View Poll Results: How many of you have had:

Voters
90. You may not vote on this poll
  • No problems at all

    35 38.89%
  • Some soft resets

    49 54.44%
  • Some soft resets, hard resets, or hardware problems and considering a replacement

    1 1.11%
  • Have had their Treos replaced?

    5 5.56%
Results 1 to 12 of 12
  1. Luna's Avatar
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       #1  
    It seems that Handspring rushed the designing and manufacturing of the Treo so they would have it ready to market for the Holiday Shopping rush. By doing that, the Treos now have a high return rate due to hardware/software problems. This is a poll to see how many of you have either:

    1. No problems with their Treos.

    2. Some soft resets, but no replacement necessary. Mostly due to 3rd party software.

    3. Some soft, and hard resets, or hardware problem, and considering getting a replacement.

    4. Have had to get a replacement.

    If it turns out that the majority of Treos have a flaw, could we be entitled to a better product and get a free upgrade when Palmone comes out with a better design?
    Last edited by Luna; 12/08/2003 at 02:03 PM.
  2. #2  
    Sorry, it's the poll that's flawed.

    The cause of soft-resets is a software application generating an error which is unhandled. Your poll is not specific enough.

    If Blazer causes a soft-reset should HandSpring be blamed? Yes.

    If Verichat causes a soft-reset should Handspring be blamed? NO.

    Should the OS soft-reset when a critical error occurs, no but it does.

    Should software authors create bug-free code, we can wish.

    Is this issue unique to Palm, heck no.

    Overall Handspring did a good job with the bundled software. I only recall issues with Blazer (resets and cookie issues).

    Nearly all of the other soft-reset issues posted could be traced to a third-party app. These are most definately not the fault of Handspring, or the result of a "flawed design."
  3. #3  
    Originally posted by dgoodisi
    Sorry, it's the poll that's flawed.

    The cause of soft-resets is a software application generating an error which is unhandled. Your poll is not specific enough.

    If Blazer causes a soft-reset should HandSpring be blamed? Yes.

    If Verichat causes a soft-reset should Handspring be blamed? NO.

    Should the OS soft-reset when a critical error occurs, no but it does.

    Should software authors create bug-free code, we can wish.

    Is this issue unique to Palm, heck no.

    Overall Handspring did a good job with the bundled software. I only recall issues with Blazer (resets and cookie issues).

    Nearly all of the other soft-reset issues posted could be traced to a third-party app. These are most definately not the fault of Handspring, or the result of a "flawed design."
    I agree with you fully. There poll needs to be more detailed in order to produce accurate results.
  4. Luna's Avatar
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       #4  
    The goal of this poll is to find out how many plan to replace their Treo, had their Treo replaced, or have not had any problems with theirs. If it's just soft resets, then it's fine, because it's problably a 3rd party incompatibility. But the issue is still there. Maybe the design is as good as anyone can come out with, but the constant complain of people who have to return their Treo because of a major problem with their hardware is worrisome. How many people return thoudands of product to the manufacturer because they are faulty? Do you hear that in the automobile industry? Or in the gaming industry? You don't hear thousands of people saying: "Yeha, I had to return my Game Cube/X-box/PS2 because it keept on freezing".

    Im not saying that products can't be deffective. What Im saying, when hundreds, if not thousands of producst come out deffective, something has to be done. That's why I ask "should Handspring/Palmone give us a free/discounted replacement when a new, less troublesome Treo comes out?
  5. glenng's Avatar
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    #5  
    Also, if a lot of people jumped from a previous treo (OS 3.5), they should be aware of the sensitivity of going straight to OS 5. I remember jumping from a palm m515 to the tungsten t when it first came out. Lots of software made my TT reset. Thankfully, a lot of software has been updated since then. But, if you came to the Treo 600 from a previous Treo, just make sure that your software is compatible. You just have to remember that OS 3.5 had been around for some time, and OS 5 was the first major overhaul done to the OS since then.
  6. #6  
    My 600 is working fine, and won't be going back. I have, however, had several soft resets, all of which can be tied to bad software - some OS 3x apps, and the recent bug in Snappermail. I've also had a couple of hard resets that were the result of using a 300 USB charger cable - which we were warned not to use. Everyone I know (and I know quite a few of them) with a 600 is as happy as a clam!

    Dunc
  7. #7  
    Not a single reset, soft or hard, and I've been using it for about a week extensively. It's nice to see that 90+% are not having major problems.

    Cheers.
  8. #8  
    Originally posted by dgoodisi
    Sorry, it's the poll that's flawed.

    The cause of soft-resets is a software application generating an error which is unhandled. Your poll is not specific enough.

    If Blazer causes a soft-reset should HandSpring be blamed? Yes.

    If Verichat causes a soft-reset should Handspring be blamed? NO.

    Should the OS soft-reset when a critical error occurs, no but it does.

    Should software authors create bug-free code, we can wish.

    Is this issue unique to Palm, heck no.

    Overall Handspring did a good job with the bundled software. I only recall issues with Blazer (resets and cookie issues).

    Nearly all of the other soft-reset issues posted could be traced to a third-party app. These are most definately not the fault of Handspring, or the result of a "flawed design."
    I agree completely with these sentiments.

    Furthermore, many of the purchasers of Treos have had no prior Palm experience and are coming to the Treo strictly from the cell phone market. If something unexpected occurs, from their viewpoint, even a soft reset appears as a defect.

    Only Handspring would know for sure, but I am willing to bet that a very substantial number of the Treo 600s returned by buyers having no prior Palm experience have absolutely nothing wrong with them from a hardware perspective. An unsophisticated new buyer has no way to distinguish, and Handspring, like most companies who want to have maximum market penetration and satisfied buyers, finds it good business to replace the unit rather than lose a new user by arguing with them. Remember, the replacement unit comes with only the original basic software installed and so is perceived as working fine as opposed to the original unit, which may well have had a junk code or obsolete app or game installed by the newbie buyer on recommendation of some friend. Nevermind that the user could have accomplished the same result by a hard reset. Most people do not read manuals.

    Furthermore, Handspring has a no questions asked return policy during the first 30 days, which means that many first-time smartphone buyers are not fully committed to whether they really want a product like this, having come from a smaller, lighter cell phone only, and finding something to complain about gets them past the 30 day limit.

    I'm not sure where the original poster gets his/her information that "thousands" of Treo 600s have been returned - is this statistic published somewhere?

    And lastly, boards like this are most likely to contain a higher percentage of negative comments than is representative of the market at large. Unless one is addicted to reading and posting on boards like TreoCentral, like we obviously are, the average buyer is not apt to go find a board on the internet just to say "Gee I bought a Treo and I like it and it's working fine" as this is not the way most people live.

    Best regards,

    NateS
    Last edited by NateS; 12/08/2003 at 05:00 PM.
  9. Luna's Avatar
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       #9  
    I said thousands, but Im just saying it because it seems a lot of Treocentral posters have had issues and returned their Treos for a replacement. Well, according to the poll so far, there have been more happy, trouble-free users, that users that actually returned their Treos.

    This poll wasn't created as a error-free, scientific way of knowing the return-rate for the Treo. It's just to get an overall feel of what customers have experienced, and so far, a lot of you have enjoyed the Treo greatly, with no problems at all

    For the ones that have experienced soft resets, remember test the applications you want to load on your Treos. Maybe that application that's causing your Treo to reset is not worth having after all.

    And to the ones that have returned their Treos, hope you don't have to deal with all the problems with your new one.
  10. #10  
    Your exaggeration is irresponsible. To assert, based on anecdotes from "a lot of posters" that "hundreds, if not thousands" of Treos are being returned as defects is ludicrous without a modicum of statistical evidence. Smells like purple astroturf . . .
  11. #11  
    Originally posted by Luna
    The goal of this poll is to find out how many plan to replace their Treo, had their Treo replaced, or have not had any problems with theirs. If it's just soft resets, then it's fine, because it's problably a 3rd party incompatibility. But the issue is still there. Maybe the design is as good as anyone can come out with, but the constant complain of people who have to return their Treo because of a major problem with their hardware is worrisome. How many people return thoudands of product to the manufacturer because they are faulty? Do you hear that in the automobile industry? Or in the gaming industry? You don't hear thousands of people saying: "Yeha, I had to return my Game Cube/X-box/PS2 because it keept on freezing".

    Im not saying that products can't be deffective. What Im saying, when hundreds, if not thousands of producst come out deffective, something has to be done. That's why I ask "should Handspring/Palmone give us a free/discounted replacement when a new, less troublesome Treo comes out?
    The answer here is of course no. The reason is that the devices you mentioned are one-trick ponies. A car has to drive, and that's pretty much it. A PS2 is more complex, because it can do other things, but for the most part it just has to play a game. If you want the cell phone equivalent, that's a basic Nokia 5160. It makes phone calls and plays a couple of built in games. That never crashed on me. Once you start expanding what a device can do you start opening the door for problems. Hey, if Microsoft had to give out the next Windows version every time it crashed they would have never made a red cent. PocketPCs crash, Macs crash, everything has crashes.

    As for hardware defects. I know three people with the treo 600 and three with no problems. The things you read in this forum are not the normal user. Everyone here seems to be an early adopter with unusual expectations. For instace, see threads on "my screen isn't centered", "there is a jiggle when I shake the phone", or "the SD card sticks out". These are not flaws in the device. You'll also get subjective things like the vibrate isn't strong enough or the speakerphone isn't good enough. Also not flaws. I haven't really seen anything objective that's happened to more than one treo. To the contrary, I've heard about people accidentally dropping it three feet on concreate and having it work fine with just a couple of cosmetic crashes.
  12. #12  
    I had my unit replaced because of issues with the speakerphone (poor echo cancellation) and general concerns about audio quality (I hear distinct electronic buzzing in the earpiece that seems related to whether I'm speaking while on a call that for some reason I haven't seen mentioned anywhere on this board, so I must be the only one?). The replacement unit also has problems with the speakerphone, unfortunately, and also has that really annoying buzzing. It'll probably go back for a replacement as well.

    I've noticed this replacement do a self-soft reset once in awhile while I never caught my original do that. Other than that and the probelms above, no complaints.

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