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  1. #41  
    Well I'm voting with my feet. B/t the new BB, the Treo 650, the MPx, the BenQ, and the IPaq 6315, I'm getting the BB, and not just b/c it's cheapest and available soonest (and with my current carrier).

    I'm getting the BB because after many years with many devices, including several converged, I've learned quite specifically my usage patterns in terms of connectivity, hardware and software needs. The BB by far most closely matches my needs. So I'm getting it. Arguing which is better presumes we all have the same needs, desires and opinions which is of course plain silly.

    TM
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by enagel
    Walter Mossberg in today's WSJ column reviews the new Blackberry 7100t and compares it against the T600. The most interesting thing, however, about the review is that he hints strongly on some of the features that will be in the new Treo (e.g., better screen, removable battery and Bluetooth). Since Handspring used Mossberg to generate buzz for the T600 by giving him a pre-release version of the handset, I would anticipate PalmOne is probably going that route again. Then again, perhaps Mossberg got his info. from here and WBO's pictures.
    while i was reading the article, i had the feeling he already had one (an ace).

    Felipe
    On the road to 5,000 posts
    Life is what happens between Firmware releases.
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by imageone
    maybe Mossberg is WBO. WBO is jewish and so is Mossberg ...... interesting.

    I'm Jewish, too. So are William Shatner, Jerry Seinfeld, Joe Lieberman, Leonard Nimoy, Michael Eisner, Ariel Sharon, and a few million other guys (and girls). Guess we are all WBO?
    http://www.doctordalai.com
  4. #44  
    I have to agree with gharrod. I have a T600 and love it, but I also have a Blackberry for my corporate email. I will seriously consider the new BB as it combines both the phone and BB client nicely. I don't need MP3 or Camera functionality. Although nice, not a necessity. I like that the BB has Bluetooth, decent screen, battery life, web browser and combines my corporate and personal email. P1 better annouce something soon, before corporate folks like me switch to the BB.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai Lama
    I'm Jewish, too. So are William Shatner, Jerry Seinfeld, Joe Lieberman, Leonard Nimoy, Michael Eisner, Ariel Sharon, and a few million other guys (and girls). Guess we are all WBO?
    I think there's a little WBO in all of us
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai Lama
    I'm Jewish, too. So are William Shatner, Jerry Seinfeld, Joe Lieberman, Leonard Nimoy, Michael Eisner, Ariel Sharon, and a few million other guys (and girls). Guess we are all WBO?
    All these time I thought you were Chinese...oops, sorry, I mean Tibetan
  7. #47  
    bmacfarland wrote:
    I think you can make a case for not needing a touchscreen, but it has to be considered a plus. Some people use it, and come to think of it, I use it when web surfing because I don't want to scroll to the bottom of a page to go to new a URL icon (a pain if it's a really long web-page).


    Or you could just hit the spacebar.
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    #48  
    If you didn't read the article, Mossberg also said that while it was a nice try, he wasn't giving up his 600 - even at 1/3 the price (tho he also said you could get the 600 for $250-$300...)
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai Lama
    I'm Jewish, too. So are William Shatner, Jerry Seinfeld, Joe Lieberman, Leonard Nimoy, Michael Eisner, Ariel Sharon, and a few million other guys (and girls). Guess we are all WBO?
    EXACTLY ! thanks for seeing my point.
    <body bgcolor="#ffffff">
    <p><font size="-2" color="#4684ff" face="Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular"><b>imageone</b></font><font size="-2" face="Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular"> &#x2022; current - <b>PowerBook G4 - Mac OS X - white iPod video 60GB - Treo 650 - 700p (Sprint)<br>
    </b></font><font size="-2" face="Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular">retired - Visor Deluxe - Visor Prism - Kyocera 6035 - Treo 300 - Treo 600 - Blackberry 7250</font></p>
    </body>
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by anthonymoody
    Arguing which is better presumes we all have the same needs, desires and opinions which is of course plain silly.

    TM
    I don't think that's entirely true, though true to some extent. I'm sure you could argue pretty much nearly anything if you that good of a debater. However, I think a lot of people would take pretty much any cell phone from today and say it's better than a cell phone from 12 years ago. It's an extreme example, but I think there is value is discussing the pros/cons of a various phones.

    Gamboy70, Thanks! I knew there had to be an easier way. Still it reaffirms my point that while more anything can be done with the 5-way, it takes some learning (and something like that isn't really obvious). For that reason, I like the idea of having a touchscreen. It's not quite the difference between controlling your computer with a keyboard and a mouse (you really don't just a mouse or just a keyboard), but there's some validity to that analogy.
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    I don't think that's entirely true, though true to some extent. I'm sure you could argue pretty much nearly anything if you that good of a debater. However, I think a lot of people would take pretty much any cell phone from today and say it's better than a cell phone from 12 years ago. It's an extreme example, but I think there is value is discussing the pros/cons of a various phones.

    I'm not debating the value of discussing the pros/cons of various phones. The issue is that that is not what generally happens. What generally happens is that people favor one device or another (probably b/c it suits their particular fancy), then try to ram it down everyone else's throats, treating dissenters like they're stupid for preferring something different. It's not discussion, and it's certainly not even rational debate, it's more like indignant defensiveness layered with a heaping of jerk.

    TM
  12. #52  
    Face facts, every post in this thread is correct IF you consider the point of view. For us "techno-lust geeks" only the T650 will do the job. I could never see even having a Samsung i600 for lack of a touchscreen. I want it all in one case; the smaller the better.

    If you ask the average consumer (even some techno-literate professionals in the real estate, banking, insurance, legal industries) they've never heard of a Treo 600. Yet many of those have heard of "th Blackberry" and now you can not only talk to it; it's $400 less than the Treo 600. (Yes, it's much cheaper at Amazon, but to the average person who still shops at Best Buy, where list price is $599 less a $50 mail in rebate, that IS the price).

    Net result - unless PalmOne comes out with a low end competitor, the Treo line will continue to conquer a niche market that keeps getting smaller - for the "rest of the world" the 7100T will be their smartphone. The only thing going for PalmOne is that it's a T-Mobile product - so that narrows its market (watch out if it shows up on Cingular, AT&T, etc.)
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    Would your thoughts change if PalmOne added Blackberry support? A News.com story today says they might have already if not for a lawsuit on RIM that they don't want to be pulled into. Granted Blackberry will still be a big brand, but Treo could billed as full Blackberry support and any business decision maker (blackberry's core audience) should be able to understand that and base a decision knowing that.
    Yes, palmOne adding Blackberry support would mitigate that a bit. Like you said, however, the big-brand nature of Blackberry is hard to completely overcome for those to whom email is the "killer app" for converged devices.
  14. #54  
    P1 gets much cheaper and RIMM will end up buying a lot of P1 stock and our Treo's will have that funny Canadian accent all of a sudden...
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    If you ask the average consumer (even some techno-literate professionals in the real estate, banking, insurance, legal industries) they've never heard of a Treo 600. Yet many of those have heard of "th Blackberry" and now you can not only talk to it; it's $400 less than the Treo 600. (Yes, it's much cheaper at Amazon, but to the average person who still shops at Best Buy, where list price is $599 less a $50 mail in rebate, that IS the price).
    I'd argue that plenty of average people shop at Amazon. Also the average consumer generally isn't in the market for a smart phone (IMO), but if they were they'd do a little research into it or ask a techie friend what they think. I know if I'm spending $200 or more on ANYTHING, I do some research. Maybe I'm a tightwad and the average person isn't.

    All that said, all PalmOne would simply have to do is drop the price on the Treo 600 everywhere when the next generation is out. Many dates seem to say October 20th, so about 40 days from now. Is the sky falling in the meantime? Of course not. There's no way that Blackberry adds Verizon, Sprint, Cingular, AT&T in the next 40 days.

    I'm not even too worried about Blackberry brand if PalmOne gets their Blackberry Connect in place. Basically, they could bill it as Treo 650 with Blackberry Inside (like Intel does) and anyone with an IQ of 50 or more (and who is in the market for Blackberry functionality) should realize that the Treo 650 qualifies.
  16. #56  
    Note the following from JP Morgan...

    Point 1 - They (P1) do EXPECT the new BB device to be competition in 2005 - Those that doubted that you have it from P1 themselves.
    Point 2 - They have confirmed with the analyst that the new Treo will be INTRODUCED in October. I take it that INTRODUCED means available for purchase not just announced. That means production has to be in full swing and shipments starting to roll into the country and through distribution.

    07:25 PLMO palmOne: JP Morgan comments on recent competition (29.79 )

    JP Morgan out on PalmOne following news out yesterday that RIM introduced the 7100 smartphone priced at $199 through T- Mobile, and details became available regarding the higher priced (approx $800) Nokia 9300 Communicator. Competition in the Smartphone category is likely to intensify going into the 2004 holiday period and beyond. RIM's pricing strategy looks challenging for PalmOne (Treo), though not until 2005, in their view. In the near-term, they see continued strong demand for the Treo 600 and have nudged up their August shipment forecast to 250,000 units accordingly. Firm believes Treo shipments remain modestly supply-constrained but that the ramp should continue into the Nov (280K) and Feb (310K) qtrs. They expect a new Treo model to be introduced in Oct which will contribute to this growth. Believes there is potential for PLMO to ratchet down operating expenses in F1Q05, and the effective tax rate could come in below firm's 17% forecast owing to NOL carryforward. JP Morgan has nudged up EPS by $0.01 for the qtr to $0.20 EPS (aligned with consensus) on slightly higher sales of $272.8 mln (prior $271.8 mln). They have trimmed FY05 gross margins slightly; FY05 EPS is down by $0.02. Reiterates Neutral rating saying they believe PLMO's near-term prospects are good and they look to trade the stock; buying ahead of the CY04 holiday season on further weakness.
  17. #57  
    You guys should get your companies to switch to Good -- it kicks the pants of BB. Really. And, the Treo supports it. Truly the converged device. Perfect.
  18. #58  
    What are you saying MHR?
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by MHR
    You guys should get your companies to switch to Good -- it kicks the pants of BB. Really. And, the Treo supports it. Truly the converged device. Perfect.
    You can't always just get your company to do something. My company uses 123Together.com (for a variety of reasons) and seeing how they provide e-mail services for many, many companies, one guy in one company with one smart phone isn't going to count for a lot of weight to them.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by gharrod
    Note the following from JP Morgan...

    Point 1 - They (P1) do EXPECT the new BB device to be competition in 2005 - Those that doubted that you have it from P1 themselves.
    Point 2 - They have confirmed with the analyst that the new Treo will be INTRODUCED in October. I take it that INTRODUCED means available for purchase not just announced. That means production has to be in full swing and shipments starting to roll into the country and through distribution.
    That's interesting stuff. I wonder why the BB device doesn't look challenging until 2005? Maybe because it doesn't work on as many carriers right now? I think by that time the Treo 600 will be in the same price range and they'll probably compete pretty equally with each other. I still think the Treo 600 is able to do more things than the BB, which count as "better" in my book. If you don't need those things and/or never use them, then it probably comes down to how good each can do your core tasks.

    In any case, I see this as more of a Treo 600 vs. the new BB than the Treo 650 vs. the new BB. As for competition, right now, I'd say it seems to be the supply-chain management more than any other device.
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