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  1.    #1  
    So, after all the hoopla about how useless the camera, the consensus shifted a little to that it was mostly useless in low light/tought light situation.

    Well, for sure, it is just another camera phone, not some great Canon 10D. Even then, the quality of the first pics I saw made me think it would have not usability whatsoever.

    Then, a couple days ago (it can't be more than that seeing as the first lucky ones got their phone on Monday I believe), we started to see some descent outside pic (You know who you are Mr Denver Beemer 5 ).

    So, for those who are still on the cusp of gving into the Treo6 craze but this have doubts about the camera usefullness, I give you 'Random Low Light Pics at the mall'. The pics are REALLY somewhat random and I'm just doing that to help my fellow... and also because it is an incredibly cool device and I'd take any excuse to use it

    Plus, the oogling eyes of the people in the mall, including all the guys at the small Cellphone stand, selling what they think is state-of-the-art stuff when it comes out of my pocket... what's the word... I know: PRICELESS

    Without further ado, here are the pics.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  2.    #2  
    another one. The lights are always fairly low and indirect, or really bright but only on one point, etc...
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  3.    #3  
    Just trying to pick stuff with lots of color. Notice that if you wait long enough, there is light on the center but you still get the low light blue noise on the outside of the pic
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  4.    #4  
    and again. Colors are fairly accurate toward the center of the pic.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  5.    #5  
    ok, this looks weird but it is weird (somekind of flower-in-water lamp), the light comes from inside the lamp
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  6.    #6  
    an ad poster with feeble back light in a dimly lit corridor (actually is not too bad, really).
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  7.    #7  
    another inside. More light, colorfull kid play area.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  8.    #8  
    last one, same play area. You need to wait a while for the color to adjust while taking pictures inside. They can be decent in the end.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  9. jngai's Avatar
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    #9  
    Wow, those are great looking pics. Do you have any previous photography experience? Hmm, it seems to me that ppl need to understand how to take pics w/ the camera to get some decent results. Also, the way u described it, the camera seems to work like the Zire 71 camera where it slowly adjusts to the low light condition until you can get the maximum light exposure.
  10. #10  
    Those are great indoor pictures. I can just see how the cam would perform outdoors. Looks like the key is patience while waiting for the cam to adjust the exposure. I am absolutely convinced, the camera is alright!
    Ed
    Visor Deluxe, Prism, Visorphone, Treo 270, Treo 600, Treo 650, and am eagerly waiting for the next generation Treo...but wait...is that the iPhone????
  11. #11  
    WOW!! Thanks GreenTeeth!

    Approximately how long were you waiting before you take a picture?

    Are you able to see the effect of waiting on the screen? Do you notice the image going from crappy to being a lot clearer?
  12.    #12  
    jingai,

    no, I'm really an amateur photographer (although I do have 4-5 cameras lying around ). I haven't played with the Zire 71 but you're right, the camera slowly adjust to the light condition. It's sad that the program doesn't work better with the data from the CMOS and gives us blue pixel for low intensity: I'd like a black halo better ! Still, I'm pretty darn happy with what it can do. Plus, we may get a patch or an upgrade at one point !

    Silverado:

    Time really depends: some of the earlier pics, I waited 2-3 seconds... Some of the later one (like the poster) I probably waited 8-10 seconds... As long as the subjects is not moving, you're in relatively good shape. You do need *some* light though. You do notice the image getting better as you wait. There is actually a weird effect, not sure if this because of the way the program is written or what: if you focus on a place with low light and wait, the color will end up comming but with somewhat of a blue overcast (ie: the poster). If you focus on a source of light then turn the camera to the area you want to picture which is "low-lighted", the color are more vivid (ie: the kid play area at the end.) It's almost like the system tries to do some automatic white balancing but the algorithm needs work... or at least understanding to get more vibrant results

    The only issue I have really is that, because of the time necessary for a good pic, movement creates quite a bit of blur. So, if you have plenty of light, you're good. If you have low light and a steady subject, you're ok. If it's moving in low light, well, your mileage may vary... You may get some funny pictures though !

    To illustrate my point, here's what happen with a fairly mobile subject (a major understatement for my 2 years old son) in the same kid play area. I started focusing while he was away but by the time the colors were good, well...
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Since people have problems with my Einstein quotes, I will now quote my true hero: Homer Simpson.

    "Doh !'
  13. #13  
    I did notice that you have to wait a few seconds for the cam to adjust.....I took mine 600 out to dinner with me......and just started pointing at people.......the pics were great........and their response......."Where can I get one of those?......and it's a PDA too?"


    iGo
    GIVE DEBBIE THE CHIMP.....GIVE DEBBIE THE CHIMP!!!
  14. jngai's Avatar
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    #14  
    The camera is turning out to be a lot better than most ppl expected. It's also possible that it is the same camera in the zire 71. Unfortunately, that also means using the camera to take video is pretty much out of the question as everything would probably just turn up as a blur.
    Last edited by jngai; 10/12/2003 at 01:37 AM.
  15. #15  
    I'm glad I saw this thread. After a little experimenting, you're right - giving the camera time to adjust to light makes a huge difference. Thanks for the great tip.

    I wonder why it's so slow? Maybe the aperture mechanism is sluggish? Maybe the software is inefficient at sending commands? (Does the camera even have a hardware aperture?)

    I would still advise people not to buy this phone thinking they'll get a useful camera. But, this does make it a nicer perk than I thought it was before.
  16. #16  
    Great pics, GreenTeeth. And those shots made indoors!! I knew the camera was not as useless as some said it was. Can't wait to get my T600!!!
    ...I think we're gonna need a bigger boat.
  17. #17  
    The trick is to ignore how the pix look on the phone. The display is of such low resolution, that nearly everything looks bad. I had a bunch of pictures that I thought were useless judging by how they looked on the phone. Once I transferred them to the PC, I saw that they were really quite nice.
    Regards,

    Robert
  18. #18  
    I wonder if they could improve the camera's capabilities (not resolution but removal of the blue pixels and time to adjust) in a rom update in the future?
  19. #19  
    Ok another trick I have used is when in a low light situation, point the camera at a light source, give it a few seconds then move to subject and capture, usually you can do this before the camera adjust back to low light and the picture is better.
    Not great but it helps.
  20. #20  
    I'll stick with my Canon 10D for now, too bad it doesn't quite fit in my pocket like the Treo though.....
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