if your phone can make use of it.
    I do this all of the time...

    ...with my laptop.


    I would shoot myself if I had to do it with my T600. (or 650 for that point)
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