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  1. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #61  
    You may be right (won't take your word for sure.. you've been wrong about other things).. but my point still stands. A board's membership has nothing to do with how well a product sells.
    I still don't understand why people gets so hot and bothered with my correlating lack of significant new tcf membership vs low treo600 new ownership.

    somebody please post convincing argument why it is not a darned good indicator, or at least correspond enough to tell product acceptance.

    (and no, cause you say no isn't the explanation)
  2. #62  
    Originally posted by DrDoom
    Could it possibly be that the GSM version isn't out yet and alot of people use that? Or maybe your version of success is measured in unrealistic terms purple. Or MAYBE your just angry because a month ago you were saying the device would NEVER be out this soon and since you were...oh, what's the phrase...DEAD WRONG you're looking for something else to gripe about? Yeah I think I pretty much nailed that one.
    Exactly ! I am about to chew thru my bit waiting for the GSM version (which my CIngular Biz rep is dispatching for trials). I work in a rural manufacturing center, and Sprint is just not an option - esp as they decided not to include an analog-roam option for voice on their Treo.

    BTW - the Cingular Biz rep says that he has recieved quite a clamour for the T-600

  3. #63  
    Originally posted by purpleX

    I still don't understand why people gets so hot and bothered with my correlating lack of significant new tcf membership vs low treo600 new ownership.

    somebody please post convincing argument why it is not a darned good indicator, or at least correspond enough to tell product acceptance.

    (and no, cause you say no isn't the explanation)
    Interesting. You say that "cause you say no isn't the explanation, yet you expect us to believe your scenario.

    Yep, you proved it yourself . . . you are just as full of BS as the rest of us.

    kthnxownt.


    Michael
  4. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #64  
    Originally posted by mwsmith2


    Interesting. You say that "cause you say no isn't the explanation, yet you expect us to believe your scenario.

    Yep, you proved it yourself . . . you are just as full of BS as the rest of us.

    kthnxownt.
    Michael
    So still no alternate explanation to dispute it? Sounds more like denial to me, not even a decent BS.

    thanks for playing.
  5. #65  
    lol...you guys are hilarious. while we are on the subject...i think I will return my 9 month old (by way of birth canal) until a better model comes out. hahahahaha
  6. #66  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    So still no alternate explanation to dispute it? Sounds more like denial to me, not even a decent BS.

    thanks for playing.
    I've sat back and watched several threads. There is a common theme in all the threads of which you participate. I'll get to that later.

    On the subject at hand...I can only speak from personal experience, but I had a Visor a long time before I discovered VisorCentral. Also, I'm in the computer field, so joining a board like Visor/TreoCentral would not be out of character for me. The membership in this forum is a poor indicator of the popularity (or unpopularity) of a product when considering "average" (non-enthusiast) people.

    Many people that do browse the Internet and discover VisorCentral or TreoCentral are "lurkers". They don't join the membership rolls or post to the forum, but they own Treos or Visors (or did at one time).

    Forums like this have always been platforms for the "vocal minority" (whether they are pro- or anti-Treo). So how can anyone base the popularity (or sales numbers of a product) on the membership numbers in an enthusiast website's forum?

    I can see the underlying logic, but in truth, the correlation and logic is flawed. It's like doing a survey to see how many people use computers, yet only asking people that are hanging around the computer lab at school. I guarantee a lot more people use computers than will be represented by the people you run into at that lab.

    People come to sites like this to get opinions, information, and to seek help when they need it. Those reasons for posting are what normal people do.

    The thing that seems to be a common theme with you and what I find interesting (sad really ) is that someone would take time to come to an enthusiasts' forum for the sole purpose of bad-mouthing the product for which the forum is based.

    If a poster is having problems with his/her device and wants to vent frustration, that's understandable...but from what I've seen, your sole purpose here is to find fault (no matter how small). You don't own a Treo. You've never used one for any appreciable amount of time. Yet you bash it and complain about what the Palm operating system CAN'T do more than anyone I've ever seen. It's like you have a vendetta.

    You have a "negative" attitude...a "negative" tone...You seem to be miserable and want everyone else to be just as miserable. How sad. I really feel sorry for you. Are you THAT lonely?

    People will buy what they want/need. If Treo meets that want/need, why try to steer them away from it? Can you not find more productive use of your time?

    I'm not saying that you have to "sugar-coat" your point of view. If you have something useful to contribute...by all means...do so. But all I've seen from you is antagonism, fanning flames, "rubbing salt" in people's wounds...You're just trying to bring people down. I don't know why.
    --Inspector Gadget

    "Go Go Gadget Pre!!"
    Palm Pre on Sprint

    Palm V--> Palm IIIc--> Visor Prism--> Visor Phone--> Treo 270--> Treo 600--> Treo 650-->
    Treo 700wx--> HTC Touch Diamond--> Palm Pre & HTC EVO 4G.
  7. #67  
    Ah, yes - Love It Or Leave It.

    Yes, I've heard that before.
  8. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #68  
    Originally posted by Insp_Gadget
    On the subject at hand...I can only speak from personal experience, but I had a Visor a long time before I discovered VisorCentral.
    It's because visor central was NOT the premiere board for visor in the early days of handspring. Other Palm forums offers higher participant number and hence better place to seek help. (eg. PIC, the now called pdastreet.com, NG, etc)

    Visor central was small, new and doesn't offer anything special. Visor was also before 'google' become mainstream.

    now, if you google treo 600 forum, google any treo 600 words, treocentral pop up on top. To a treo 600 noobs, all path leads to treocentral.com. This of course only apply to 'english'. But as you can see from Handspring financial report, their non US sale is much smaller than US sale.

    Also, I'm in the computer field, so joining a board like Visor/TreoCentral would not be out of character for me. The membership in this forum is a poor indicator of the popularity (or unpopularity) of a product when considering "average" (non-enthusiast) people.
    average joe doesn't spend $500 bucks on a phone, they buy whatever come with cheapest/biggest any minutes, chance are Nokia or motorola handset.

    Many people that do browse the Internet and discover VisorCentral or TreoCentral are "lurkers". They don't join the membership rolls or post to the forum, but they own Treos or Visors (or did at one time).
    Sorry, I am watching the 'read' counter too, and alexa tracker doesn't say treo central suddenly is deluged with visitor either. If Handspring is selling 20K units in 3 days, treo central forum would be crashing by now, instead of merely sporadic slow down one day a week during lunch time.

    (actually alexa tracker does say treo central get a nice hit in the 2 weeks of october. but has come back down again)

    Forums like this have always been platforms for the "vocal minority" (whether they are pro- or anti-Treo). So how can anyone base the popularity (or sales numbers of a product) on the membership numbers in an enthusiast website's forum?
    forum is where user go when screen is scratched, unit doesn't sit right in cradle, or get all excited over some mickey mouse gimmick. It's group therapy kinda thing, that and email.

    I can see the underlying logic, but in truth, the correlation and logic is flawed. It's like doing a survey to see how many people use computers, yet only asking people that are hanging around the computer lab at school. I guarantee a lot more people use computers than will be represented by the people you run into at that lab.
    lol. nice guess, not even close.

    People come to sites like this to get opinions, information, and to seek help when they need it. Those reasons for posting are what normal people do.
    okay so now you claim 'there is' a correlation between increasing treo 600 ownership and forum ativity. Well which one is it? does increasing t600 ownership increases membership/readership/traffic, or it does not? Make up your mind.


    You don't own a Treo. You've never used one for any appreciable amount of time. Yet you bash it and complain about what the Palm operating system CAN'T do more than anyone I've ever seen. It's like you have a vendetta.
    very impressive! So what are you? part time fiction writer or out of job shrink?

    You have a "negative" attitude...a "negative" tone...You seem to be miserable and want everyone else to be just as miserable. How sad. I really feel sorry for you. Are you THAT lonely?
    here is a hint: If I am psychotic loner, usually it's not a good idea to provoke me. so watch it.

    I'm not saying that you have to "sugar-coat" your point of view. If you have something useful to contribute...by all means...do so. But all I've seen from you is antagonism, fanning flames, "rubbing salt" in people's wounds...You're just trying to bring people down. I don't know why.
    awe, you poor thing. Here I give you condolescence post: "Treo 600 is the best gadget you ever spend money on It can do all the thing treo300 can do. now go and be happy. Don't read any post without 'sugar-coat' you can't handle it. Play with your toy and think happy thought. Warm wollen mittens... Schnitzel with noodles... or treo 600 packages tied up with string... something..."
  9. #69  
    If Insp_Gadgt's explination wasn't enough for you (which I'm see you think its not), how about we take a look at other forums and compare mmmk?

    dell forums: Total number of computers sold = in 1999 they sold 2 million computers. Can't find data for 2002. From past articles that I have read they have sold way over 10million computers.
    Dell forums Membership level: 80,000+

    NASIOC (subaru impreza board): total number of cars sold = 80,000+ membership level = 13,128

    Treo Sales: total number in 2003 through Q3 = 180,000 units.
    treocentral membership = 22,005.

    I can't get stats for dslreports.com but the last time I looked there were about 20,000 members and millions with broadband connections.

    So tell me why all of these forums are not anywhere close to even 10% of total sold to membership level?

    If you need more proof than those numbers you must be just stuck in your ways and will never accept when you are wrong.
  10. #70  
    Originally posted by purpleX

    okay so now you claim 'there is' a correlation between increasing treo 600 ownership and forum ativity. Well which one is it? does increasing t600 ownership increases membership/readership/traffic, or it does not? Make up your mind.
    I visit PPC sites all the time, yet I don't own a PPC device. Does that mean that my visitation (or lack thereof) should be an indication of PPC sales? Of course not. That's the point I was making. The readership of a website is a poor indication of a product's acceptance or proliferation.

    very impressive! So what are you? part time fiction writer or out of job shrink?
    Neither. I was simply making an observation that is apparent to anyone who has read your posts during the last year. Even in this thread, you blatantly admit to purposefully looking for the product to fail: "Well that's true, but I still want to see a spectacular flop with a bang, not a pathetic whimperish plop."

    What's the point of that?

    here is a hint: If I am psychotic loner, usually it's not a good idea to provoke me. so watch it.
    Watch what? So now you're threatening me? Again: Sad.

    The point of my post wasn't to provoke you or to be confrontational. I simply wonder why someone of your obvious intelligence thinks it's necessary to tear down people's enthusiasm for a product.

    awe, you poor thing. Here I give you condolescence post: "Treo 600 is the best gadget you ever spend money on It can do all the thing treo300 can do. now go and be happy. Don't read any post without 'sugar-coat' you can't handle it. Play with your toy and think happy thought. Warm wollen mittens... Schnitzel with noodles... or treo 600 packages tied up with string... something..."
    I'm not looking for condolenscences from you...and my "skin" is thick enough that I don't need sugar-coating (as I already said). But there are ways to state your point without being abusive. Singing the praises of other devices is fine, but what is the point of the hostility toward the product line? You don't need to answer...I don't think there really is a point other than to get a rise out of people.

    Pretty sad.
    --Inspector Gadget

    "Go Go Gadget Pre!!"
    Palm Pre on Sprint

    Palm V--> Palm IIIc--> Visor Prism--> Visor Phone--> Treo 270--> Treo 600--> Treo 650-->
    Treo 700wx--> HTC Touch Diamond--> Palm Pre & HTC EVO 4G.
  11. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #71  
    Treo Sales: total number in 2003 through Q3 = 180,000 units.
    treocentral membership = 22,005.
    I am sorry to inform you, but treocentral and visorcentral uses the same forum member database. (at least it appears that from where I sit)

    Comparing membership/post# alone is not in treo 600 advantage, since tcf is not exactly the biggest forum in the business. It's merely the only big forum for treo 600 user to go. All other are small second fiddle sub forum in a huge phone site. That's why I am looking for rate of change.

    Here is comparative perspective in similar niche:

    -modaco.com: (top Smartphone site, single model site, very similar to treocentral)
    Members: 19,269, Post: 164663

    -howardforum.com (general phone forum)
    Members: 55,153, Posts: 1,760,146

    -PDAphonehome.com (general PDA phone)
    Members: 5,700, Posts: 70,964

    who knows where symbian users go...

    As you can see considering treocentral encompases far larger set of product models, and has been around longer than some of new forum above, the raw number isn't that terribly impressive. But again, that's beside the point. It's the treo 600 section that matters.

    And it's been a blip. (okay a spike) but the trend is very hard to see.
  12. #72  
    Originally posted by Treo Rat
    PurpleXhole, where are you buddy?
    He's taking the lead in the retard race. Go, Purple Hole, go!
  13. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #73  
    Originally posted by Insp_Gadget
    I visit PPC sites all the time, yet I don't own a PPC device. Does that mean that my visitation (or lack thereof) should be an indication of PPC sales? Of course not. That's the point I was making. The readership of a website is a poor indication of a product's acceptance or proliferation.
    a single person or a small group of people doesn't change overall hit pattern of a site.

    PDA and smartphone users are internet savvy, and user the web as info source. Unless you are proposing treo600 has reach the level of Nokia phones, I find it hard to believe new treo 600 users are not hitting the net.

    again, I do note the alexa spike for this, but apparently it doesn't last, or at least it's not sustained trend.

    I'm not looking for condolenscences from you...and my "skin" is thick enough that I don't need sugar-coating
    than quite whining and bring in fresh approach to the issue.
  14. #74  
    there's a difference between ranting and constructive criticism. my suggestion to posters at this board is to try and recognize the difference.


    ranting, is someone who mouths off , jabbers, spouts, for reasons not related to the topic at hand. their criticism has no intent on improvement and often is rooted in deeper areas that should be of no concern to anyone at this board. an attempt to find underlying reasons for someone venting should be considered a waste of your time. especially, when it concerns individuals that mean little if nothing in your life and to which no physical or mental harm is exerted.

    constructive criticism, on the hand, should be welcomed, even in light of disagreement, constructive criticism always includes ways to improve or correct a problem that in their mind exists. a healthy disagreement is one that seeks improvement. that trys to make things better.

    look for the difference.

    my experience with people who vent is to LEAVE THEM ALONE. if they are not mentally disturbed they soon relize their destructive nature and change. as i say, if they are not mentally disturbed.
    Last edited by JTREOB; 10/26/2003 at 09:48 AM.
  15. #75  
    Originally posted by JTREOB
    as i say, if they are not mentally disturbed.
    What if they are physically disturbed?
  16. #76  
    Originally posted by snerdy

    What if they are physically disturbed?
    them find them a good plastic surgeon snurd! one that can do a make over on trolls.
    Last edited by JTREOB; 10/26/2003 at 09:55 AM.
  17. #77  
    Originally posted by JTREOB
    them find them a good plastic surgeon snurd.
    Is it alright if, in order to save money, I offer to do the work myself? I have a budding interest in rhinoplasty. ...Okay, not really -- I just wanted to use the word "rhinoplasty."

    Rhinoplasty, rhinoplasty, rhinoplasty, rhinoplasty, rhinoplasty.
  18. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #78  
    Originally posted by JTREOB
    there's a difference between ranting and constructive criticism. constructive criticism, on the hand, should be welcomed, even in light of disagreement, constructive criticism always includes ways to improve or correct a problem that in their mind exists. a healthy disagreement is one that seeks improvement. that trys to make things better. disagreement can be very constructive.
    right,

    so what exactly is 'constructive criticism'?

    -don't ask features such as larger screen, BT, replaceable battery, because that's trolling
    -saying other phone can do it as a prove of viability is doubly so.
    -straight up comparison to other phone is 'trolling'. Treo is in a class by itself.
    -Thumboard is the greatest. Long live thumboard.
    -It has 19,ooo apps that cover everything one can think of. If you need anything more, get a laptop.
    -treo lacks nothing, it requires nothing else, and it has everything one needs.

    -treo is the best, suggesting anything else is...


    (whaddya mean treo doesn't sell 20K units in 3 days? It's perfect.... I am sorry, amd I being heretical again? )

    So anyway, back to basic right?
    why should anybody spend $250-699 for this device?

    Is this the best device out there at $499? Does it offers the best features? Is it the best phone? is it the best PDA phone for the price?

    Answer: not really.
  19. #79  
    Rhinoplasty.
  20. #80  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    right,

    so what exactly is 'constructive criticism'?

    -don't ask features such as larger screen, BT, replaceable battery, because that's trolling
    -saying other phone can do it as a prove of viability is doubly so.
    -straight up comparison to other phone is 'trolling'. Treo is in a class by itself.
    -Thumboard is the greatest. Long live thumboard.
    -It has 19,ooo apps that cover everything one can think of. If you need anything more, get a laptop.
    -treo lacks nothing, it requires nothing else, and it has everything one needs.

    -treo is the best, suggesting anything else is...


    (whaddya mean treo doesn't sell 20K units in 3 days? It's perfect.... I am sorry, amd I being heretical again? )
    Your points can, indeed, be constructive. I welcome such comments. I think there is nothing wrong with offering alternatives.

    However, comments such as: "...I still want to see a spectacular flop with a bang, not a pathetic whimperish plop." are NOT constructive and they don't win you any fans. When you attack with comments like that, the good points you make get lost because you've set yourself up as someone with a hidden agenda and a slanted viewpoint. That doesn't embody trust.

    Given that situation, why should anyone consider your otherwise valid points as anything but bashing?
    --Inspector Gadget

    "Go Go Gadget Pre!!"
    Palm Pre on Sprint

    Palm V--> Palm IIIc--> Visor Prism--> Visor Phone--> Treo 270--> Treo 600--> Treo 650-->
    Treo 700wx--> HTC Touch Diamond--> Palm Pre & HTC EVO 4G.
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