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  1.    #1  
    This is getting confusing. With all the misinformation out there and the variety of options, can we clarify in a couple of posts what the options are for people looking for GSM phones? Is the following right?

    - AT&T - from Handspring - with plan - LOCKED = $499
    - AT&T - from Handspring - with no plan - LOCKED = $499
    - AT&T - from AT&T - with plan - LOCKED = $549
    - Cingular - from Handspring - with plan - UNLOCKED = $499
    - Cingular - from Handspring - with no plan - UNLOCKED = $699
    - Cingular - from Cingular - with plan - UNLOCKED? (their rep claimed it's LOCKED) = $499
    - Cingular - from Cingular - with no plan - UNLOCKED? (their rep claimed it's LOCKED) = $699
    - Unbranded GSM - from Handspring - UNLOCKED = $699
    - T-Mobile = unavailable
  2. #2  
    Though it may be unlocked, palmOne warns that the Cingular TREO 600 is optimized for the Cingular network and may not work as well (or at all?) on other networks.

    That makes the "unlock" factoid somewhat moot, no?

    (to those who say "Works fine for me on another network!" - don't. You are a single datapoint peculiar to your own location and do not even BEGIN to reflect the network as a whole - and carriers need a phone to work here, there and everywhere.)
  3. #3  
    I signed up & purchased a Cingular branded Treo 600 last month when they hit the stores (Walnut Creek, CA). walked out of the store, popped in my AT&T sim card and viola! 2 days later AT&T came out with their own, albeit a locked version. I have 8 accounts w/ AT&T, and I am happy. So, I went to the San Ramon, CA store "weassled" a great deal on the phone & returned and canceled my Cingular. Both phones worked identical with the only notable differences:
    Cincular has Cingular Splash screen on Startup
    AT&T has AT&T Splash screen on Startup.
    AT&T has "Office Online" icon link to a premium web service.
    When the phone was on it read "At&T Wireless" at the top regardless of wich unit I was using.
    I was able to access my Comcast mail account on either unit.
  4. #4  
    Can I get an unbranded, unlocked GSM from Handspring? Was there ever an option to apply the T270 upgrade to such a model?
  5.    #5  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    Though it may be unlocked, palmOne warns that the Cingular TREO 600 is optimized for the Cingular network and may not work as well (or at all?) on other networks.

    That makes the "unlock" factoid somewhat moot, no?

    (to those who say "Works fine for me on another network!" - don't. You are a single datapoint peculiar to your own location and do not even BEGIN to reflect the network as a whole - and carriers need a phone to work here, there and everywhere.)

    I have not heard of a single person with a truly unlocked phone that has not been able to use their phone on AT&T, Cingular or T-Mobile by simply putting in the appropriate SIM. If it was an issue, I would have expected problems would have been reported by now. The sample size should be fairly significant (over 1000 users?) by now.

    To those who say "You are a single datapoint peculiar to your own location and do not even BEGIN to reflect the network as a whole!" - don't.
    Last edited by The Chupacabra; 12/16/2003 at 11:23 PM.
  6.    #6  
    Originally posted by roadwarrior
    I signed up & purchased a Cingular branded Treo 600 last month when they hit the stores (Walnut Creek, CA). walked out of the store, popped in my AT&T sim card and viola!
    It was the Walnut Creek Cingular store that I had called when I was told the phone was locked. (I'm not sure if it was really Walnut Creek that answered though, since they have an annoying voice mail system that could easily have transferred me to Mexico for all I know...)
  7.    #7  
    Originally posted by pbryon
    Can I get an unbranded, unlocked GSM from Handspring? Was there ever an option to apply the T270 upgrade to such a model?

    I don't think it's on their website, but I've heard you can get one if you call them.
  8.    #8  
    Originally posted by The Chupacabra
    This is getting confusing. With all the misinformation out there and the variety of options, can we clarify in a couple of posts what the options are for people looking for GSM phones? Is the following right?

    - AT&T - from Handspring - with plan - LOCKED = $499
    - AT&T - from Handspring - with no plan - LOCKED = $499
    - AT&T - from AT&T - with plan - LOCKED = $549
    - Cingular - from Handspring - with plan - UNLOCKED = $499
    - Cingular - from Handspring - with no plan - UNLOCKED = $699
    - Cingular - from Cingular - with plan - UNLOCKED? (their rep claimed it's LOCKED) = $499
    - Cingular - from Cingular - with no plan - UNLOCKED? (their rep claimed it's LOCKED) = $699
    - Unbranded GSM - from Handspring - UNLOCKED = $699
    - T-Mobile = unavailable

    So is this right?
  9. #9  
    Except for the part of getting an locked from Handspring I believe you are right. I don't know anyone who has gotten one in the U.S. I did get one from a distributer in Singapore. When I called Handspring about an issue with the display they were dumbfounded that I got an unlocked one and insisted that the unlocked one is not for sale yet.

    To Seldomvisitor, I say phooey to your "single datapoint". This datapoint has tested three Treo 600s in two states and they work fine. Do you really know how GSM and GPRS works? I've bought the latest GSM phones from distributors in Europe for new Nokia and Sony Ericsson models and they work fine with no special work from T-Mobile. The only problems are either:

    a.) They have a bug in the phone that needs a firmware update. This is a bug, not "optimizations" for a network. This is pure B.S. If someone says it's optimized for their network, they only mean that the phone bugs and network bugs match!

    b.) The network has a bug/needs upgrade. This is the case with using a Nokia 6600 right now on T-Mobile. This phone uses the newer WAP 2.0 for access and MMS and T-Zones don't work on T-Mobile because they haven't implemented WAP 2.0 gateways (proxies) yet. It does work fine on Cingular and AT&T if you know the settings to use.

    I have several times taken a phone from the U.S. to Europe and parts of Asia and it works fine. I didn't have to get an "optimized" version from the carriers in those countries to work. The way some people talk, you would think GSM was voodoo or something. If it's not working right it's a bug. If it's a bug it will get fixed eventually either by the phone provider, the carrier, or both.
    Main Phone: Treo 270/600/650/700w/700p/750v/Motorola Q/iPhone
    Tried but sold: Motorola Q/Nokia E61/700wx/HTC TyTN/Treo 680
  10. #10  
    > ...To Seldomvisitor, I say phooey to your "single datapoint"...

    Good lord!

    You are unfamiliar with scientific method, eh?

    Well, that's okay - no need to go there.

    What we have is THE MANUFACTURER saying:

    == No no no!

    Now, you can say:

    == Yes yes yes!

    but is it REALLY worth a $400+ bet that for some VERY STRANGE REASON a manufacturer who WANTS to sell you that $400 phone says:

    == No no no!

    and possibly loses a sale?

    I'm going to suggest to treocentral that they write an article about this because there are so many people like you naively misleading people against the suggestions of THE MANUFACTURER OF THE PHONE.
    Last edited by SeldomVisitor; 12/17/2003 at 06:09 AM.
  11. #11  
    I am familiar with the scientific method, are you? There are dozens of people here posting about the Cingular working fine, but you feel you can dismiss all of them by calling us all a single datapoint. I think you need to review the meaning of empirical data. Do you have a single datapoint that the Cingular model doesn't work on T-Mobile or works slower? If you do I'd love to see it given that nobody has a T-Mobile Treo to compare to. I can tell you the Cingular Treo 600 is much faster than a T-Mobile Treo 270 on their network.

    You also seem to need to distort the facts to suit your needs. Handspring is only putting up a disclaimer, the data may be slower on the T-Mobile network. This is something that they HAVE to do since T-Mobile hasn't officially released the device. All this talk of optimizations is silly. If you know how the technology works, you would know this is only an issue of possible bugs/settings needing to match the network for optimum performance. They are not tellling people, no no no!

    Keep in mind this all a theoretical issue. The reality is any data connection is going to be far more affected by network conditions at the time of the connection than any settings. If you want the fastest data go to Sprint anyways. If you want the interoperability of GSM/GPRS across many providers get the GSM model.

    I have to ask, do you even have a Treo SeldomVisitor? You seem to spread lots of negativity in your posts. Have you ever really contributed any data to any of these posts to help anyone or only to get people to not buy a Treo?


    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    > ...To Seldomvisitor, I say phooey to your "single datapoint"...

    Good lord!

    You are unfamiliar with scientific method, eh?

    Well, that's okay - no need to go there.

    What we have is THE MANUFACTURER saying:

    == No no no!

    Now, you can say:

    == Yes yes yes!

    but is it REALLY worth a $400+ bet that for some VERY STRANGE REASON a manufacturer who WANTS to sell you that $400 phone says:

    == No no no!

    and possibly loses a sale?

    I'm going to suggest to treocentral that they write an article about this because there are so many people like you naively misleading people against the suggestions of THE MANUFACTURER OF THE PHONE.
    Main Phone: Treo 270/600/650/700w/700p/750v/Motorola Q/iPhone
    Tried but sold: Motorola Q/Nokia E61/700wx/HTC TyTN/Treo 680
  12. #12  
    Originally posted by bcaslis
    I am familiar with the scientific method, are you? There are dozens of people here posting about the Cingular working fine, but you feel you can dismiss all of them by calling us all a single datapoint. I think you need to review the meaning of empirical data. Do you have a single datapoint that the Cingular model doesn't work on T-Mobile or works slower? If you do I'd love to see it given that nobody has a T-Mobile Treo to compare to. I can tell you the Cingular Treo 600 is much faster than a T-Mobile Treo 270 on their network.

    You also seem to need to distort the facts to suit your needs. Handspring is only putting up a disclaimer, the data may be slower on the T-Mobile network. This is something that they HAVE to do since T-Mobile hasn't officially released the device. All this talk of optimizations is silly. If you know how the technology works, you would know this is only an issue of possible bugs/settings needing to match the network for optimum performance. They are not tellling people, no no no!

    Keep in mind this all a theoretical issue. The reality is any data connection is going to be far more affected by network conditions at the time of the connection than any settings. If you want the fastest data go to Sprint anyways. If you want the interoperability of GSM/GPRS across many providers get the GSM model.

    I have to ask, do you even have a Treo SeldomVisitor? You seem to spread lots of negativity in your posts. Have you ever really contributed any data to any of these posts to help anyone or only to get people to not buy a Treo?


    Know what? It freakin' works! I've been watching this forum for some time now and I had some initial issues of my own with my Cingularized T600 w/ TMo service crashing but I overcame 'em. All it took was a bazillion calls to TMo and HS and getting through to a HS Level 2 techie. I perfomed a hard reset (K and Backspace w/ Reset button simultaneously) and set my APN to internet2.voicestream.com and my Tzones fallback IPA to 216.165.155.50 and BAM! I'll be damned if I haven't been riding the GPRS express ever since, baby! The Cingular phone is UNLOCKED unlike AT&T's and my EXTENSIVE research shows that The Chupacabra's numbers are right. And SeldomVisitor? This configuration is working for people all over these freakin' United States! We don't need no stinking "single datapoint" stuff...we need working T600's! I got mine!!
  13. #13  
    I challenge the previous two posters to count the actual number of Cingular/T-Mobile users who have said "Works fine", send that scientific data (giggle) off to palmOne, and post what they send back to you.
  14. #14  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    I challenge the previous two posters to count the actual number of Cingular/T-Mobile users who have said "Works fine", send that scientific data (giggle) off to palmOne, and post what they send back to you.
    Don't have to...they're all over the freakin' forum. That's what surprised me @ first when mine wasn't working but it was a combo of things that contributed to my GPRS not working and part of it was me. I've seen one or two users with very similar issues to mine and I bet if they did what I did they'd be up and running. You can't ignore all the users on this forum using Cing T600's w/Tmo that say they work fine and act like there's some conspiracy. It freakin' works., SV! Sit down, pour yourself a cup of java and YOU surf and compile numbers. I don't need to...seeking personal satisfaction is what made me dig deep and I'm glad I did. Mine works...just like the majority of the other users with the same config!
  15. #15  
    Works Fine. (actually, works great)

    (another single data point)
    Palm V-->Visor Deluxe-->Visor Prism-->Visorphone-->Treo 180-->Treo 600-->Treo 650 on Sprint-->Treo 700p-->Centro-->Diamond-->Pre-->HTC EVO 4g???!
  16. #16  
    W.r.t. "All over the forums" - yeah, that's a scientific count, alrightee!

    But, what the hell - let's just agree and forget the whole matter!

    So - it is AGREED that palmOne DOES NOT KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TYPING when they place a warning on their web site saying:

    == "...*** Cingular-branded Treo 600s have been optimized for
    == use on the Cingular Wireless network. Customers who use
    == Cingular-branded Treo 600s on other GSM/GPRS network may
    == not receive optimal voice reception or data speed..."

    -- http://www.handspring.com/products/c...overview.jhtml

    Not a problem!
  17. #17  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor

    So - it is AGREED that palmOne DOES NOT KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TYPING when they place a warning on their web site saying:

    == "...*** Cingular-branded Treo 600s have been optimized for
    == use on the Cingular Wireless network. Customers who use
    == Cingular-branded Treo 600s on other GSM/GPRS network may
    == not receive optimal voice reception or data speed..."

    -- http://www.handspring.com/products/c...overview.jhtml

    Not a problem!
    Where does it say that? I follow your link to a general overview of the Treo 600. I don't see any such warning on that page. In the FAQ, at http://support.handspring.com/esuppo...24&ResType=FAQ

    it says:

    Q: Can I use the Cingular Wireless version of Treo 600 with another network?
    A: It is possible to use the Cingular Wireless version of Treo 600 on another GSM/GPRS network, however, the software for this device has been optimized to ensure optimal performance on the Cingular network. Customers who attempt to use this version on other GSM/GPRS networks may experience issues such as slower data rates. There are also several sections of the software that display Cingular branding that cannot be changed. We highly recommend that customers of other GSM/GPRS mobile service providers wait until your mobile service provider's cerified version becomes available.
    Where did you find any language about voice quality?

    BTW, I already "optimized" my data for T-Mobile's network. My voice quality is the best of any phone I had. Are you telling me I should have waited for T-Mobile's phone? What in the world for? How does your Treo 600 perform on T-Mobile?
    Palm V-->Visor Deluxe-->Visor Prism-->Visorphone-->Treo 180-->Treo 600-->Treo 650 on Sprint-->Treo 700p-->Centro-->Diamond-->Pre-->HTC EVO 4g???!
  18. #18  
    Good grief!

    I see what your problem is - inability to read.

    Go to the bottom of the page that I actually provided a link for so you COULD personally check and read again - slowly.

    Sheesh.

    BTW - I'm not telling you a damn thing - palmOne is.
  19. #19  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    Good grief!

    I see what your problem is - inability to read.

    Go to the bottom of the page that I actually provided a link for so you COULD personally check and read again - slowly.
    Thank you for your kind and gentle response. I see it now - It's not at the bottom of the page in my browser (Mozilla), but I found it when I scrolled to the right.

    Hey Seldom, why do you have such a hostile attitude toward me and anyone else who doesn't agree with you? I didn't call you a liar or claim that you made the quote up. (I've seen other people misquote stuff.) I simply asked, "Where does it say that? I follow your link to a general overview of the Treo 600. I don't see any such warning on that page."

    Why such anger? Why the insults? It's just a Treo discussion group.
    Palm V-->Visor Deluxe-->Visor Prism-->Visorphone-->Treo 180-->Treo 600-->Treo 650 on Sprint-->Treo 700p-->Centro-->Diamond-->Pre-->HTC EVO 4g???!
  20. #20  
    You're an ***** who cannot read and has no problem calling others names.

    I respond in kind.

    Go check the dates of the posts - I believe you'll find "Troll" used by someone long before I went ballistic.

    Jerk.

    (when I go onto a board such as this and respond to a post saying "Sure! Go use a Cingular TREO on T-Mobile" by typing "Well, you might not want to do that because palmOne says don't" and, after only a few backs and forths where I've continued to point out that fact, ONLY to have a jerk like you call ME a troll, well - go **** yourself!

    Giggle.
    )
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