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  1. #41  
    Originally posted by purpleX

    I've heard those literacy program at the local library is great too.
    Irony, sweet irony.
  2. #42  
    I mean we could try to define what makes for an integrated e-mail/SMS/IM/phone/PIM/browser, etc., but each person's definitions would be different. For me, nothing counts as having e-mail if it doesn't have a thumbboard. For the next person, it doesn't count as much of a phone without voice dialing. Hence, I doubt we could ever really have a useful conversation about this.

    I do want to note that purpleX hasn't taken my challenge of finding a better device on the market as well as my posting on the first page about why the other devices are not ahead of the Treo in innovation (i.e., video conferencing is not here due to bandwidth, Microsoft should would with their own systems (PPC with Exchange), etc.).
  3. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #43  
    I don't think the 'integration claim is made based on some sort of personal preferance criteria. The claimed afteall seems to be said by more than one person and you didn't dispute earlier claim by other person and by the review of Bweek and WSJ. Afterall you would have to question their claim viewed from your personal criterion otherwise.

    Let's just say:
    integration :shared data between apps or one app can access another app featured.

    for eg. email/PIM is said to be integrated if the address data can be shared. Dialer-PIM-email are integrated. Hardware button/thumbpad can access certain features of an apps can be said integrated.

    simple: least amount of step
    intuitive: coherent/easy to find/easy to follow steps

    free is better than cheap is better than expensive.
    more usable feature and more user control are good.

    So if treo is the most integrated device, that means all apps can share data seamlessly and feature can be called from one app to another better than other handheld can.

    okay let's start. hardware/Dialer/PIM/email/internet. Give favorite scenario and what apps are involved. Surely it couldn't be that hard to find something that other device cannot come close matching, considering treo is 'THE MOST integrated'. (I am sorry poking a name in address book to call somebody is an old hat, other device can do that too)
  4. #44  
    M$ will win at the end, and Palm will be the next Netscape/Corel & Apple if their lucky.
  5. phildro's Avatar
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    #45  
    PurpleX...I'll bite on your request for the "killer app" features that make the T600 as the most integrated smartphones...

    Today I was looking for a restaurant in a particular area, "googled" it and found a listing. I hit their phone number from the 5-way pad...dialed the number directly and put the call on speakerphone so that everyone could hear the resevation times and decide if we wanted to eat there.

    Today, I bought a casette adapter @ Radio Shack so that I can listen to mp3s in the car. Call comes in,music on hold...call answered and played through the cars speakers...Integration!

    I manage a set of servers, so if anything goes wrong, I get an SMS alert...log into the server via VNC or TermSvcs client and fix the issue.

    Have PCS Business Connect...need to call someone in my company, but they're not in my contacts list...or maybe I even forgot their last name. Type in their first name...BOOM...a few seconds later a list of people named "x" comes up...would I like cell phone, work or email? If I want to email them a file, I have an entire directory of files that I can attach and send.

    I'm out (during the daytime) and see an interesting site...snap the pic and send it to a list of contacts with some comments...

    People ask me questions all day long about technical product info...our company uses AOL IM. With Verichat, they don't know if I'm at my desk, at the coffee shop, or in the park...seamless.

    I could go on and on, but these are some tangible answers...

    Now [sort of] knowing Purple's style, I anticipate that he'll argue that these are software enablements rather than the device itself. However, I don't know of another converged device that could host all of these enablements.

    Hope that was remotely valuable to you...posted directly from my T600 when I had no access to a 'puter.

    ./P
  6. phildro's Avatar
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    #46  
    I write this with a grin on my face...Purple, being an intelligent person and certainly someone whose time is valuable....

    Doesn't your participation in this forum betray your arguments in some way? What I mean is that if there was NO WAY that the T600 was one of, if not THE MOST integrated device, you wouldn't waste your time on such a meaningless / pointless debate.

    The very essence that your righteous self spends hours and hours in these forums must mean that the Treo is ARGUABLY one of the best of its kind.

    Whether you like it or not, your participation here has made you a part of this COMMUNITY!

    Dissenter or not...don't fall for it, folks. PurpleX is here BECAUSE HE ENJOYS IT, as do I.

    Remember whose side Darth Vader was on?
  7. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #47  
    Originally posted by phildro
    PurpleX...I'll bite on your request for the "killer app" features that make the T600 as the most integrated smartphones...

    ./P
    *yawn*

    ....all those are doable a year ago with the old version of XDA. Some of them are now even doable with Voice command, try dialing your restaurant while driving with your one hand operated treo. good luck I say.

    (boom... another clueless palmie eat the hype without thinking. Most integrated my foot. Most hyped about integration maybe)

    Now let's try this:

    My friend call, and I need to make a note to label this particular phone conversation. (yeah good luck)

    I am listening to MP3, the phone rang, I pick up. (whew the phone is still functional while listening to mp3)

    phone is attached to GPS in the car giving direction. I am lost and make a phone call. all while the GPS is running, friend is typing message on top of the map)

    Voice command: read me all my todays appointment. (that would be zero hand, even better than one hand operation eh?)

    Boss call, hey can you read me that number out of the XYZ spreadsheet in columx? sure do. (eh hmm, multi tasking rulez)

    calling 3 people, and suddenly need to check the web while talking? no problemo
    http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobi...akerphone.mspx

    record phone conversation, answering machine, and voice recorder? (not in highly integrted treo. sorry)
  8. #48  
    Originally posted by hoxbox
    M$ will win at the end, and Palm will be the next Netscape/Corel & Apple if their lucky.
    Isn't it strange how whenever hoxbox posts, purpleX is sure to be close by? Reminds me of "Frailty". Could they be the same woman?
  9. #49  
    I JUST REALIZED THAT PURPLEX = BILL GATES OR AT LEAST OF OFTEN SEEMS THAT WAY! LOL

    TAKE CARE AND ONLY KIDDING PURPLEX
    ACTUALLY I AM SURE U WISH BILL GATES' BANKER THINKS U R ONE AND THE SAME!

    TAKE CARE, JAY
  10. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #50  
    Long live the highly integrated treo...wooo hooo!

    It's highly integrated cause some gas bag reviewers say so, just don't dare asking what exactly that means.

    with crowd like this, the future of treo is definitely bright. It's the best money can buy folks. hurry up, it's the most highly integrated device. (don't ask compared to what, jalapeno on a stick maybe)

    yay!
  11. #51  
    now now purplex some like steak I LOVE DESSERT, take care, jay
  12. phildro's Avatar
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    #52  
    Purple,

    You are very expert at negating the theses presented by others, but seem to be slow in offering up your true nirvana of a converged device?

    Its starting to get to me that we're focusing on Purple's opinions, as if he's an expert since he doesn't even own a smartphone (and yes, I get the moon/cheese argument, thanks)

    If NOT the Treo, then which M$ smartphone or XDA???-- you stay focused on the technologies-- "doable with this or that w voice command"--

    Great, then give me a brand and model number- that should be simple enough, right? You can poke all kinds of holes in what the Treo 600 doesn't have, but it has so much more together than anything else-- let's hear your top pick then...my apologies if you've uttered it before.

    Don't give us theories or technology-level pontifications. I simply want to have a list of devices that are better and give YOUR scenarios as they apply to devices.

    What do you mean by "labeling a particular phone conversation?" Like capture it, record it, package it and send somewhere?

    By the way, your arguments are only partially valid, if at all--lets go down the list...[chime in, anyone else]

    ---Your GPS analogy will work soon with the SD and external GPS solutions coming to market for T600

    ---OOOOH! M$oft can talk on the phone and send SMS! Wow Purple, same as T600! Nowhere said that you can talk and surf concurrently, and in all your infinite wisdom, you are surely aware that Sprint's CDMA network can't do that, regardless of device. (sorry, thanks for playing)

    --voice command- you got me. possible to enable this feature through future firmware/software upgrade. Okay, one for you...if you want truly handsfree, there's some personal assistant that you can call an 800 number and have them manage your life if you want to pay...This is a DEVICE- don't know how to surf the web handsfree. You can get voice assisted, dialing, which pretty much satisfies your argument there.

    If you want to see today's appointments, you would have to "wake up" any device with a button IMHO, unless it somehow was always listening for a special word to then listen to your instructions. Otherwise, it would respond inappropriately to the television, radio or if you are talking to yourself. If you have to press a button to wake it up, you may as well press another to look at your schedule. What device does what you are asking here?

    Email apps can handle attachments, and Docs to Go can read a spreadsheet...

    Okay-- 3 people con call- doable- surf the web? You plan to do this? Another network limitation of concurrent voice/net...can't help that with any device- can't speak about whether GSM can/cannot satisfy that requirement, but once again-- network problem, not device problem.

    So basically you're looking for a T600 with a voice recorder. Or, as I asked before, supply a brand and model that you think does these things already...

    DON'T DODGE THIS QUESTION!
  13. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #53  
    scroll up pal, the question was if treo is the most integrated smartphone out there or not.

    You are regressing to pathetic old excuse 'who needs those'. I didn't even bring exotic example such as capturing frame of .mpeg and sending it to a friend while talking on the phone, or video conferencing. I am just recombining the situation you gave me using multitasking. Nothing fancy or exotic.

    >>>Your GPS analogy will work soon with the SD and external GPS solutions coming to market for T600<<<

    Nope, sorry, no multitasking mean no GPS while making a phone call, let alone your friend directing you with overlay message on the phone.

    >>>What do you mean by "labeling a particular phone conversation?" Like capture it, record it, package it and send somewhere?"<<<

    whatever you want to do. record the phone conversation and attach it as PIM notes. reshuffle the phone recording and distribute it through email. record the conversation and attach a note on that conversation. The phoen conversation is just another form of digital data.

    >>Email apps can handle attachments, and Docs to Go can read a spreadsheet...<<

    really? why don't I send you a .wma attachment and see how your DTG will react. heck does it even open a native .pdf without choking?

    >>>Okay-- 3 people con call- doable- surf the web? You plan to do this? Another network limitation of concurrent voice/net...can't help that with any device- <<<

    any treo device maybe. other device can do it just fine. making conference call and opening GPRS connection for data. Just because treo can't do it, it doesn't mean other devices cannot do it. Treo ain't all that.
  14. phildro's Avatar
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    #54  
    All right Purple. I'm not going back and forth with you.

    I gave several examples of multitasking that unfortunately didn't line up with your requirements. Development of any technology is a continuum that gathers and builds specifications over time.

    Name any object on earth that is man made- cars, house, clothing...there is always *SOMETHING* about any item that one of use / some of us / all of us would like to change or improve.

    I don't understand why you choose the tone of "Treo is not as cool" as it should be rather than the more productive tone of "this device is great- there were compromises between price, size, cost and speed of development and here is my list of things I'd like in the next version. There have been many of those posts.

    It is too bad you choose the negative way to discuss thought-provoking technologies. It is obvious that you don't have a better device in mind, because you would have proudly paraded that and held it up as the example of whatever your core requirements happen to be for a device like this.

    You can rant and poke holes all you want. I and many other Treo owners are quite happy. I find it very strange that you would choose this forum as a place to roost when you don't seem to care about having this technology yourself? Rather, you seem to get a sense of purpose or sense of self by being an irascible stakeholder who really holds no stake.

    I hope for your family's sake that you take all of your negative energy out on people who you don't really know (TC) rather than them!

    Peace.
  15. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #55  
    Is that mean treo is most integrated or not most integrated? :|
  16. skidoo's Avatar
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    #56  
    The Treo 600 is hands down the best convergent device out there at the moment periiod. End of discussion. Sure, I'd rather it run CE, but so far no one has anted (sp?) up. Until then, shut your trap.... :-)
  17. #57  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    It's a simplified supposition.

    It's not a question of believe, but the foundation upon which the analysis is done. ie, their use of IDH stat on revenue model. Unless you for some reason suspicious that Palmone itself doesn't behave to maximise capital return. hmmm....

    I maybe stupid, but I am not the one who is wasting time to comment on a stupid post, so ... double hmm....

    PS. historically speaking putting a 50K on microsoft would give better return than Palm.
    simplified and very stupid.

    all that's should be derived from the data you've been refrencing is that as palmone proceeds into the future phone /data devices are how they intend to grow their business. companies often use supporting sources that are compatiable with their intentions and help support their forecasts.. there is absolutely nothing wrong with this.

    equity holdings: if returns are ones intentions, ones interest should be aimed a great deal more at a company like palmone who's incentitive to hit the mark is predicated on its survival. this of course is in contrast to the chronied up company of microsoft which has far less incentitive to create and to which continues to ignore their share holders best interest.

    the fact is ms has been a relative bust over the past few years. they've yet to establish a long term dividend plan in light of their 50bills in cash and lack of growth stock status

    ms has been no gem,in recent years and there is nothing to suggest otherwise moving forward.
    Last edited by JTREOB; 11/09/2003 at 01:13 AM.
  18. #58  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    scroll up pal, the question was if treo is the most integrated smartphone out there or not.

    You are regressing to pathetic old excuse 'who needs those'. I didn't even bring exotic example such as capturing frame of .mpeg and sending it to a friend while talking on the phone, or video conferencing. I am just recombining the situation you gave me using multitasking. Nothing fancy or exotic.

    >>>Your GPS analogy will work soon with the SD and external GPS solutions coming to market for T600<<<

    Nope, sorry, no multitasking mean no GPS while making a phone call, let alone your friend directing you with overlay message on the phone.

    >>>What do you mean by "labeling a particular phone conversation?" Like capture it, record it, package it and send somewhere?"<<<

    whatever you want to do. record the phone conversation and attach it as PIM notes. reshuffle the phone recording and distribute it through email. record the conversation and attach a note on that conversation. The phoen conversation is just another form of digital data.

    >>Email apps can handle attachments, and Docs to Go can read a spreadsheet...<<

    really? why don't I send you a .wma attachment and see how your DTG will react. heck does it even open a native .pdf without choking?

    >>>Okay-- 3 people con call- doable- surf the web? You plan to do this? Another network limitation of concurrent voice/net...can't help that with any device- <<<

    any treo device maybe. other device can do it just fine. making conference call and opening GPRS connection for data. Just because treo can't do it, it doesn't mean other devices cannot do it. Treo ain't all that.
    Okay, the XDA can voice command Spreadsheet data? I want proof of this!

    You can get the XDA to work on Sprint's network and do voice and data at the same time?!?! Incredible! Yet Impossible! With GSM/GPRS, the Treo can do the same voice and data at the same time too, but in the states, GPRS isn't as fast as Sprint so your network isn't going to be fast. So listen when we say that your device being GSM based only works for some people, not really an integrated solution when you lose the phone/internet connection, is it?

    I want to take a poll of how many times someone needed to take a screen capture of a mpeg and send it to a friend. I also want to know the software that makes it possible to do on a PPC. I can't even capture an MPEG frame a WinXP system and send it to a friend without additional software.

    As for multitasking, I've been listening to mp3s and playing games at the same time. There's no reason why I can't use GPS and call someone. In fact you can call people and use any Palm application while talking to them. That would include GPS software/hardware as well.

    Which other devices record voice calls and allow all the labeling things you mentioned? Please specify both CDMA and GSM options. Bonus points for one with a thumbboard.

    Why don't you send a .wma to a Linux OS and see how that plays it? What? It doesn't? Hmmm, that's because you picked out something that only works with Microsoft because Microsoft invented it only to work with Microsoft instead of going with something like Ogg Vorbis or Divx which are available for all OSes. As for the Treo opening PDFs, from http://www.adobe.com/epaper/tips/acr...alm/main.html, "You can read any Adobe® PDF document on a Palm OS® device by simply dragging the file into the Adobe Acrobat Reader for Palm OS application window." Can't get much simpler that that.

    Umm Treo can make conference calls and use GPRS data connection at the same time despite your claim otherwise.

    So your best device is the XDA? Can you please link to it so the rest of us can see the statistics?

    Also you fail to mention how you e-mail on the device without a thumbboard. Does it come with ViaVoice for your zero hand interface? Oh wait, T-9 is a fast way to enter in data, which is why I don't see it in any of Fitaly's tests at http://www.fitaly.com/domperignon/domperignon3.htm. Keep in mind that's a biased test because 90% of the users participating are likely fitaly users - most Treo owners wouldn't go to the website or d/l the software. It's worth noting that the Treo thumboard is top 2 of 3. The first one by a landslide over #2. Let's compare one hand entry as well, for fun. :-)

    So what's your device have then? Maybe something - in the world of non-CDMA, non-brick-like PDA to my face, non-reasonable speed e-mail/SMS/IM world.
  19. #59  
    not to jump in on this- i'm not a big purple x defender, or XDA fan, i tried the first version- didnt work for me- but-

    i've been an extremely happy sony ericsson p800 owner for about the past year, and i've got a treo 600 GSM being delivered monday.

    in my opinion, the p800/900 is the best converged device to date, but no thumboard. as far as the whole multi-tasking OS debate, Symbian does it very well- and its pretty nice using Opera as your browser- with complete small screen rendering and full support for all sites.

    also, in my opinion- the keyboard is really the only thing going for the treo- the crappy display, and lack of voice dialing are the huge drawbacks for me, along with no bluetooth...

    i'm going to try and live with it, but we'll see, i might go with the p900 if i can't deal with the treo.

    btw- to all of you naysayers out there, there have been more p800's sold than treos and ms phones combined- and they're not even available in the US...

    i won't even get into the market share for symbian phones worldwide, vs palm and ms...

    anyways, just my two cents-

    i also played with the new moto mpx200 the other day in seattle, and i have to say, wonderful display, build quality, and pretty snappy performance- but again, no input method other than t9 makes it only a backup/weekend phone for me.
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    #60  
    (As in Rocky)

    Donnnnnnaaaaaaaaaaaaa! Donnnnaaaaaaa! Give us 320 x 320!
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