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  1. #61  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    For two-part solutions, the Sony UX40/50 comes very close but the lack integration of the thumbboard and scroll wheel (which ought to be more of a D-Pad) into the OS means you have to tap on the screen far too often. It's also expensive and there's a bunch of other smaller issues about it I dislike.

    Scott

    Scott,
    I use a UX50 and a Siemens S55 BT phone which works great. Combined with the wifi in the UX, there's never really a situation where I can't connect. I'm a former 1 device guy (XDA, 270, 180 prior), but am liking my current solution tons. GREAT surfing, great messaging, beautiful hi rez screen, and great connectivity. There are quirks of course, to me the biggest being the inability to charge w/o the cradle. That said, the scroll wheel/screen tap issue can be largely overcome with keyboard shortcuts. Check out the UX forum at cliesource.com for more info, but there are tons of great short cuts for navigating.

    TM
  2. #62  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    all of that's currently good about it and add in the good stuff I want and you'll have something like the mockup I made a while ago:
    http://hipnetic.com/geek/treo_new2.gif

    It would be possible to do this with today's technology and, I'd argue, could be easily sold for $600 or less.
    Scott
    You'd be leaving out the best features of the Treo 600: form factor and D-pad. What I think is really "currently good" about the Treo 600 is that you can do everything one handed. I will not be moving back to a device where i must to use 2 hands to type or hold the device. I can't express how pleased i am with the Treo 600. It's the best available in my opinion.

    I've seen your desgin before and like it, but i would not buy it. I dont want to have to open my phone to use its other features, nor use 2 hands. If its going to work like a mini tablet pc w/ a keyboard: I think it would be too cumbersome to transform it to the pda alone position (hope that makes sense)
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    #63  
    Originally posted by IanL


    I'm still so much in the "wow, I can't believe I can do all this on such a tiny device" phase that I probably need a little more time to evaluate the question properly.
    I'm still in that phase and I don't even have one yet . I've been waiting for an acceptable smartphone for some time and I believe they are the future of mobile computing (or at least a big part of it). I want one device that I can make phone calls from, contains my contacts and schedule, can check email with, can browse the web, and carry an hour or so worth of music or video. Of course, I'd like it to have a fast processor, decent memory, and at least a 320x320 screen. I was very interested in the SGH I500 that's been delayed and of course the SGH I505 looks good as well assuming they upgrade the screen prior to production. That said, I've tried the SPH I500 (which I liked but I don't have Sprint), the Kyocera 7135, the Treo 270 and 300, the SPH I300, and the Kyocera 6035. Not really worked for me for various reasons, though of the bunch I'd have went with the I500 if I wanted to move over to Sprint. But having held the Treo 600 I think it's the best designed smartphone I've seen thus far. I love the 5 way dpad design (love it on my T3) and think it's a great idea. The enhanced use of the dpad on the 600 makes it even more enticing. When it becomes available for Cingular, I'll try it in earnest. I think that I could overlook the screen if most everything else is good, which it sounds like it is.
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    #64  
    Originally posted by anthonymoody



    Scott,
    I use a UX50 and a Siemens S55 BT phone which works great. Combined with the wifi in the UX, there's never really a situation where I can't connect. I'm a former 1 device guy (XDA, 270, 180 prior), but am liking my current solution tons. GREAT surfing, great messaging, beautiful hi rez screen, and great connectivity. There are quirks of course, to me the biggest being the inability to charge w/o the cradle. That said, the scroll wheel/screen tap issue can be largely overcome with keyboard shortcuts. Check out the UX forum at cliesource.com for more info, but there are tons of great short cuts for navigating.

    TM
    Hey, I've been using a Siemens S56 paired with either a T3 or UX50. Still trying to decide between the two pdas (and finding it very difficult). Still, I believe in the smartphone platform and really would like to make the transition. We'll see.
  5. #65  
    Yeah I hear you - I love the idea of a smartphone. Thing is, I've gotten very fond of having only a tiny little phone (the S55/56) for a quick errand or (more importantly) going out at night...makes life much easier. When out and about on business, I carry both.

    Still, I look forward to further smartphone development, whether Palm, PPC, or other...

    TM
  6. #66  
    Originally posted by wireless-doc
    Regarding the camera, if you can understand its limitations you can produce some acceptable photos. I posted a link under a thread I titled "Treo 600 photos" but now I realize some might think that it is just more pix OF the Treo 600 instead of pix taken WITH the camera.

    People shouldn't give up on this camera too easily without giving it a chance. And considering this is a converged pda/phone its quite a feature.

    http://www.wireless-doc.com/treocam.htm
    Nice. These have to be among the best that I have seen. The amount of light (natural or otherwise) seems to have the most affect on the quality. My hands shake so mine look a little blurry at best. My avitar was taken with my Treo600.
    <-----
    Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.
  7. #67  
    I will be going from the 270 to 600 once T-mobile offers service. I actually appreciate people that give honest opinions even if negative.
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    #68  
    Originally posted by anthonymoody
    Yeah I hear you - I love the idea of a smartphone. Thing is, I've gotten very fond of having only a tiny little phone (the S55/56) for a quick errand or (more importantly) going out at night...makes life much easier. When out and about on business, I carry both.

    Still, I look forward to further smartphone development, whether Palm, PPC, or other...

    TM
    That's one advantage of the two device set up. Just a small phone nights and weekends. The other currently is having a hi res screen and screaming processor when you need it. On the other hand, having only one contact list to keep track of is nice as well as only one device to charge, etc. I know that when I can get EVERYTHING I can get with the two device set up, I'll go with a smartphone. And I may even go sooner if I can get past the screen and view the device as a phone. When I change my perspective, I think "now, THAT'S a phone!" Can't wait to find out when Cingular releases the 600.
  9. #69  
    Originally posted by JTREOB
    you can read all you want about a product, any product, but until you possess it, evaluate it with your own criteria one never knows for sure.

    That is so true. And might I also add, unless you spend a fair amount of time possessing it.

    I think I may end up having to eat a lot of my words of criticism and dismissal. I realize now that perfunctory first impressions absolutely suck. I would not have some of the wonderful friends I've had in my life or some material possession if I'd let first impressions be my guide. In some cases, even second and third impressions were misleading. So I was an ***** to snap judge the Treo 600 after "playing with one" for "awhile". There, I got that admission off my chest.

    I don't have one of my own, but am in the very fortunate position of being married to a happy new 600 owner, so now I'm not limited to testing just for a few borrowed moments. I got to spend over an hour this evening getting better acquainted with web surfing on Blazer and a couple of other browsers which unfortunately crashed the phone. But Blazer worked better than I thought. The problems I had before--must stop to take foot out of mouth--were user error. My duh. I still do have a frustrating and perplexing problem logging onto a forum I absolutely do not want to be without. But that is their inane setup--not the Treo's "fault".

    I did a more complete side-by-side default browser shoot-out. Blazer vs MSIE on my Hitachi. I actually preferred the Blazer rendition of most of my favorite web pages to the out-of-box setup of MSIE on Hitachi. Oddly enough on graphics there appeared to be more dithering on the Hitachi display. And I don't have a plug-in for my MSIE that makes all of a web page fit to screen, so the Treo 600 got nods of appreciation for doing that out of the box. (The Fit to Screen option on my Hitachi doesn't seem to work for all web pages so I am forced to scroll side-to-side a lot of the time). Of course browsers can be tweaked. So, such a shootout is not that meaningful. What was meaningful was that I learned what I did wrong the first time I sat down with Blazer.

    I gave Collapse another chance. This time I did not go from the PPC version to the Palm version. It did not annoy me nearly so much this time. In fact I got caught up in the game that I forgot the differences that bothered me before.

    Next chance I get I'll test out the phone quality. And MP3 playback.

    But I don't think any amount of time is going to make me happy with that camera. I'm giving it a valiant effort though.

    I admit I'm liking this little squirt more and more despite really not wanting to go through the hassle and expense of switching to it. However, I'm glad it's joined my family.
  10. #70  
    Originally posted by anthonymoody
    That said, the scroll wheel/screen tap issue can be largely overcome with keyboard shortcuts. Check out the UX forum at cliesource.com for more info, but there are tons of great short cuts for navigating.
    Actually, I did know about that, but since I didn't have access to that 3rd party app at my local store, I had to play around and see what could be done out of the box and found it lacking in that regard. This app has actually been out for a long while (TG50 users used/loved it), so it's rather pathetic that Sony's folks couldn't have licensed, cloned, and/or improved upon it with the UX50.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  11. #71  
    Originally posted by wireless-doc
    Regarding the camera, if you can understand its limitations you can produce some acceptable photos.
    ...
    http://www.wireless-doc.com/treocam.htm
    Excellent job! Those pictures give me new hope. They also further underscore my earlier response to those that misunderstood some of us critics who complained about picture quality with off-the-cuff statements about "well, they're never going to be as good as a 3MP camera." As I said then, I don't need a 3MP camera. I don't even need a 1.3MP camera. What I want is for a manufacturer to give me good quality photos at the resolution they're claiming to offer. The Treo 600 claims to offer 640x480 photos, but at that resolution they're out-of-focus, almost making me wonder if they're not utilizing some sort of digital zoom to take a lower-res photo and store it as 640x480.

    Your images have been rescaled to 320x240. They look very good at that resolution (and I'm sure much of the credit goes to your photo-taking abilities as well). Good quality 320x240 would actually be fine with me, so you've renewed my interest in this phone a bit. Question: Can you take photos directly at 320x240 or do you have to take them at 640x480 and then rescale them on a desktop (which, BTW, is one of my complaints about the Palm OS right now - there aren't any image editing programs that allow you to resize, crop, etc. directly on your PDA - though I'm sure developers will catch up soon)? If you can take them at 320x240 on the phone, do they come out as good as images you took at 640x480 and then rescaled? Thanks,

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  12. #72  
    Originally posted by craigdts
    You'd be leaving out the best features of the Treo 600: form factor and D-pad. What I think is really "currently good" about the Treo 600 is that you can do everything one handed. I will not be moving back to a device where i must to use 2 hands to type or hold the device. I can't express how pleased i am with the Treo 600. It's the best available in my opinion.

    I've seen your desgin before and like it, but i would not buy it. I dont want to have to open my phone to use its other features, nor use 2 hands. If its going to work like a mini tablet pc w/ a keyboard: I think it would be too cumbersome to transform it to the pda alone position (hope that makes sense)
    As I said, my design isn't for everyone. You (and many more like you) are the perfect target audience for the Treo 600 because you highly value a small form-factor and the ability to thumb-type with one hand. Personally, other than looking up someone in my address book one-handedly to make a phone call, I'd rather use two hands to do more extensive typing (emails, responses on forums, etc.). I'd be willing to forego the smaller form-factor in favor of a roomier, more comfortable thumbboard and larger, higher-res screen. I think there are enough people like me to make this design worthwhile, though I'd agree that the market of people like you could very well be larger.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  13. #73  
    You could always go back to two tin cans and a string
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    #74  
    great form factor and fits nicely in the hand. However the screen is awful, the D pad is v difficult to use especially the centre button, the keypad is better than the 270 but I would prefer a bigger screen and a virtual keypad or graffiiti.

    I think I'll wait for the P900
  15. #75  
    Originally posted by itsyvonne
    Didja ever consider trying another browser? Blazer ain't the only game in town just because it is the one that comes w/the Treo!
    Yes, as I read the original poster's comment I was thinking about this too. Do the other browsers: Xiino, AvantGo, EudoraWeb, etc. work well on the T600? I use all of these depending on the site visited. While I was hoping that I wouldn't have to use different browsers with the advent of Blazer 3, one of them might be a solution for this person.
  16. #76  
    Originally posted by itsyvonne
    Didja ever consider trying another browser? Blazer ain't the only game in town just because it is the one that comes w/the Treo!
    At the time I made the post you replied to, no. I've since tried two others (Xiino and I Panel) and they immediately soft reset the Treo when I tried entering the url of the forum I was trying to get into.

    The problem I am having specifically is with an EzBoard forum run by a good friend of mine. EzBoard has both public and private forums. This is a private forum and when you initially join the forum, you must first log in with your EzBoard id. Then to gain admittance to the private forum, you enter the forum password once (I don't remember where or how that took place, not even when I registered through my Hitachi), and evidently never have to do it again. I presume they use a cookie of some sort yet I never have had to enter the forum password even after deleting my cookies.

    The long way to get in: When logging in from my G1000 on MSIE, I enter the url of the forum and am taken to an entry page. Then I log onto EzBoard with my user name and password through a Log In link on that entry page. From there I'm taken to my account control center where there is another link that says Managing __(name of the forum). If I click on that link, it takes me back to the forum entry page, where this time I am recognized and able to enter the pages where the topics are displayed.

    On Blazer, for some crazy reason this link "Managing **name of forum**" is missing. So I can't proceed any further in the EzBoard system. I have tried turning the graphics off. I have tried different settings in case the link was there but being obscured by the way I had my display set. Nothing works so far.

    That link also seems to be missing in the Desktop version of MSIE 6. But on my desktop PC version, logging in via the control panel seems sufficient to get me into the forum. I do not seem to need the added step of clicking on an additional link. I log in and then just bring up the url of the forum and I've instantly gained admittance. I do not even remember or see a link where I should enter the forum password in the event I try to enter using a new computer. No matter how much I try to wipe my browser clean, the forum still recognizes me from my original log-in.

    I've perused their FAQ section but haven't found the answers I'm looking for, yet.

    All it comes down to is a missing link. A simple text link.
  17. #77  
    Originally posted by monkeywithacold

    All it comes down to is a missing link. A simple text link.
    More than enough to break an entire system. I know the feeling only too well. While I'm really grateful for what we have (I remember how wonderful I thought Blazer was on the 300 when I first saw it), the truth seems to be that our browsers aren't quite there yet. Dealing with different browsers and multiple bookmark files is really trying. One would think that the development community would see an opportunity to address the problems in this category. It must be *much more difficult* than people imagine.
    Last edited by copernicus; 10/19/2003 at 10:21 PM.
  18. #78  
    Originally posted by monkeywithacold
    All it comes down to is a missing link. A simple text link.
    Have you considered manually adding the URL as a "Favorite" (after inspecting the link on your PC), and just clicking on the relevant favorite to get your there?
    Palm III > Treo 300 > Treo 600.B
  19. #79  
    I think I understand what you'r suggesting, and it is a good suggestion, but the link is also missing from my pc, oddly enough. Which is why I am not sure what is going to happen when I get a new computer--I wonder how the EzBoard is going to authenticate my membership at that time. It has been so long since I had to go through the original authentication process, I don't remember what steps I took then. I have tried deleting my cookies, clearing my cache, and making my browser as "new" as possible without actually reinstalling it, but EZboard still recognizes me and lets me into the private forum with only my general log-in. It does not require the private forum password for entry. It has been a long time since my friends were required to enter the original password and authentication as well, so they don't remember, either.

    The link I need ONLY appears on my Hitachi G1000 browser, Pocket MSIE, and when I try to click on the link to get the url, the redirect to the forum page happens so fast I can't get the exact url I need to copy into the Treo. There is no way to simply "mouse" over the link to see the url displayed anywhere else on the screen, as with the pc based browser.

    Well I do thank you for the suggestion and to those who have sympathized with my dilemma. I do have some people who may be able to help me and I'll ask them to look into it for me.

    Unfortunately I don't think Ezboard is going to become very Treo Friendly anytime soon. Even on Pocket MSIE, when I go to the Log-IN page, I'm met with a notice that if I can see their message, I am using a browser that does not adhere to "Web Standards" (shame on me! ) and to click on a link to learn more. I clicked on that link out of curiosity to see what my "faux pas" supposedly is, and it took me to a site that proudly announced Web Standards is a grassroots coalition fighting to ensure simple, affordable access to web technologies for all. They advise everyone to upgrade from old browsers to new ones that support their standards.

    Evidently when they came up with this campaign they forgot PDA browsers. They did say their campaign has come to an end and advised their members to take down that message. I guess EzBoard admins haven't gotten around to it yet. Oh well I'm lucky my Hitachi was able to get aboard at all. I'm glad it could, I really needed to be in touch with my friends on that forum when I was travelling.

    I do think eventually I'll be able to find a way to make it work on the Treo. If I can, I just may make the switch to a Treo 600, so I can carry around something smaller. I'm not sure yet. I've got plenty of time to make up my mind and give both devices a fair evaluation, so I'm in no rush. This forum has been a great resource and I appreciate it. Thanks, all.
  20. #80  
    Since it also doesn't appear properly in IE6 on your PC , it doesn't sound like it's a problem with the Treo browser at all. Not that I think the Treo browser(s) are perfect, far from it. The ones I've used (Blazer, Xiino, Eudora, iPanel) are all barely sufficient. Blazer does seem the most "compatible", though. I can see why Handspring stuck with it.

    Sounds like some kind of weird saved password/authentication problem. The browser saves the password in the Windows profile, not via a cookie. Either that, or it's simply a bug in the EzBoard software. Or both.

    You could also try other browsers on the PC, like Mozilla/Firebird or Opera. If the link doesn't show up on anything other than the Hitachi, there's something seriously wrong with what you are doing to login or the board itself.
    Last edited by IanL; 10/20/2003 at 03:25 PM.
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